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There is a BIG difference between someone who chooses to bury their head in the sand and ignores the potential harm...
... and someone who studies, works out with a therapist and/or AA sponsor, and prays to God for guidance in a deeply troubling situation.
BR doesn't need my support but she has it. She is someone that I once turned to in a time of crisis and she was unfailingly generous with her knowledge and care. I believe she is living her life with her eyes and heart wide open but knows her boundaries... including those she must impose on behalf of her children.
I thank you for your story of courage, BR. You are someone I respect deeply.
PS: I came from a dry alcoholic background (grandfather was an alcoholic, my mother is dry but has the crazy-making characteristics that made my FOO's life miserable for many years). I am an addictive personality and understand the struggle with addictions, even when they harm others. Love in spite of everything is a beautiful goal, and BR has achieved that. I wish I'd had someone like her in my life when I was 20 and a total mess. (Sorry to sound overly emotional, but this touches me deeply)
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Hi Sheryl ~ thank you! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> I was 20 and a total mess too...
I know I was sicker than my husband when I first started recovery...he's lived most of his life comfortably numb...I got to experience it stone cold sober.
I think this is the case for many affected by someone else's alcoholism.
~ Pain is a given, misery is optional ~
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If my instincts are correct, BR knows that leaving IS the best option(given other circumstances) but that there are other things "lurking" outside of her marriage that makes her feel that leaving would put her and/or her children in danger. While her message is somewhat cryptic, it certainly explains why someone that is so in tune with her emotional side would choose to stay in a situation that she knows has the potential for vast harm. I am not walking in her shoes regarding this fear and not knowing more, I will afford her the benefit of the doubt that she is acting in her childrens best interest. Since BR has been unable or unwilling to share certain things... which is her right and even possibly her "duty" I understand where others would be confused and yes, judgemental of any act which they see as harming children. Anyone that has been here for any amount of time knows that many moms/dads do not put the interests of their children first and that questioning these people... and yes, even judging actions is needed at times. But when all the facts are not on the table.... such as this case, I think it is important to read between the lines and consider the person we are speaking to. BR has done nothing that I have ever seen that makes me believe she would be anything less than a caring a loving mother. So, IMHO, I choose to believe she is doing the best she can for her kids.
MEDC
Last edited by mkeverydaycnt; 07/05/07 09:13 AM.
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I spent years in psychotherapy and more recently have been doing this PERSONAL RECOVERY stuff. A large part of my PERSONAL RECOVERY has had to do with BR's encouragement of me to work on the STEPS and the continued effects of growing up in an alcoholic family...
When I said LIFE IS COMPLICATED yesterday, I should also have added COMPLEX....
I can without a doubt say that FOR ME it was much much better for me to have grown up with an ALCOHOLIC FATHER than with an ABSENT FATHER. Yes, he was SICK but he was a WONDERFUL PERSON. Folks said that his funeral was like a Sunday morning service. I was amazed at how many lives that he touched..how many folks LOVED him...
I fully understand what BR is doing...
I would have been JUST FINE as far as I'M concerned if my mother had been like BR.
My Daddy wasn't home when my mother was threatening suicide day after day and me, a terrified little girl, thought I had the POWER to talk her out of it. Why wouldn't I grow up with an ILLUSION OF POWER AND CONTROL? My mother is still living isn't she? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />
I'm so PAST this stuff now...
I SOOO UNDERSTAND IT ALL NOW...
COMPLICATED..COMPLEX..and a ZILLION OTHER WORDS that I can't come up with right now...
I made it happen..a joyful life..filled with peace, contentment, happiness and fabulocity.
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BR:
It certainly seems that you do not have your head in the sand on this.
I believe that is obvious here.
Will there be effects on her children? There may be, they could be profound, or minor.
But there are plenty of other dynamics in a family that can have greater effects.
Most issues inside families that cause the greatest damage are the one that are not addressed.
It's swept under the rug, covered up, hidden away, and never properly discussed with the children.
Doesn't seem to be the case here.
Makes for a remarkable family in my book.
BR is exposing what is going on, and her H is playing by the rules that they have established together.
One day Mr. BR may address his addiction, and Mr. BR can really become all he can be. As an aside:
My Mother had her head in the sand, and my father's drinking led him to his grave.
Notwithstanding, he raised a fine and upstanding eagle scout. NOT.
