Faith -

Hang in there, girl. It gets better and better. The more you go on with your life, the less you will miss WH.

I'm volunteering at my work on the floor that has the casualties coming back from Fallujah. It REALLY has changed my perspective. All these guys are so young - mostly 17, 18, 19.

My WH? Who knows what he is doing, but whatever it is, it is nothing that matters in the big picture.

So keep on doing what you are doing, and hopefully your WH will figure out what is really important in life.

Hi FIM... I was wondering about wh's visit with his mom. Have you talked about it with your mil?

I hope you're doing well. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Isleepwithacat
Isleepwithacat@yahoo.com

First of all, thank you to everyone who has been keeping us in your thoughts. I think we're getting the positive thought vibes here:)

It's been crazy around here, but I'm going to try and keep this short.... let's see how it goes!

The baby's toe is finally healed. After a total of four doctor's visits and a change in antibiotics, he is doing great. BUT, last Thursday, Regina fractured her collarbone on the playground at school. Now she's in a sling for four weeks. She liked it at first but is now irritated with having to wear it.

Dork is as dorky as ever. His visit with his mom went well, I guess. I do believe he got to her though. I've only talked with her once since he left and she seemed a little more reserved. She could also just be tired though. His sister arrived from Switzerland the day before he left, so she's been run pretty ragged lately.

He has been calling, oh, about 15 - 20 times a day since Friday. I didn't hear from him at all last Wed. and Thurs. but then Friday morning he called and said that OW was gone.

I'm not sure what he thought that should mean to me.

She's been deployed somewhere...he won't tell me where because I'm such a scary stalker <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> (My interpretation, not a quote) So, ever since she's been gone, he has been calling with I love you's and I miss you's.

He is flying here for Thanksgiving. He gets in at 2pm. I've told him my family will be at my aunt's and he'll need to find a way to the house. I also told him that while I will let him stay at the house, he will need to be in the basement (no heat, no bathroom). I had told him a few days ago that I thought it might be a bad idea for him to come here at all because it would send the kids the wrong message. He had purchased the ticket though, so he'll be here.

Our conversations have been very light. Not much relationship talk, unless he brings it up and I just go on about how much fun the kids and I are having. I answer about 1 out of every 10 calls.

Last night he called and was a bit down because he'd been trying to call for a few hours and asked if I had seen that he was trying to get through. I told him, "Ya. But I was on the phone with a friend and she was telling me about today's Oprah show. Did you know it was her My Favorite Things episode. I just love that one! She gave away......" and went on for about five minutes.

Then, I stopped and asked him if he would babysit the kids on Saturday. I told him I had seen an old friend from high school and we thought it would be fun to go shopping and since he was home....well, it would be the perfect time.

Silence. (sad, shiny voice) I was hoping to spend the day with you. But, I guess I can see how you'd need a break. Okay. Well, at least we'll spend Friday together.

Me: Uhhh, the kids and I are going to Seattle for the day. I told you that.

"But I thought we decided I would go with you."

"No. We decided it was okay for you to come here for Thanksgiving. I think we'd send the wrong message to the kids if we spent a happy-go-lucky family tradition day together."

"Maybe it wouldn't be the wrong message."

Me: "I tell you what. Let's error on the side of caution with this one. If we end up together someday, great. They will be happy. But since I don't see us on that path, let's just be careful." (This is the line he used on me 100 times about why he was filing for divorce...error on the side of caution)

(sad, whiny voice) Okay. I guess it's not fair to push myself on you right now.

"Anyway, you said you wanted to take the kids to see Polar Express. You can do that on Saturday while I'm out"

WH: Wait just a minute! You said we can all go to the movie!

"I don't see where we'd have the time. The kids and I won't be back on Thanksgiving until about 9pm. Friday we'll be in Seattle until about 9 and the kids will be exhausted. Saturday, I'm going out with my friend, so I guess if I get home earlier enough we could maybe go then. Then you leave Sunday. Why don't you just plan on taking them."

WH: "But when do I get to spend time with you?"

