Thanks for asking SD.

Well, I survived the weekend.

There were what I consider 'major triggers' and tried really hard for them not the get to me, and to be honest, I don't know how I managed, because what I really wanted to do is 'hit the roof'.

On our way to a dinner invitation, and for the first time, needed to hear OW calling H on cell phone. I remained 'cool' but what I really wanted to do was get out of the car and off somewhere by myself, mostly because I don't think I can handle this. We brushed it off by him explaining his project at work involving the OW. I know H would like to me get 'comfortable' with the idea that there is OW in his life, testing me I guess to see how I handle the idea of presence of OW in his life - our new reality??!!

Then, later on, I needed to hear how much H 'loved the OW and missed her' and all this time I am telling myself: I should not be surprised that he is telling me this, and worked really hard at not reacting, not confronting him, not doubting him, just 'dropped the subject' like - but really, I was literally crushed - and then wondered if this will be interpreted as 'indifference' and 'not caring' - but it was either that or say things that would make him feel guilty (he already does) and then H would defend 'his love' etc. etc. because he needs to justify it, needs to rationalize it, needs to say that "that's life" etc. - which he has already done, and I did not want to go through again.

The rejection is hard to take! I don't recognize my H. I now wonder if his plan is to be hurtful enough for me to want to ask him to leave - if that's his plan, H will certainly hit my limit, sooner or later. But, this feels like confrontation - like, who will let go first - or, going for the "wear and tear" - and I do believe at this point, if that is the case, he will succeed and I will come out of it "broken" and he will feel even worst about himself and probably blame me for getting him to the point of having to have to be "mean" to me - but that there was no other way.

My attempts at answering his EN (unless I have wrongly identified them) are being rejected - his explanation is that he is "shutting himself off" in order not to give me "hope" of any kind, and obviously because he doesn't have the same feelings for me and therefore resisting - I have decided to back off, too hard to take - and maybe it is what I need to do. I do fear the distance this is putting between us.

If I were to think of myself now, I would ask him to leave, and how some peace of mind, stop having this continual 'turmoil' feeling in my stomach that keeps me wondering about how much damage all this is doing to me and will I be able to recover from it. My survival instinct tells me to 'let go' - or am I just not used to living in this "uncertain" state. I will hang on, knowing myself, but can't help but want to be passed this, either way, to a place where there is some 'peace' in my heart. I really miss that.

As it stands, he wants to leave, but is still at home - trying to convince me that I will be OK with him gone - so that he can leave.

I have decided to take it "day by day" - this is all driving me nuts. I am not used to my H being so "cold" towards me.

Anyway. I will keep reading; I will keep trying; for now, my decision is to do my best until he decides to leave and literally leaves, and then go from there. It feels like a nightmare.

I am soo sad.

Lunamare

Luna - I suggest you take one of two paths:

1. Go today and see a lawyer and take the steps necessary to file for divorce and get him out of your house so that you can "move forward." The sooner the better to lessen your pain as quickly as possible and to regain some self esteem. He is literally walking all over you.

or

2. Start today with the strategies and principles we've been spoon feeding you since your very first post on this forum so that you can recover your family.

You are currently on a path to do neither. You are paralyzed in indecision and he is sucking your life out of you and your kids. Please, woman, get a grip on this.

WAT

PS I also ask myself, by acting this way, am I enabling the A? But, there is nothing I can do to stop it - H doesn't deny it - if fact, he wants any and all occasions to justify it - and I don't want him to keep doing that - because I see him actually trying to convince himself that that is what he needs to do - and then all there is left to do is "execute". The best I can hope for is for H to reevaluate his decision, and not contribute to him pushing his heels down to justify it.

I also have to admit, that I have had a few moments where I have "broken down" and probably helped H to seek comfort of the OW. That's also one of my objectives - to take it day by day - because if I think too far ahead, I get all panicky - out of control. On the other hand, I wonder if maybe to get passed these momemts I need to hit the bottom of these panicky moments rather than fight them, because they seem to be always just around the corner.

