roughroad, this is a little bit beyond me. I do not mean that I don't understand all your conflicting thoughts and emotions, but I definitely don't feel qualified to advise, so please take anything I say with a grain of salt.

I don't like to say what you should in the case that you do divorce because I'm not sure how much you should let your thoughts go down that road. But I'm going to say it anyway <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I think that if you divorce, you should take it very slow with any relationship you enter, but I do think you will be ready to start dating--AS LONG AS YOU TAKE YOUR TIME!!!! You have been separated and apart long enough where I do not fear for your vulnerability. You have also had plenty of time to make your changes, and ALSO have had plenty of time to be on your own for awhile.

In the meantime, keep you distance from this fellow...I mean EMOTIONAL distance. Only you can say how much time you can spend with him and still feel on the "safe side" of things. roughroad, everyone needs help and if this guy is the only one offering, I would hate to see you toss that out. But if you feel like any contact like that is too much, well...again, only you can say. But please please please make sure that the distance you keep is not a "cool" distance, but a friendly one. Cool distance could keep him away from you forever...friendly allows for a friendship later on if he's not patient enough to wait for you. I'm not sure if I'm making sense here, and I'm trying not to make excuses in order for you to stay close to him. I hope that you can get the gist of what I'm saying.

As I read your posts, I'm almost getting the vibe that you're blaming you being less willing to work things out with your H on this new friendship. roughroad, think hard about this. I don't think it's true, but it's almost like you're talking yourself into believing that. You are not galavanting around! It does not sound like you have done anything you should feel ashamed of, nor anything that would make God frown upon you for. This has been going on a long time for you and you're at a standstill. See what happens when you get the house stuff settled and take it from there.

And consider the possibility that the recovery road looks so much steeper simply because you've endured too much as it is..and not because there's a possibility of romance waiting in the wings.

rr:

Sorry if I missed something in the replies, but I gotta run for a bit and wanted 2 answer this part of your original post:

"so i'm just not sure how to do a letter of my own given the fact he essentially did it to me."

It sounds like he wrote the letter 2 you specifically as "damage control" 2 protect his s2pid selfish choices. Don't give him that by staying silent. EXPOSE 2 his family and friends. Just tell them the truth. It's probably not what he's told them. And telling the truth is not LBing.

"also i cannot think of one single person that i could use as an intermediary other than my lawyer."

Go 2 Penny Tupy's website www.saveyourmarriagecentral.com and look up the info on intermediaries on her home page. I think she's the only one that offers professional intermediary service.

"you know the story of his family in that they have not contacted me whatsoever since dday (he's the oldest of 7 kids) and i don't want him calling my mom for anything UNLESS it would be to say he wants to work on our M. my family, his family, me, and my husband all live in separate states (4 different states). we have no mutual friends that live where he is so what should i do?"

In this kind of si2ation, staying silent might just make "out of sight, out of mind" that much easier. Your H may NEVER face his demons.

I would send a letter.

-ol' 2long

2long, yes the letter he wrote to me a couple of months ago was all about him making himself feel better, bottom line. exposure is already done in one way or another so that's not really a stone left unturned. i guess now i'm just thinking more and more that i don't want him back. i'm almost sure now that i will give him a letter (then again, ask me tomorrow). as far as an intermediary, there's really not a need to have one. we don't have any kids and the house will be sold on 11/1/04, yes we will still have bills but i'll continue to pay them until something is done officially. if anything does or doesn't happen w/the bills well that's really the time a lawyer needs to step in. thanks so much for reading and taking the time to reply.