Me: "You know, why don't we just play things by ear and see what happens. But, hey, I need to get the kids to bed so I need to get going. Have a good night"

He reluctantly got off the phone and I hung up with a huge smile on my face.

Dork.

So, when he get to my house this is what will greet him.

New Christmas stockings for me and the kids. Only. There are four holders and four stockings. No room for the fifth. It would mess up the balance of the appearance on the mantle anyway.

Guest sheets, blankets and towels in the basement. I'll also have a little basket put out that I give to guests. I put soaps and shampoo and a few little snacks in it whenever we have an overnight guest. He thinks it is cute that I always do that. Now, he's the guest.

All pictures of him have been removed from the walls and the main part of the house. Our wedding picture and any of him are now in the kids room. Only.

I've redone my bedroom. No room for him there now. The drawers that used to be his have some of the baby's clothes in them. His clothes have all been boxed and put in the garage. This includes his winter clothes...which he may need since I doubt he took any with him to SAT and will therefore not be bringing back with him.

His mail...on the mailbox pick up marked "NOT AT THIS ADDRESS".

The phone message has already been changed to include the number where he can now be reached.

He should also be surprised when he finds out I paid our bills with his "secret" bank account.

Dork.

So, that's what is going on here. I'm feeling good and looking at a couple of different full time job opportunities. The apartment I want will be available in January, so if I don't take a job out of state, that's where we'll be moving.

All in all, the kids and I are doing good and enjoying our time together. We'll continue to do that this weekend, with Dork listening to the family laughter, smelling the homecooked meals and seeing my family's life from the outside, as the outsider he has made himself.

Wow FIM!

You sure know how to cook a turkey!

-AD

Hey Sweetie,

No one deserves this hurt.

You seem to be handling the situation well, you are a woman of action and you have a plan.

You seem to have your life planned out...but also let your WH know it is because of the hurt you have seen in your kids and have felt yourself that you have to go to these measures to protect yourself and the kids.

Otherwise, he starts to look at this as a battle...("Grumble,grumble...she's playing some silly game, kicking me out of my house.") And doesn't understand that you are doing this because of HIS actions, not to get back at him, but to protect you and the kids from his apathetic, halfway contact.

Let him know if you had your d'ruthers you would have wished him to stay somewhere else because it is ENTIRELY too painful to have him under the roof knowing he doesn't want to give up the OW.

I know, these are all things you are doing, and doing an EXCELLENT job of it...keeping a good, upbeat attitude. I guess I'm saying, let him know the consequnces of his actions are a great deal of pain also...the guilt is hard on him now, but if he were to feel the full brunt of his actions? The guilt may nearly kill him.

Wow FIM,

Strong stance indeed. Hope this helps him see what he is missing.

So what if the OW didn't get deployed? What happens if she shows back up in his life again?

I see the value of the BS not wanting the OW in their lives. That was and still is a biggie for me.

All the best.
L.

I frankly have a hard time trusting the deployment thing.

It could very well be a ruse with him thinking that if he tells me she's gone I will believe there is nothing to worry about and be more open to his fence sitting.

Then again, he's called more in the last four days than all the calls in the last month combined. So, she's probably not there RIGHT NOW. 3-6 months though? I'm not buying it.

He tells me he is staying in billeting on Fort Sam too. More likey? Staying at her apartment, at least for the remainder of the month.

I'm still not as dumb and trusting as he'd like to believe I became when he started his A.

He also admits that he is still talking with OW and has strong feelings for her. He tells me that he thinks that maybe they aren't meant to be together though since things keep happening to keep them apart. Dork.

He says he thinks his feelings for her will just kind of fade with their separation, especially since he's missing me so much. (insert puke smiley)

I do hope he sees what he is missing. I am very adament and set though in moving on and maintaining my family without him.

Unless he is willing to DEMONSTRATE change and desire to repair this marriage, woo ME back, enter IC and MC with Steve and maintain those changes and desire for an extended period of time, I'm not changing that stance.

