TM,
I believe that your self image is what you choose for it to be. Remember that our maker regards us as fully vested members of his family, created in His image. He doesnt want you scrambling around on your hands and knees beneath his table looking for crumbs and scraps. He wants you seated at His table enjoying the feast of life that he has provided for us. Take your seat at the table and dont let anyone, WW or anyone else, kick you out of your seat.
Our WW's will never be able to beat us down and take away from us what is rightfully ours if we move them down to #2 on our list of priorities. Know what I mean?
I was reading "Your Best Life Now" by Joel Osteen last night before going to sleep and I thought about you being in H-town and your ability to go hear this guy speak. I wish I could go hear him speak. I am envious that you can actually do it. I will probably make a trip after baseball season to go hear him.

SURGEON GENERALS WARNING: 2 X 4 coming...NOW !!!

I think there is way too much "what if" here. There is no EVIDENCE in any way, shape, or form that TM's wife wants to "reconcile" under MB principles or any principles for that matter. This is all fairy tale talk. Hypothetical talk is of NO USE HERE AND NOW. It is all a waste of time and energy.

This is the problem for TM. He is so damn afraid to be alone without his wife that he is desperate to find anything or anyone to tell him to hang on for the marriage sake and permit him to move his boundaries YET AGAIN.

TM, my friend, you "DO NOT GET IT". By the mere fact that you make this statement:
"I feel certain that once my WW is back in TX, and away from the OM, she will want to work on our M."

This is all your own fog and delusion. Your continued shifting of your boundaries will NO DOUBT hamper away at any semblance of self respect that you may have remaining. How could it not? Anyone who tells you or infers to you that doing so is "strong" or that it is what you have to do to save your marriage is not helping you.

You have recieved a lot of very good advice from people here, but I still think you believe that your situation is different or that what we say does not apply to you. I wish you would realize that this has NOTHING at all to do with the powers of the OM over your wife or any of that B$....this is 100% on your wife. She is choosing this for her life. Moving her to Texas now does NOT change who she is. I would not be holding my breath that she does that either. Not for a new york minute. The sooner you get out of the fog the better. Untill you do this, you are gonna struggle my friend.

Have you registered for premed classes yet? What have you done to PRODUCTIVELY improve your life since you moved back to Texas. Ask yourself this. Be honest with yourself.

LM

WCNT -

I am sorry to say, but because of all that has occurred recently in my life, my faith has been shaken. Like I said before, I am still somewhat angry at God. I wish I could get comfort from Him, and find peace in His strength, but right now I am just not there yet.

Lemonman -

To answer your question, I have done little other than making the move back to TX. That in itself was a big step for me. I have been waiting in limbo for my date to arrive...and it is almost upon me. Once that date comes and goes, I will file on her, get me an apartment in Austin, and file for classes for the upcoming fall semester.

I was considering staying in Houston until the spring semester, so I could be completely free of all debt, but that would be emotionally much harder on me. So I have decided to take the financially more challenging path, so I can finally have some direction, some goal to work toward. I am going completely crazy stuck in limbo here.

Please also understand that I am afraid to be alone, without my WW, because I have never been alone. Ever. I moved out from my mother and in with my WW (then GF) as a senior in High School...at the age of 18. I have always been with someone. I am having a hard time picturing myself solo.

I do "get it"....but I don't wan't it....

I know there is no other way, I am just fighting the changes that are coming.



To put it simply -


I am frightened.


There - I said it.


TM

Hi, TM.

Quote:
==============
I am frightened.
==============

Good. That is a normal reaction to the unknown. It's what you do about it that counts.

Face it head on.

God bless,
Gimble

"I am sorry to say, but because of all that has occurred recently in my life, my faith has been shaken. Like I said before, I am still somewhat angry at God. I wish I could get comfort from Him, and find peace in His strength, but right now I am just not there yet."

TM,
I understand what you are saying here and certainly a lot of folks would feel the same way you do. Many wonder why God allows bad things to happen to us. To me, it is simple. We are creatures of free will and that was the way God created us. We are not robots. That being said, there is a real, undeniable presence of evil in this world. Because of OUR weaknesses, we sometimes allow evil to creep into our lives and then bad things do happen. So how can we rightfully blame God for us allowing that evil to creep into our lives? The key is to instead, take that evil and turn it around for God's glory. By doing that, we win the war. It is our choice. Are we going to let evil win this battle within our lives?
You can get comfort from and peace as well. It is freely given and is there just for the asking. The question is, are you willing to humble yourself enough to ask for it? I have there is a lot of empowerment in submission to Him.
Also, as far as rushing to D, for me, I have no reason to move mine or allow my WW to move mine along quickly. I dont see any reason to hasten the finality of the demise of my M. If I was ready to move along to another relationship, maybe. But I know that I dont want to do that. I dont need another relationship to complete me. I can continue to work on myself and my self-improvement regardless of the progress of the D. Lemonman is correct. You HAVE to get out of your fog. I differ though by believing that you can get out of your fog without filing. I dont really see how the two issues are joined together. For me they are not. I guess that is a question you have to answer for yourself. If you cant get out of your fog under the present conditions, then I guess you have no choice. If you do chose to file, make sure it is for the right reasons. The only way you can be sure of that, goes back to the faith issue. Just my .02 and I am for sure, not a MB veteran here.