Maddy, once again you hit the nail on the head with "you're blaming you being less willing to work things out with your H on this new friendship." i am, i didn't think about it this way but yes i would have to agree. so what do you think about me actually telling this guy about my concerns? i guess to me that's the only way to make sure he knows that i'm not keeping my distance to be "cold" that i'm mad or anything (getting kind of high school here) but that in order to not ruin things between us that i feel that until my D is final that i just can't be as close to him. it's about me not trusting myself. i simply just don't have the strength anymore to not let my emotions to fall where they may but because i know i need to take things slow regardless, i just really feel i have to put the brakes on now.

i talked w/a friend last night who has gone through something similar and we are pretty much one for one on the God/faith/church factor. i didn't tell her everything only that i'm pretty much waiting for my H to file and be D'd to get on w/my life. that i don't want to file because that would make things easier on him, that's what he wants, plus i just told him a couple of weeks ago that i could not help him in what he was doing (filing for D). she said she went through the same exact thing, knows how i feel, and that it is completely normal. she was the one that eventually filed because she said it just wasn't going to end, her H had no reason to D her because he was continuing to do all he did before even though they were still married (basically cake eating).

so i think i have come to a decision. that i will send my H the letter, don't know if it will be before i leave florida or once i'm back here and i will give him until 1/1/05 to file. If he has not filed by then, i will file. i'm pretty sure that he will file before then but then again i just have no idea anymore. by the new year it will be almost a year since dday. i think at this point i need to set a date to keep me sane and know that there will be some closure at some point instead of wondering when it will happen.

i know God allows for D in my situation and that according to the Bible my H is dead to me for what he has done. that's not to say that we would not be able to recover but if he never gives any indication that he wants that, in fact basically says he doesn't, well maybe that's just it. i have tried to be realistic throughout all this that it just may not be in God's will that me and my H get back together. i've tried not to do anything in haste and i have tried to listen to what God is telling me to do. perhaps your right when you say "the recovery road looks so much steeper simply because you've endured too much as it is." i can't sacrifice the close R i have w/God now to save my M (say once we were in recovery) i can't go back to the way i was because i know it's not right and that's not what God wants for me. I'm just really skeptical that my H would ever be receptive of that, even though i know i have changed for the better, in all areas of my life, not just my M.

so that's it. i decided to take out the disrepect thing out of the letter because i don't think this is the place to say that even though i really really want to. but everything else would pretty much stay the same.

thanks again maddy for your insight, i think you've stumbled onto another career!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">thanks again maddy for your insight, i think you've stumbled onto another career! </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Teehee, yes, engineers have feelings too! *G*

roughroad, I think it took a LOT for you to reach that tentative decision for you to file after the first of the year. I think it is very very wise to consider that "cake eating" factor. I don't believe cake-eating is a HUGE aspect of things with your husband, but it is still there. I mean..why should he file? The marriage isn't really stopping him from doing anything he wants to do. In fact it may be a weird sort of safety net for him that he can use as an excuse not to get 100% intimate with this girl. Who knows? I don't think *you* ever will! Think about folks who 10 years down the road are living completely separate lives but still married. You are certainly too young for that happy-crappy!!! I am not saying that your tentative plans are right or wrong (I actually think you're on the right track, but know you have to consider the alternatives and God's will), but just that I understand where they are coming from. From my perspective they are coming from a healthy mix of logic and emotion. I have to be honest about something here. As much as I want recociliation with my husband, sometimes I just get so weary just thinking of the work that real recovery will require and I do not know if I have the stamina. And I said in my other post about his statement of dating each other after we divorce. Well, duh..the person that he is becoming is not the kind of person I would date. Yes, I love him, but my main reasons for staying right now are more because of my promise and my commitment. Anyway, all I'm saying is that I believe you have fulfilled your promises and commitments to your husband and God in regards to your marriage (I don't feel that I have yet)..so whatever you choose to do now with filing or not--I think that you can safely remove morals from the equation and think about what's best for roughroad and roughroad's future.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">i think at this point i need to set a date to keep me sane and know that there will be some closure at some point instead of wondering when it will happen.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I understand. And despite Florida being a no-fault state, it still takes at least a little time for this to all happen. Filing itself does not mean a dissolution to the marriage. If at the last minute your feel you have erred, you can pull the papers. And that is still 2.5 months away. Definitely not hasty and maybe something will happen in the meantime to make your decision more firm, or will sway you in the other direction.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">"you're blaming you being less willing to work things out with your H on this new friendship." i am, i didn't think about it this way but yes i would have to agree. so what do you think about me actually telling this guy about my concerns? i guess to me that's the only way to make sure he knows that i'm not keeping my distance to be "cold" that i'm mad or anything (getting kind of high school here) but that in order to not ruin things between us that i feel that until my D is final that i just can't be as close to him. it's about me not trusting myself. i simply just don't have the strength anymore to not let my emotions to fall where they may but because i know i need to take things slow regardless, i just really feel i have to put the brakes on now.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I think it would be perfectly acceptable to let your friend know that you have been deeply considering your marriage and its future. That you are worried that your new friendship with him as been affecting your thought-process. Let him know that you need to be sure that your feelings have only to do with your husband and yourself. By all means, I think it would even be ok to say that should your friendship deepen in the future, that you wish it to be completely untainted by questions of propriety. roughroad, your friend is a man of God and I think he will understand all this. Without knowing him, I believe that he would probably welcome and respect your honesty and your scruples. Don't tell *him* you don't necessarily trust yourself. Just let him know that you need to distance yourself a little bit to be sure that you are following God's will and making your choices for the right reasons. If you keep it simple and don't explain TOO much, then you are less likely to say something you will question yourself on saying. You will be less likely to think you might have sent the wrong message. I guess what I am thinking of is like a WS who writes a NC letter. That letter does NOT say that if things don't work out, they will get together with the OP later on. you don't want to send that kind of message. So just keep it simple and honest.