I'm not counting on that. I don't even know that I HOPE for that.

fim

I've never posted to you before, but felt I had to at least once.

Your clever and grounded approach to all this mess is awe inspiring!

The Republicans may be looking for an answer for Hillary in 2008, and I daresay you would be a great choice.

Seriously, I know all of this takes a toll, and requires much of your energy, but your class and humor are nothing short of remarkable.

I so hope WH comes crawling back to you on his hands and knees, and defogs to his "old" self and your marriage becomes yet another MB succes story.

Stay strong, as you inspire us all!
SD

Do you have the Plan B letter ready?

And will you go dark after this "visit"?

How about how he can prove there is NC if/when he comes back? (Open cell phone account, email passwords, etc...)

double post

<small>[ November 23, 2004, 04:17 PM: Message edited by: faithinme ]</small>

I just posted my Plan B letter. I absolutely plan on implementing it when he leaves. 100%.

The "master plan" has been to let him come, remind him of what he left (after all, it's been a WHOLE MONTH since he's been gone and I don't know how long anything stays in Dork's memory), and then BAM! take it all away. That it's right at the holiday's doesn't hurt.

I can't imagine what would help me to believe NC was truly in place. I guess that's part of the roadmap to our future we'll have to look at should we get that far.

Frankly, right now, I'm not counting on it. I am beginning to doubt my ability want him back. I am willing to try though should hell freeze over and he is willing to do the work.

Quick post here ( I will try and be brief):

I think it is HIGHLY PROBABLE that after this holiday weekend you will have won your husband back....well, at least another "chance" at meeting his EN's, showing him admiration, and letting him have his family back. I know that you say that you "may not want him back, etc..", but based PURELY on your actions and remarks in your posts that is nowhere near the case....at least in my humble opinion. That is ok, he is lucky he was such a good and honorable man during the "other" times in your marriage for you still to have some level of love for him after all that he has done to you and the children. The OW being deployed was a good break for you and you need to take advantage of this to win him back. He seems like the guy who could be "out of sight, out of mind", so this is a great break for your marriage. If he can't be with her now, he will surely want to be with you. He strikes me as the kind of guy who "needs" someone at all times in his life (hence his numerous previous affairs while on deployment)....do I have that right? or am I mistaken ?

Yeah, I know you may say "that is not good enough for me", but you want to be married right? You want the kids to have an "intact" home right? After all that he has done to you, you still are willing to do PLan B to save the marriage, so I think in the end this may just be enough for you to consider yet another reconciliation with him. Once again, purely my opinion based on your previous actions and posts. There is no doubt in my mind that you will get a chance to win his love and committment back.....and for him to "pledge".. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> to you to do the same.

I can almost write the next chapter in your story. Your WH will be back amidst the beautifully decorated house, fresh smelling desserts, and loving children and be hit with a strong sense of "FAMILY" and will SAY OR DO ANYTHING to convince you he is now willing to go NC and commit to your marriage. It is pretty evident that this will happen. I think you probably know this too, after all you have it all orchestrated perfectly. You are a very determined and intelligent woman and I am very impressed with you on all of this. What kind of a guy leaves his family and devestated children for some OW and still says things to you like "When will we have time for us" "I miss you and love you". <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> ? He obviously deep down inside thinks that he can "get you back" if he so desires. Honenstly, FIM, do you really blame him for thinking this? You have taken him back time and time again, and YET AGAIN are ready to do it again.....as clearly spelled out in your very well written PLan B letter posted here earlier. All he has to do is say NC and pledge to you that he will "work" on the marriage and he gets another chance. He knows this and so do you. I am not saying there is anything wrong with any of this. Hopefully your storied marriage is blessed in the Marriage Builders Recovery Hall of Fame (if there is such a thing <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> . Your husband will someday have to really thank you for essentially keeping this marriage alive singlehandedly (but you know all of this already). I think you have done a masterful job of handling his affairs and betrayals and whether you know it or not you have battled back from out of nowhere to get another chance with him. I may be premature in saying this but I will do so anyways: Congratulations!!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> and good luck, I hope your "marriage recovery" goes well. I sincerely doubt that you will need the Plan B letter, but even if you do, it is still a very good bet that you will get another chance with your husband. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

It bothers me that his sudden desire to reconnect with you coincides [ <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> ] with OW deployment.