PS I also ask myself, by acting this way, am I enabling the A? But, there is nothing I can do to stop it - H doesn't deny it - if fact, he wants any and all occasions to justify it - and I don't want him to keep doing that - because I see him actually trying to convince himself that that is what he needs to do - and then all there is left to do is "execute". The best I can hope for is for H to reevaluate his decision, and not contribute to him pushing his heels down to justify it.

I also have to admit, that I have had a few moments where I have "broken down" and probably helped H to seek comfort of the OW. That's also one of my objectives - to take it day by day - because if I think too far ahead, I get all panicky - out of control. On the other hand, I wonder if maybe to get passed these momemts I need to hit the bottom of these panicky moments rather than fight them, because they seem to be always just around the corner.

Question:

I know for a fact that there is only one person who is aware of their A in workplace. It's a school. I think H and OW don't want more people to know until they are ready to come "out" - it can get really gossipy there - so, it would probably create an "uncomfortable" situation were more people to know. Should I bust them? Would this not pull them more closer? I would rather not do that. Or, would they be "called" on lack of professionalism. I am not even sure how I would go about it. Tell the principal? Anonymous parent unhappy with teacher behaviour? It could get really messy. It would be the opposite of what I normally do.

Your thoughts please.

Dear WAT,

OK, you got my attention.

I would like to have your thoughts on a couple of PSs after your message. You're right, but I also know that's not what you want to necessarily be. I appreciate your concern.

Luna, Luna, Luna.

I've been after you to "bust" them since your first post.

I'm beginnng to suspect you're making this all up solely to frustrate me. Are you real?

Assuming you ARE real -

They're teachers in the same school???

Pennies from heaven!!!!!!!

Call the principal this afternoon. Call the school board. Call the president of the PTA. Call the teacher's union. Use these mediums to do exactly as you mentioned - make this uncomfortable for them. Spill the beans - all of them. Otherwise, you ARE enabling the affair.

DO NOT threaten or reveal that you plan to bust (expose) them. If you do, they can take pre-emptive measures.

WAT

PSS (Dear WAT):

On the other hand, you maybe right - I do feel like a wimp right now.

PSSS (Dear WAT):

What to do if you can feel the "mind games" being played, but also know you are not very good at it (or don't want to play them, don't have the guts to play them, don't want to have to play them, or too damn scared or know you will lose).

Think of this one single word

R E S P E C T

That, my dear, is what is lacking in your marriage.

Your H has no respect for you. And he knows that you will not demand / comand his respect.

Therefore, he can do just about whatever he wants.

Dis-respect is killing your marriage ... not the affair.

Pep

Luna - read bOb pure*'s post on this thread and ALL the links in it.

WAT

Re exposure at workplace.

I will have time to make sure it's what I want to do, the school is closed for this week.

Questions I have right now. Will I be able to live with myself for doing this? It would be SO out of character. Can this be done in an anonymous way (or am I just being a chicken), but really, I think I also want to avoid LB - I am supposed to be doing PLAN A at the same time! I am also worried that the whole thing could backfire on me - because fundamentally I don't really believe in vengeful actions - BECAUSE I believe sooner it backfires on YOU!

I also think that somehow this would contribute to "solidifying" H's and OW's committment to each other. Like, claim their right to "privacy", because they are being private about it! Also, in this day and age, A are being tolerated much more, and also wonder if "nothing" will happen from exposure in the workplace. If fact, they may actually get sympathy - both are very "likeable" people, believe it or not! even my H, inspite of what he has done, or I wouldn't be here! (This would be the "backfire" theory kicking in).

What I really would like to be doing (but I won't) is call up the OW and give her a peace of my mind! GRRR! And OW's H for not even wanting to try to save his M - apparently (I know, I don't have a very good source! so, why did I bother asking H if OW's H knew??) - when OW admitted to her H of having an A, he threw in the towel, said he would not stand in her way if she has fallen in love with someone else, and is getting IC just to cope with breakup! (My interpretation - or reading too much into it: I wondered if it was my H's way of sending message on how he would like to see me handling situation! - but then it was I who asked!)

