Hunny, no one here is telling you to leave him, but we ARE telling you that you do not have to accept this as *normal* just because some people think it is acceptable.

That is an absurd thing to post on a thread of someone that is hurting.

Hugs to you,

Susan

this is called judging and labeling ... right here when you said this...


[b]You judge something to be an EA and you also judge something to be a PA and you place limits on these things that you decide are NOT OK in your life.

Polyamory life style IS devient ... and you are normal to feel awful about what your husband is asking of you.

He wants to continue the affair. He wants to call adultery by a new name.

That lifestyle is adultery ... but he is asking for your seal of approval.

Susan, I am really OK with all the responses on all of my threads. I think when I began posting about this a while ago, I was seeking informatino, and different opinions and points of view. That is how I process information. I do appreciate your concern for me. BUT, one thing the A did for me was that I grow'd up. And as a grown up, I will speak up for myself if I feel infringed upon. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Pep, he isn't really asking my to participate with him. He is asking me to 1)support him in finding if this is a core belief of his, and 2)accepting him in our M whether this is his belief or not. And I am having a hard time with both of these things.

On the one hand, I realize that as his spouse, I should not put limits on my support of him. I realize I am putting these limits on because of my *fear* that I will be hurt again. But being hurt is a fact of life, it is bound to happen again, whether I plan for it, or protect against it, or not.

On the other hand, if I don't believe in that concept, and he falls in love with another, I will be very hurt. I know this, because it is how I felt last time. And I feel incredibly resistant to venturing down that path even the slightest.

H also feels hurt that he doesn't feel supported in figuring out what is going on inside of him. And I know that if he told me he wasn't supporting me because he didn't like what I was saying, that would hurt my feelings.

I guess I am just stuck between how I am treating him, and how I would want to be treated if I was confused. On the other hand, on the other hand, on the other hand. I can go on and on! I am torn, and confused, and hurting. And scared. And I can only control me.

Thanks for listening. I just don't have anything really good to say, just a lot of emotional vaccilation. I probably shouldn't post in such a state, but having it all in my head is driving my NUTS! H wants me to just wait, for him to figure it out, he isn't going to act on anything, nothing has changed. But I am resistant to waiting, only to find out that he believes something that is incompatible to me. I just want to run run run.

are you buying this????

YOU have stuck by him AFTER infidelity with your BEST FRIEND ... come'on....

He can FEEL anyway he feels ... but the reality is ... you have put in effort ever since D-day ...

remember ... your train leaving the station ... and he can choose to be on it or not ....

well YOUR integrity shall not be called to the carpet ... nope

Hi Spidey,

I had no idea things were going on with you again.Is your H cheating again or just questioning some feelings he has? Sorry to bring this all up.

I can understand your fears if he IS thinking along these lines.It's not right IMO when married, obviously.

Are you still posting on SYMC? Would be easier to catch up there?

{{Spidey}}

O

That's the one. You didn't bring anything up, Ogirl. This came up all on its own. And I think you can see that others besides yourself keep up on this thread, too, even if they don't post regularly. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Yeah, there is a whole thread over on the "site that shall not be named." It's kind of long and convoluted, but good information.

I am just so lost and confused and hurt. Thanks for the hugs. I really appreciate them.

Spidey

No, Spidey, it's not my thread. And I tried to figure out how to change the subject/name/whatever... HOW DO I DO THAT(?)




Spidey, I stick with what I said before... I can't figure out how LOVE has anything to do with this.


I wish I could get madder than I am -- I honestly think I've been numbed by too much pain/crap/etc -- but I can't help but feel the appropriate response to that is... GET REAL (your H), and, as we've discussed -- GROW UP. But, I know that doesn't help.

IMHO, if you have the urge to try to get it out of your head, to somewhere else... you should post-away 'til your fingers are numb. You'd say that yourself, and you know it.

Of course you do... we all would, Spidey.

Am I stupid/ignorant/naive ?? This polyamory thing, to me, just doesn't cut it.
I can't imagine a counselor/therapist/whatever-this-person-is that your H is seeing.... not digging into this "polyamory" to try to figure out what's really going on with him. To me, it doesn't add up.

Your H screws up, and gets involved in an A. Gets caught. A ends. R begins.
Now, all of a sudden, he decides he's polyamorous, as a "core belief?"