roughroad, you are struggling and I hope that by taking things slow and giving yourself the time to mull things over, that your choices will become clearer to you, one way or the other.

"As much as I want recociliation with my husband, sometimes I just get so weary just thinking of the work that real recovery will require and I do not know if I have the stamina. And I said in my other post about his statement of dating each other after we divorce. Well, duh..the person that he is becoming is not the kind of person I would date. Yes, I love him, but my main reasons for staying right now are more because of my promise and my commitment."

I pretty much feel the same way, except my H has never said he wanted to date me. but the more i think about it, why would i want to go out w/someone whom i know had an A? and if me and my H did get back together, we would be starting from scratch. in a weird sort of way, that's why in part i'm obsessing about frienship w/people of the opposite sex. because many times R develope as a result of good friendships and i could use as many friends as possible right now and hence my concern w/this guy from church because i feel like we could really be good friends right now.

you know i could be totally off base and maybe this guy really just wants to be friends and is just trying to help like he would any other person in my position. but i also think i'm a reasonably intelligent person and just can sort of tell that i think this guy is attracted to me for many different reasons on different levels. but he is a man of God like you said and i don't think he would do anything to jeopardize my walk w/God. i mean good grief he has told me that if he ever got married again that he wouldn't even kiss before they got married. i was thinking to myself good grief that's a little extreme but i didn't say anything. at the same time i think i'm really sending out the neediness vibes. i even told him that i thought i was extremely needy right now and hoped that people (at church) weren't thinking i was taking advantage of people (i've asked for help to move twice already since i've been here). he just told me that i was right now but it was out of my hands and that if i need help that i should let people help me.

w/my friend from last night i told her i don't think am meant to be single for the rest of my life and i knew that there was someone out there for me that i know that i could trust and that i wouldn't have the obstacles that i would have w/my H should we reconcile because i don't think i could ever truly trust him again. she said there definitely is and said that she cannot believe the utmost happiness that she has now w/her husband and has no concerns whatsoever (they met in church unlike her first H). she wished i could just feel for 30 minutes what she feels in her heart given what she's been through and where she is at today.

so your right jan 1st is still a couple months (but also not too far off) away and lots could change in the mean time but it means that things will have an end. i'd also kind of like to start the year off better and get things "settled" before my 30th b-day which is 1/19/05.

thanks again maddy and hope that someday or in some way i can be as much help to you as you have to me, prayers to you, RR