Hi everybody,
this is my first day here, so now I give it a try with my story.
My H is in the Army and after he came back from Iraq last year in october, the Army moved him back to the States.
We decided together, that it would be better for me and our children to stay behind in Germany, since we owe a house over here and I am a local national anyway. He planned on trying to come back as soon as possible and the first month he really tried but then...

For the last 11 years of our marriage we have been here in Germany and my H always says, that he wants to retire over here. So for the last 11 years I raised our children S10,D4 more or less by myself and took care of everything.
It didn't take my H very long though, to get involved with an OW and her two children and let her move in with him.
This has been going on now for almost a year and I found out about 6 months ago because a girlfriend of the OW called me one night to let me know about it just in time to make sure, we would not all meet at a family reunion in Florida in July.
He keeps telling us, that he wants to return back to Germany and that he already put paperwork in for it but can I believe that?

He has not seen his children now for almost 9 months except for 1 day in July and still, he finds excuses not to come here and see us even for Xmas although I did not ever go off on him or anything like it.
Is he just going the easy way, so that he does not get into an argument with OW or what? In July, since I did not want to meet him in Florida after finding out about it, he came to visit us in Germany instead but already when he arrived he told me, he had only gotten approved 10 days of leave instead of the 3 weeks that had been planned for Florida and he also told me and our councelor, that he had broken up with the OW.

Well, after 3 days of him seeming to be depressed or maybe missing her, who knows,I saw his leave form and of course he still had the 3 weeks of leave approved. That same evening I caught him on the phone with the OW and boy, she really got him by the b...
Every other word from that OW was bs and I have never heard anybody use this word as often in my lifetime as this lady used it in one conversation.
So I asked my husband to pack up and leave and he did that in a heartbeat and flew back to her, to spend the rest of the 3 weeks with her.

She must have already made it real hard for him the first time, to even come at all and see us, so maybe she is doing the same thing right now about Xmas, especially since her bday is on the 29th of dec. as well! But shouldn't he be man enough to tell her off...? He talks to me on the phone once in a while and tells me about how it is gonna be once he is back here and so on but his actions don't say the same thing then his words do!I suggested to him for us to come see him but he does have excuses for that too, like we would be in his way while he is moving and so on, like he is actually moving on Xmas day?!

He did not tell me yet where he is moving to or with whom, he just said he wanted to separate from her and that he could not just throw her out on the other hand, after helping her so much.
Our children miss their daddy very much and the little one keeps asking him every time on the phone when he is coming back and still; not even for Xmas!
Should I just tell him- either you come over here or we come over there? Any suggestions?

Or should I just stick to plan A, since he said he put the paperwork in to get stationed over here again by the latest in the summer?

HELP!!!

Of course my family and friends say by now, I should let him stay where he is, especially since he does not plan on coming for Xmas!

dakotamoon|

<small>[ February 01, 2005, 09:53 AM: Message edited by: dakotamoon ]</small>

No advice here! But I would read the many posts on here and you will see there are more than enough women and men on here who have taken back their cheating, lying, deceitful spouses many times over. Do you want to be right? or married? The key (as people proclaim here) is that you need to do everything in your power to meet your husbands Emotional Needs. You will need to not be outwardly angry with him or be confrontational. You may even need to hold and sooth him while he suffers the pain and depression over separating from the OW <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> . You have to find a way for him to know how much better life would be with you and your children so that he will give you another chance to win his love and committment back. The good thing is that affairs usually end, so you just may have to hang in there for a Loooong time and be the only one willing to save the marriage. This website is chalk full of many many examples of women/men who have suffered even far worse betrayal (Other Children, Financial Ruin, STD's to name a few) than you and have still fought for their marriages and wayward spouses. This community on this MB is the place for you to be if you want to save your marriage and win your spouse back. It is all here in black and white, just read. Good luck in winning your husband back. I am sure that you will someday get another chance with him and another chance to give him the support, and admiration that you did not in the first place which helped contribute to the circumstances that you are in. Please realize that you DID NOT cause the affair, these were solely his actions. Good luck.