"You gotta have a good imagination,
If you are gonna live a life of hope"
Jack Ingram

WCNT -

Thanks for your perspective. I will think about your last post. If I file, it will not be to just shake my WW up. It will be to end our M. Otherwiswe, it would just be another form of pretending. I really can't see how I could ever take her back and be 100% trusting and happy with her for the rest of my years. I have come to this realization recently, and that's why I am losing it just a bit right now....


---------------

My best friend, whom I talk to almost every day, told me a couple of things that struck me. She said 1) that I want to be a martyr for some reason, and 2) that I can't see myself through my own eyes...I always want to see myself through other's eyes.

This woman is the most intuitive, and self-aware person that I have ever met. And I think her read on me was dead on. I am not sure as to why I feel and act this way, but I know she is right. I am sure this plays a part in why I am having a hard time letting go and standing completely on my own. She also believes that martyrdom is in essence a selfish act, not a selfless one. She feels that you want to do something for a cause, but only if others know you did it, and why you did it ....you then turn the act back into a selfish one.

And I see her point. She has become somewhat of my therapist right now, albeit tougher and more to the point than most would be. I guess she is what Lemonman would be if he were a psychologist. Although some of the things she says hurt, they are the truth....and the truth hurts sometimes.

My favorite lines of any song can illustrate how I would like to be perceived...

A man in black, on a snow white horse,
a pointless life has run its course,
and every night the tears still run,
as he fades into the setting sun.

Pink Floyd "Yet Another Movie"


I am also amazed at the amount of people here, veterans and otherwise, that all agree I should leave my WW and never look back. In most (all?) the other threads I read, save maybe KMEJ and her abusive WH, I hear so much more adivice to try and keep fighting for the M. Why is my sitch so different? Is it because I am too weak, too unable to stand alone? Or is it because my WW has put her career before our M?

I am just curious.

I awoke this morning very sad after having a nightmare. My WW and I were in a mall, and she was just so happy, so content. She told me that she was over me completely, even though I had gone there to tell her I was filing on her. It just about made her day. I was crushed that there was no hint of remorse, no concern, nothing but joy.

I know it was just a dream, but it affected me pretty heavily this morning.



TM

Hi, TM.

Quote:
==================
Why is my sitch so different?
==================

Your wife is a user, TM. That is a character issue that you can't help fix.

Gimble

"1) that I want to be a martyr for some reason, and 2) that I can't see myself through my own eyes...I always want to see myself through other's eyes."

TM,
this is just too much to be just a coincidence. Last night while reading Osteen's book he was speaking about this very issue. So, I feel obligated to impart this to you....he said that we have to stop being concerned about how we are perceived through others eyes. We have to stop comparing ourselves to others. We have to run our own race guided by God. We have to see ourselves as God sees us. As God sees us is the most truthful and accurate vision there is. Ask Him to change our hearts to what His will represents and you will already be a success. This all goes back to not letting the world beat us down.
How do you stop being a martyr? Take control of you own life. Again, find empowerment through submission to His will.
I hope I am not overloading you with the faith aspect of this and how it relates to your life. But really, the choice is yours. I challenge you to go, just once to Lakewood Church to hear Joel speak. If you find God doesnt speak to you through him, dont go again.




"You gotta have a good imagination,
If you are gonna live a life of hope"
Jack Ingram

Being afraid is OK. More then OK. It's reality. Facing that reality, how and when, is how you will measure your image of yourself some where down the road. Be afraid...just don't be so afraid that you forsake your courage and sense of self in favor of that which is more then just less.
Coach

Thanks for the responses...

Gimble -

I hope you are incorrect, although I think you may be right. My only thought is that you are getting a biased opinion of her as seen through my eyes...and right now my filter on her character is pretty negative. Maybe one day, I can get her to post here, as a condition to reconciliation - that is, if she does indeed "catch up" to me....

WCNT -

Don't worry about overloading me. I am a strong Christian, although I am going through an angry phase right now. I know I will be giving up this anger, as it just wrecks me emotionally and spiritually. I will take your advice to see Joel at least once before I move to Austin. It is about an hour drive away, but I will do it.

coach -

Could you elaborate on what you mean by "...just don't be so afraid that you forsake your courage and sense of self in favor of that which is more then just less?"

