<small>[ July 07, 2004, 11:45 AM: Message edited by: relady ]</small>

Hi all,

This is going to be a kind of drive-by... because I'm at work and only have a few moments. I've been pretty busy still and it's my Son's B-day today... he is 25 yrs. old. Man, how time flies!

Leah...

We are happy to be of help... and I will speak for myself at this point. I will call any situation the way I see it (as you probably already know...LOL), be it good or bad.

Keep looking and staying aware... until you can either come up with the goods on him, or find peace of mind.

Relady...

Well hello stranger!

It's good to hear from you. I have missed your quick wit and humor, as well as all the good solid advice you have given me over time.

I'm sorry to hear about all that has happened... you really had to probably muster up all the stregnth you had to get past all of that. I hope things are settling down for you and evening out.

You went to "HAWAII" and didn't ask me to meet you over there? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> What's up with that! LOL/ j/k

I'm waiting for you to give me the business... just as soon as you get caught up with all the posts. This should be good. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Stay in touch... and let us know how you are making out... it's good to see you back, but wish it were under better circumstances.

WGTT...

Sorry I didn't read you SIG line lately... I don't usually read them... unless someone is new to the thread... or I'm posting to another thread, or it gets pointed out to me that the SIG line has changed. It does sound like yours is going to change again though.

The WS never ceases to amaze me. Just when you think you have dialed into them... they change directions, and go and screw everything up... and then you have to almost start all over again.

I'm sorry to hear about the latest. Keep praying like you have, and let the Lord guide you through this time as well.

Trusting Him...

I finally had a little time to visit your website.

It's very touching, and I know you put your heart into it, as well as probably quite a bit of time.

Do you think your former has seen it?

Nice site though... keep working on it, and keep it up to date... It helped me rethink a number of things in my life as I read through what you had to say.

Petvet...

Count me in on Beach front property as well. I love the beach, as well as lakes, streams, waterfalls and the like.

I'm with you as well... no "M" for me for awhile either. I like being single again! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

avondale...

Since you have had your hair done... how many guys have tried to make a pass at you? I'll bet quite a few... huh?

EC...

I know your out there! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Let us know how your making out when you get a chance.

Well I hope everyone had a good holiday... it's back to work for me now.

Hope everyone has a great day today.

Stay Strong!

Wallace

Trusting Him-

What is your website?


EVERYONE - FYI
DearPeggy.com announcements:

The Cover Story of the current issue of Newsweek magazine focuses on the increase in women having affairs. It's an 8-page article with illustrations if you want to pick up a copy. To read an excerpt from the article, go to: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5360418/site/newsweek

Next week (after the magazine is no longer on newsstands), it will be appropriate for me to post the entire article on my website - which I'll do. So check back after July 13 to read it.

I am quoted in the article, and the particular comments of mine that they used relate to “Online Affairs” and the study I did on that issue. (Actually, I conducted TWO surveys: one for those who had had an online affair and the other for those whose SPOUSES had had an online affair.) I have now completed an eBook with all the results of both surveys as well as the many "comments" submitted by the respondents.
You can read a brief overview (in html format) at:
http://www.dearpeggy.com/online.html
Or to read the longer sample (in pdf format), see "View Sample" at:
http://www.dearpeggy.com/shop/index.html (where it can also be purchased).

Also, I want to alert everyone that I'm leaving early Thursday morning for the SmartMarriages Conference in Dallas. I'll be making 2 presentations plus have a "Poster Session" and hosting table discussions on Affairs at the luncheons. So I won't be able to respond to emails or other contact until next week.

For more information about SmartMarriages (formally the Coalition for Marriage, Family and Couples Education - CMFCE) you might read this week's Question of the Week (where I say more about it at the end of my response)
http://www.dearpeggy.com/question.html
or go to the page that always posted on my website:
http://www.dearpeggy.com/seminars.html
or go directly to the SmartMarriages website:
http://www.smartmarriages.com/


More later,

D.