This is NOT about YOU, Spidey -- that's glaringly obvious!

Thanks for that, tqt. And I know you are right. But it doesn't take away my panic about losing my family. I'll post more tomorrow, if I have time. I gotta work and get on the road, though, so I might not post again until Saturday afternoon.

Thanks so much for being here ~ you, and everyone else. I really appreciate the support.

Spidey

Keep your head up, Spidey... and post if you can.

So, here I am, up at 2 am again. Almost 2 years to the day that this all began 2 years ago. Maybe there is no such thing as recovering a marriage, tqt. At least, my marriage. I really thought we were going to make it. Now I really think we aren't going to make it.

I can feel myself shutting down my emotions, my love. I'm sure it hasn't gone away, but when I shut it down, it doesn't hurt as bad. And oh man, does it hurt! I had forgotten about the pain. I mean, like childbirth, I knew it was there, I remembered it abstractly. But wow. Can't eat, can't sleep. Can't stay on task.

I don't even really have anything to say, but I can't sleep. At least typing does something. Maybe keeps part of my mind busy so that the other part can rest or something, I don't know. Part of me feels exactly as Pep posted earlier. I've stood by him through so much already. I know that enlightened people can stand right with their pain, and be OK with it. And I want to be brave, tqt, I really do. I want to stand by him, see him through this, and trust that it will all work itself out. But I am so scared of being hurt again. Because for how much I hurt now, I know it can get a lot worse. I know a D will be no picnic. I am certainly not being a very good Fear Slayer now.

So, tomorrow I have to get up early and quiz a kid on a test he's having, then get them all off to school. Then I have a cleaning job, and then I get home and finish getting us ready for our trip to visit the relatives. Lordy, I can't believe we are going out of town at this time. Of course I haven't told my family, because they would probably stone him at the worst, at best my Grandma would "accidentally" whack him with her cane at every turn.

That's another thing, I haven't told anyone here, except one person but not the full extent, because they would all be angry with H. I just don't think that is conducive to him working out his feelings. And, as he says, he hasn't decided on anything yet. Wow, I can't get over how much this feels like before. I feel like in 3 weeks my life has gone from hum-drum, wonderfully boring and routine ~ to disaster. Will I always be 3 short weeks away from disaster with this man? I guess it's not fair to blame just him, since this is a M and I am 50% responsible.

I don't know. All my thoughts, all my words, all my everything is running together into a huge stream of pain, hurt, disappointment. I just literally want to crawl into a dark room somewhere, alone, and lose myself.

Just a quick reply so you know I am OK. I finally fell asleep, with a little assist from a couple Tylenol PM's, and I am feeling better. I know I am not trapped, or cornered, even though that is how I feel.

I am kinda in my own fog. I'm going to go to my relatives' for the holiday, and soak in all their love. I'll check in when I can, probably on Saturday, unless I commandeer someone's computer over there. :-)

Good plan!
Hang in there.... stay strong... and while you're at it, travel safely :-)

We made it back safely. A HUGE storm moved in the night before we left, though, and for almost 100 miles we were driving in very tough weather. BUT, H grew up driving in bad snow, and he took very good care of us.

On the way there, when the weather was good and we weren't sleep deprived, we talked for 4 hours straight. And H thinks he understands what this whole thing has been about. Boundaries. He thinks he never learned proper boundaries in relationships, and so when he feels he has connected with someone, he will do almost anything to continue the relationship. Which is why he has a hard time balancing his work and home life.

It all makes a lot of sense. I know that is the barest bones Readers Digest version, since it was talked about for 4 hours, but that is the jist of it. Please ask about anything that doesn't make sense to you, and I will expand on it.

We had a great visit. We got there feeling good about each other, and all our relatives had the day off, and we all spent time playing games and laughing. It was good times.

My CAT is driving me NUTS. I think she must have Separation Anxiety. Each time I sit down to type, she jumps up on the entertainment center on the other side of the room and begins eating the plant that she knows will make me stand up and get her!!! I gotta go and play with her for a while. I'll check back in later.

Spidey

ps, did you have a nice Turkey Day? Did you go to your parents' house? Sorry I didn't ask sooner. I'm becoming rather self-absorbed! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />

Lots of things don't make sense to me, but... I'm not the sharpest knife in the drawer, so I'll take more time to kick it around.
Let's put it this way... I'm all at once tired of not speaking my mind, and full of self-doubt and wondering if what's on my mind is (or isn't) a few degrees South of sound thinking...