I will face this new reality. It is just so hard to accept that it IS reality. This was not how my life was supposed to be working out at this point.

-----------

I went out last night, and had some very ego-boosting fun with a number of girls...all innocent, and I went home alone. But it was fun flirting. I did get some numbers, but I don't have to use them...it makes me feel good to be able to just get them. I need a bit of a boost right now.

I have reconnected with a married couple that my WW and I used to hang out with all the time back when we lived here...and they were shocked when I told them what is going on. They have been inviting me over to just hang out and BBQ and talk, etc...it is good to have some friends that are more stable and calm. All my other friends just go out and party...

In fact, I may take my old friends up on an invitation to go deep sea fishing with them next weekend. That will keep me out of the clubs for the whole weekend. This will be the first weekend I will have missed going out in about 6 weeks, maybe more.


TM

TM,
glad to hear that you will go see Joel at least once. I didnt realize you were an hour away. I guess the fact that I live in podunk San Antonio (according to Charles Barkley)I sometimes forget what it is like to live in a major metropolis like you do. Anyway, if the hour drive gets in the way of you going, at least (and maybe you ought to do this anyway) pick up his book.
I think, his church is moving to or has already moved into the Compaq Center.



"You gotta have a good imagination,
If you are gonna live a life of hope"
Jack Ingram

WCNT -

Yes, his church is moving, but not there yet...the move will cut my drive time considerably.

--------------

Just a quick update to all that follow my story.

I decided to go back on Zoloft a few days ago. I was on it for about two years leading up to my WW's A. I believe it contributed to the state our M was in...but I know I will need the extra help during the D process...which will be starting soon. I am not looking forward to filing, and am procrastinating, but I am aware that I have few options left.

A doormat no longer....I hope.


TM

TM,
I am not going to tell you what you should or should not do, as I am muddling my way through this mess with the help of others on this site as you are too. But what I will tell you is that you should try and view yourself as God views you. No one else matters.



"you gotta have a good imagination,
if you are gonna live a life of hope"
Jack Ingram

TM

how you doing mate?

anytime you need to have yak just email away I'm usually only a few hours or so away from the PC these days - recovering still and still on crutches half the time - did I ever say its driving me up the wall? well it is ..lol
anyway hope you doing ok <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

WCNT -

I am trying to change my focus - it is a difficult paradigm shift for me.


Aussie -

Doing pretty well, all things considered...and thanks for the offer - I may take you up on it.

-------------

I returned home this morning from a fishing trip - since Friday afternoon. No computer access all weekend - I don't know how I survived! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I went with a old buddy of mine to Aransas Pass to bay fish on Saturday, then offshore fish on Sunday. First of all, let me say I am no fisherman. I know it may be hard for some here to believe, but there are Texans that don't enjoy killing things for sport, but I am living proof of this fact. Now don't get me wrong, I am no vegan, nor do I hate those who choose to hunt...I just don't want to partake in such activities. I had a bit of a problem sticking the hooks through the sides of the bait fish we were using. I guess I see all animals as innocent...humans are a different story altogether.

But I went despite my reservations, just to get away from my impending D filing, and all the turmoil that goes along with such a monumental decsion. And you know what? I enjoyed the trip much more that I expected to.

The first day of fishing was a total bust, though. We sat in the sun for about 9 hours, with hardly a nibble. I didn't really care honestly, but it was amazingly HOT...at least I am as tan as can be at this point...I could almost pass as a Latino now. The offshore fishing was a whole 'nuther ball game. It was amazing. We went out on a FAST 38' fountain boat - 66mph top speed, and went more than 50 miles offshore. We caught gobs of red snapper, a number of shark, a couple of grouper, a triggerfish, and a 50-60 lb. Ling. Because of the size laws we only could keep 5 of the snapper, the grouper, the triggerfish, and the ling. But we had a ball, and were able to partake in the spoils of the day yesterday night at a resturant where they will cook what you bring in.

I am now back in town, and back to work. I needed that break....in fact I need about 10 more like that one. I am heading out of town on business for the next three days, then back here for more on Friday.



I am dreading the 4th of July. It has always been the biggest holiday for my in-laws and WW...we rarely missed the huge BBQ and parade at my MIL's country place - even when we lived in Philly. I know I will be down that weekend. I am trying to find somewhere to be that weekend...or at least to be here in town, but very busy.



