Options,
My wife had the very same concern. Didn't want to do the phone counseling. I tried to tell her that the phone counseling was more anonymous, but she chos the local MC.

You should have seen the look on her face when she had to explain to the MC why we were there.

The other problem with local MCs, ours included, is that they didn't have a PLAN. We talked and talk and talked.

My wife finally refused to go back saying all we ever do is talk about the affair and keeps exhuming the negative feelings. To a certain degree she was right.

More ammo for the chamber

Mac

cwmac, ammo well taken. thanks!!

Opt.

Opt, just a word of caution about your discussion. No matter WHAT YOU SAY or how reasonable you are, you are not going to get her to agree about exposure. So, do not allow her to drag you into a futile debate about the glories of exposure. It will be a waste of your time. Nor will reason work, because I assure you that you are not dealing with a rational individual right now. It is like trying to reason with a drunk.

All she needs to understand are 2 things and don't let her drag you into anything beyond this:

1. you are not doing it to be mean

2. you will do what it takes to save your marriage because you love her and you love your family

LEAVE IT AT THAT. You do NOT have to justify yourself. Please remember that.

And secondly, you very much should discuss no contact. Ask her to assure you that contact has ended by sending a letter, written together, to the OM. Do you still have the sample?

Mel, ok I understand. I do not have a sampe NC letter. I have read some in the past but am not sure where that was at.

I will discuss NC and the letter but I will be prepared for a wishy washy answer. In other words I doubt she will see the importance of NC yet. How could I handle that?

Opt.

I hope you can convince her to at least try the phone counseling with Steve Harley. Then you have a chance to let Steve Harley convince her that he can as helpful or more helpful as a local MC. I have heard that he is great with WS's.

If not maybe there are other MBer's who can direct you to a good pro-marriage counselor in your area.
So many are not. We tried a couple that all we did was talk and basically agreeing with my H that he didn't love me anymore and was in love with OW.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by options:
<strong>

5) Then I am going to talk about MC. WW was not convinced that phone counseling was a very good option before, so I will have to sell her on that.

</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Options, there is a possibility that nothing you say will convince her, so be prepared for that. Counseling spells the end of her bad behavior, GOOD counseling is even more of a threat. But, the last thing you need is to run through a passel of useless counselors trying to find a good one. And SH is pro-marriage and has a SOLID track record.

This is not something I would negotiate on, because your marriage may depend on it.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by options:
<strong> Mel, ok I understand. I do not have a sampe NC letter. I have read some in the past but am not sure where that was at.

I will discuss NC and the letter but I will be prepared for a wishy washy answer. In other words I doubt she will see the importance of NC yet. How could I handle that?

Opt. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">She may not be ready at this point, but it won't hurt to try. At least you can let her know that you do expect her to end all contact and eventually send the letter. I would ask her the status of her relationship with OM.

And PUHLEESE consider calling him as I had suggested..

Here are some samples: http://www.marriagebuilders.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=37;t=018918

Ok, if I get one thing accomplished tonight, I am convinced it should be gettng her to agree on counseling with SH. I am going to an IC locally and he does joint counseling but I know it would not be good. My IC is pro marriage but he does not have a plan or strategy as others have said here. It would just be talking as I do in my IC sessions.

Opt.

Mel,
I am considering calling OM yet. I know I need to do it it is just a matter of when. I know the sooner the better.... I know where he lives now too. I know for sure WW was w/OM on sat night until 4a.m. (My mom had PI out again. I think I need to control her..)

The one thing that worries me is if WW does counseling with SH and she learns about MB site (which would be good) but I don't want her to find the forum and figure out my thread. I couldn't loose the support and advice of you all. Maybe it is a long shot but possible...

Opt.

<small>[ March 08, 2005, 05:24 PM: Message edited by: options ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by options:
<strong> Mel,
I am considering calling OM yet. I know I need to do it it is just a matter of when. I know the sooner the better.... I know where he lives now too. I know for sure WW was w/OM on sat night until 4a.m. (My mom had PI out again. I think I need to control her..)

The one thing that worries me is if WW does counseling with SH and she learns about MB site (which would be good) but I don't want her to find the forum and figure out my thread. I couldn't loose the support and advice of you all. Maybe it is a long shot but possible...

Opt. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I agree that you don't want her coming here. God Bless your mother for having her tailed! I would suggest telling your W that you know exactly what she did and give her details.

Don't tell her your mom is having her tailed but let her know that your parents know all about it, ok?