Wow, this is like family reunion week, isn't it? It is great that some of you are posting again; we're all at stages that are different but can still learn from each other in many ways.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Wallace said: Since you have had your hair done... how many guys have tried to make a pass at you? I'll bet quite a few... huh?
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Actually, none, <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> but I did giggle when I read that! I still wear my wedding & engagement rings, and make a concerted effort to not do or say ANYTHING that can be misconstrued to make myself appear available. But now I'm thinking it's a good thing I gained weight from cancer surgery, cuz otherwise I'd be a knockout! LOL Meanwhile, a friend's daughter told me I "look hot". Imagine that! I cannot WAIT for hubby to set up the next meeting so I can impress him. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> By the way, who would have thought that a haircut would have given my battered self-esteem such a boost?!?

Petvet - Count me in on the beach property. Maybe we should start a limited partnership here for those of us from this thread to buy a house? If I ever get divorced, I'll then know what my financial status is, so I can plan better.

Hope everyone stays cool....it's been in the upper 90s here <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

Hi all,

WGTT...

Thanks for the links! I'm proud of you for being such an advocate for what is really going on in a vast amount of marriages these days.

I haven't had a chance to look at the links you posted yet... but I knew that in the last several years, the WS has been for the most part... the woman/wife. Don't ask me why... maybe it's something in the air.

avondale...

You want me to believe that not one person made a pass at you yet... and since when did a wedding ring top someone from making a move on someone? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

You go girl! Your heading in the right direction. Take care of yourself... When your feeling good... your also looking good as well.

Me...

Well my son had a nice B-day.

All of my kids and my G/F went out to dinner and then had B-day cake and ice cream. It was very enjoyable having all my kids there... and we all had a great time.

Well I hope everyone's day is going well.

Back to work!

Stay Strong!

Wallace

Hello Everyone,

Hope you are all enjoying a good week. Time is flying fast for me. Summer is a great time with the girls, lots of fun and activity. Still no phone bills...but I'm okay with that for now. Just giving it all back to God and asking Him daily to reveal truth.

I'm confident that in time truth will come out. Meanwhile, I'm enjoying this time of decency with H. It very well could be the yo-yo effect that a couple of you wrote about. I figure either way, his behavior will reveal truth in time.

WALLACE,

Thanks for the advice on letting go of the phone bill thing until the tide turns again. With time and prayers, that is what felt right to me too.

So you did this for 23 years! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> We've been married 16 years but the severe misbehaviors didn't start until 5 1/2 years ago. But there was an EA ten years ago with his secretary. It was all minimized and swept under the rug at the time. I didn't really see it for all that it probably was until later when all the lies and deceptions began.

I'm a very different woman today than I was then. I've learned so much and have become much stronger because of all that has transpired with H. I continue to strive to find the balance of tough love. I hope that this doesn't continue for 23 years. How I pray that in time it will be resolved one way or the other.

I hope you and your girlfriend are doing well. You haven't mentioned her much anymore. Hope we didn't scare off your thoughts on the subject. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> We just want to see you happy!

PETVET,

I have let H's know I would have to "evaluate my options" a time or two before. When it comes to the point when he thinks I might call it quits, he always turns around and gets his act together quick. He knows how desperately I want to make this marriage work and he seems to know just how much he needs to do to keep me here.

What I'm looking for now is consistency on his part. I truly do not wish to be stupid about this relationship and I can only continue it if I can be at peace. Also, I want what is best for the girls most of all. So that is what my points of evaluation are.

Thanks for your comments and help. I'm so glad you have Buddy. That is an encouragement to me, as when I first was drawn to this thread, I hurt for you and your loss. Some of it just sounded so familiar and I wanted you to find that "happy ending". It helps to see others who have survived all the pain of a hurtful marriage and who have gone on to find happiness on the other side.

Real Estate at the beach sounds nice! We were just there last week and so enjoyed it! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />


TRUSTING HIM,

Reading what you wrote about the statement your former had written on her bills was like a step back into the past. The same thing happened to me five years ago when I was attempting to discover if his adultery was continuing. I was frantically trying to figure things out and there were continuous road blocks, deceptions and lies. Not a happy time.

I was surprised to read that you would separate quicker given what you know now. It seems you so want your marriage back that I didn't think you would have ended it given the chance again. There are times when I look back at the past five years that I wish I had just ended it a long time ago when things were much more blatant. But I just wasn't ready at the time. Every time I prayed about it, it would seem I was put on hold. I don't know if thats because it just wasn't the right time yet or if that was because we really are meant to be together. Only God knows and I'm going to continue to commit it all to Him. He alone can be my strength and peace through it all.