Whaddya growin' out there, Spidey?

No. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> Kidding, sort of...

I decided to turn it into a Non-Event, and went down to NC to do some more exploring/property hunting. Got back late last night. It's a strange thing... I'm pursuing something that I've always wanted, but when I've envisioned it, for so many years, there was always someone else in my life. I didn't want it for me, I wanted it for Us.
Like I've said before... and I don't feel good about this... I don't know if I know how to be alone. Very little makes sense to me.

Can you tell I'm "out of sorts," and in a weird/bad mood(?)
Actually, this mood I'm in is very foreign to me.... maybe I'm just tired.

Believe me, I know how that works. You should be (NEED to be) self-absorbed, Spidey.

More tomorrow...

I have definately felt this way before. It's strange how sometimes words are very hard to come by for me, and sometimes many (that even seem to make sense!) come pouring out with no problem. I tried posting to a lady who was really hurting the other day, and I just couldn't say what I wanted to say ~ I tried for a long time, like 30-40 minutes. So I left the post unposted, and went along my day. Later, at H's office while I was waiting for him, I logged in and posted something that seemed significant to her, in a short 5 minutes. I think that is so interesting.


Hee hee . . . Well, potatoes, dontchaknow. We all have them growing in our front yards out here ~ sheesh, everyone knows that. Funny story, let's see if I can type it as well as I know I can tell it. I met my girlfriend from Virginia and her daughter in Las Vegas a year ago. We went out to dinner, and I ordered a salad. It was very good, but there were these white crunch cubes in the bottom that I didn't care much for. I also didn't know what they were. They weren't water chestnuts, though the texture was similar. Finally, my girlfriend jabbed one on the end of her fork and popped it in her mouth, and began laughing hysterically. Perplexed, I asked, "Do you know what it is, or not?" Through her now watering eyes, and red face, she says, "They are potatoes! How could you not know that?!?" Well, this restaurant had cubed up RAW potatoes and served them in their salad. I don't eat RAW potatoes! Good grief, we cook them over here. Anyway, as you can probably guess, the ENTIRE restaurant KNEW that us at that table were having THE MOST fun EVER!


I know. I believe deep down in my heart that this is your opportunity to become familiar and OK with this feeling, BUT . . . what I believe doesn't have much to do with how you choose to live your life. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" /> I am here for you, though. Not to say I don't think you should have a life partner. On the contrary, I very much do think you should. But it could be a wonderful learning opportunity for you in the meantime, to embrace these uncomfortable feelings until they don't feel so strange to you anymore. What you resist will persist ~ that is a law of the Universe, and I proved it recently with my latest drama.


Yeah, I can tell. I know that I find myself in those "funks" every now and again, and it is OK. This mood will pass, and you will find yourself feeling more like the "old" you soon. I saw the "old" you just a couple pages ago, so I know you're not far away. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

I have a rare day off today. Because, yes, this IS the week of my college registration! I have checked 1, 2, 3, and 4 times to be sure, and I will check again each day. And on the last day, I will have my H read the brochure so I KNOW I am really going on the correct day this time. I have arranged all my jobs this week (again), and I am ready to go get registered!! Woooo-hoooooo!!!!!

Today I am going to get my house cleaned up, get my inside X-Mas decorations up, so that when my H comes home from his 4th counseling session today (oh, I hope his feelings are the same as they were on our trip ~ if not, I'm busting in on thier IC and it will have to be MC again, for serious real) he will figure out how he broke my NEW X-Mas lights outside that he hung up yesterday. They worked, then he started putting them up and on the 3rd hook they all went dark. I think he blew a fuse.

ANYway, I'm sorry you didn't want to have a special day this year when you eat too much and have to undo the top button on your pants. Or deal with strange family members and pretend for that one day that they are normal. OR, like me and my relatives, get up at 3 am on Black Friday and go shopping with all the other crazies. We have a system, and we all have game faces, and hand-held radios, and very warm winter clothing. And by 9 am we are all done, have eaten a very fatty breakfast at a greasy spoon, and are ready for naps. If you're ever out in Idaho at that time, we are always looking for more muscle. This year my H and my uncle both went. We all piled out of our minivan ~ I'm sure it is comical.

