My friends asked me to join them on a night out, H does not want me to go, and I do not want him to be upset if I go, I want him to be fine with it. He said he does not care if I go out with them but I can not go dancing. I am trying to understand- but I am going with a group of girls and he kows how much I love to dance- I do not see the harm. I have told him he is more then welcome to join us, and he just laughed and said no thanks. I am hurt by the fact that he does not trust me or want me to have a good time.

So do I stay home to keep him happy while I feel I am missing out? I encourage him to do what makes him happy (as long as it is faithful), I would like the same curtosy in return.

<small>[ March 14, 2005, 06:34 PM: Message edited by: KMEJ ]</small>

Ask him is he worried about you dancing with guys or is it ok that you dance with your girlfriends. I would object with my wife dancing with other guys. Is it worth the hurt it will cause? That is if it will cause hurt between the two of you.

<small>[ March 10, 2005, 02:33 PM: Message edited by: RHM ]</small>

Hi,

If you are the one who had the affair then I completely understand your husbands concern. My WW met her first A out dancing. Having been in his shoes what I would suggest is that you consider maiking a deal with him, say call him every hour and a half or whatever he needs.

KMEJ,

Let's disregard the abusive dynamic in your marriage right now..and instead of focussing our attention on H..let's focus it on you.

OK?

So..going out dancing with the girls...hmmm.

To me, this is questionable territory [sorry <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> ], despite your love of dancing, sans your spouse it is highly questionable in my opinion. I would not be comfortable with H going out "dancing" without me..whether I was invited or not.

The invite is considerate, but not the point.

Saying..I don't like to dance..but I am also not comfortable with YOU being in that environment without me, is entirely reasonable.

Whether you see the harm or not, he has made it clear that he DOES, and to disregard this..is to contribute to the general atmosphere of disrespect..ie..justification of one bad behavior with the bad behavior of another.

Example? Here is a detailed list of ways that H is a [censored], so I'm going to go dancing because I derserve to have a little fun.

KMEJ, I have said before, that the person I most worried about becoming a WS is you and this is why. Your logic is so similar to that of a WS I can't help but think you are ripe for the picking. Especially considering how unpleasant your M is. Especially considering your preference for conflict avoidance and denial.

So, basically this is what you have. POJA will not work, because..according to your history H doesn't give a flying [censored] whether you are happy or not as long as he gets his way. There have been MANY posts..entire threads dedicated to trying to help you recognize the abusive patterns. However, you put yourself in danger of losing YOUR way..of compromising YOUR integrity every single time you disregard his concerns and rationlize doing so.

Furthermore..you are not satisfied to just go even though he doesn't like..he has to accept that you are going, and smile.

Not very realistic, not very respectfull, not something I would be willing to do.

I have to ask. At what point are you going to focus on the real issues in your marriage, and stop hiding behind the day to day minutia? With consideration to the state of your M in general..whether you go out with friends or not seems to me..well, trite, you know? Yet this is your pattern, it wasn't long ago you had a post just like this..and possibly [if I remember correctly] about the same thing.

I would love to see you break out of this cycle.

Noodle

No he is the one who had the affair and left. While we were seperated I went and saw this Band about 6 times, and really loved it, we have been back together for over a year and I have not seen them in over a year, and REALLY want to go, but have refrained because of his feelings about it. I would dance with my girlfriends, and he would be invited- however he does not like country music, do he has declined. He is jealous because he thinks I like one of the band members, I think one is cute but I am NOT interested in him in any inappropriate way.
He goes bowling weekly and he goes to all night card parties and lots of other things and i do not stand in his way, he was the one that had the affair why does he not trust me? Actually I am not sure if it is trust or control.

“””H does not want me to go, and I do not want him to be upset if I go, I want him to be fine with it. He said he does not care if I go out with them but I can not go dancing.”””

OK. So y’all have talked and at first he said he didn’t want you to go and then he clarified it to it’s OK as long as you don’t go “dancing”. Is that correct? Which sounds like some good negotiating to me.

But then again, what kind of dancing are we talking about? I presume you ain’t going to a “Waltz” club. Some of the dancing going on these days is nothing more than a vertical expression of a horizontal act.

“””I am trying to understand- but I am going with a group of girls and he knows how much I love to dance- I do not see the harm.”””

C’mon KMEJ, do you really not see the harm. Maybe this is a sore spot for me, because my X “Went Dancing with the Girls”, well actually she told me she was shopping, but it turned into dancing with the girls, which turned into YEAH…OK.

“””I am hurt by the fact that he does not trust me or want me to have a good time.”””

I’ll be honest, I haven’t a clue of the dynamics of y’alls relationship but most of us “trusted” our spouses later to find out that we shouldn’t of.

”””So do I stay home to keep him happy while I feel I am missing out?”””

What are you missing out on?

“””I encourage him to do what makes him happy (as long as it is faithful), I would like the same courtesy in return.”””

So it would be ok if he sat at the strip bar every evening as long as he’s faithful? NO!!!! I have a hard time believing the innocence, maybe because it burned me…

Noodle- you are right it is about the same topic. It is something I feel is worth fighting over. i do see your point as I too would hate it if my H went dancing without me. I can see the point, I am not asking that he smile as I go, but to trust me enough to go- does that make since.

yes I know I have bigger issues, and I am working on them, I am working on my plan. I guess I feel bad because I want to go I really do, my friends want me to go, and they keep asking knowing it is what I want, and I keep having to tell them no. They understand why I say no, but they are married as well and think I am giving up too much.

Yes I do see the cycle- the pattern, the hideing, I know I am a huge conflict avoider, can that be changed?