<small>[ November 24, 2004, 11:36 AM: Message edited by: lemonman ]</small>

Hi everybody,
not much changed so far.
My WH is still in the US and we are still in Germany.
He did not come home to visit on Xmas but still tells us, that he wants to come back and live with us. He says he wants to separate from OW but she does not have enough money right now to live by herself... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />
Well, however.
Most of the time we are the ones initiating contact and if we ask him how come he hardly ever contacts us in return his reply is always the same; no money to recharge his calling card etc.
Unbelievable, isn't it?! Yesterday he send an email to our children, telling them that he loves and misses them so much and that he hopes to be home for good by summer. If not he says he'd come visit.
First time in a year although he has had leave many times but he always spend it with the OW and her children instead.

How much truth is in these statements of him.
He also tells me that he talked to his Sergeant Major about wanting to be stationed back in Germany with his family etc. but how can he talk like this to his superior and at the same time walk around and live with that OW and her children openly in this military community?
Most of the people he works with know that he is married and also know about him living with the OW.

So many people still know my WH and me as a couple from Germany and at the same time that he tells me about wanting to come back home, he tells me having had invited a few couples we know from Germany for a barbecue with him and his roommaid. He never usually talks about the OW but I told him that I know about her and her children living there too and I asked him if he knows how much a statement like that hurts me?

By the way; what reason would a grown man have to move in with my WH, the OW and her children?
Yeah, my husband and that man had been roommates before and then the OW moved in with them but why would he move with them again to the next home?
My WH says, that his friend did it because he knows about my WH wanting to leave the OW as soon as he gets paperwork to go back to Germany and to help her cope with it?! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

I don't believe much of this but what can I do? I cannot really do much of a Plan A over this distance or can I? Plan B still scares me because already now we do not have much contact and making that even less, won't that hurt more then it does good?

Opinions please, thanks!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

dakotamoon

BS (me)39
WH 34
S10,D4
Married 11 yrs

Bumping, as I really need a reply please! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

dakota . . . this is not a man who loves you or even seems to care anything about you or your children. This is a man who is going around the world starting families and making children, only to abandon them to go start another one somewhere else.

He has abandoned you. You need to take steps to secure your family and your finances and stop waiting for him to do it. He has made it clear that he is not a husband or a father; he is a playboy who is just stringing you along because he knows you'll sit and wait for him while he goes off with his girlfriends for months and *years* at a time.

Fence-sitting is one thing, but this man has simply deserted you and your children. Get help from the military and find out what your rights are. You must move forward and stop sitting and waiting for a man who has no interest in being part of your family. Otherwise, you and your kids can look forward to a lifetime spent in limbo hoping that this man will magically wake up and want to be your husband and father. Dakotamoon, he is not going to do that.

Help is out there. So is a much better man. Good luck.
Mulan

I agree with Mulan. You've been in limbo long enough. You could Plan A this man into the next decade and it wouldn't matter. He sounds like the kind of man who'll abandon you now but will come home someday with a dreaded disease and want you to nurse him.

I hardly know what to do in my own relationship but it looks to me like you've tried all you can. Now, take him for everything he has.

Is he supporting you financially? Check out your options with the military. This type of conduct is 'supposed to be a no no'. You could even file that he abandoned the family and his short messages are attempts to string you all along while he plays house in the US.

Sorry for the rough talk.... I think your H is a jerk.

L.

<small>[ January 21, 2005, 06:39 PM: Message edited by: Orchid ]</small>

Thanks to you all for your support!

Orchid, yes he supports us financially (we have to pay off a house over here in Germany)but he cannot deal with money and already now he gets himself into deep depts in the U.S. by buying a very expensive car ($35,000) etc. without even talking to me about it before hand.

The military won't do much but tell him to either divorce me or leave her and so far his choice was always to divorce me only to tell me different again the next day.
I wish I could talk to his superior to ask him if my husband really tries to get back here and talks to him about it.

