GG,

Thanks for the update. I have always been so impressed with how SH can take individual situations and be so right on with his instincts.

I had a hard time putting into words on the forum what he told us as well, even though I took pages of notes. I often found myself trying to explain things he said that I had NEVER read on this forum or even the books or this website.

There is no replacing counseling with him. It's why I am such a big cheerleader for his coaching!!

I am also relieved that you won't be sleeping in your house anymore. I have to say I've been worried about the stability of your wife and your safety.

Also you can move ahead with a form of peace, knowing you've consulted experts, and in their best judgment have advised you accordingly.

Glad you found a place you're excited about, and that your dog can come too. I'll pray for you, as I know the rollercoaster ride isn't over yet.

Thanks so much to both of you. I must say that today is very, very hard & I'm having a hard time coping. However, I am having absolutely no doubts about my plan.

I ate lunch with my parents and told them that I was filing next week and I had found an apartment. They both told me they were so glad and didn't know how I had been able to put up with this for so long. They said that if we weren't going to be able to fix the marriage, that I needed to get on with my life. They again started talking about the day WW came over and told them what sorry IL's they had been, etc. Today they added that WW told them what a mistake it was for her to have ever starting dating me to begin with.

I've got so much to do this week. I could really, really use some time off but there is so much to do here. I've got a job that it is up to me when to come and go, but I'm responsible for the fall-out. Hard to get away right now and I'm interviewing (and spending the whole day with) a guy flying in from Wichita on Friday.

On a lighter note....I am indeed excited about the apartment. I've always thought it would be really neat to live in an old house but I've not wanted to buy the responsibilities that go with it. This old house is so cool (both figuratively and literally). There is a total of 4 rooms, with the 2 big ones being the original "parlor" and living room. There are 2 add-on rooms that should be the bedroom and a "whatever" room. I'm thinking (already, can you believe it?) of living entirely in the 2 original rooms, making one of the add-on's storage and the other....are you ready?.....a potter studio. (How's that for presumptious?). I could combine that with an office and other assorted stuff.

Anyway, perhaps it has finally happened and I've completely lost my mind. Maybe my moniker should be "insane guy in Georgia".

All right, all comments welcome. Today stinks.

Georgia

<small>[ January 26, 2005, 12:16 PM: Message edited by: Georgia Guy - FGG ]</small>

I can relate. I remember the excitementat the thought of moving into a new house... Getting away from the bad memories.

Get your emotional resources ready for the aftereffects of the ELECTROSHOCK,though!!!

Do you have to file for divorce in your state? In my state, I just initially got a legal separation and then after a year I could have filed for divorce. You sound so final about this when it seems that you don't have to be....

You know me and my thoughts about this whole idea of divorce. I now understand your need to move out but.....

BTW, just letting you know, Georgia, I'll be leaving to go out of town with H tomorrow morning and will return Sunday evening.

<small>[ January 26, 2005, 01:07 PM: Message edited by: mimi1254 ]</small>

I can't really say that my house has been saturated with bad memories. We've only been in that house 2 years, and there have been some real lively "debates", but I could still live there with no problem.

The issue regarding a separation is that WW doesn't really want a divorce, separation, or anything else. She wants me and OM. I am the one saying NO. In a legal separation, both spouses have to agree who will be responsible for what (finances) while continuing the M. In order to get anything WW would agree to, I would be giving her a license to carry on without any changes forever (at my expense).

What I am doing in many ways is the ultimate Plan B. It is my way of saying that this time I'm in Plan B with no reservations. WW still has her hand firmly on the emergency brake and can stop it at any time, but not by dragging her feet on the pavement and trying to dig her heals in. However, I AM going on with my life, there is no question about that.

As you know how us CA'ers are (you formerly being one), we thrive on affirmation. It is interesting to note that (like CSue noted) of all the very reputable and conservative folks I've discussed (who are in the know on this situation), none have counseled me to STOP!!!

