What?!?! Digest my words? Good grief. Don't put too much thought into my drivel, you could go crazy trying to make sense of it all. Just take it for what it's worth ~ not a whole lot. Just some random thoughts, that I typed out. My fears, or concerns, or worries, do not have to become yours. It's probably all just doom and gloom, anyway.

Let's talk about something fun for a change. What exactly are we looking for in our investment property? And would you be interested in access to several large reservoirs? We don't have much need for Coast Guard here in Idaho, but the cops patrol the lakes to make sure we don't drink and drive our boats around. Which is good, we have a lot of *gasp* red-neck types here. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

Well, I thought this was sorta fun:

Oh, ok... I get it now....
hang on a second, I have some pesky little brain surgery to do, and then I'm gonna whip up some Chateaubriand for a snack.
Just random stuff, no big deal.

I have a feeling you get the point <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Hey, you'll be proud of me, maybe.... I just had a very lengthy (4 hours) visit from a YOUNG (36!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />), single woman (D'd, of course -- what are the odds(?))... I pretty much had to feign narcolepsy, or it would've gone on forever... or somewhere. (She lives up the street, and wants to buy the house, so her visit was supposed to be a business thing. I'll stop there... which is exactly what I did <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />)

Interesting scenario, given my situation in life these days. Or the last million days, I should say.

More tomorrow... maybe even something of substance!

Hi Spidey,

FIRST order of business on this late Sunday-afternoon-of-no-Eagles-game here in beautiful Pennsylvania. Ok, scratch the "beautiful" part <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

I want to thank you for that very nice little paragraph. I appreciate it -- a lot.

Ya see... EVERYTHING you said made perfect sense to me, and it really made me think. And maybe the good news here is that, yes, I've thought about some of that stuff before, and I think the "answers" are real, and good, and... IOW, you brought up all these incredibly important points, and I STILL feel good about, ummm, her -- and the concept of "us."

Thanks for that. But ya know what? It's like night and day.
In thinking about things today... I thought about asking you for your opinion on something, and maybe that will make my point, in a roundabout way.

What do you suppose would "happen" to someone if he (or she) spent a long, long time with someone... and he/she was never really loved, supported, etc........ but rather, neglected and rejected -- emotionally and physically and everything in between?

I'm not in my own little fog, nor rewriting history. Just coming to terms with the facts, as they become more and more apparent, the further away from my M I get.

RE-introduce a person (HSS) that was, at one point in my life, the most important person in the world to me... do a little involuntary comparison between what we had then, and what I lived with for 20-something years with VVVSTBXWWW... and the Night Vs. Day thing explodes in my face.

I DO know (after years and years of introspection - no exaggeration) what happened to HSS and me -- why I "blew her off" and felt like wandering around looking for something else. Very difficult, complicated subject. Not necessarily something I can't/won't talk about here -- just not right now, anyway.

Who knows, really. The last word was that I'd get the paperwork "next week." But I've heard the exact same thing since early September.
Plain and simple -- she's NOT in any hurry, apparently. I do NOT understand why she continues to stall everything until I bug her about it. And then she acts like she's got everything under control, and it's no big deal...
It just seems to me that a rational person (in the context of our situation, anyway) would want to get this over with.

From the first day -- many many months ago -- when she realized I no longer wanted her back, I think that confused her. That was very new and foreign to her. Part of that personality/character/whatever, I think. And, for what it's worth, in the last couple days I realized that I do still feel very sorry for her. I know... who cares that I feel sorry for her, right?? Doesn't mean a damn thing. Except that it leads me to that "place" that I don't want to go anymore -- in spite of what she did to me, there's a spot in my heart for her in some way...

Hmmm... am I "healing" or what? Maybe like any other wound, it itches once in a while -- but heals nonetheless.

Enough of that.

So, that Rambler-of-the-Year Award -- will I get that in the mail, or do I have to pick it up in person?

So how are YOU, Spidey? Don't worry, my self-absorption is turning me off, too (sorry) <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

ps. hey, my favorite song of all time just came on the radio (Southern Cross - Crosby, Stills & Nash -- yeah, I'm an old man!). I'd always crank that one at TEN at our boat parties <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

After she left... when that song came on the radio, it was Guaranteed Instant Breakdown, for months.

