FGG:

I was a Christian Scientist growing up. That's why I remember those stories so well. ...plus, Doonsbury did a hilarious car2n about the cutting the baby in half story.

AD

"I'll just say that my office is about 30 seconds flying time..."

Not enough information. Need performance specs on the vehicle. The stuff we fly, for example, could get you halfway from LA 2 SanFranksDisco in 30 seconds. Talk about the reward being in the journey! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

-ol' 2long

<small>[ February 17, 2005, 04:29 PM: Message edited by: 2long ]</small>

CSUE:

I actually also heard the OW on the phone, there at the end, begging him to leave me. YUK!!!!

Another stupid comment from her that I actually heard her say during that conversation, that I will never forget: "So you still have feelings for her?"

What would she think after 28 years of marriage?

Good Morning to all -

Hummm....sounds like we could have a plan afoot. AD - incredibly enough, my first job (at 16 y.o.) was at the airport you reference. Also, that is where I learned to fly and got my P/P at 17. When I was dating WW (and she was GF), I used to take her flying out of that airport.

Okay, Gimble, AD and I are ready for instruction on the fly fishing. Ball's in your court. Is there a season to this thing, or can you do it year 'round? where are some good locations in our general part of the world?

Sounds like no P.D.G's allowed this trip.

Georgia

Now....on to more serious stuff.

I called #1S yesterday and he didn't return my call. Very unusual. I haven't heard from him or #1DIL for several days.

This morning I have an e-mail from #1DIL, in part it says the following:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I have to be honest and tell you that #1S really doesn't want to think about anything right now. He is so upset and sad. I know we all are, but he seems to be taking it really hard. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I wrote her back and told her that I understand. Then I wrote some more just general stuff.

I have been afraid that the burden of all this might be such that the family would need to "escape" by distancing themselves from me as well as WW. I know that this must be very hard on them.

Any thoughts about this from any of you?

Georgia

I think it's good for all of you to stop dwelling on your WW. She's getting too much focus in your lives. I know this may be a stretch but... distancing yourself from your boys might be a good idea for you right now. When you are with them, you might be tempted to talk about WW. Actually they need to have a R with both of you. Having been in that position before when my parents were separated, I couldn't help but want to try to get them back together. Their separation and eventual divorce when I was 30 yo was devastating. Until my F passed away, I had the fantasy of them reuniting.

See my point here, Georgia? You need to free yourself from that triangle and they probably need to feel freer, too.

Yea, Mimi..I do know what you are saying. This has all been so "unfair" (I hate that term) to them. They are young, just starting their adult lives and doing such a great job, then they have to deal with this.

I think in the same way Plan B has offered some peace to me, that they almost need a "Plan B" as well. They need peace in their lives, and daily conversation with me is a daily reminder of all that is happening, even if we can successfully steer the conversation to other areas.

As you can well imagine, that is very difficult for me at this point. But, it is unfair to them to be a "crutch" for me.

BTW - Looked at TV's at Wal-Mart last night. Probably will get one within a week or so, I've got to check on the cable siuation and maybe get internet hook-up as well.

Georgia

I'm glad that you realize that your boys probably need PLAN B. I'm just beginning to acknowledge how traumatized my YS was by all of this. I was so caught up in my own turmoil/depression that I did not take good enough stock on how it was affecting him. Our children used to be able to rely on us for support. Who do they turn to when we are no longer emotionally available to them or worse yet we begin to depend on them. I feel somewhat guilty about depending so much on my YS. He saw me at my worse, not eating, sleeping, crying uncontrollably, doing drivebys.... YUK! Oh well, he seems to be doing better now and enjoying college life, visiting his older brother this weekend.

I'm so excited for you at the idea of purchasing a TV. My new acquisition is a DVR from cable. This is new for me, too. The whole time that WH was gone I never watched TV or movies.....

I'm sorry to hear that your father has passed away, and that you had to experience the trauma of their divorce. What about your Mom?

