On Sunday OM introduced the sparrow to his daughter. Car4love found out when the girl started talking about her new friend.

She was talking to him about it today, and he said he wanted her to start getting to know the sparrow because the two of them are planning on moving in together in April.

That's a long way off, sure. But hearing about the two of them planning their future together took me down a peg or two.

I think I'm only able to stay in plan A (from a distance) because I don't have this stuff coming at me every day.

But I've heard worse...

GC

GC,

Why April? It seems a funny choice unless laws/D are dictating what these addicts are planning. Hopefully one or both pushed the date back because the illusions are fading.

Nah, he rents a place from his sister. She plans to sell the place in the spring. When she sells it, he'll need somewhere to go, so that's when they'll shack up for real.

He probably wants to wait until then to officially shack up because doing it sooner could screw up his custody case.

GC

gc:

I hope some more experienced MBers who've dealt with the impact of an A on young children will chime in here, but my feeling is that this is a clear-cut WRONG that needs 2 be nipped in the bud before it gets any worse.

Sparrow is NOT Om's "new friend". What is she, really? Particularly 2 OM in the long haul?

I am going 2 look up a post by SKM 2 a WW by the name of Sarie that posted here for a while, because it provided the clearest definition of what role the WS and OP really played during their A:

*crap!*. The server is so slow I'm not able 2 do a search. I'll try again later and post it then.

But the point is that car4love's daughter is being fed a huge lie and is being expected 2 believe that sparrow's A with her father is a good thing, which is cruel beyond my imagining. I think she should be told the truth, but I don't know how you tell someone so young what's going on.

-ol' 2long

<small>[ October 07, 2004, 03:45 PM: Message edited by: 2long ]</small>

In my opinion as a single mom, this is par for the course for pansyass. He left a pregnant women and young todler for a MW

He is stupid beyond understanding. And no it is very, very bad for the child. If I were car4love there would be an emergency hearing before the judge to get a court order to stop this!

My DD dad and I agreed that NONE of our romantic interests would be around our daughter until we were engaged to someone, and then it would be done very carefully.

Well she was six before she met another woman besides me, and that is her current stepmother.

This makes me see RED! I don't know how car4love puts up with that idiott.

<small>[ October 07, 2004, 03:49 PM: Message edited by: weaver ]</small>

And I went the first 6 years of her life without dating at all. My ex fiance was the first man she met also, (six then too).

Weaver, I advised car4love to stay cool in person and just call her lawyer.

Pansya$$ is a good name for him. He didn't even have the plums to tell car4love he'd introduced them. Car4love had to hear it from the little two-year-old girl and then call him, and only then was he forced to admit it.

Sick, sick people, these. It's all okay if it makes you "happy".

GC

UGH.

I just love it when these WS's expect to drag everyone along for their demented ride of selfishness,children included. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

As it is,I made my WH agree in our Mediation discussion that neither of us would introduce any new "partners" to the children until a year had passed after our D.I would prefer they NEVER meet the homewrecking trash but by the time a year has passed,I am hoping their little cheat fest will have run it's course and I won't have to think about that.The kids don't want to know this person right now and probably never will and I am not going to let my WH force the issue.

But toddlers and younger children obviously can't process any of this so it's up to mom and/or dad to spare them all the disgusting events.It's too confusing and just plain WRONG.

What a tangled web they weave.

O

I know October.

Sometimes I wish these "people" would just hook up and fall off the face of the earth, instead they have to drag their nightmare into the innocent world of babies.

Stupid, fogbrains!

Ok I think I need a little glass of wine. Starting to get a little keyed up here <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

ROCK ON, Gray!!!!

Rock on I shall, weaver. And I'm going to have a BIG glass of wine after work. I haven't bought a bottle since I've been on ADs.

GC

All this talk about Wine is making me thirsty. You guys are torturing me. I can't wait until Christmas, when I can have a BIG glass of wine.

Hang in there GC, they don't call this a roller coaster ride for nothing!

This is some coaster, Kloe! It just goes down, down, down.

I'm okay though. It's gonna take more than a few whacks at these good ol' boy bones to keep me down.

GC

P.S. Yeah, so I'm quoting Max Cady in Cape Fear. So what?

Hey Kloe,

After your beautiful little baby girl is born, were all going to break out the wine! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

2long...

I found many posts to Sarie by SKM.

But I'm reading SKM's Chronicles
and it's definitely enlightening. I've read it before, but it comes across differently than it did a few months ago.

SKM wrote

"I view everyone else on this higher level, an even level where no one has cheated, lied or gotten into trouble - and by the choices I made, I'm living on this sub-human level."

I'm sure my WW is in the same place.

I don't expect the sparrow to come out of it. Or do I? When things like today's news hit me, I have this visceral pang, this wave of grief that washes over me. My hands shake, the blood drains out of my head.