Now it's crankin' again :-) Thanks, Spidey :-)

I am, I am! A little (4 hours!) flirting goes a long way! It's good for you.


Wow, it all made PERFECT sense? Does that mean I am PERFECT? I'll have to make sure my H knows about this recent development. And I'm glad I participated in making you THINK. Thinking is very important, and should be attempted regularly.

Well, I don't have much to share. H and I had a very fun party Saturday night, and I drank too much tequilla. We had SUCH fun, though. Then yesterday I recovered from Saturday night. Getting old SUCKS.


Of course there is, it is in your nature (I've told you 10000 times if I've told you once!).


Right on! Definately coming up on the rollercoaster again. Don't forget to put your arms up at the top, and scream with a HUGE smile on your face, OK? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Spidey

Wait! No! No! No! Not this time -- this wasn't good!
Uh, she's not my type..... this was weird and uncomfortable. I almost wanted to say "ok, the house is yours for eight bucks, now will you leave, so I can go to sleep, all by myself?!?"

ALL true, but, I feel sorry for her. She's in a very rough spot in her life, and... blah blah blah........

He|| no. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

THAT was pretty funny, Spidey. Yes, in one sense, that's why Sunday was invented -- to recover from Saturday! (just kidding, of COURSE. I really know NOTHING about these things.)

So was this Margaritas, or ? And did you know that sometimes "yellow" tequila is just white tequila with yellow food coloring?

And does this mean you get to tend bar at our Big Party On The Water, while the rest of us act like idiots?

Lemme guess... you READ that somewhere, right?
C'mon... getting old is GREAT. Let me give you an example.

Um, tomorrow.
Maybe.

And aren't you supposed to be studying for school or something, old lady? :-)

Spidey, my friend.... where are you?

Well, the other morning I came in here with my coffee, and my cat got up in front of my monitor so I couldn't see what I was typing ~ you know, just like every other morning. I soon realized my 'puter was all gummed up! I couldn't get on the internet, my phone didn't work (they both run off our cable internet connection). It sucked. The next day, I finally got H's attention about it, and all he had to do was recycle our blah blah blah thingie. Whatever. I said, "If you knew it was that easy, why didn't you do it the day before?" He said, "I didn't know it was down." I said, "I told you it was down!" and he made some type of MALE noncommittal gutteral noise and deftly avoided the subject.

*sigh*

Then, the past couple days have been VERY busy. Yesterday, after running a very short 2 miles, then cleaning, I came home to kids and homework. Then, before dark, we had to rake 16 trees worth of leaves (and they are VERY tall trees, not little baby trees) and bag them, because the lawn recycle was coming this morning. And I don't want 20 bags of leaves in our landfill on my conscience! Needless to say, I was pooped last night. This morning, my hands were actually swollen and tender, and I have a big blister on my right palm. I wore my gloves, but gave them up halfway through for DS14, because H finally got home from work to help, and we ran out of gloves (the leaves also had, er, poops in them, from the dog. Hard to separate poops from one billion leaves!).

Then, this morning, I got to my cleaning job, and I had forgotten my rubber gloves. Actually, I didn't forget them, they fell out in my garage before I even left! I probably didn't notice in my frustration of trying to change out my mop head, but couldn't, because my hands were so sore and swollen and stiff! I ended up breaking the head off, and having to ask my client's H to pry the little plastic piece off for me. *UGH*

I was just about ready to speed back home and climb back into bed! But I persevered. Now, I am staying awake to go see the Harry Potter movie at midnight with H and the boys. Speaking of, I better go now and get them up from their "nap." Sorry I don't have anything really interesting to say. But I am here! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Spidey

Happy Saturday, Spidey!

What?!? Actually, I'm envisioning the next hit reality TV show..."The Slayers"
Whaddyathink? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

And believe me, I KNOW what Extreme Raking can do -- hope you're all back to normal!

How's everything in the musculoskeletal system holding up these days, anyway?
And are you still getting to the gym, or do I have to entice you with my new gym concept/business idea?

Things are also a bit mundane in this direction... working on creating more "bright spots" in my mind's eye, but it's still a strange world to be living in all alone. Still find myself very surprised to be in this (what feels like a) predicament at this stage of my life.
And I spend too much time thinking, I think...