I pray for you that either God would work a miracle in your former's life or that he would give you total peace about that chapter of your life being over. I don't think there could be anything more difficult to accept. Facing my H's feelings or lack thereof for me has been a monumental task that I couldn't do apart from God's love. It's knowing He's there no matter what that keeps me going. Keep looking up!

AVONDALE,

In answer to your question about reminders to him, yes, I reminded him twice in the beginning. I was seriously considering what you wrote two weeks ago when this whole phone thing came about. But with time I decided to go the other way. What I envisioned was him giving me the phone bills but then me being even more confused about what to do with them. Another words, there would be a big grey phone bill sitting in front of me, with no real answers.

At one point, I looked at his phone and there were a couple of "unknown callers". When I asked who those callers were, he quickly named three different clients and said their company phone registers unknown caller for some reason. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> So that type of thing would probably be all over the phone bill.

In the past it's proven just about fruitless because he often covers ground quickly if he knows there is the possibility I'll look. One time there was just a monthly total. When I asked where the detailed billing was, he just shrugged and said he didn't have a clue, must be the secretary filed it away somewhere. Another time all incoming calls were listed as that, rather than with an actual number.


So in the end, it's like chasing rabbits. I go down many trails but end up empty handed with more questions than when I started. That is why I decided to just give it all back to God again and wait for Him to do something concrete. He's a much better detective than me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> I think I just waste a lot of energy and time when I try to play detective with H. He's far too smart and creative in his efforts. God's the only one who can keep up with him. So H's all His.

I wish I could see a picture of your haircut. It must be quite the thing!! I'm always looking for a good style. I sure would love to trim 10 years off and have a good ole boost of self confidence. I'm really glad for you and can't wait to hear about your H's reaction. That will be fun. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />


EC,

Hope you are doing well. Hopefully you've been busy having fun with your daughters. It seems that you've been doing better and better each time you write. It seems that you really have got past the worst of it. I'm glad for you. Take care and write when you can.

WGTT,

When you wrote about God changing your direction, I had to smile. He has done the same with me several times. It was really pretty amazing. One time I was returning from talking to the attorney who was trying to convince me to file. I cried and prayed all the way home for God to direct me. I was ready to go ahead and file unless God stopped me. When I got home, I found a letter in my mailbox from a friend of my sister whom I hadn't seen or talked with for 15 years. (She is living on the other side of the country.) Any how this letter was a long letter of encouragement to continue to commit the marriage to God, complete with personal testimony and verse after verse.

This did not happen just once. God seems to give me the message of extending love and grace to my H, even when I'm so ready for it to end.

I will pray for you as you have once again had to return to square one. My heart goes out to you. I know how difficult it is. Isn't it good to know that God is still there, ever faithful and ever present. He will see you through.

RELADY,

It sounds as if you have been through much. I'm so sorry for the loss of your mother. God has entrusted much to you. You seem to be a woman of great strength. Keep looking to God. He will bless and guide you!

HELLO to anyone else I might have missed. Hope you all enjoy a happy weekend!

Hi All,

Glad to see everyone, Wallace, Petvet, Avondale, WGTT, Trusting Him, Relady, Davepr, Leah and anyone else I missed. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

Lots of things going on I see, I'll have to post later...

YD didn't come, she pushed the visit date back further, but she'll come sometime in the future.......

Me: I haven't been doing much but living life.

See Ya later.......Have a great weekend

WillGetThruThis

Jehovah Rophe - For I am Jehovah who heals

Simply a place that started out as a place for me to write and attempt to maintain some sense of order in my life.

As time has progressed and the proces of forgiveness has set it I have slacked up there as I usually just expressed myself or vented there. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Your words hit home. Without repentenance and a turning from their old ways there is no chance of receovery. The old has to pass away and a new person emerge. I personally believe that without repenting, forgiving, becoming contrite and showing remorse that a marraige is doomed for failure. (something like that, probably did not come out right)


Leah2be

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I was surprised to read that you would separate quicker given what you know now. It seems you so want your marriage back that I didn't think you would have ended it given the chance again. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Although the words are very true I think WillGetThruThis pretty much summed it up with these words;

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> WH never repented & I believe the guilt and shame is really eating him. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">My former never showed one ounce of repentance or remorse and even today still believes that all of our marital problems are because of me. I do believe that the guilt and shame is really eating at her but rather than own up to our 17 years together she would rather find happiness in a new relationship.