BTW - Lunch with my parents today. They are being so very supportive of me, keeping me fed and laundered.

Georgia

It's a real Peyton Place in my family. My M remarried a total jerk whom I detest. My B recently told me that she was having an A with him while he was married. YUK! That's another whole story. I'm alright with me estranged from her and him at this time.

I was really close to my F's parents who were really more like parents to me. They died this year after being married 71 years. My grandmother was my role model.

<small>[ February 18, 2005, 08:10 AM: Message edited by: mimi1254 ]</small>

Mimi...I am so sorry to hear all this. Your grandparents BOTH died this year? Like, within the past 6 weeks, or do you mean within the past year?

Okay, I know that you'll not want to hear any of my suggestions that I am TOTALLY unqualified to offer....but I'm going to anyway.

It is obvious that your Mom has hurt you by her actions, and her re-marriage. But....I suggest you consider doing all you can to restore that relationship while you still have that opportunity. I know that is hard, and I also know it is NOMB. I'll not mention it again if you wish.

(CA'er telling me to shut-up....)

Georgia

Grandfather died Jan.04 and grandmother died July 04.

You have opened up a can of worms with the mother discussion. She was awful during the stuff with my H. Maybe it was because she was involved in an A before with her now husband. Everytime that I spoke with HIM or her about my sitch I felt more and more awful. She wanted me to D my H, tried to convince me to date and to find someone else. It really brought out all my issues throughout my life of how she could not accept me for who I am, more of a Christian, Prima Donna Goddess like my grandmother <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> .

I really seem to feel better without her in my life right now. At the right time, I feel like I will reconcile with her. It doesn't feel right yet. Plus, I have to go through her H. I have to respect that he is her H. He hates my husband, lied on him and is basically a liar. My M doesn't see that and is understandably happy with him.... A LONG STORY!!!!!

I'm so sorry for the pain you have endured there. I know it must be very hard...I'll butt-out.

What a great testimony to your grandmother that you can speak of her as your role-model. So sorry you have lost her, but your doing a great job carrying on her values as you represent that to others here, as well as your own family. I know she must have been proud of you.

Gotta go... a meeting at 10:00 that I'm chairing.

Georgia

Wow Mimi -

They were married 71 years! That's beautiful. I'm glad you had them for so long.

I'm proud of you that you're able to distance yourself from your unhealthy relationship with your mother. That's not an easy thing to do- it's much easier to get caught up in the "drama", I think especially mother/daughter stuff.

You sound at peace with it - and I'm sure it didn't come easily. You're a good role model for your boys.

GG, I have such empathy for your boys - sounds like they are going through a grieving process. I am relieved that both have supportive wives with them.

I think something that would help them would be for them to see "how well you're doing" - and being positive and upbeat about your future, and continue to show compassion for your wife's situation. I am amazed at how we as BSs seem to have to be the "greater person" in these situations. Called upon to be our best selves in light of our situations...but it's Ok at least for me, I consider it "character building"!

Thanks, CSue, for the comments.

Last Sunday when the whole gang was at my house (I'm going to quit calling it an apartment), #1S commented how relaxing and peaceful it was. #1DIL even told me later that he said he found it more peaceful than "our" house. He read on the couch while #1DIL laid on ths same couch with her feet in his lap and napped.

But...just as they were leaving is when WW showed up unexpectedly. I think that is what has really gotten to #1S, he saw the way his Mom looks. I know that really hurt him, and I so wish that he hadn't seen her.

I know what you are saying about the positive, upbeat attitude. But it is so hard to be GENUINE and not phony, and I feel like they see through me quickly if I try to put on a false front for them.

However, I do think I can be "encouraging" about my future, and include them at the right time in those discussions.

Mimi - My parents also have a hard time with the WW thing. Doesn't help that she made it a point to go tell them what lousy IL's they have been, and brought up stuff from 28 years ago. They have said they never want her back in their house again. So...I understand where you're coming from.

Georgia

G'morning GG,

(It is still morning)

It's amazing what a small world it is!