I have been very careful to try to make this decision MY decision, not just taking a poll to try to decide what everyone else thinks I should do. However, it is (again, deferrence to CSue) reassuring to have such exhaustive confirmation.

Allow me to say how refreshing it is to see that you are going on a trip with "H", not "FWH". Was this intentional? Is there some hidden message there?

Georgia

<small>[ January 26, 2005, 01:45 PM: Message edited by: Georgia Guy - FGG ]</small>

Yes, Georgia:

I am beginning to view him as H not FWH. I am pretty convinced, strictly mathematically speaking here, that there is a low probability of him straying again anytime soon. I am so firmly entrenched in MY PLAN that we are very much IN LOVE!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

My H and I are definitely in a much, much different place than we were even a month ago!

I can't say that I can really relate to where you are now. I never got to the place of wanting out of my M. I stayed more like DYING HERE. I can really, really relate to her. Before I knew it, my WH wanted to come back home and I was working on negotiating my terms.

<small>[ January 26, 2005, 01:59 PM: Message edited by: mimi1254 ]</small>

It is obvious that you and H (which is how I will from now on refer to him) are doing quite well in your R. Congratulations.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I can't say that I can really relate to where you are now. I never got to the place of wanting out of my M. I stayed more like DYING HERE. I can really, really relate to her. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I'm glad you've never gotten to where I am. It is a confusing paradox. Let me at least modify your statement by saying "I want out of the M AS IT IS NOW". I think what really put the icing on the cake for SH was the issue about #1OM. It is indeed like WW is no longer capable of deciphering right from wrong, and I'm not just talking about "fog speak". She is WAY out there, and seems to be heading that way even futher as time goes by with no indication of response to "the medicine". I believe that she could justify in her mind doing physical harm to me or anyone else that stands in her way, and not feel any guilt or remorse if she did.

Anwyay, I have noticed that you've gotten yourself a new MB'er to work with. Deja vu?

Additional hesitancy to post on my part is that there may be some who would say "GG followed MB, look where it got him". Even though the toughest part of the game may be yet to come, and may very well be where recovery occurs, some may look at this as a MB "failure". To those I would say that MB give me hope and a direction to take when I was just floundering aimlessly, even after seeking "professional" help. So... I definitely consider MB the way to go, with the best OPPORTUNITY to recover my marriage, but with no guarantees. Likewise, I can say with confidence that MB (and some of it's adherents) have given me the strength to go on with my life IF that is what is to be. This is no small thing to a man who has been near panic attacks a lot of times out of sheer ignorance of knowing what to do next.

Enough.

Georgia

I am leaving a little early to go the bank and open an account, then to a local car lot to get some idea of the value of WW's car.

I hope your weekend with H is wonderful. I hope that you and H pray together, and I would ask that you pray for me / us.

Georgia

FGG,

Actually, I think you are a classic example of how MB should work and be worked. YOu have given it every chance and while not happy with the outcome, you are comfortable with where you are going and why you are going there. In many ways that is as good as it gets.

I am suspecting the SH, yourself, and others are seeing the issues with your W as being more than just "not happy" in the marriage and more to do with internal issues, that MB is really not able to touch. I think it is cool that you have found a place you would like to live and that you are looking forward to the future no matter what that might be.

Good luck and God Bless,

JL

Hi, Georgia.

I hope you will continue to post here.

In all honesty, the real ride for you, starts from here. Now is when it starts to get interesting.

I can completely understand your need to remove yourself from your current situation.

I do want to encourage you, if possible, to take your time on moving on to someone else if your marriage does end in divorce.

The reason I think you should consider moving very slowly is simple. I firmly believe that at some point in time, probably in the near future, your wife is going to 'tank'. Hopefully, some professional with a clue, is going to recognize her condition, and treat her for it.

When your wife returns to some semblance of normalcy, she is going to want to fix as much as she can, of what she has broken.

You have to do what you have to do, of course, but I felt that I should at least tell you what is on my heart about your situation.

