If you're going to go on vacation with him, it's extremely important that you continue to Plan A. Upon your return, if he won't commit to the relationship, then you Plan B, and leave all of the Plan A stuff in his head to mull over. If you LB on the trip and get him all angry, he's likely to feel justified in leaving you for OW. Do you see what I mean?

Cat

So far planning for the trip has been all positive interaction. I've been trying to do a good plan A without being a doormat or LB. Its difficult because historically I usually give in. I've avoid R talk. I think thats part of the reason he avoids talking to me. In the past, times that we have actually had prolonged conversations it would end up with questions about M or OW. I haven't brought that stuff up in a while because I can't listen to another lie or denial. As far as I know he has not SEEN OW but I believe they still have some telephone, IM contact. He has been home nights, amazingly the number of meetings he is required to attend has dramatically dropped. He no longer gaurds his cell phone. But he also has not committed himself to the marriage.

We are all really looking forward to our trip. We've got a lot planned to cram into 19 days. The kids will be with us the entire time so we don't have to worry about uncomfortable intimate situations. If you saw us as a family you would have no clue that we were not a solid unit. Its time alone with WH that things get strained. I love watching him with the kids. He has the capacity to be incredibly kind and gentle. Thats why I have such a difficult time accepting his cruel alien behaviors. Its like he is 2 different people.

He is a gemini I wonder if that has something to do with it? BTW OW is gemini too thier birthdays are 4 days apart. Those birthdays are coming up in 1.5 weeks. I have no idea how to handle that.

Last year on WH 40th he announced he couldn't see growing old with me and that I was the last person he wanted to spend his birthday with. He spent his Bday with his friend (OW) that was before I knew she was OW. I had reluctantly accepted they were only friends at that time. (Before MB)

I haven't made any plans for his birthday.
I do have a couple ideas for presents I would like to send to OW but that probably would not be a good idea.

As I ramble, one more thing came to mind. When I was home at lunchtime today WH IM'd me. Asked why I was home and asked about the new position I'm working at in the hospital.
He said it was good because I'd have the opportunity to "form new relationships." Then he asked if anyone had asked me out for a drink. How weird is that?! Its like he was trying to match me up so he could get off the hook...or was he jealous? I think its weird...is this normal alien behavior?

I'm in Plan A. And I miss my husband! I'm stuck with this WH. One of the problem areas that WH identified in our marriage is that I did not work full time to contribute more to the family finances. Prior to children we both worked full time and back then I actually made more money then he did. He HATED that! When we decided to have kids we agreed that I would work part time on weekends and and be a stay at home mom during the week. Having worked in child psych in my early years of nursing it made a big impression on me on the importance of having a responsible adult around. My WH now tells me that when both kids were in school full days he had expected me to go back to work full time like 4 years ago when my DD was in kindergarten. I always thought it was important to be available incase the kids were sick. I was the room Mom. Everybody's Mom. I loved that. Consequently I know pretty much every kid in the school the good influences and the troubled ones. After school our house was the choice place for the kids to go because I was always here to supervise and help with homework. I didn't mind working part time, it meant we didn't take big vacations or buy a lot of stuff. I was willing to make that choice. The downside was we did tag team parenting. When he worked I was off, when he was off I worked. We didn't spend much alone time. And then we both got involved in community activities (where he developed relationship w/ OW). In this last year I quit weekends and have worked pretty much full time (30-35 hrs a week) I love having weekends off. Too bad H isn't here to enjoy them just WH. When we start to have a good time I see him pull back. And I'm trying to save as much money as I can in case he does leave the family.

Since I started orienting to a new positon about 1 month ago the kids have been coming home after school to an empty house. I am currently working less then 10 minutes away. They are here for about 20 min. DS in 7th grade, DD in 4th grade. Tonight at dinner they kids told us that one day after school last week a boy (transfer from inner city school with a very troubled home life) came and banged on the door and wouldn't go away. He wanted a copy of some computer game. DS told him to leave and the boy wouldn't go and was verbally giving DS a hard time. Finally the kid left. I am so upset by this. 1)that the kids didn't tell us about it until today. 2)I feel guilty that I wasn't here.
3)I want to talk to my HUSBAND on how to deal with this and its damn WH here. I feel like he blames me for this like he blames everything else on me.

I want to reach out for his support but I don't think its there. He hasn't really shown me any positive support for a long time. Do I go ahead and handle this without him? I have to do something this kid is real trouble and I won't put my kids in danger. Just after kids told us WH left for a meeting. I don't know what time to expect him home.

OMIGOD, confused, I think that you are married to my H! The CA, the non-communicative with me but not with others. I just stumbled on your thread tonite. Sorry, that I haven't kept up with your story!

I promise to come back and read the whole thread later and respond more.

bye for now, must get S7 ready for bed.
jls

jls,
I look forward to hearing from you. This is so hard for me and I'm not real good at hold boundaries or sticking up for myself. I appreciate any feedback. I know that I will eventually do whatever I have to do to save my family.