I would only begin the process of seperation earlier if I had to do it over again. I fell to the concept of instant forgiveness and I believe it allowed her to believe that I was a doormat. A person who would do anything to save the marriage and even put up with the lies and deception. But. . . like they say, that is hind sight.

Today I am just trying to prepare myself for the possibility of having the children with me one day. All three tell me quite regualry that if Mom should marrie this guy she is dating now they will not stay in the same house with him.

I think He is leaning toward the total peace about that chapter of my life. I had the children last night as the former had planned a suprise birthday party for her BF that was going to run into the wee hours of the morning.

Today our daughter went forward at Chruch to tell all she wanted to be Baptised <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> , and of course the parents stood with her as the congergation greeted her afterwards. So. . . there were the 5 of us at the front of the Church, 4 beaming sparkling smiles and 1 somewhat hardened Mother. Even for something like this.


Wallace

I think Avondale may be holding a bit back. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> No one made a pass at her!

Glad to hear the B-day went well and you had a good tiem with the kids. It is great to get them all together.

Me:

Just going on with life. Had a brithday recently and it was good. Several of the people in the DivorceCare class I help with took me out to dinner and of course <img border="0" title="" alt="[Embarrassed]" src="images/icons/blush.gif" /> me by singing Happy Birthday in the middle of the resturant.

The children took me to see "King Arthur" for my brthday. It was a pretty good movie. Me and the 2 olders ones enjoyed it while the YD took a much deserved nap.

My former called that day with her usual cheerful words, "Happy Birthday, today is your birthday isn't it?" Like she has forgotten so soon. I personally would rather have nothing or just the Happy Birthday part but to each their own.

Other than that life goes on.

Hope all have had a great weekend! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Hi all,

Hope everyone had a good weekend. Mine started out real rough, but then started to level out towards the end... but I will get back to that later.

EC...

I'm sorry to hear that your YD didn't come out.

What happened?

I know you were really looking forward to seeing her this summer. Is there still any possibility of that still happening?

Hang in there... you sound like your still in good spirits... keep your head up, and keep doing what your doing.

Trusting Him...

A belated "Happy Birthday" to you. Glad to hear that you had a good time.

I agree with you as far as avondale holding out on us... I think there had to be at least 5 or more gentlemen make a pass at her.

I'll bet that felt kind of awkward having your former at Church while smiling the whole time. I haven't seen, nor spoken to my exW for over 2-1/2 years... so thankfully I have been spared that kind of situation.

Me...

I had another episode concerning "marriage" again with my G/F this weekend. We just about decided to call it a day it got so intense.

She is acusing me of not wanting to get "M", when she in fact is the one that throws the roadblocks in the way. When she does... and I agree with her that her concerns are legit... and we should wait... she gets upset, and then says that I have no intention of ever wanting to get "M".

I finally stated that we have gone over this way to much... and if it's brought up again within this year... I'm going to call off the "M", and we can just date if she still wants to.

Add this and the IRS and all their wonderfulness, and the stack of papers that I'm still filling out... it was just one of those weekends that I could have done without.

Well I hope everyone has a great day and a great week.

Stay Strong!

Wallace

EC - Let me echo Wallace’s regret that your YD didn’t come to see you. I know that has to be a disappointment. What have you been doing in the meantime?

Leah - Good for you, for letting God be the detective. That’s a moniker you don’t often hear, isn’t it? Although He is a protector, so I guess it’s a similar title.

Relady - Thanks for the explanation about what’s happened with you. Are you still in the same church? I hope they’ve stood with you through your stuff! To answer your question to me- physically I’m doing pretty good. No more kids for me, but at age 47 with my youngest child being 24, it’s a non-issue, LOL. I have gained some weight (which I didn’t want) but part of that was from the “why bother” attitude I had in the 3 weeks prior to surgery, and then 6 weeks of limited walking post-surgery. We’ve missed you!

Trusting - You have A LOT of class, standing in front of people yet still able to smile with your former wife. I admire that. It’s still difficult for me to imagine you guys in the same church, though. I’m glad I don’t have to walk through that. Do you think your former would create problems if the kids wanted to live with you if she remarries?