I think you have done a man's job, Georgia. I would be proud to know you.

All the best,
Gimble

FGG:

"On a lighter note....I am indeed excited about the apartment. I've always thought it would be really neat to live in an old house but I've not wanted to buy the responsibilities that go with it. This old house is so cool (both figuratively and literally). There is a total of 4 rooms, with the 2 big ones being the original "parlor" and living room. There are 2 add-on rooms that should be the bedroom and a "whatever" room. I'm thinking (already, can you believe it?) of living entirely in the 2 original rooms, making one of the add-on's storage and the other....are you ready?.....a potter studio. (How's that for presumptious?). I could combine that with an office and other assorted stuff. "

As you may know, we have such a house. Tell you what. If you do elect 2 make upgrades 2 reduce the rent, seriously consider getting yourself some Bradbury and Bradbury or William Morris reproduction historic wallpapers. You won't believe how peaceful it can be 2 sit quietly in a parlor with high ceilings decorated with that stuff!

Be thinking about you, FGG.
-ol' 2long

Good Morning all -

Thanks for the posts.

Gimble / JL - I think that anyone who has somewhat followed this winding tale would have to come to the conclusion that there is something far outside the realm of normalcy happening here. SH analogy of her "operating system" being broken is a good one to use. I also suspect that someday the light is going to illuminate, but my speculation is that it's going to be a long, long time in coming. By the way, thanks Gimble for the kind words and compliment.

I got a lot accomplished yesterday afternoon.

We have been paying extra ($300)on our mortgage each month through automatic bank draft, I was able to get that cut back to just the minimum monthly payment. I opened a checking account in just my name and put some money in it. And...I activated a credit card in just my name.

I went by the car lot and was pleasnatly surprised at what I was offered for WW's car. Also, he has a car that I think will work well for me. Probably tomorrow afternoon I'll raid the garage and take WW's car and leave her mine in it's place. Then go directly to the car lot and sell it. That will likely not make her too happy.

I've also started a list of what furniture I want to take to the apartment. I've tried to make an inventory of all furniture, then itemizing by what I am leaving vs. what I am taking. I don't want it to look like I'm taking everything good and leaving her with nothing, so I'm trying to make this fairly balanced. Either Monday or Tuesday will be the day that I show up with a truck and get the furniture while she's at work.

2Long - No, I didn't realize that you are an old house guy. The more I read of your posts, the more I think that you and I have a lot in common (however, you've got me way beat in the ed. department, I've only a B.S., I still have to pull out my Boolean algebra cheat sheats from time to time). I've talked to the landlord about painting, which he will buy. I haven't thought about wallpaper, but I've hung quite a bit myself. I may consider that. Thanks.

Again, thank you all for taking the time to post. I'm staying with #1S until I move into the aparment, which means I'm spending about 3 hours a day on the interstate. I'll be glad to settle back into some kind of normal routine.

Georgia

GG -

In addition to the inventory of what you take vs leave behind at the house - take pictures.

Your W may get violent after your departure and blame you for breaking all the furniture...

Crazier things have happened!

Gib

GG...

I also want to second just learnings and others sentiments of you being a marriage builders success...

you sound healthy
you sound strong
you sound well....

and you have learned a lot....

I hate to sound so cliche-y
but you are going to be OK..
infact most likely great...


be well...

ARK

None of my business, really, but go to bluebook.com and check the value of the car before you sell it to him. Just to have another figure to judge by. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Thanks for the suggestions and kind words of all.

I went over to the house at lunch and filled my trunk with various tools from the garage and almost all the rest of my clothes, as well as a few odds and end from the room where I'd been staying.

All as gone well so far.

Georgia

FGG -

Please rethink timing of when you take her car versus when you will have a truck come load up your stuff. Is there any way you can have the truck still come on the same day as planned (while she is at work) and then drive to her work and trade out vehicles (leaving her a note so she doesn't think it was stolen?)?

I'm only cautioning you on this because if she reacts like I fear she will to having her car 'taken' and sold, she might hole up in your house and skip work out of fear of what you might do next. I'm not saying you should let what she might do hold you back at all, I'm just trying to see if you can do it all in one fell swoop and reduce the amount of damage she might do in retaliation?

I've been on these boards for about 4 years, but I don't post anymore. I am a FWW who has had no contact with OM for over 3 years, nor have I had another A and have complied with all my H's requests after d-day (I revealed), but we are not recovered and he continues to berate me on the A to this day.

I read posters like you and 2Long who have shown such love, mercy, and grace to their WW's despite what happened and I just weep out of happiness that there are such men of character out there and I also weep because of what I've done and my H's continued abuse.

Wishing you the best.

YR

Thank you, FYR, for the kind thoughts. I see you are new here? Would you care 2 share your story on a new thread? Anything we can help you with?

FGG:

I agree with FYR, but haven't been able 2 figure out how 2 respond about the car issue. I'd be worried she'd react very badly also. Anyway that you can get a third party 2 explain the need 2 sell it or swap cars with her?

-ol' 2long

2Long - your kindness and offer means alot to me. I am not precisely 'new'. I used to post as YellowRose back in the days when Spacecase, you, Mortarman, Lisa in London, etc. were all in the initial part of d-day, etc.

My situation is impossibly tough and not likely to change so I gave up posting. Also, my H was totally against this site, counseling, etc. so I just faded away although I constantly watch and pray for people.

FGG - sorry to dump part of my situation on your thread. I wanted to say one more thing...I think you have the absolute coolest kids (yes, I know they are young men) and daughter's-in-law around. Their support has made me so very pleased for you. On top of that, the support the church has given you has blown me away. I went to my church and didn't receive much support at all, but perhaps it is because I was the WW.

No matter the fireworks, no matter the explosions, please know that speaking for myself, I would have sat on a fence as long as I was allowed to. I am incredibly stubborn and as long as I was comfortable (and yes, even pain can feel comfortable after a while), there was nothing short of people (in my case, it was my kids talking about living with their dad instead of me)knocking me off the fence and leaving me alone on my knees surrounded by my own manure to get my attention.

I pray for God to speak to your wife and soften her hardened heart and convict her of the truth...I pray for her healing and awakening..and for healing and peace for all those who have been taken hostage by her behavior.

God Bless,

YR

PS: 2Long - I know you are not a believer, but I still sneak in some prayers for you, your wife, and family..and your 'Mars work' all the time. My DD (17) wants to work at NASA.

FYR -

It is my pleasure to meet you. I am honored that you have chosen my thread on which to reveal your presence. I will consider carefully your suggestion of logistics.

Now, to more important matters. Even though I know you are long since over the hurdle of knowing that what you (FWW) did was wrong, it is sad that your H does not understand (or been able to accept) the concept of forgiveness. NONE of us stands blameless and / or sinless, your H is torturing himself as much as you. It is so unfortunate that he (to this point) chosen not to accept the gift of a loving W, forgiven her for being imperfect (okay, even a sinner like all the rest of us), and moved on to enjoy life. I am glad to know you are there praying. And, by the way, thanks for the comments about the "kids". I am indeed a blessed man to have them. (DIL's have offered to make curtains for the apartment).

Also, break in anytime, this is just my version of a soap opera. Jump in wherever you want.

2Long- Say it ain't so. Is it true that you aren't a believer? BTW - I've a lot of ties to NASA, too.

<small>[ January 27, 2005, 02:44 PM: Message edited by: Formerly G.G. ]</small>

FGG,

Apologies for breaking in and talking to FYR, but I wanted to ask her something.

FYR have you ever asked your H if he is happy at this point or is he just sort of tolerating things.

If he is not particularly happy, then perhaps there is an opening here for you to salvage more of your marriage. I have a feeling that if he were to let you in, you just might be the woman that could make him happy. Just a thought.

God Bless,

JL