Do you think a Plan B would still be worth trying or not? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

One of the OW's friends keeps calling me, telling me that she wants her girlfriend to leave my WH because she thinks that he is playing her and will leave her as well some day, she'll even ask me stuff like " Are you all really filing for a divorce" and stuff like that.
Sometimes I get the feeling the OW has somebody call me from time to time to find out about things he is telling her... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> I know that he tells her that it is just about the lawyer right now and then the D will be final but we did not even file yet!

However, you cannot see love, one can only show and feel love, which I do not do at the moment!

dakotamoon <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

<small>[ January 22, 2005, 04:18 AM: Message edited by: dakotamoon ]</small>

To your benefit may be his lack of funds. This could hurt your family also, so secure your finances. Make sure he doesn't try to remove you from his insurance or other coverages. Find out his child support requirements and spousal support obligations.

Don't answer the OW's spys questions. You can plant some doubt if you want. We can help with the reverse babble if you need it.

take care,
L.

Orchid,

that would be great, I could really need help even recognizing a babble, not to mention replying to one, thanks again!

But what about the Plan B, do you think that would help? Or what else could I do?

dakotamoon

I would attack this issue on two seperate plains...


the first and most important issue is his abandonment of the children....

what are their ages by the way....

your husband is visiting great heartache on your children...

their belief and imagination that they are replacable is tenfold as he lives with some stranger children instead of them....

the thought is heartbreaking....

first off you stop ALL communication with OW friend...she is as much as a no-body to you as is the OW....and you should never ever ever correspond with her again.....

second is he providing for your financially what is the childrens...if not you need to pursue this through the legal system...

the protection of the childrens well being is seperate from the re-building of a marriage...it is the nature of the beast of their creation and no matter how much a WS cries foul and tries to accuse you of love busting...their words ring falsely....do not give a minutes worry to his reaction over any and all means that you pursue to secure your childrens financial safety....

you also need to seek out legal counsel...what is to stop him from demanding you send the children to the states to visit..you must seek legal counsel on NO NO NO exposure to the OW and her children.....

thirdly...
you must do all that you can in your power to facilitate communication betweeen him and the children...
send him calling cards...
meet his excuses head on...

send him things the children draw...
let them write letters to him...expressing their feelings and hurt...

watch the kids closely for signs of anything..
let their teachers and counselors know of the hurt they are feeling....

do all you can to facilitate communication between him and the children...
then go to plan B...

choose out of his sick waffling chaos....

write your letter and post it here..

use all resources available to you through the government...
find support groups...

ARK

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> Thanks ARK, your mail was very helpful!
Last week he asked me to send him pictures of the children and some german coffee he (and his coinstructors at the Military Academy)like so much but should I even do that? Maybe for Valentine's day?
Would a Plan B letter not keep him from wanting to come back and putting in the paperwork that is necessary to even come back?

Our son (10) has been seen by a child psychologist (german and american and they both evaluate him the same way)ever since last july and the military councelor even wrote a very strong statement to get a compassionate reassignment for my WH to come back to Germany and my WH says he wants to put that in and hopes to be back by summer.

Is that something to believe or is it just babbling?
If he really wanted to recommit, would he be able to leave her eventhough he would occasionally still bump into her, as it usually is in a small military community?

My WH likes taking the easy road, so I am assuming that he plans on just leaving her as soon as he has the orders in hand to be stationed back here in Germany, if at all.

He tells me how much he wants to save our marriage and how bright he sees our future if we both meet somewhat in the middle and we both can give and take...
Sounds good but can I believe it?
I emailed him trueheart's letter for the WS and he immediately emailed back saying it was long but good. That's all he said about it, talking again about him talking to his sergeant major about coming back to Germany.

Before the A was disposed, he called the kids every sunday but now he will only email or call(if at all)at times, that he is at work.
The only phone number we have had for the last six months was his cellphone number and he says he does not have a home phone.

Well, I know he does not have email at home but...
Should I let the kids call him whenever they want to or reduce that too?
The little one always wants to call him where as the older one is more and more reluctant.

I will sit down now and work on my Plan B letter in case I will want to send it but I'll post it here first for all of yours advice and opinion on it!