Will things feel any differently if I ever do actually become D'd, I wonder?
She's stalling yet again on the papers...... and I'm convinced she still has a problem telling the truth, as a rule. What a terrible way to live your life!

And on the flipside, it feels more and more UNlikely that HSS WON'T be back in my life again... somehow. It just seems like that's the way things will "naturally" go -- if I let things run their course. The tough part is that just about everything feels urgent, like I have so many years to make up for, and the days tick by.... AND, the High Road ain't all that much fun, either.

Yikes! Too heavy for a Saturday morning!

Check in when you can, Spidey...... hope all is well with you :-)

All my replies will be short, because the HEATHEN boys spilled root beer in my ergonomic keyboard, and it broke. So, now I am typing on H's laptop, and it is 2 steps forward, and 1-3 steps back.

I'll check in later. H needs to use his puter. *sigh*

Spidey

Hi tqt,Spidey,

I feel compelled to jump in here and say what's on my mind.I have been holding off saying anything to be sure what I felt was true and how to say it.

tqt,I was one of the first people to post to you when you arrived.I have followed your story even though I have not posted to you much in some time.

Spidey,I have followed your story from the beginning too and I appreciate how hard you worked for your marriage and we were all so happy it was saved.

By now you probably know what's coming so I'll just say it: this thread is making me and I am sure,other's, uncomfortable but I will only speak for myself.I appreciate how you both like talking to one another but I find this thread to be inappropriate now.If you have noticed,everyone else has dropped out of posting and it's been only you two for numerous pages.tqt your M is ending and spidey your M was not too recently saved as well.You are opposite sexes too and frequent posting to only eachother is usually not recommended here when going through marital troubles.I am surprised no one has mentioned anything yet.

We have gone beyond marriage building,it sounds all very personal and I worry about the implications.Yes I could ignore this thread and not speak up(that is just not me in anyway though) but I read a lot and worry too about newbies and their impressions of MB.It all matters to me,how we present ourselves.

I sincerely hope this doesn't offend or anger you and that you will only take what I say as caring observation.I do care about everyone here and how their lives are going.

Thank you for listening.

O

Octobergirl, I am pleased that you feel comfortable enough to come here and share your uncomfortablenss. If others are also uncomfortable, then they should also feel free to voice their opinion.

I understand your point of view that two people of the opposite sex could begin down that "slippery-slope," which is why tqt and I only communicate on this public board. I believe this ensures integrity on both our parts.

This is an open thread. Come one, come all! I think we have been discussing pertinent issues on this thread, and MB is not just for supporting people who are recovering their M's ~ it is also for supporting those who are not able to recover their M's. And it would be GREAT to have different points of view with these issues. I cannot control others, though ~ and I won't stop posting just because everyone else has.

Thanks for dropping in, O! Maybe you could join us regularly and give us a wopping dose of your awesome common sense and say-it-like-it-is attitude. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Love you lots, Sweetie!

Spidey

To be honest, pretty darn well. I have been going to the gym, but I would still love to hear about your gym business/concept idea. I noticed when I was at my gym the other day that they now have supplements on sale in the gym, on the upper level by the machines and weights. I thought that was very interesting. Not sure in a good or bad way, but interesting.


I think things will feel differently once you are divorced. I have a friend here whose WW is stalling like yours, and he is much as you are now. Just kinda STUCK in the nether world. I have another friend whose WW D'd him very quickly, and he went through some rough times, but almost a year later he is now happily dating a lady and he laughs a lot is is so happy. And he doubted that it could happen to him, too. I think that once the deed is done (Plan D), it signifies the end of one thing, and the beginning of the other. Until it happens, you are still stuck at the end of the first thing. Does that make sense? My experience with my two friends here in "real" life is that the act of D'ing makes a difference, and changes feelings.


That is a horrible way to live life. I wonder why she thinks that it is "easier" to live her life that way. Because people do these kinds of things for reasons. In one or more important ways, this really works for her. Seems exhausting to me.