WGTT - I hadn’t been to Dear Peggy in a long while. I’ll have to look at Newsweek magazine this week, to see the article there too. Have you had that intervention yet which you mentioned? Let us know how it goes, and how we can support you.

Wallace - Are you officially (or even unofficially) engaged? The reason I ask is what you wrote: </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I'm going to call off the "M", and we can just date if she still wants to </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Reading that, it implies you have definite plans, no matter how far in the future they might be, and are not just dating. Forgive me if we’ve already been over this, it’s just that I thought you were “just dating” already, with POSSIBLE plans for marriage when all kids were out of the house. In my mind there's a difference, and I wonder if your G/F thinks so too, hence the communication problems <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Hello Everyone,

Hope your all doing well and enjoying a good week.
I'm afraid I haven't been the best. I feel like such a failure. I have not been able to let the phone bill thing go like I should.

Each day that goes by that he doesn't bring the phone bills home, the harder it is. I finally brought it up again on Sunday night. He didn't bring them home again yesterday. I got upset and felt like he just didn't care.

Now he's getting them. He called to say he made copies of the "stupid phone bills" He's doing it but he's angry about it. He feels I'm trying to control him, when I feel I'm just asking for some reassurance that he's being faithful. QUESTION FOR THE MEN... Would you feel your wife was trying to control you if she asked for proof that youré being faithful???

I guess I'm still trying to go both ways... give it to God but then still wanting him to be accountable. CAN YOU DO OR HAVE BOTH??

Sorry this is a "downer" I'm just feeling pretty defeated right now.


EC

So sorry your daughter did not come for a visit. I hope that can still happen later this summer. You sound good despite the disappointment. Hope everything else in life is well.

TRUSTING HIM,

I very much understand the concept of forgiving too quickly. I'm afraid I messed up on that one too. I might still be messing up on that one. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> I believe we're always called to forgive but we don't have to choose to accept someone's bad behavior or even choose to continue the relationship. I think there should be forgiveness but there should also be consequences for peoples choices. Does that make sense??

It's hard to imagine that your wife has shown no remorse at all. That would be infuriating!! Although my H has not truly repented before God, he has shown some remorse towards me. He has admitted how wrong he was for the choices he made. He has told me that although I contributed to the break down of the marriage, he takes total responsibility for having the affair. He has also said how very sorry he is for hurting me. So that does mean something, although it loses quite a bit of its meaning when the behavior is repeated.

You seem to be so strong... to stand in front of the church with your ex-wife. That would be so hard. I admire your positive attitude and determination to move forward with God.

Happy Belated Birthday!!! It's great that you have a good support group at your church. I'm sure that's a great help for you. Keep looking up!

WALLACE,

I'm sorry you had a bad weekend. That doesn't sound like much fun. I sure do hope you can iron out the point of "M" conflict with your girlfriend. I thought AVONDALE brought up a good point about the engagement thing. Hopefully, with some good communication about that things could be worked out. I hope you have a better week than weekend.

AVONDALE,

Has your husband seen the "new" you yet? Thanks for the kind words of encouragement. As I've already written, I'm afraid I haven't done such a great job of continuing to "give it all to God". I seem to do good for awhile then I find myself drifting back to wanting him to be accountable to me. He interprets this as control and becomes angry and defensive. Will I ever break away from this vicious cycle??

Hi to PETVET, WGTT, RELADY and others who I wrote to in my last post. Hope you're all doing well.

Thanks for listening to my "woes". I'm sure in time I'll put this thing in proper perspective. I'm just tired and frustrated at this point. But there is always a new tomorrow and there is always hope in God. I just need to remind myself of that.

Hi all!

EC: I'm sorry to hear about your YD. Try to reschedule another visit if she wants. I know it must have been disappointing.

Leahtobe: Keep in mind that your H put himself in this position where someone has to watch over his shoulders.

Wallace: What can I say! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Avondale: 47! Sweetheart, fine tune the engine and go for it. Kido, you are in the prime of your life. Show what you got! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

Trusting Him: You are on the right track it sounds to me.

Me: Catching one of EC's statements, I'm just living life.

Later.

Leah2b

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">QUESTION FOR THE MEN... Would you feel your wife was trying to control you if she asked for proof that youré being faithful???</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I can only answer from where I stand.