As for the immediate problem with my kids I made up an emergency contact sheet, with VERY CLEAR instructions. I have no problems with boundaries for the kids. LOL. (Its just the big kid.)My mom will pick them up after school and take them to her house. Thank goodness the school year is almost over!

Hi C42,

got thru your thread, I have read parts of it before. I am just not a "wise" one. I usually post more to show support or when I can relate.

I will tell u one of the things that has really sunk in here, and I am working on it. That whole boundaries thing. I have been reading here for almost 2 years. I have asked and asked HOW to enforce them. I am learning.

THIS is important, so read carefully. Think about how you don't trust your H. And when he says that he is gonna be home on time or call when he is late, and then he doesn't. Well, you don't think that he is gonna follow thru the next time, do you?! THAT is exactly what you are doing when you SAY that you are not going to allow (and I know that isn't the "right" term) Contact, but then you do nothing about it. He then thinks, "Hey, she(you) isn't gonna do anything about it now, and probably won't later".

I am currently separated - and liking it a little too much, by the way. Why, hmm, not exactly an A. I don't KNOW if my H had an A (2 yrs ago), althouhg I am purty sure. But he lied to me again. And again...FINALLY I did something about it besides just "[censored]". IF I have to, I am getting ready for Plan B - my dilemma is no "proof" of A, so is it appropriate?!

I really think that Plan B is the way to go for you. Maybe you can wait til after vacation. When is that?

If your H is still in contact, then you are not in recovery. If he is not in Recovery with you 150%, then you are not in recovery. Maybe he could come up with a Plan. To reassure you of NC. What is this wordplay of his anyway, No "contact" means NO CONTACT, of any sort. Don't people call it contact when they call or write to sombody?!! i.e. "I contacted the autoshop today about the car". Hmmm,Not contact, if they don't touch - bullhockey! and who is to say they haven't? Him, well that means alot, must be true then. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

Anyway, that point i was tryin to make; Tell him what you expect. It is NOT too much!!! If he cannot agree, then poof, out he goes and not just to the RV. He is not getting what he will be missing and you are not getting your peace, that way!

I'll try and be more clear next time.
jls

jls,
You are absolutely right we are SSSSSOOOOOOOOOO NOT in recovery. I had transient hopes of recovery when he came back after his brief...hiatus. He said all the right things, did the right things for about....a week. When refused to send the NC letter I knew he was not invested in recovery at all. That is why I haven't really pushed any R issues. I've worked on things for myself. I have no expectation that he will do anything to work toward recovery. I don't think he is "seeing" OW. But my gut tells me they are still in contact. Unless he completely cuts the ties we will never get to recovery. He will eventually understand he needs to decide her or me.

We start vacation 6/23. At this point I don't see him ever working to save our M. I don't think he'll ever take any responsibility for any problems in our M. I don't think he will take any reponsibility for his "inappropriate friendship". The steps I'm taking now are for me, to prepare myself (or try to anyway) for what is ahead. When everything is said and done I need to be able to look my children in the eye and look at myself in a mirror and know that I did EVERYTHING in my power to save my M and keep my family intact. Then I will be able to move on. A year ago I couldn't image living without him, now I know it will be a difficult adjustment but we'll do just fine. I am damn lucky for what I have, healthy children, a clear conscience and an open heart. I hope WH will someday be able to say the same thing.

I did something stupid, I'm sure it was a LB to WH. In the RV WH had hung up a little stuffed teddy bear. I thought it was from OW so I removed it. Everytime I saw it, it was a trigger. Tonight WH noticed it was missing and asked about it. I lied and said I thought DD and her friend had put in there so I put it away. WHY lie?.......CA!!!!!! I felt stupid and immature. My next instinct was to confront him head on and ream him out for dangling that "momento" under my nose, tell him how it hurt me and how bad he was to flaunt it in front of me. Anyway during the discussion about where this stuffed toy was(without WH present) DD said "oh the little bear so & so gave daddy for his birthday last year?" (NOT ow)

So tonight I asked WH if he remembered who gave it to him he said "I think it was so&so." I said " I think you're right and I would like to apologize for lying to you earlier. I knew the girls hadn't put it in there. I thought it was something OW gave you and I just didn't want to look at it. So I put it away. I've been asking you to be up front with me and I lie about somehting stupid like that. I'm sorry." He said " I knew you thought that." Then I asked if he understood why I wouldn't want to look at something she gave him, he said yes then said goodnight and went out to bed. In the past I would have gone after him and try to get him to talk with me more about it, to pound in my point of view. Tonight I just let him go and said goodnight.

I was sitting back back enjoying a nice cold Diet...nevermind...I don't want Melodylane to blow pepsi out of her nose! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> Decided to update my own boring thread.

Just coping day by day. Good days and bad days. I'm pretty sure he is still in contact but I can't prove it. WH denies.For the most part as far as I can tell he has been keeping his word. There has been some unaccounted for time, but he clams up and denies. Other days he is open and almost resembles my H.

OWH won't put keylogger back on their computer. He says its too painful he doesn't want to know. I on the other hand want all the information I can gather.