I ask myself sometimes, when I'm particularly caught up in my own brain's workings, why don't I hate her? Why don't I want her out of my life forever? Love bank my butt. Mine was not so much higher than hers when the A began. It's certainly empty now. And that's where the metaphor fails, because I still want to be married to her, and I still love her (but I'm not IN LOVE with her!).

So I wait, and try to let these events roll off my back. And I wonder, why isn't she doing anything to make this divorce happen? I see my IC, and she asks how am I doing with the anger. And I wonder is something wrong with me? I have little moments of anger, and I invite myself to feel it, and then it's gone.

And then I let go of all the wondering and speculating and analyzing, back away from myself, look at the little insecure boy terrified of rejection, listen to the spider in there saying, "You see, you were right - nobody wants you," and let all that be okay. And then I try to think about other people instead of myself. I need more practice at that.

Well, gotta go to the airport and pick up my buddy.

GC

gc, doesn't all of this just really suck?

Lol, my therapist is *very* concerned for me. She understands what I'm doing and does agree with it in principle.

But she is afraid that I am allowing myself to be emotionally abused. The even though my husband does seem to care about me deeply, it ain't love, baby. You simply do NOT do this to people you love.

I am truly starting to wonder if she's right. I'm still sticking in there...but man, I need love so bad. It would be SO freakin' easy for me to go get some lovin' from someone right now. Yeah, I think it would be kind of empty, but sometimes I just don't care.

Not gonna do it, but I wonder how long I can hold out. I can tell you this, I'm not waiting a year after the divorce to date! I won't get serious, but no friggin' way I'm waiting a year to get the human touch.

PS She said what she is really worried about is that this whole process is changing my definition of love. That whether or not my husband and I stay together, I will end up having a really skewed outlook in a NOT good way. I worry about that too.

<small>[ October 07, 2004, 08:57 PM: Message edited by: maddyk ]</small>

Maddy,
(and by the way, I have a granddaughter named Maddy, and she is really cute too.)

I think you do care, or you wouldnt't be here talking, and trying to get through another day.

When you get down, remember how far you have come, and remember those other days when you felt like you were loosing it, but you made it somehow. You can do this, I believe you can.

Gray - I feel like smashing that little spider, except that sometimes we need to hold back a little, and he does that for you.

One of the reasons I encourage you to pray, is that God knows us as we really are, and he loves us, and wants us, and helps us anyway. Once you know that, it is easier to face all the rest.

You are loveable - do you know that?
We need to love ourselves - do you......... can you?

SS

Maddy, how would your definition of love be redefined and not in a good way?

I suppose your IC refers to loving somebody who hurts you and refuses to love you.

But to me, being able to do that, and - of equal importance - being able to let go of it, is what love for another, and love for yourself, is all about.

And of course you need boundaries to preserve your self-respect.

SS, thanks for trying to step on that ole spider, but you know, he's a part of me. I can't think him away. He's just something that my past has left there, and he remains of little power, long as I keep my eye on him.

And despite my weak faith, yeah, I still pray anyway.

GC

GC, I admire you. I don't know how you can still Plan A even at a distance.

Sometimes I'd like to. My Plan A fell apart when I got my notice to vacate and leave behind everything but a moldy couch.

Even now, I get the crappola everyday - in my face. It is so illogical, so unreasonable, so .... just plain rediculous! No good deed goes unpunished.

I don't think I have to worry about STBX bringing OM around our kids. They would reject him for the homewrecker he is. In addition, I think my STBX would be embarrassed. Homewrecker Steve has no real interest in seeing/meeting/raising my kids. He just wants my STBX's "goodies".

Wish we could share that bottle of wine.

<small>[ October 08, 2004, 07:25 AM: Message edited by: Tom Joad ]</small>

gc, I think it's because I believe my husband still LOVES me. I believe it's more than deep care and concern. I feel that he's going through a "phase" that he may or may not snap out of. I feel that the fog has become a permanent part of his personality. That the love is still there, but may not be permitted to come out.

He is trying very hard to lose love for me. If he has to try so hard..well..i dunno..how sad for him.

Anyway, i think that is why she worries, because I do believe he loves me. She listens to what I tell her his actions are..and she sees his selfishness. Love and selfishness cannot co-exist for very long.

Hmm..not sure if I'm saying this well. She has a point though. gc, I am proud of what I am doing. It would be so EASY to give up and I have not. I have never done anything so difficult in my entire life, let alone do something so difficult that might not ever be rewarded in the way that I want.

I do worry about my next relationship, whether it be with my husband or someone else. I worry that I will not be able to set appropriate boundaries. I think it is this whole "fog" thing that confuses me. The BS is supposed to help chip away at this..is supposed to be the lighthouse..but how much is too much? I feel that I can keep going right now..but at some point this becomes bad for you...how will I know where that point is?

stillseeking, yes...soft smile..I do still care about my behavoir and how it affects my marriage. Honestly? I wish I didn't.

Ick..I have been in such a GREAT mood for about the last month or so and yesterday I just came crashing down and don't know why. gc, sorry I threadjacked...I hope I didn't make it worse.

(((gc)))