Does your Mother have pictures?

cwmac, thanks for your outstanding support here. I think you have much in common with Opt and can give him a unique perspective. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

OT: Thanks for coming back Mel...your input was really missed while you were gone.

Thanks, Trix <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Yes, there are pictures and video footage...

I am going to tell her I know the details about what went on.

Opt.

Mel,
Thanks for the comment.

Opt.
All I can say is....Were was Melody when I was a newbie? Why do I say this slightly sarcastic remark? One is I'm always sarcastic and two I was constantly told here at MB that calling the OP was never a good idea.

The logic was that they are the enemy and they will turn and twist everything a BS says when they go scurrying back to the WS. This has merit, however I think there are some reasons that can out weigh this one.

Mel has given you one reason. The OP may not know the complete truth. Anyway...Mel has given you a great rundown of this reason so I'll not reiterate.

I think there is another reason. This may go against MB doctrine but indulge me. I'll put it in my personal terms and you can draw your own conclusions.

I really needed to call the OM and tell him I didn't appreciate his interference in my life. I knew OM from the early days of my marriage. Also, in my case there was some interaction between OM and my girls during the very end of the A. IOW I needed to call this guy to get complete closure.

Here it is 3 yers after DDay1 and I'm still considering calling the guy. Of course bc it's been 3 years and NC has been in place it makes me nervous and it's against MB doctrine to do this.

So do it for me. Call your WW's OM and tell him the truth and tell him he is interfering in your marriage.

Just remember you are in control here. He isn't. Stay calm. He's a low life. You aren't. If you are like me, you'll want to get emotional/angry. Don't give him the satisfaction. If you get upset, you're just telling him that he & she are right and you are wrong.

Good luck,

Mac

Thanks for the advice Mac. I am convinced that calling the OM is the right thing to do. I am going to do it soon.

WW and I talked last night. I didn't get much positive from it but the one thing I did get positive was that WW said she would talk to SH. It took a lot of convincing so I hope she will talk to him with an open mind. I hope he can work his magic somehow. I am going to schedule the appointment today for the first available evening date he has available. WW brought up the D word last night and asked me if I wanted her to leave. Of course I said no way. I think she was testing me and wanted me to say yes. Then she would have been out the door. I talked to her about NC and she said there hasn't been any contact for quite awhile. Then I gave her some details about Sat. night and she just looked me right in the eye and lied. So convincingly too. Then I said talked about sending a NC letter and she said no, I don't see what that would do. (I know FOG talk.) I said what would it hurt? WW didn't respond. I think I am going to draft one up from the samples and try to have her sign it tonight.

WW was negative during the whole talk and said she doesn't have feelings for me anymore and knows she can't get them back. She said she hates being home when I am there.

Maybe SH will have an slot available tonight.

Opt.

Also, Can I get some more guidance on what to say to OM? I am the type of person that likes to have a list of points in front of me so I don't forget to touch upon anything or get diverted off course with anger etc.

Opt.

Sorry, double post.

<small>[ March 09, 2005, 07:57 AM: Message edited by: Suzet* ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>I said talked about sending a NC letter and she said no, I don't see what that would do. (I know FOG talk.) I said what would it hurt? WW didn't respond. I think I am going to draft one up from the samples and try to have her sign it tonight.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Options, it will be good if you can convince your W of the importance and purpose of a NC letter… Maybe the appointment with SH will help. A NC letter is only successful and serve the right purpose if the WS is committed to NC and willing to sent the letter. You see, a NC-letter also serve as an action from the WS to show the BS that the WS is committed to the M and NC... If you draft up the letter and your W sign it reluctantly, it won’t serve the right purpose on this stage… A NC-letter written by the WS and sent by the WS is certainly not a guarantee that contact won’t happen again (the WS can still slip up and contact the OP because of the withdrawal) but at least it is a positive step in the right direction. You can show the NC samples to your W, but she must draft up the letter herself. You must approve the letter and sign it too before sending it to the OM.

Blessings,
Suzet

<small>[ March 09, 2005, 08:02 AM: Message edited by: Suzet* ]</small>

Hi Suzet. I guess I will not force her to sign the NC letter. I realize that would not be any good and would be useless. It was funny though because WW said "where did you come up with that idea". <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I will write an NC letter and tell her when she is ready to commit to our M and NC we can send it.

I am very excited that she will speak to SH. I hope it goes well. Keep our finger crossed. WW has not talked to anybody about all this except to OM and very little to MIL.

Opt.