I'll bet you know why. Until he leaves his affair of his own free will while she is available and coaxing him to stay with her..I wouldn't take him back..because you and I both know he can pledge the world to you and his kids on Monday, and change his mind on Tues if he smells fresh meat, lie about it, and make everyone run around in a big circle.

I think a truly solid Plan B is in order. I think it should outlast OWs deployment ..after all..he needs to prove over a loooong period of time how committed he is this time..it isn't his first A or his second.. unless you lock him in a closet you are taking a real chance here..no..you aren't even taking a chance. If he does not deal with his character issues you will almost certainly do this dance as many times as you can stand before losing ultimately to the latest piece of @ss, I'm very sorry to say.

I think stick with the original plan..he visits..sees what he stands to lose..and then makes a decision. That he will have to work for the realization of..perhaps for months or years before he is granted full status. IC is a must..unless he really sees a problem..he won't even want to fix it. He won't see a problem unless you make it a problem for him.

I do hope that you and yours enjoy your holiday [dork too]..and that the beginning of the journey home is taken..just please please do not get caught up in wishfull thinking and believe his tripe.

Noodle

I'm with noodle, FiM. Until he can stand in her presence and feel nothing and STILL choose you and the kids, he can't be trusted. Instead of "dork" maybe you should dub him "yo-yo." <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I love your plan and your Plan B letter. Go for it!

Hey, LM, you're getting kinda soft there, buddy! Glad to see you chiming in and supporting FiM.

Hang tough, FiM, hang tough!

~ Snow

Had a reply and it was lost. Dang it.

And it was brief. Like LM's "brief" post. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Too tired now. Will be back tomorrow.

Have a wonderful night.

But, in a nutshell, you're all correct.

He's still trying to play both sides.
He thinks he can.
He has reason to.
He thinks I don't see what he's doing right now.
He's wrong.

Be back tomorrow. Have a wonderful night. And...go to sleep people:)

Oh Faith this is perfect. Yes, you have to live like this is it to protect yourself. Just let him know the way home, I like your plan b letter, and leave it to him. It is your family now and he can visit the kids...it was his choice. The secret account is your money too. Too bad you can't get back what he spent elsewhere.

Oh the OW is gone, yea, like gone home to her family for Thanksgiving..please. I don't believe she left for good. He's still trying to keep one foot there. Like her family would be happy she brought home a MM. Just wait till they get thru with her, unless they are equally dysfunctional!

Your plan is great, while he was out, life went on. He needs to understand that. Why get excited about him coming home if he's just going to go back. Hey, it's his choice. Let him know what he is missing.

You are perfect. I love that you redid your room and put his clothes in the garage. I love the four stockings. Perfect. Consequences of actions-period. God bless. You are doing everything correctly as usual. Does he know the HS friend is female? Don't let on!

Say you do want him back. Say he does want to come back. Does he know what to do?

I think he will get the point that you aren't going to let him waltz right back into your life with what you plan to do this weekend. And that's good. But he might get the message that you don't want him at all. But if you can give him a list of what he needs to earn your trust back, then at least he knows there is a path.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by wannabophim:
<strong> But he might get the message that you don't want him at all. But if you can give him a list of what he needs to earn your trust back, then at least he knows there is a path. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Wannabop,

Look for FiMs Plan B letter elsewhere on this board. There is no way Dork could interpret it as "she doesn't want me." And, her guidelines are pretty clear, too. It's a good letter. Check it out.

~ Snow

Faith...how is thanksgiving going? Did Dork arrive?

Hope you are enjoying it despite all...

Love

Debra xx

I am praying for you. Praying and praying. Hope you feel it and hope he feels me praying for your marriage. (I sound like a religious freak, but really, it helps). Sigh.