2Long,
I'm glad the high speed craft you're working on don't come here. We don't have a huge amount of traffic, but we do have a 13500ft runway (I'm sure 2Long has a longer one <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> ) I don't worry about the regular traffic, but sometimes there's somebody in a C5 practising touch-and-go's all day. That is a bit unnerving. I'm imagining some pale kid (or rusty reservist) in one seat and an old fat guy napping in the other seat - while they repeatedly pass over my office (and my house) at low altitude. I'm just on the other side of the highway from the airport.

GG,

I think the reality of the crisis is finally dawning on your sons. I'm sure they need some time to mourn. I'm sure they'll be there for you in the long run.

-AD

AD:

Our last 2 "runways" were about 80 kilometers long, and we needed every centimeter! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

FGG:

I'm having such a tough time right now with the plan A/plan B stuff. I still think I'm doing what's right for me, but I agree with the proponents of plan B that it is very difficult. When it "ends", I hope my M comes out the other side intact, but it might not.

-ol' 2long

2Long -

We have done market research and determined that there is very limited demand for such a vehicle in the corporate world. However, there is again renewed interest in a SST-BJ. However (IMO), as soon as we enter into another down business cycle, those interests will wane (been watching that repetitive cycle for over 2 decades).

On the Plan B thing, do you like pain, or what? If you've been putting up with the stuff it sounds like for as long as it seems like, Plan B should be a snap for you. Okay, I take it back. Let's just say that for me, Plan B is "easier" to take than watching WW obsess over OM 24/7.

Sounds like if you wish to join us fly fishing, we can discuss (as well):

1. WS's
2. Flying Machines

A question for you, 2Long - Have you ever wondered why we (folks like you and I) can't seem to build as "graceful" of a flying machine as the ones' that occur "by accident" in nature?

Okay, I'll not debate. That is just a thought that me and a coworker had one day while watching geese skim across the river. Amazing how our best attempts are still loud and pollute.

Georgia

FGG:

My vehicle isn't for the corporate world. It's for exploring other worlds <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Re pain: I hate it, but I use it 2wice a day! (paraphrasing an old Listerine commercial). <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> Seriously, though. I do believe pain is a necessary part of growth. I just wish I would stop growing and reach my full height, already! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

At least I don't believe I'm dealing with OM in my W's life 24/7. I'm hoping that Penny's right and it's withdrawl, that RM has moved on with his miserable life (self-inflicted). I do worry that contact has continued 2 a degree, but it's definitely not the same thing as dealing with an active, if remote, A.

So, it's painful, but not excruciatingly so.

As a geologist who started life out very interested in paleontology, I was absolutely fascinated by all the ways different animal orders implemented flight. Take birds and pterosaurs, for instance. In both, the fourth finger seems to have supported the outer half of the wing beyond the "hand", whereas bats have fingers within the wing membrane. Pterosaurs were originally thought 2 have been just bare-skinned, like reptiles, but I believe are now thought 2 have had fur, like bats. Life is wonderful.

[edit: I forgot, birds fingers are all short. The feathers comprise the outer portions of their wings. Pterosaurs and bats have really long finger bones 2 support the wing membranes]

-ol' 2long

<small>[ February 18, 2005, 01:44 PM: Message edited by: 2long ]</small>

2Long -

I assumed your work to be related to S/V's. We (WW, myself, and tiny #1S)were in the spectator stands for the first shuttle launch (4/11/1981, I think). WW was at several of the Apollo launches. Lots of family history with the space program.

I certainly can't outguess your Plan A vs. Plan B thinking, but you've obviously received better counsel than I could offer.

On the "life is wonderful" idea (I know we are REALLY getting way off MB stuff now, forgive me. Also, don't feel compelled to answer if you don't wish to do so)...do you, with all your biological knowledge (of which I have NONE) believe that life is "by chance"?

Georgia

Be Careful, Georgia. You are in danger of calling out- You Know Who- back into your thread. You asked that person to back off for awhile and here you go.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />