Noodle I am crossing my fingers also. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Paper,
I didn't even realize I put "think." Really I cannot kick him out. I can tell him not to come home that he is not welcome here IF he goes to see her. But if he comes home I cannot force him out of his own home. The lawyer said I could suggest he find somewhere else to live but I cannot make him leave.

I could move to my mom's but I feel I didn't do anything wrong. Why should I be forced to leave our home? If anyone should leave it's him. As much as I want him here. I do not want him here continuing to do the same crap. I want him here working on things and respecting me enough not to hurt me over and over.

Or you could force the sale of the house.

I might have mentioned that before.

Noodle

I have an idea!

Let's see if Noodle agrees. How about forcing the sale of the house?

(just playin' with ya, Noodle!) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

If that fails..you could always try forcing the sale of the house <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Noodle

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by SadMarylandLady:
When my husband moved out in Oct for two months and lived with his sister. I didn't think I would make it. But after two weeks I started to realize I COULD survive without him. I still wanted him in my life. But I know I don't need him. Sometimes I hold on so much because I fear being alone, starting over, becoming a single mom and losing the one man I ever really loved. I know I lost a piece of myself when I met my husband. He became my whole world. Now I need to discover ME again.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">SML,

Remember that if this is going no where you are just wasting precious years of your life while you wait around for him to "find himself". You need a plan.

If you think you can and want to save things do your best to get rid of OW and get him back. Check out Plan A & Plan B if you haven't already.

If you do decide you are ready to throw in the towel on the marriage. Then jump to it and make it happen. There is a ton of different challenges there and some are pretty scary but you'll get through it. Re-discovering yourself is definitely a scary experience but it is quite exciting as well. I'm in the midst of it right now myself and I'm not really sure who I quite am yet, but I'm liking the way its looking. Sure feels a lot better than having the crap kicked out of you emotionally all the time but it does take some time getting used to.

Be strong! You'll get through this.

Miker

Again SML, you should really get into some IC. it would be professional feedback specific to your situation and would just serve as some additional support.

Obviously, you are going to do what you are going to do. I think doing a plan B letter before he leaves for new years is one of the best ideas you've had. I agree w/shul in that you should still plan A, to a certain degree. I've said what i have because it seems as if YOU can't do a plan because you continually, time after time, bring up the OW, the R, the M, things that hurt, etc. in just about any interaction that you have w/your H. you just can't do that. detach, detach, detach. even though he is still in the house, don't call him, don't ask him questions, don't pick up the phone when he calls, and don't be available to him. start a modified plan B like someone has already suggested.

it's not like this is the first time this has happened. i bet if you posted on doing plan B (modified) while the WS is still in the home you would actually find quite a few people who have had to do this and it can be effective, maybe not necessarily at ending the A but at least help you to detach and get to a point where you just leave him alone and start living a life for yourself and your kids. you are by no means close to a divorce (legally speaking). the way that it sounds like the law works where you are, it doesn't seem like there's anything that can speed things up in that area so it's not like if you go to plan B the D will occur tomorrow or even in 6 months.

let the tensions that are rising between WH and OW be used to your advantage. let them LB each other till the cows come home because it is inevitable, even if he were with her all the time, simply because both of them are in a fog and they have no concept of anything but themselves right now. their R began as an A (EA, PA, whatever) and no matter what happens, that will never ever change. SH told me that my OW (also 20 yr old single college student who still lived at home), had a character flaw, she knew she was seeing a MM and that she had no concept of what a true R and M is all about and said that their R had a shelf life. Now granted who knows how long that shelf life is, it could be 6 more months or it could be 20 years. but they will not always be the "happy" couple they are because they just have no clue.

i don't remember if you've said that you attend a church or have any support in that regard but something that helped me was understand that it may not be in God's will that i reconcile w/my H. i know that for a fact now. my h was not a very strong person and even if we had got back together, he would have continually put himself in positions where he would be vulnerable simply due to his career and hobby choices and that would never change. anyway, expect the worse, hope and pray for the best. the worst i could possibly think of was that the OW would get pregnant. so i half-heartedly expect H to tell me that at some point and because of that mostly the things that came up or the things he did had little effect or surprise to me.

it may be childish but sometimes when you are a kid and you were mad at someone you'd play this game and ignored them. well why can't you do that w/your WH? i KNOW it's difficult especially if he's still in the house but you know what? if it saves you heartache and grief and helps you detach, isn't it worth it?

continued prayers to you, RR

Granted, the kids love their house and neighborhood and friends.......

but they can't be happy living in this situation between their mom and dad. The tension on a day to day basis would be almost too much for a person to bear, let alone a younger person who is truly reliant on others for their environment!

After last night I realize I need to do the motified plan B like you suggested. I need to detach. I will let him alone. He came home in one of his moods. We ended up talking around midnight. Which led to hurtful things being said by him. I asked him while he is living in the house until there is a divorce to please respect me and let her alone.