My formers fear stemmed from my inability to manage our finances in a way that ensured she could trust me. That stemmed from my procrastination, my inability to tell her and the children no, me having no financial discipline at all and a 10k cut in pay several years ago which put us on the brink of bankruptcy.

To remove those fears I put our checkbook on the kitchen counter, told her that if she had any questions at all about any checks that were written to simply ask and I would answer. I attended financial counseling with 2 men and made myself accountable to them and my former for everything that was spent.


Why?

God convicted me of the weak areas in my life, of how I had managed the small things that He had entrusted me with, how I had failed to love my former just as Christ loved the Church. The least I could do was repent, show remorse and contriteness and attempt restitution and put people or principals in place to ensure that I did not fail in those areas again.

But when all of this stuff with the OM popped up.

I know that you will not understand this but I see you asking for access to my cell phone account and call detail as a control issue. That is my phone and my voice mail and it should be considered private.

Was she seeing a OM?

If our marriage was what it should be I would have never pursued a relationship with OM.

I guess that’s a long winded version of what I believe. If repentance is from the heart the person will do whatever is necessary to ensure the trust of their mate. In the early stages of recovery I think a WS should do whatever the BS needs to ensure them of that trust. But…there will come a time when we as the BS will have to choose to trust again vs depending on external evidence. Our mate’s actions agreeing with their words are what will bring us to that point of choosing to trust again.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It's hard to imagine that your wife has shown no remorse at all. That would be infuriating!! Although my H has not truly repented before God, he has shown some remorse towards me. He has admitted how wrong he was for the choices he made. He has told me that although I contributed to the break down of the marriage, he takes total responsibility for having the affair. He has also said how very sorry he is for hurting me. So that does mean something, although it loses quite a bit of its meaning when the behavior is repeated.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I would have been happy with those statements. The best I ever got was an “I guess it’s not all your fault.”

TRUSTING HIM,

Thanks for your reply. Wow, it sounds as if you worked very hard to be in a place of accountability. I agree with you that if a person is sincerely repentant, he or she doesn't mind doing what it takes to prove themselves trustworthy again.

I'm sorry you never heard the words of remorse that all of us BS's long to hear. Keep trusting God to work in your former's life. She may yet come to a point of conviction in her life. If not, it seems that you have done all you could do to restore the marriage. You can move onward in life with the freedom of that knowledge.

EVERYONE,

I could be off base here, but the more I consider our situation the more I think it's going to have to be an all or nothing proposition here. Either I totally entrust this relationship to God and not "require" anything of H or I seek a divorce.

There doesn't seem to be any middle ground in this relationship. H resists and resents any type of accountability, even if he's innocent. That is his make-up. If someone tells him he has to go right, he'll go left just because. So, if I'm to stay married, I'll have to leave any consequences or judgements up to God. Then, continue on until I feel "ënough".

Like I said, this is a thought that's in process. Take care everyone. Wishing you a good day!

Leah
You said: </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Either I totally entrust this relationship to God and not "require" anything of H or I seek a divorce </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I think that's it exactly. Which leaves a lot up to you, regardless of which way you go. I know you've been trying to trust God with this for a long time. How close are you to the end of your endurance level?

AVONDALE,

You asked how close I am to the end of my endurance level. It varies from day to day. Sometimes I'm sooooo there. If there was a lawyer sitting in the room with papers, I'd be signing on the dotted line.

Then other times, I'm really okay. I hope things are soon resolved one way or the other. Thanks for your concern.

<small>[ July 18, 2004, 10:05 PM: Message edited by: Leah2be ]</small>

Hi all,

Still busy with work and the IRS situation.

avondale...

I'm not sure how to explain this "M" scenario... because I'm not sure how I ended up to the degree I did.

WE initially talked about it off and on... with no real commitment from either of us. Then out of no where last summer she started talking about getting "M" in September of this year.

Well I said we could take a look at it... and see what happens. If it looks like something that will work... we can maybe look at September 18th of this year.

Well after much discussion concerning our kids (mine and hers) coming together in one household... we decided to hold off until they were all done with school and out of both houses.

The reason for this... is my kids don't really care for her kids, and visa-versa. So rather having two freight trains collide head-on by bringing the kids into one household... we decided to wait.