The count down is on for our cross country vacation. I talked to WH and told him I wanted NOTHING that reminded me of OW on this vacation. Nothing she has bought any of us.(not much of that left it just seems to disappear on trash days) Radio stations will be changed if certain song comes on "Amazed" was their song ...gag me. This is a family vacation not a romantic vacation. No R talk, no A talk we need to figure out if we like eachother. W#hen we get back we'll decide whats next. I'm thinking paln B if he still won't commit to M.

Survived WH birthday yesterday. Last year I threw him a 40th surprise party, live entertainment, 75 friends, tons of food and beer. The party was 2 days before his actual birthday. Last year on his birthday..he told me I was the last person he wanted to be with...later I found out he spent the evening in a bar with our "friend" didn't know she was the OW then.

This year he spent his birthday with me and the kids. We took him out to dinner, I bought him a strawberry cheesecake, and clothes for the vacation (in unwrapped boxes) He thanked me and seemd to mean it. We watched a dvd with the kids. When the dvd was done, kids went to bed, I went and returned dvds. When I got home WH had already settled in the RV for the night. I went in wished him happy birthday, he thanked me again, and i said good night.

Believe it or not I think his birthday was hardest on my parents. They have loved him like a son and are so hurt and disappointed. My mom usually buys him a present and they come down and have dinner and cake with us. Not this year.I told her that I bought clothes and I would just say a couple of the shirts were from them. The kids wouldn't understand why Grandmom and Grandpop didn't give a gift. My mom reads a religious passage everyday. The one for that day was all about forgiveness. So my mom took it as a sign and bought hima card and put in a small gift card with it. When my H opened it, he said "they didn't have to get me anything". The look on his face said it all...he felt it. His own father didn't even call him.

Theres been a change in WH since his birthday...I can't quite put my finger on it but a change in his attitude. He has been helpful around the house, calling before he leaves work and initiating actual conversations. Mostly about our upcoming vacation. He is drinking less alcohol and staying home instead of going to meetings. He continues to sleep in the RV and has been trying to have me and the kids join him.
He initiates SF but still won't kiss me. I hate that!! It takes the intimacy away and reminds me about what Orchid says about WS and body parts!!

Theres a change in me too. I am more confident. My self esteem is improving. I am not obcessed about what WH is doing. I don't feel compelled to drive by OW house. I don't feel guilty about WH sleeping in the RV. I enjoy the peace it gives me. I am enjoying my new job with the added financial security. I don't look for his approval. I feel more calm and less confused.

This trip coming up....most of the people in RL think I am out of mind for going on this trip with him. I am really looking forward to the adventure for our family. I also want the opportunity to see how I feel about him removed from all this. When we get home there will be big discisions to be made. I have to know in my heart if I am willing to accept what he has to offer. I will not settle for less then I deserve. My mind is clear. I can see 2 futures 1)working w/H in recovery and moving forward. or 2) Moving forward without WH. It surprises me that I can invision a future without him... but I can and its peaceful.

c42,

Good to hear from you. Now keep plan B in your back pocket and enjoy your trip.

Remember you can remind him of his WS ways when he acts up. I did that to mine when we went to Kauai. He listened and agreed. He even made suggestions on how to avoid those problems in the future. I found it exhilarating to have him do most of the recovery work.

Enjoy your trip. You deserve it. He still needs to earn it. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

L.

Well tomorrow is the big day! We leave for our 3 week vacation right after work. We are packed and ready to go!!!
I am looking forward to getting away and curious to see if I get a glimpse of my long lost H.

Things have been quiet here. He has been home at night. We talk about the trip and the kids and thats about it. Even though he has been sleeping in the RV is does invite me out to keep him company or watch TV. SF is still pretty frequent.

There are days that he comes home from work withdrawn and has a negative attitude... never does say why. Could be a bad day at work or he had contact with OW, I don't know he just shuts down. Sometimes I wonder if I want to live with that the rest of my life. If he can't/won't open up to me about anything how can he let me in to love him?

The other day a member posted on a thread that bob pure started about BS fearing the children being exposed to OP.
This poster sounded SO much like MOW in my sitch. I thought she had been lurking...maybe not. Maybe she just had a copy of the alien script all WS follow. But it really struck a nerve. It was a good thing I was at work and didn't have time to respond. When I saw all the responses she got I just ROFLMAO. Pep you are the best! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

I will be away for 3 weeks without computer access!! If anything major happens I will try to get my sister to post.
I'll be thinking and praying for you all. Pebbles in court, Sleepless welcoming home DS8, Grape Girl STILL celebrating her birthday, Newlywed searching for a new pup (I think you deserve one), Coach dancing at his daughters wedding, Tucktummy getting *ahem* LOL, mimi polishing the tiarra, Bob pure in leather chaps (just can't shake that one, LOL), Orchid giving reverse babble lesson from way out in the deep blue, Pep and lemonman keeping y'all in line!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Your support and advice has given me so much, I just want to say thanks! I'll be back after vacation!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Have fun, confused! I hope your long lost H shows up for some fun. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Thank you for keeping me in your thoughts and prayers. I'll do the same for you.

Ok, guys I'm leaving work!!!!

I'll wave as we pass thru your state! I'll be the Goddess in sunglasses!