Thanks again and take care <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

dakotamoon

BS (me)39
WH 34
S10,D4
married 11 years

<small>[ January 22, 2005, 08:02 AM: Message edited by: dakotamoon ]</small>

Hi,

this is a letter I send to my WH 3 weeks ago and he said that he loves that letter and that he is gonna keep it.

Quote:

Dear *,

how are you? I’m doing o.k.
I’ve been thinking a lot lately and I’ve given those eleven years of marriage
a lot of thoughts.
I tried to figure out what went wrong. It took me a few days to finish this letter
and I hope you understand what I’m trying to say.
I guess we both lost track on our way together and with all the problems we had from the very beginning we forgot to be ourselves, the people we were when we fell in love with each other.

I tried to control you in any way and that was my big mistake.
I didn’t let you be yourself. I wanted to “raise” you like you were my first born, like I thought it was right, “my way”.
I thought that was my job as your wife and I took advantage of you without even knowing and got more and more control over you.

I did everything in the house, had my hand over the money, did the papers, bills and left you with no responsibility at all. I even controlled the sex part. I only made love with you when I wanted to but not when you needed it.
I did not meet your emotional needs and instead I took over you slowly but surely.
Unfortunately you took it the way it was until you had to leave.
When you were gone you probably realized how bad things got and I still didn’t know.
I didn’t want to be this way but it happened and you and me let it happen that way.
You never said anything or maybe didn’t make it clear enough to me, how you really felt and what you really wanted. I made all the decisions for you.

I wanted you as a strong person, which you were when we met but instead I made you weak.
I believe a lot of things that went wrong were my faults but we both made mistakes and unfortunately marriage and love don’t come with instructions about how to preserve it!
I wanted to make our marriage work the way that I thought was right but obviously that was not your idea of how a marriage should be.
It never occurred to me that I could hurt you with the way I treated you.
I didn’t watch out for your feelings, I was too busy to feel sorry for myself in between taking care of the children, cleaning and everything else that I thought was important at the time.
But now I realize, that all these things and taking them too serious just stressed me out and I lost track of what was really important in our life.

I want you to take time and think about everything . I want you to be sure about your feelings, what your heart tells you is what you got to do.
I don’t want to push you or threat you or anything else, I just want you to make a decision and not to worry about weither you are going to regret it or not.
If you really love me * and you think our marriage is worth a try, then we will find a way to get back together and stay together.
I know I’ve said and done a lot of things that have hurt you deeply and I feel really bad about all of this but I cannot change it and I can’t even take it back because it already has done its damage.
Nothing could make you forget it. All I can say is, that I’m terribly sorry for all the mean things I’ve done to you which made our life no fun at all.
But I want you to know how much I love you and how proud I am of all the goals you achieved during these eleven years.

I want us to be able to rebuild our marriage someday in a way that will meet both our emotional needs and make us both happy.
I never thought that you could run away or that I could lose you. I was so sure that I had you and your love forever, that none and nothing could ever take it away!
But I was wrong, I didn’t realize how fragile our love was. I think I never realized, how important it is to be gentle with the feelings of your loved ones and to maintain a working relationship and sexlife, which was really resting in peace.

As we both know, one cannot and should not even try to change the other persons character but we could for sure find a better way of dealing with certain characteristics.
I can assure you that I am willing to do so and avoid the mistakes I’ve made in the past.

* , I want you to do what’s best for you even if that means you want to be without me!
I’m prepared to let go!

With my love
dakotamoon

___________________________________________________

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> Some of it I could use in my Plan B letter as well, right?!

dakotamoon

BS (me)39
WH 34
OW 30
S10,D4
married 11 years

<small>[ January 22, 2005, 08:55 AM: Message edited by: dakotamoon ]</small>

read here to get some grounding with plan b...


recent plan b link.....

ark

Actually dakota....this is a very good Plan A letter. Being that you are so far away...this was a good way to help the marriage look attractive. But what other parts of Plan A have you done? Have you exposed this affair? Talked to his parents? His siblings? Have you confronted him with how badly you feel knowing that he is raising someone else's children while his cry for him? All of these things are also part of Plan A. They need to be accomplished....so that when you move to Plan B...you are ready. Have you respectfully requested confirmation that he is really moving to Germany this summer?