He said "No, I don't want to." He says he never loved me that he tried all these years thinking he could grow to love me the way I should be loved. He asked me if I remember him giving me affection in public. He implied that he was embarrassed of me. That hurt deeply. And that made me realize I have to detach. He really is messed up in the brain. He totally loved me no matter who he was around. He would kiss, hug, touch and play around with me. He did rewrite our whole past together. I may be a little overweight but I far from ugly. So if he is telling any truth he bascially used me all these years for my love, attention and affection until he found someone else. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

I told him this morning I will let him alone. That I will be looking in to selling the house and then I won't be the roadblock in the way of his happiness anymore. I also let him know that I may stay with my parents for awhile in the near future. Especially during Christmas. It will hurt knowing his may be our last Christmas together. It will hurt when I get nothing from him and I know he bought OW a ring. Then he has nerve to tell me well I don't have any money this year... Hmmmmm then maybe he should stop creating 400 cell bills, pulling out money to go see her and stop buying her presents.

I am hurt and sad. I told him that I cannot continue living like this everyday. I told him he needs to get out. He laughed and said he is working on it. But until he finds another job and can afford out on his own he has a right to live there. He said he pays the mortgage.

I just don't see how he could be so different for 5 straight days then go back to the jerk again. I still believe him and OW are having issues and he is blaming me again for his unhappiness.

He says he does not want to try in our marriage anymore. Because he already knows that not talking with OW will not change how he feels. He already knows that he will never feel the way he should about me. And he already knows he will never truly be happy in our marriage.

So I guess I should just give up. That is why I decided to talk to a realtor about selling the house. Then I will get my apartment and he can leave me alone and go chase his happiness. He says even if there is no OW he still wants out to be single again. I don't see him changing his mind anytime soon. Course when we argued he got his mean look and said "Do you think talking to me like that and saying those things are really going to change my mind?" I guess he wants me not to say anything about what he is doing. I am suppose to hide in a corner and not care how much he is hurting me.

I am sorry for the vent. I really have nobody to talk to about any of this. I am sorry if I upset anyone because I haven't taken most of your advise. But it helps me when I do decide to take those steps. Which I feel I need to do. I feel hurt more than anyone has ever hurt me. Fog or not he still should atleast care about my feelings. He knew my deepest insecurity and he used it against me to hurt me trying to get what he wants.

Well my plan after the doc's go ahead was to work on myself. I was already planning on going to a gym and eating healthy since I am closer than ever to my goal weight. So I will show him. I will show him what he gave up. Then he can eat his words. And by that time I may not even want him anymore. I do love him still but each day my love for him slowly dies.

SML,

I'm about ready to come across the Potomac and kick your husband in his gonads. How dare he talk to you like that! Embarrassed to be seen with you? What a fool! You are the mother of his children!!!

I wish there was a way that you could get away from this man and get on with your life. I'm beginning to think that he has mental health issues that probably have nothing to do with OW and adultery.

I just hate to see you waste away your life on this man. You are still so young; you have beautiful children and your entire life ahead of you. There are so many things that you can do and there is probably so much happiness awaiting you.

I know that you are scared of being lonely and a single mom and you probably think that you will never ever again find someone to love and marry. But you will. And don't let him fool you.

You have NOTHING to be ashamed of, well maybe him...

So, don't let him venom spew hurt you any more.

Kati

Well when I got upset he said well I was just trying to talk to you.. Obviously I can't I was just trying to tell you how I felt.

When someone says to you "Remember how I didn't show you affection in public." What does that mean. I didn't let him finish... I said what are you trying to say that your embarrassed of me. He tried to take back what he said but I just got upset and said whatever. Because he is lying. I lived it with him. I was there. I know when I was loved.

He is a wonderful man. I guess just a man that doesn't want me anymore. So I got to let go.

I guess I understand what he is trying to say. If you truly love someone you shouldn't care what anyone thinks or says. I guess I just believed he was different. Because he treated me so good throughout all these years. I felt totally loved and wanted.

Just like I love him. I don't care what anyone thinks. As long as I love him that is all that matters to me.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> He said "No, I don't want to." </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">HELLO??? Teenager from he!! here! Good grief. I know I haven't followed my own advice, SML. I have become SOOOO supremely frustrated by your continued waffling, that I purposefully haven't posted to you. We can do nothing to assist you, without you helping yourself. The only solution that is acceptable to you is if your WH miraculously POPS out of the fog, unlike every single other WS on the planet, and becomes instantly the man you remember him.

I have to tell you (AGAIN), that ending the A is the "easy" part of rebuilding a M. Take it from someone who knows. You are using ALL your resources right now, because you FEAR being out of his chaos. You would rather be the crap he scrapes off his shoe each and every night, than having the dignity and self-respect of removing yourself from his sickness.

You say you will "let him alone." Then you engage in R talk with him over and over. You say you will "detach," yet you fear him "forgetting about you."

Set him free. Sell the house. Show him you have no fear. Right now, he KNOWS he can come home whenever he wants. Good grief. Do you really want your kids learning that this is an acceptable way for them to treat women? For your young daughter to grow up thinking that it is OK for her H to do this to her?