(((BR)))
LG
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BR,
You've been my hero for a long time. I want to jump in against this "leaving is the best for your children" opinion because it isn't true.
The difference growing up with an alcoholic father and a non-codependent mother is HUGE...from what I can see, it's the antidote for what you experienced growing up...which was ACOA parenting, handed down, sans alcohol.
You aren't teaching your children to live from wishfulness...you are demonstrating daily to see life as it is, choices humans make, and to make their own. So is your DH. High parenting contains no fantasy...no "if only you didn't or did"...and you know that. How valuable to be a part of your family as wife, husband, mother, father or child. What a privilege and blessing.
Your children know they are safe from being the scapegoat...because in your family, no one person can tear the whole family apart. That's powerful and real.
Your children have learned the difference between acceptance and approval.
And to live from that reality, our responsibility as parents is not to live conflict free (false protection), but to teach our children to live well in conflict. To know only their part, not the all or nothing, and become adults who understand parts and wholes...not labels and control.
Vast harm...comes from lack of honesty...which is like leaving an alcoholic and saying to the children...it's not who you are in life, it's who others are which will determine your happiness or misery. BR, you example how to own our experience here...not to mollify (which is deception), avoid conflict or think we can be safe if only we keep certain humans out of our lives.
You said it so well...there are invisible ACOA out there...the coping skills are passed down...the perspectives and perceptions with the alcohol filter...long after the alcohol is removed. Which is why I believe anyone can go to Alanon and find their place in the world. Just their part.
To me, you are teaching living skills to your children...breaking the pattern. Not endangering your children...I know you have healthy boundaries in place...rather, giving them the path to thriving.
You are not what I saw growing up in my own mother(s)...which was accommodation, support, walking on eggshells, righteous rages, resentment machine, snarky entitlement statements and actions, and addiction to the addict...that non-alcoholic side of the alcohol dance...which is really the addict dance. Which is how I passed these down to my sons without an alcoholic husband or being an alcoholic. Didn't need it...had all the behaviors and dances without a hangover...and no one to point to the drug in our home (power struggles from fear) as the exact same thing.
How empowering and amazing your choices are...what a grace you are to this world.
My take on Let Go and Let God...let go the outcome (all we do not control) and let God help you to choose your results. Be with you fully in your part, power and limits.
LA
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You are not what I saw growing up in my own mother(s)...which was accommodation, support, walking on eggshells, righteous rages, resentment machine, snarky entitlement statements and actions, and addiction to the addict...that non-alcoholic side of the alcohol dance...which is really the addict dance. Which is how I passed these down to my sons without an alcoholic husband or being an alcoholic. Didn't need it...had all the behaviors and dances without a hangover...and no one to point to the drug in our home (power struggles from fear) as the exact same thing. No wonder you speak to MY HEART, LA.... We lived the same life..wore the same shoes... Mimi..truly touched by your post..knowing that I'm not alone...
I made it happen..a joyful life..filled with peace, contentment, happiness and fabulocity.
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{{{Mimi}}}
Right back atcha, my friend.
LA
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I find myself agreeing with LA. Barring outright abuse, I don't agree that "leaving is always best for the children." It shocks me that people say that and makes me wonder if they have ever experienced a broken home. My alcoholic father left when I was 4 and I was never the same after that. My personality changed. Our whole family life, what there was of it, just fell apart when he left. The wheels came off the cart. It never bothered me too much that he and my mother fought - it wrecked my life, though, when he left.
star posted a study once that showed from children BAD HOMES actually do better than children from BROKEN HOMES and having been in both, I tend to agree.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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LA ~ thank you for adding such beautiful insight. Amen!
Mel ~ You are so right. My children LOVE their father. They struggle with the effects of his disease, but I do not think for a second that they wish he was gone. Not that I allow my children to make these choices - they are children after all - but I know I am doing the right thing. He's already emotionally unavailable in so many ways, but he is home with them every single day.
Removing him from the home would simply make his unavailablity even worse.
They still would be impacted by alcoholism.
And of course, I have other reasons for deciding that they are safest with an intact family.
Staying means I can't be a victim and I can't sit around feeling sorry for myself and making my children pay the price of misery.
I have a pretty decent life. I am still a work in progress, but I can honestly say I am happy.
~ Pain is a given, misery is optional ~
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