Well now she gets upset about once a month... because she says that she wants to get "M", but she knows that the kids may cause a problem. So she is thinking of ways to get past it all... only to frustrate herself more because she comes up empty handed... with no solution in sight.

So she gets upset with me... because I'm not coming up with any viable solution to our situation.

In the meantime... she set a time for next year out of the blue... June! Now she wants to get "M" in June of next year. Nothing really will have changed concerning the kids... if they all continue going to College and living at home. So rather than argue with her... I said "let's look at June, and see if it's possible".

So now she has June of next year picked out to get "M".

I don't see our kid situation changing... but I suppose it could.

Originally... we were looking at possibly getting "M" in two years because that's pretty much when all the kids will be finished with school, and most likely want to go out on their own.

But she is not real happy with that... so she keeps trying to bump up the timeline.

Hope that made some sense.

Leah...

Sorry to hear that you couldn't hold back on the telephone bill situation, but I understand why you asked for it again... and personally I would of probably did the same thing. You just want to know if he is out screwing around again... and you have every right to know... if he is, or if he isn't.

Considering what he has done... you need to know these type of things, in order to help feel secure in your "M". He should gladly hand his phone bills over to you, if he truly wants to comfort you considering what he has done.

I can only answer your question about the control issue from my perspective.

I wouldn't look at it from a control stand point if I was in his shoes. In fact, had I gone out and had an "A", and I was trying to make things right again (trust, etc.), I would do everything in my power to try to earn your trust back again.

If someone is concerned with their "M", and truly wants to keep it... they will tap dance if they need to... in order to keep the peace.

Now... if that doesn't get it... then... "Houston, we have a problem"!

Hope everyones day is going well... well back off to work and to fill out more IRS wonderfulness.

Stay Strong!

Wallace

<small>[ July 14, 2004, 08:33 PM: Message edited by: Wallace ]</small>

Wallace - When I was a kid, and my parents would say “maybe” or something like you said, such as “we’ll look into it” to me, that meant “Whoopie, it’s mine!” It’s almost like to me, those words imply the inevitable and all I needed to do was whine to make them definitely come true. I wonder if the same is true of your g/f. OR it could be explained by the following:
You said:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well now she gets upset about once a month </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Let’s just blame the marriage focus/timetable pushing on PMS, lol <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Me - I went to visit my dad today, had a great trip and came back with a bunch of birthday cake. Tomorrow I turn 46 and I am still feeling pretty good about myself <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> despite the last three years of yuckiness. God is faithful!

<small>[ July 14, 2004, 08:00 PM: Message edited by: avondale25 ]</small>

Hi avondale,

It's like I said.

"If your feeling good... then your looking good too"!

"HAPPY BIRTHDAY" avondale!!!

I love B-day cake, and I would have some with you... but I'm in the process of losing about 10 pounds. Then I will be at my fighting weight... and since I have to go in and fight with the IRS, well I might as well be ready to take them on... LOL <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

I have been working out quite a bit in spite of all the wonderfulness surrounding me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Three years of yuckiness for you... but the good news is, is that when it finally does resolve itself... it does start getting better.

It will take time... sometimes it takes longer for some than others. I am personally still haunted with it all from time to time. But it is getting better.

Personally though... I don't think it ever really truly goes away. You just can't erase that amount of time that you have spent with someone. It most probably will always be there... you just have to mentally tuck it away, until it rears it's ugly head the next time... and then you deal with it accordingly.

You know... my G/F told me that she in fact was spoiled as a child. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> So maybe she is in fact taking it the way you spelled it out.

Personally... I think it is PMS <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Hope you have a wonderful B-Day avondale. Your one year younger than my G/F... and she looks really good for her age... in fact she looks like she is about 38 yrs. old. All natural... the girl next door look... if you know what I mean.

Stay Strong!

Wallace

AVONDALE,

Happy Birthday!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I hope this is the beginning of a great year for you. Maybe all the ÿuck is behind you and good things are around the bend. Have a terrific day!

WALLACE,

Wow, sorry you are still dealing with the IRS mess. It will be great when that is all done. We'll all do a little jig for you. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Yeah, the PMS thing gets my vote too. That was my first thought when I read "about once a month..." <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> I know that is when I have to guard my tongue the most.

Hope things are looking up for you soon!