Nothing is urgent. Don't you know that we are all supposed to live to very ripe old ages now? Sheesh, you aren't even middle aged yet! I kinda know what you mean, though, regarding a career for myself. Many people my age are already educated and established in their careers. And here I am, starting college in January as a Junior. Good grief! And it'll be another probably 5 years before I can actually start practicing anything as a professional. Just in time for my 20th class reunion, I guess. But then I remind myself that if I would have started this particular career years ago, I wouldn't have been as good as I will be now ~ because of critical life lessons that I have learned. So, it all happens exactly when it is supposed to. Just keep reminding yourself that you are exactly where you are supposed to be RIGHT NOW.

My extreme raking injuries have healed, and my H got me an ergonomic keyboard from work today to use until we get mine replaced. There aren't too many of them around these days. I looked at Walmart the other day, and they only had one wireless kind. I guess they aren't as popular as they once were. We are getting ready to go to Idaho Falls for the holiday, so I am busy getting all that stuff ready. My aunt wants my cousin and I to make home made rolls. I'm not that great with yeast (I think I'm a yeast-Slayer, too!), but we are going to give it a go!

Hope all is going well with you. Hope to hear from you soon.

Spidey

Spidey,

Thanks for not slamming me.It's always a possibility when you broach certain subjects although I didn't really expect anything but sincerity from you.

But,I relayed my concerns so I will be on my way.I want only the best for each and every one of us.Stay well.

Love and hugs right back at ya~ <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

O

So, after H's 3rd IC appointment, he still sees that Polyamory is what fits in best with the way he feels and thinks about things. And that makes me so sad. Because right or wrong, I am not willing to be in a M with someone who believes in something that I don't even understand. I want a H who loves only me, who only ever wants to be with me. And when I first met him, I really thought that was how it would always be. But maybe he's been this way all the time, and he just didn't know it was possible or OK. So now I have almost 15 years of M, and 2 kids, with someone that I apparently don't even know.

I am so sad today.

((((Spidey)))) I can understand your pain. That would hurt.

I noticed elsewhere that your pain was overlooked and instead a discussion was begun in *support* of Polyamory On YOUR THREAD! That was rude IMO.

I'm sorry. Please trust your feelings. You have every right to feel sad about this discovery.

Hugs and blessings,
Susan

{{Spidey}} <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/teary.gif" alt="" />

Spidey, I'm so sorry. I don't understand it either.

Let's just call his desire deviant .... naming something for what it is can help with the decision-making process.



you are NOT wrong ... nor should you consider accepting this deviant arrangement your H desires.

Main Entry: de·vi·ant
Pronunciation: -&nt
Function: adjective
: deviating especially from an accepted norm <deviant behavior>
- deviant noun

Spidey....

I am so sorry....what your H is proposing must be so painful after 15 years.....{{{{Spidey}}}

You are not wrong to want to have a relationship just with him....and him alone.....

All the best....
Daisy

Susan, yeah, it was a bit disheartening at times on my other thread, at the other place. They all contributed a lot of interesting information, though. Thanks for your support. I appreciate it.

faithful, thank you for the hugs. I know you have been there for me with hugs before, and I will take all I can get!

Pep, thanks. I have trouble sometimes with some things, because I don't want to judge, or limit, or label. But after the EA and PA, and I ignored my gut instinct for so many months, I vowed to never ignore it again. And right now it is SCREAMING at me that this is just NOT OK. My H is hurt that I am resistant to supporting him in finding out how he really feels about things. He says this might not even be what he feels, that that is why he is going to IC to figure it out. But, after 3 sessions, all I keep hearing is, "It just really seems to fit." And each time I hear that, it breaks my heart. I feel like Romeo and Juliet, or some other tragic love story, that because of certain things going on, two people who love each other cannot be together. Because I truly do love him. I just can't be with him if he believes he can be in love with two people at the same time.

tqt, thanks for being here. Oh wait, it is your thread! Sorry for "jacking" it. I hesitate to post this on the main site, for fear the newbies might become discouraged. And NOBODY wants to go back 18 months and get totally caught up on my story. Anyway, I know you don't care, and that you do understand.

White Daisy, thanks for the support. I'm really lucky to have my MB friends. Because I hesitate to tell my friends/family here, because they would all look at me and say, "WHAT are you waiting for??? LEAVE HIM!!!" And I need to make my own decision about that. But I would understand their POV. Half of myself cannot even believe the other half of myself is still here.

Spidey