KMEJ,

Please clarify for me..what you feel is worth fighting over.

Noodle

Noodle- what I meant by what is worth fighting for is trust and equal respect for one another. I want him to trust me to go dancing- I see your point and others that Dancing these days can be the equvilant to dry humping <img border="0" title="" alt="[Embarrassed]" src="images/icons/blush.gif" /> however I go with girl friends, dance with the girls and it is a country live band- not a night club- there are differences. This however is a mute point now as H and I aggreed to staying home putting the kids to bed early having dinner together and watching a movie. Not what I had originally wanted to do, however not a bad replacement. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

<small>[ March 10, 2005, 06:58 PM: Message edited by: KMEJ ]</small>

oh and Noodle on the other note- I think I agree with you- and it scares me.

I'm so glad you decided to stay at home with your family.

I am totally against going out to the bar with your girlfriends and leaving spouse at home.

There is many, many things you can do with your girlfriends that don't involve booze and bars.

You chose to stay in this marriage against the common feelings of most, given the abuse/neglect factor.

So be in it. Practice what you preach ...home, family, marriage.

Family activities KMEJ, family activities.

I know staying in this marriage is not ideal in almost everyones mind- including mine most days, however I am trying my best to make a go of the vows that I made, and until I can say to myself I have done all that I can, I will continue to put my best foot forward- and that is the main reason I elected to stay home with him tomorrow night- as I would not be following the guidelines I am trying to install in our marriage if I just ignored his feelings. Thanks to everyone for reminding me how selfish I was being. I still really want to go dance- however my brother in law is getting married in a month- I guess I will have to wait to dance at that.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by KMEJ:
<strong> I am trying my best to make a go of the vows that I made, and until I can say to myself I have done all that I can, I will continue to put my best foot forward- </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well KMEJ my good friend, continuing to put "your best foot forward" is admirable......I guess <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> . I see it more like you saying "well, I can probably take more abuse from my husband, after all I made vows to him". YOur husband is an abuser any way you look at it. "putting youe best foot forward" by continuing to do what you are doing is actually just enabling him to continue $hitting on you. SOme here may see that as "fighting for your marriage", I see it as being a doormat. Please reread your posts of the past 6 months. What has changed from 6 months ago?, despite your best "feet" being put forward. Despite what is intuitive here, ONLY a plan B is likely to save your marriage...NOT continued A$$ kicking from your abusive husband. I think this is where you just "don't get it".

There is only one thing here for sure: By you continuing to do what you have always done, you are only ensuring the things that have happened in the past continue to happen again. That is a virtual certainty. I may not know much, but I do know that. This message board spells out that fact a hundred times over. I am sure that you know this, sometimes though I can't help but open my big mouth and offer an opinion (even though unsolicited).

Your friend

LM <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

<small>[ March 10, 2005, 07:29 PM: Message edited by: lemonman ]</small>

KMEJ you remain in an abusive situation by choice. This is not your "best foot" by any measure.

I agree with LM.

Pep

now see I was trying to be all upbeat about it- there I go trying to post what I think others want to hear instead of what I want to post. I actually think that the double standard is crazy. I am working on my plan- I have daycare and am looking at homes on line. I am making a way out while trying to improve what I have- so I have a swinging door instead of a locked one. Thanks for your thoughts- <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by KMEJ:
<strong> now see I was trying to be all upbeat about it- there I go trying to post what I think others want to hear instead of what I want to post. I actually think that the double standard is crazy. I am working on my plan- I have daycare and am looking at homes on line. I am making a way out while trying to improve what I have- so I have a swinging door instead of a locked one. Thanks for your thoughts- <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I can't speak for what others may "want to hear"........BUT I want to hear you say " I WILL not accept this behavior from WH, and I am taking my kids and self AWAY from this utterly destructive behavior UNTILL meaningful LONG TERM ACTIONS have been shown".
That is what I want to hear from you. I hope for it everyday that you post my friend. At this point, WHAT MARRIAGE ARE YOU SAVING?

Protect your beautiful tornadoes and self NOW. Your husband can ONLY change if YOU allow him to. In this, I mean, that you HAVE TO STOP enabling this behavior of his by "staying put". He needs some serious help and he will not ever get it if you enable him to continue on this path. He may NEVER get the help he needs.........YOu have no control over any of that, but YOU DO have control over what your children live with and learn every day from living with an abusive man like your WH.

NOONE is saying this is easy. It obviously isn't. The EASY thing to do would be to stay put. I don't know if my advice jives with proper Marriage BUilder philosphies/beliefs/preachings, etc...(truthfully I don't care if they do or don't) so please take my advice and opinions with that large grain of Salt.

Goodluck

LM <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

I thank you for your response Lemonman. I understand where you are coming from- and you are SO RIGHT I am taking the easy way out- I am terrified of living alone and not being able to support my boys- more so that he will get custody and I will lose them. I keep convincing myself that things will get better, and they do for a few hours or days, but then it goes back. It is very heartbreaking and frustrateing. One would think I would be past the point of no return by now- I really am not sure what keeps me holding out- maybe because when i look at him I still feel love.

Lemonman how have you been?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by KMEJ:
<strong>

Lemonman how have you been? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I am good. Been keeping busy with work and stuff. I am writing a book chapter in a trauma text so that has kept me busy on the puter. All in all things are A-ok. Thank you for asking.

LM <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

are you still working out?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by KMEJ:
<strong> are you still working out? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yep, but I have been slowed a little. I think I was overtraining so I had to cut back my hours of training. I am starting to get back up to speed though.

LM