And so, I would also want to have a word with AW's H, too, to ask: what's up? Again, not sure if I am just being a chicken, or really want to avoid LB. I can't do both at the same time!

But, really, bottom line, I don't know what I would tell either the OW or her H. If it's just to make a scene - I'd rather not - because I don't think this would help the situation - I see it as a good chance for H to redirect focus on my actions - and use it to justify his actions - I'd rather vent here for now. I am not convinced speaking to OW or H would really help, unless I had a very specific objective to do so.

SORRY EVERYBODY, I know I don't make much sense right now, don't seem to have a very clear direction, I admit it: right now, I am just trying to keep afloat - I don't deny it - and I don't know what it will take for me to MOVE - I am getting fed up with myself (but not as much as WAT). But really, how many angles can an ACTION have. I can see myself beating around the bush, but just hope that it's just a step for me to get through to elsewhere. In 2 week's time, H is going to be gone for 2 1/2 weeks: I want to be doing PLAN A, but at the same time, as you all point out, I feel (and am made to feel) like a doormat - with no respect. I am in the GIVER position and H is in TAKER position. I thought it was to be expected. It's just really hard to take sometimes.

BOTTOM BOTTOM BOTTOM line: I am mostly mad at myself! I really should start from there, I guess, accept the fact that that is how I feel, and then maybe I can move on.

I need a break.

Take care, all of you, and sorry for all the crap.

On one hand I see the need to have a plan, but I just don't know what to do with my feelings, at the same time. Don't blame you all for being impatient. I must make a boring read!

It boils down to just being fearful of the UNKNOWN, and it's no way to live! Will I wake up in time?

LUNAMARE

The way I see this....

If any plan involves taking a risk or making a bold move to save your marriage ... you are unwilling to do it.

Pep

<small>[ February 28, 2005, 02:04 PM: Message edited by: Pepperband ]</small>

***Will I be able to live with myself for doing this? It would be SO out of character.***

Your husband is counting on you not to make a fuss. So is the OW. Since neither one of them has one ounce of respect for you, they are COUNTING on you not to bother them since they KNOW it would be "out of character" for you to do so. If it wasn't, it would be a lot harder for them to have an affair.

They are relaxed and happy and enjoying themselves right now, while Luna suffers the torments of hell. Why is that okay with Luna? It must be okay with her, because she's not lifting a finger to get herself out of it. Can't do anything that is "not nice" or "out of character."

This is EXACTLY what BOTH of them are counting on. If you are not willing to fight for your marraige, you WILL lose it.

Everything you are doing right now tells your husband that you are adjusting to his having an affair. It tells him that you will learn to tolerate with having three of you in this relationship. This is the clear message he is getting from you. Is that what you want?
Mulan

lunamare

I dry heaved for a full five minutes on Tescos car park before i summone dup the courage to call OM GF and expose the affair to her.I actually puked in teh bushes afterwards. WIthin five minutes news had gotten to my Squid and she TXTed me saying any chance of rescuing our M was gone, I was a b@st@rd and OM was leaving GF to live with her.

And God smiled, because I had taken the most important brave step towards recuing my wife from herself.

I would be a pathetic divorcee right now if I hadn't exposed. I have no doubts.

Instead I am PROUD of my actions ever since that day six months ago.

AND exposure catalysed OMs relationship recovery too.

Do it. Stop being so woolly. Nothing else you will do will make any difference until you expose. Nothing. You may as well 'hope' the affair will stop.

Don't you want OWs H as your ally?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by b0b pure*:
Stop being so woolly.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">??? 'wooly' .... does this mean sheep-like? Damn Brits... always saying weird things ... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Pep <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by lunamare:
<strong>

It boils down to just being fearful of the UNKNOWN, and it's no way to live! Will I wake up in time?

LUNAMARE </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Luna, aren't you MORE fearful of the KNOWN? Of your family being destroyed in a divorce? Because as it is now, you are heading for divorce since you refuse to do anything to save your marriage. Do you really have the luxury to sit around and do nothing in order to accommodate your fear?

You have SO MUCH ammunition at your disposal to help end this affair, and you just refuse to pick up the tools. Why?