I hope you are feeling better. I hope you found some good property, to take the future life partner to. Your life won't always look the way it does now, remember that. You are in the middle right now, in "The Meantime," and soon it will blend and fade into an active life.

Spidey

Yikes!... if the registration thing gets a "Woooo-hooooo," just imagine what the first day of classes is gonna do <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />. Very cool stuff, and, I'm happy for you -- bet you're going to love it, and do great!

Ummm.... said with some sort of grimace... how'd it go(??)

I think it went very well. I asked him (like I do each time) if he wanted to talk about it, and he did. He told me he talked to the IC about his revelations about boundaries in relationships, which even explains a lot about the A, and also things he said during the separation that have been kind of haunting me. For instance, during the separation, when he was saying a lot of hurtful things, one of those things was that he had had a crush on a mutual friend when we were stationed in Germany. That has always stuck in my head, even though he kept saying that he just said that to push me away at the time.

Now, he doesn't think it was a crush at all, just a friendship he really wanted to keep, and his feelings got all confused, because he didn't understand where friendship left off and other stuff started. Knowing his parents, I really can believe what he is saying. His mother is very sociable, loves being with people, but her H is the extreme opposite. It always seemed to me that she did and did and did, gave and gave and gave, until she began resenting what she had given. Mostly when others didn't appreciate. My H has a tendancy to do that, we call it his "Boy Scout" syndrome. Give till it hurts, as he was feeling pre-A.

His father, on the other hand, is extremely anti-social. He is rude, crude, we don't get along, he doesn't like our kids, etc. He is a strange duck. It is really no wonder that my H didn't get a good sense of relationships, of boundaries. I think this is what his true self was trying to tell his brain with all these strange feelings, it just took him a while to figure it out.


No kidding! Well, I still haven't received the information packet I was supposed to receive by now, and the department is not answering their phone, so, I have been kind-of freaking out. But, I am so blessed, because my girlfriend is taking off work early and dropping me off and picking me up and giving me moral support. One of the things in the packet I need is the temporary parking permit. So I am WAAAAY less stressed than I was, and am really looking forward to tomorrow.

And, tonight, H is signing me up for my next 1/2 marathon training! It starts on January 7th. It is a very hilly, very challenging 1/2 marathon, and I am so excited to get busy with it.

Also, I have decided to put an ad in the paper and start my own Compulsive Eating support group ~ no diets. It is based off an author, Geneen Roth that I love, and this is how she started ~ by putting an ad in the paper. I thought we could start by reading her books together and talking about them, then get into our own program of what we want to do.

How exciting is that?!? I know I will be very busy, as I will also attempt to keep all my clients that I currently have. But this is the experiment, that I have never done before. I am going to be busy, with stuff that I WANT TO DO! Not stuff I am doing for someone else, to help them, or make myself look important to others. For ME only. I wonder if this will process differently with me. Like, create joy and not stress. Well, maybe joy and a little stress, but what in life has no stress?

ANYway, I am typing your eyes out. What's going on over there? Anything else from VVSTBXWWW? How are your parents doing? How did they feel about you not celebrating with them this year? You know that they worry about you, and when you visit, it comforts them.

Also, I must give the disclaimer that I am currently on Vicodin, because of a strained muscle in my jaw, of all things. I'm also on steroids, ibuprofin, and a heat pack. Sheesh! It is doing much better, though. I should be off everything within the week, at this rate. In the meantime, I am feeling FINE! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Spidey, this really struck me. This is my stbx. This thread recently has given me much insight. Thank you.

faithful! Hey there. Again, thank you so much for posting to me the other day when I was really down. I so much appreciated the show of support from everyone here.

Did your stbx have trouble with boundaries all around, like mine? I mean, my H for a long time didn't understand the difference between intimate friendship and being in love. And all those issues carried over into all areas of his life, like work. I still think it is scary being with someone who is like this, because I keep wondering what other learning opportunity of his is going to hurt me. Not that he does it on purpose, but just by being close to someone you risk being hurt by their behavior.

Thanks again for chiming in. Nice to know that once in a while I say something "striking." I know tqt thinks I say striking things, but that's just because he's trying to market this thread as a novel. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

Spidey

Spidey - Lots of us are lurking on this thread.