TM

Glad you enjoyed the fishing - What is a ling?? Haven't talked to you in a while. Sorry to hear your so down. Listen to me I want to tell you conserning the drugs and raves - TM it sounds to me that you are very down on yourself. Are you trying to punish yourself for what you WW does? You are not at fault here. Us BS's take to much responsiblity for what our WS have done. My God - if they had been honest about what was going on alot of us would not even be here. We are the good ones - you did not decieve anyone, you were a good H -please listen to these people please. Will you please take another look in the mirror and just stop and see how good you really are?? I realize I had to stop blaming me and am now I am starting to feel better about myself. I can now look in the mirror and see that I am pretty and my god the guys do look at me. I thought they looked and laughed and thought boy is she ugly. So I know where you are now. As far as just picking women and getting SF. That stinks - you need to file for the D and then get on with your life. You are a kind, and decent man - there is a specila woman out there. You will have a wonderful life in the future. I beg you to listen to me.

realtor-

I didn't know what a ling was until yesterday, either...so don't feel bad. It is a very tasty big saltwater fish - quite fast as well. It was amazing to see the fight that it put up - even once on the boat.

I am down on myself a bit, but I am getting better...although getting shot down at bars/clubs by women doesn't help much either. I am just doing it right now for the practice, though. I am so far out of the dating game, that my skills, if I ever had any, are rusted solid.

I am staying away from just picking up women for SF - not only for my mental/spiritual health, but also my attorney's advice. It makes for a less complicated D.

I am hurting right now, but it takes pain in order to properly heal. I have buried my emotional garbage for way too long - I need to feel this pain, and then let it go...I believe I am doing that, and coping to the best of my abilities. Fairly soon, I will develop a goal and a direction for my life. I will be able to stop treading water, and work towards that end. And I will no longer have to try to escape my life, for my life will be as I chose it. I will be back in control of my future.

Thanks again for the encouragement.


TM

Hi, TM.

So, you are practicing picking up girls in bars. I have just one question;

Why?

You are unlikely to find the kind of woman you need in a bar, or a club, or at a rave.

Do you have any friends close by, and I don't mean party friends? If you don't, go find a church and start going. Make some friends. Do some normal things. Have dinner with some families. There is another side to world out there.

I know how appealing the darker side of things are, especially when you are feeling lost and depressed.

Here is how you start to turn away from the things that want to consume you. Get on a normal wake/sleep schedule. Simply restricting your activities to 'normal' hours will have a tremendous effect on your outlook. Add in some exercise several times a week. I still work out 6 days a week. I certainly don't need to, other than it helps me focus.

Just like choosing to move on with your life, you choose to live life, not wander aimlessly waiting on a day you have set in your mind to pass, as a trigger to start the rest of your life. Stop waiting on her. That is not abandonment. That is called 'learning to breath on your own again'.

Have you actually planned out your filing? Do you have a lawyer? Money to do it?

I had myself a 30 year old girlfriend when I was 17, TM. I can understand the power of that attraction. The difference between you and me, is that I was an addict, and already so jaded that I didn't trust anyone. In that case, it kept me out of some additional misery. Still, it was tumultuous right up to the part where I walked in and saw my best friend between her legs.

You know from your religious background that there is a divide between light and dark, and that the path you walk is primarily of your own choosing. Time to make the decision to step on out in the light, TM.

I don't want to beat up on you, TM. I just want to see you take the last few steps toward regaining your life. In fact, it is a little selfish of me. I want to read your post about how much sense your life is beginning to make to you. I want to read about happy stuff in your life. Good events, good people and good times.

You are walking about in a fog that is stratified just above your head. All you have to do is hop up a bit, and you will be able to see over it. A couple of strategic steps, and it is below you.

Take the damn steps, TM <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

God bless,
Gimble

I understand TM. Just take it slow -you'll get there. Your a very smart guy. I know you can do this. Sometimes we have to go thro some hell before the skies clear.

Gimble -

I do have the money and have retained an attorney. She will be filing very soon. I have my date and will stick by it. No more pushing my boundaries back. I have written the email that I will be delivering to her after my attorney files the papers. I will post it here once they are filed for comment if I am able to get computer access where I am heading today.

I have been resistant to getting involved in a church and going to see a counselor because I might be moving to a new city in the coming months. Once I have established my home base, I have full intentions of moving forward with both items. I know I need the support that both will provide.

I do work out...probably too much. I recently bought a pair of pants with a 32" waist...and they fit just fine. I used to be snug in a 34"....


I understand your POV, Gimble...and I know you want what's best for me...it is just so very hard for me to accept that my life is, and will be, so very different from what I planned for so long. I used to work so hard....SO HARD...just thinking about how I could quit once my WW started practicing, and do what I wanted...it was supposed to be MY TURN...

Now I have to start completely over. All that time was for naught.

I will get my affairs in order, you can count on that.




realtor -

Yes, I will get there...even if "there" is not exactly where I used to think it was going to be.



TM