You two keep playing games. You went to see the lawyer, got some good information, and TOLD ALL OF IT TO HIM! Do you think he is being open and honest with you? Why are you doing it with him? Even posting here!!! He reads here! You get strong, you tell us about it, he goes home and knocks you off your game. WHY? Because he can! Because he wants to! Because you let him!

I see the strength in you, but maybe he has worn you down to a little nub, and you can't do what needs to be done? I hope not. You are gonna have to create some stuff for you, SML. 'Cause it ain't gonna happen by accident.

Spidey

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by SadMarylandLady:
Well my plan after the doc's go ahead was to work on myself. I was already planning on going to a gym and eating healthy since I am closer than ever to my goal weight. So I will show him. I will show him what he gave up. Then he can eat his words. And by that time I may not even want him anymore. I do love him still but each day my love for him slowly dies.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Do this! This will make you feel so much better about yourself and I bet he'll notice and then it can be YOUR decision whether you want to put up with HIS crap anymore. Funny things is you may find that you don't need or want him anymore.

Take back the power!

Miker

SML,

Why do you keep making excuses for him????

Kati

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by SadMarylandLady:
<strong> Well when I got upset he said well I was just trying to talk to you.. Obviously I can't I was just trying to tell you how I felt.

When someone says to you "Remember how I didn't show you affection in public." What does that mean. I didn't let him finish... I said what are you trying to say that your embarrassed of me. He tried to take back what he said but I just got upset and said whatever. Because he is lying. I lived it with him. I was there. I know when I was loved.

He is a wonderful man. I guess just a man that doesn't want me anymore. So I got to let go. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

Spider,

I'm afraid that he is gonna start planning and building something else for himself while SML is all along hoping and thinking that he may come out of this and be the man that she used to love.

Then when he leaves, she will be torn to pieces and not understand how in the world this could happen...

Please SML, for ONCE listen to what people are saying, listen to Spider, get some IC, sell the house and get out of this chaos. Your children do not deserve this!

Kati

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Spider Slayer:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> He said "No, I don't want to." </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">HELLO??? Teenager from he!! here! Good grief. I know I haven't followed my own advice, SML. I have become SOOOO supremely frustrated by your continued waffling, that I purposefully haven't posted to you. We can do nothing to assist you, without you helping yourself. The only solution that is acceptable to you is if your WH miraculously POPS out of the fog, unlike every single other WS on the planet, and becomes instantly the man you remember him.

I have to tell you (AGAIN), that ending the A is the "easy" part of rebuilding a M. Take it from someone who knows. You are using ALL your resources right now, because you FEAR being out of his chaos. You would rather be the crap he scrapes off his shoe each and every night, than having the dignity and self-respect of removing yourself from his sickness.

You say you will "let him alone." Then you engage in R talk with him over and over. You say you will "detach," yet you fear him "forgetting about you."

Set him free. Sell the house. Show him you have no fear. Right now, he KNOWS he can come home whenever he wants. Good grief. Do you really want your kids learning that this is an acceptable way for them to treat women? For your young daughter to grow up thinking that it is OK for her H to do this to her?

You two keep playing games. You went to see the lawyer, got some good information, and TOLD ALL OF IT TO HIM! Do you think he is being open and honest with you? Why are you doing it with him? Even posting here!!! He reads here! You get strong, you tell us about it, he goes home and knocks you off your game. WHY? Because he can! Because he wants to! Because you let him!

I see the strength in you, but maybe he has worn you down to a little nub, and you can't do what needs to be done? I hope not. You are gonna have to create some stuff for you, SML. 'Cause it ain't gonna happen by accident.

Spidey </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

I've been reading for awhile, but I haven't posted yet. I'm moved to now by the following statement:

"He is a wonderful man. I guess just a man that doesn't want me anymore. So I got to let go."

He WAS a wonderful man, I'm sure. But not anymore. Wonderful men don't treat their wives that way. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

What you are dealing with right now is terribly difficult. But you're getting such good advice. It's free. Take some. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

This man currently does NOT deserve you. He needs to EARN his way back. That is, if you'd even still want him after getting your life together.

You are ALREADY a single mom. You just haven't accepted it yet. There's nothing to lose. He's already gone.

But you have everything to gain by showing your strength, including your own self-confidence.

Take extra good care of yourself for the sake of your babies. And think about getting into a strong Plan B.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by SadMarylandLady:
<strong> I guess I understand what he is trying to say. If you truly love someone you shouldn't care what anyone thinks or says. I guess I just believed he was different. Because he treated me so good throughout all these years. I felt totally loved and wanted.

Just like I love him. I don't care what anyone thinks. As long as I love him that is all that matters to me. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">SML,

Where was the sense you had before? Do you really love this abusive WS or your H?

How he treated you in the past is not how you treat the future. You have to WAKE UP and see he is abusing you and your family.

Don't love someone who is abusing you because he USED to be a nice guy. Come on...... you have to come to your senses.

If it takes crying, yelling and screaming into a pillow, go ahead dear. That's ok.... but DON'T LOVE A WS!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> It is just WRONG! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

ok, I am calming down but I sure wish I was closer. Where is Just J anyway? Some closer over there to let us know that SML isn't losing it? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

L.