I have to wonder if you really do want a divorce. Do you?

Luna -

You don't know me and I rarely post anymore. Rarely as in NEVER. My good buddy WAT thought I might be able to give you some insight on your situation and I'll give it my best try.

I think WAT thought I'd have a good point of view because I was exactly where you are now when I joined this site.

My H had an A with someone he worked with. You can do a search on my name and find all of my threads if you'd like. I think you will see that we are very much alike...or at least I was once in your shoes.

What'd I do, you ask? I spilled the beans. Just like b0b pure* I was sick over it. SICK SICK SICK!!! Terrified that my H would hate me and possibly go to jail because we are military...what a joke that was...turns out the military really doesn't care anyway.

So I exposed my H's relationship. The moment my H knew he had been exposed was the moment I think our recovery really started.

He was a new man and has been ever since. It's now almost a year later....post exposure....and I cannot imagine what my life would be like now had I not taken the advice given to me on this site.

b0b pure*'s post to you is perfect. You will not get better advice. It's up to you to decide your next step. I promise you it won't be the end of the world.

Good luck to you!

Hi Luna,

I have been out for a while and wanted to see if you were making any progress. I have to say I was sad to see your posts.

You seem like you are just a leaf floating in the breeze your husband is blowing in whatever direction he wants. You are just succuming to his selfish behavior girl! You sound like a conflict avoider who has learned that being angry is bad. WAKE UP! ITS TIME TO GET MAD!!!!

You say you are in PLan A, but you haven't exposed yet. YOU ARE NOT IN PLAN A, UNTIL YOU HAVE EXPOSED.

Honey, NOTHING will get better until you EXPOSE. You must do this ASAP, if he has time to move out and then move in with OW---the impact of exposure is lost!!! (Because it will just apear like you were having marital problems, separated and then he started developing a relationship with OW).

Also, you are talking about being nice not to hurt your boys?? So you don't want to get mad at your husband. Being Angry is a good and healthy emotion when you are being threatened. It is a GOOD thing for kids to learn that a wife will be angry when her family is threathened!! A WIFE SHOULD BE ANGRY her H LIED and CHEATED!!

Otherwise, what are you teaching them---that as men it will be acceptable for them to make a promise to be faithful and then when the going gets rough to just sneak out the back door!!! And that their wife will just roll over and say okay. "That's fine. You made me a promise, now you have changed your mind. Can I help you pack? Oh and I will be here whenever you need to talk again, and I promise not to be upset when you lie, cheat and steal time from the family by giving it to a stranger."

YOUR HUSBAND MADE A PROMISE TO YOU. HE BROKE THAT PROMISE. HE LIED. HE CHEATED ON HIS OWN FAMILY. INSTEAD OF INVESTING TIME IN HIS DAMAGED MARRIAGE OR SPENDING IT WITH HIS BOYS---HE INVESTED IN A STRANGER TO THE FAMILY AT THE EXPENSE OF THE FAMILY!!

If this were a Business Deal, LUna, he committed the equivalent of EMBEZZLEMENT. People go to prison for that.

You keep acting like it is okay, like because it feels good to him it is okay...you are doing this not to push him away. But this is not keeping him with you either, it is merely helping him pack his bags.

Also, HE THINKS it is okay, because it is a secret. You watch the change when you expose. He will have to face the judgement--rightfully so mind you--of his decisions.

I know this, because I am a former WW. I did NOT realize what I had done, until it was out in the open. NO one does.

EXPOSURE!!!!!!!!

Luna,

My former post is not meant to harass you for being "nice" and "indecisive", but to hopefully inspire you to do what you must.

You say you don't have the energy, but I think you will later regret it if you don't give it your all right now. Maybe it will change nothing for your husband, BUT IT WILL CHANGE SOMETHING FOR YOU. You will have fought for your marriage with pride and you will have stood up for yourself. Rather than giving simply giving up and allowing people to treat poorly while you say nothing.

We are here to help with feedback--but only you can help yourself.

<small>[ March 01, 2005, 01:19 PM: Message edited by: Freefromlies ]</small>