Hi star*fish,

thanks for your reply. No, I never told him that about raising her children but that is a very important point.

I was afraid it would be LBing bringing up anything that has to do with her or her children.

Last week my WH told me that he is right now trying to fix the mess he constructed where he is right now but how do I know that any of his words are true?!

Yes, I did ask him for some prove.
When he told me the last time about him talking to his sergeant major, I said I needed some kind of prove for thatand he said that right now he'd go take the cell to the sergeant major's office so I could talk to him.

But since it was lunch time, he was not in his office, of course <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

So now, did he really take the cell there or did he already know ahead of time, that his superior was not in.

Well, however. Another thing he keeps telling me, is that the OW does only make so much money a month and that she has to pay such and such bills.
So I told him that if he would always want to be there to help her with her problems, then he would maybe be there for the rest of his life because from what he,s telling me, that is all t she's having, problems.

Another time he told me, that he had helped the OW to get away from her abusive husband and that by beeing there for her he had made it so much easier for her to leave him.
But what does that have to do with me and how should I reply to stuff like that, him telling me all about her problems? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

Yup, I'm pretty confused right now and don't know wether I should stick with Plan A or implement Plan B.


Got to go for now and fix dinner for my children
You all take care and thanks again <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

dakotamoon

Me 39
WH 34
OW 30
S10,D4
Married 11 years

Affair going on since 12/2003
Dday June 6th, 2004 call from OW's friend

<small>[ January 22, 2005, 10:26 AM: Message edited by: dakotamoon ]</small>

Hi everybody,

no call to the kids again this weekend.
Son tried to call WH yesterday on his cell but since it is a weekend and the OW is around he does not answer the phone, the usual!

As soon as he is back at work, he'll email again, telling us how much he misses and that he really loves his children.
He'll even state that he is back at work now, so we can call him now anytime.

Funny way to show your love to somebody, isn't it?!

Take care everybody <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

dakota


me 39
WH 34
OW 30
S10,D4
married 11 years
Affair startet 12/2003
I found out 6/6/2004 by OW's friend

Hi,

well, I'm back again with an update.
Sunday our daughter asked to call her dad and so she did.
What a surprise it was: he actually answered his cell although it was a weekend!
We were soon to find out why; he was on staff duty, so to speak at work and no OW around.

All evening the kids and him emailed photos and little messages back and forth and he even asked to talk to me about some unimportant stuff (whether or not my H's corvette was one day going to be our sons car).
I guess he thinks he can make our son happy with statements like that but what his son really needs, is his dad, not some stupid car!

Well, I beat him to the punch and told him right away, that I did not have much time to talk to him, since I had to get ready for work the next day.

So he kept talking with the children and I am still undecided about implementing Plan B.
Well, at the moment I am on business in Manhattan, sitting in the hotelroom with lots of free time on my hands, so maybe a good time to at least start working on a Plan B letter, before flying back to Germany tonight.As soon as I'm done with it, I'll post it here for your opinions, thanks for the support!

dakota


me 39
WH 34
OW 30
S10,D4
A startet 12/2003
I found out about A from OW's girlfriend 6/6/2004

<small>[ January 25, 2005, 09:09 AM: Message edited by: dakotamoon ]</small>

Hi again,

today I had to send my WH an email, stating all of our monthly expenses over here in Germany such as house payments and so on.
I want him to know, that I really need some of his pay in order to be able to pay our bills over here and not lose the house.
I did so because this month, after he moved with the OW and her children to a new house I already got $ 270 less from him then last month and I cannot let him go on with this.
Even if he is short as well, and I know he is, I am not the one driving around in a corvette with on OW by my side!
Not to mention, that I have to take care of our children as well!Am I right?!

You all want to know what he answered?
He replied the email with one word "Gotcha".

Is that babble or what? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

I send him back an email, saying "Thanks, have a great day" and added a nice smiley (mum with kids) to it.
Is that good bubbling back?

dakota <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Everybody take care

<bump> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />