ML, I aplogized because it sounded like a DJ.

Also, I don't think she is on the fence. In fact I think she is on the other side climbing down. Regardless, Plan B is for me and I need it soon. I am growing weary and my love for her is wearing thin. I find myself cursing her more and more in my mind. I think I am also protraying a more indignant attitude around her.

For the last 4 monts whenever I sneezed she said nothing, then last night I sneezed and she said "bless-you". I almost fell off my chair and I looked at her and said "thanks?".

Whatever happens with the A, her family will never accept OM.

I don't know if she has ended the A, but if it is still alive this latest exposure has defenitely given it a blow to the chin.

We sleep in the same bed and we are so close but so far. When I see her sleeping there it pains me that I can't be with her.

You know Hope, I guess I see your wife planning her escape. She has a meeting setup with her family to discuss her separation. She probably wants to solicit their support. And you never know how family sympathy will play out.

If it were me I would want to do everything possible to "nip it in the bud". Have they heard the tape?

I guess she is starting to execute her plan B.

I don't think she has ended it. It will be revealing to see if she even tries to justify it to her family. Go ahead and curse her in your mind...just don't Plan B it until you're sure where she will come down.

Keep the pressure on, quietly. Is she really that ready to leave her children? If she is, why hasn't she already?

Your wife is still very much on the fence. She's having some really big internal struggles right now between you/OM/pride/promises/mistakes/kids/work/family. Probably somewhat depressed, you may encourage her family to tell her it's worthwhile to look into it.

Also...find a faith-based counseling center, at least for yourself. They won't "Jesus" you to death but are pro-M and pro-family.

You know I couldn't agree more.

Hope: You best get ready for an all out assualt on your character in every way, shape, and form. I would just be prepared with the FACTS of the situation should they bear repeating. I would get to a lawyer and prepare yourself for PLan B and do everything that you need to to keep you kids safe and away from her destructive actions.

If you play "nice guy" any longer, you are going to get f-ing steamrolled. I have no doubt here, and I sense this turning out badly for you, if you don't prepare accordingly.

Lem <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Yes lemonman, but he's got to leave a door open, at least until the reality sinks in with his wife.

Hope- People who do what your wife is doing never realize just how profoundly their actions affect everyone who cares about them. I know in my wife's case she slowly came to realize that marriage isn't the fantasy she made it out to be all of her life- that there's more to it than "fireworks" and constant romance, that the marriage means a lot to many people besides your kids and immediate family.

As an example, my friend who is privy to our situation really freaked out about it. He and his wife held us in high regard as kind of a model marriage. I mean he was really hurt by our troubles, visibly distressed.

All I'm saying is give it time to sink in with her. There is no harm in waiting. I'm all for being tough and prepared, but make sure she sees coming back to you as a realistic move. If she does, there will time for apologies and recriminations later. Being tough will score many points, being forgiving will earn you even more- even if the worst comes to pass.

As for her family...if you are who you say you are they will not turn totally against you. They will want to sympathize and agree with their "blood" to some extent, but the bulk of their judgement will remain on your side. Let them have their agreements with her on the little things, ******, encourage them and agree yourself! If for no other reason than to keep your kids' grandparents close.

Lem, I'm preparing for this assault and will have my legal advice shortly.

I'm sure she will play the "I made a mistake card" and fault me for many things, but my in-laws know me and are not niave by any nature.

They have been around me for much of the last 8 years and know who I am. They also know my WW very well.

My in-laws main concern is the grandkids and what this will do to them. Knowing that my WW is willing to forego seeing them half the time distresses them greatly. How could you be ok with not seeing you kids half of the time? I think about that all the time and it breaks my heart.

Really I think my WW needs a hard dose or reality and she will get that once she is out. Whether or not she wakes up from that is the question

My WW has been holding up relatively well given all that has been going on over the last few months. I don't know if she really is doing well or is just putting on a great acting performnace. If it were me in her shoes, I would be close to the breaking point by now. I don't know how she is doing it?

Well, I really beg to differ here. I think the Waywards who hit bottom (where Hope's wife is at soon) will do anything and everything to impart emapthy and support from their family. Hope's wife prior to this was too ashamed and embarassed to talk to her family, but now she is actually scheduling a meeting. This to me seems like a very very big change in attitiude and perspective on her part. She may indeed be desperate enough to "nuke" Hope in every sense of the word. Blood is thicker than water folks. When Hope's wife throws herself at the mercy of her family, and perhaps pleads that Hope hit her or did Ungodly other acts to her (all lies ofcourse) and perhaps throws out suicide she will GET the "support" she needs.

I have seen drug addicts who have done far far far worse than what Hopes wife did get support from the family in ways you could not imagine.....I am tellign you, it is a dynamic that is much stringer than people realize. As much as Hope thinks he has loyalty, I would not count on it. I feel that Hope's wife signifying that she wants to face the family is a sign she is done with this marriage and is looking to start the process of a future without Hope, as she "knows" that her family she will need in the future, not Hope...and she will gladly nuke him in the process.

Perhaps, Frank or another sunshiner can come along and state a different opinion on how her desire to meet with the family is her way to make peace with them so she can come back to Hope,,,that may give him hope. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

I am not advising that Hope divorce his wife today or that he NOT leave a way for his cheating wife to come home, but just that he prepare in every other sense of the word, as I feel he is about to get steamrolled. His children's emotional and financial security FAR OUTWEIGH any consideration her cheating soul should get.

I have been wrong before, hopefully I am here again.

Lem <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Because she's in "Love" and love conquers all...<barf>...

She'll collapse eventually, and if she doesn't you don't want her anyway.

But keep the freaking door open, ok? You have good inlaws, at least you can be thankful for that.

Lem, I don't get a good feeling about any of this and feel like it is all slipping away from me...it's an awful feeling really.

I just need to remove myself from the fray and have some normalcy to my life. On Saturday my WW started telling a story and after the first few sentences she said "are you listening?". I was watching TV and thought she was talking to my son so I was shocked to see she was talking to ME!

SO I gave her undevided attention and tears almost came to my eyes. This is the first time in months where she has initiated any sort of menaingful conversation with me. I told her that I miss that from her.

I so much miss the EN's that I'm not getting from her. So when she does provide them, it is bitter sweet. I feel somewhat angry that I am missing them but happy when she does.

This whole situation really sucks!!!

Hope:

I understand your despair and pain. The good news is that there is a tried and true method for dealing with your pain and need to remove yourself from the "fray"...it is called PLAN B. I can smell the fumes you are running on. You are 10,000 times the person that I could be with respect to PLan A and living in this "intolerable" situation. Noone is tellign you that you have to file a Divorce and close the door, but just that it is time to Start Plan B. I think you are going to become "broken" soon if you don't remove yourself from this pain and dysfunction...you are either gonna to say "F- this, I want a divorce" or just go out and cheat as I can tell that you are ripe for the pickings here. Protect yourself and children......I am praying for you.

Lem <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Uhh..."sunshiner?" Read a few pages back lemonman. I salvaged my family by being a tough S.O.B. My experience is just as valid as anyone else's.

My MIL ALWAYS sides with her kids...to the point of being ridiculous. But guess what? She took my side against my wife's EA (I found out later it was PA from my W but never told MIL, she would've really flipped out over that).

Of course his WW isn't going back to beg for forgiveness! She thinks she can turn everyone against Hope...I don't think she can, as long as Hope doesn't flip out and give anyone a reason to believe her crap.

She may still go through with leaving though. Cross that bridge later. I agree with lemon about being prepared, just don't torpedo stuff before you know how the meeting goes down.

My FWW ran to her mommy and her friends with her "issues" with me. Much to her surprise they already knew what she had been up to and got zero support for her A. Why? Because I was prepared, and because they know I'm a decent guy.

Hope is too and he has a shot here.

It was my take that it was hte family's idea to meet with HER!!! Doesn't sound like it's an opportunity for the family to support other than giving her a smack in the fanny.

Yes she will try to deny, smoke and mirrors, hide, deny some more, distract...we have to trust HIW's take on this...just because other family situations may have truned out differently, doesn't make all family's the same...I've read of some tough MIL's come down on their own children...

You know if you are going to hang on for the meeting, can you make the meeting worthwhile? Can you play the tape for some family members and say, "Even after hearing this tape, and knowing what I know, I want to keep my wife, but to do it I need the support of this family. Support from you means you will let my wife know that what she did was wrong and you will not support her in her efforts to separate, either emotionally or finacially.

Is there anyway that you could pull something like that off?

Well, I don't think anyone was advising "torpedoing" anything Mflake.

I think everyone is saying the same thing in different ways. I think Hope should "Hope" for the best BUT prepare for the worst.....ala, gathering evidence, and seeing a lawyer to protect his financial and parental rights. The meeting with the family may or may not go down the way I think it will ( I hope I am wrong), but in reality does it matter? Unless the Cheating Wife is ready to go NC and trully begin reovery the meeting is in a way moot with respects to what Hope should do (i.e Plan B). The guy is hanging by a thread here, probably bordering on emotional collapse, ready to perhaps seek comfort from another person to meet his starving heart...he seems to be dying here...isn't that when even the "experts" of the site say to remove yourself from the dysfunction and go to Plan B.

Hope, perhaps I am wrong in assessing your emotional state and feelings about your marriage now, and maybe you still have a few months of Plan A in you...If I am wrong, forgive me, and discard any opinion I gave you. My support for you and your children remains the same.

Lem <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

I sense as many of you do that my situation is approaching a turning point. It appears as though my WW is planning her escape and will try to enlist the support of her family on Friday.

What happens after that is anyones guess.

My gut feeling is that her family continues to disapprove of her actions but acknowledges the fact that there isn't much they can do about it and resign themselves somewhat.

Then my WW will discuss the sepearation details and she will move out. Not long after that I will invoke Plan B and move on with my life one way or the other.

Lem, you are so right about me being "ripe" for an affair of my own. I find myself going to the grocery store and noticing some women and think "she seems really nice and I would probably enjoy her company".

That is where is stops obviously, but my LB is running on fumes right now. I could so use a talk, hug, kiss...from my W of course.

I just wanted to thank all of you since this is my only real place to vent and it help immensely to have your feedback, especailly during these last few weeks.

Thanks!!!

Yep, I agree with this also, but even if the meeting was initiated by the family, do you all think that this will be the "impetus" to make Hopes wife just "wake up"? I have a sneaking suspicion that Hope's wife knows what her family thinks of her actions...but I guess, maybe not.

I think the recent events with her family taking turns lecturing her that Hope has displayed to us have borne out this. I don't see continued familial bashings as helping his cause..........I think a Plan B would be far more helpful to his cause (which at this point is IMVHO his childrens emotional health and his own emotional and physical health).

This is just my opinion Hope. In the end, you do what you need to do. We all don't live with the consequences of our opinions, so do what you FEEL you need to do.

Lem <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

HTW I need to say something. Whatever you do, please please do it with an open heart and mind. Vanity and Pride are sins. Your pride has been insulted to an unbelieveable extent. I empathasize, and you have my utmost sympathy. But appeal to your rational nature, and remember that insulted Pride is not a sound basis for making vital decisions with long-lasting consequences.

Okay prepare for the worst, like several here have said. But don't forget the hopeful words you've passed around here to others in need. Envision the best, hope for the best, work for the best, make the best happen, don't give up.

HTW 98% of your messages are steeped in all the best virtues; compassion, love, caring. A few of your messages seem grounded in the baser sins. Do not let those base instincts win.

Think hard about the effects of D on your kids. Try to get your W to do the same. It's as if you, WW and kids have gotten lost in the woods, and there are scary things out there, and night is falling. It doesn't matter that WW got you there; what matters is getting home safely with your family.

The wrong move? You and WW to split up and go your separate directions looking for safety, and abandoning the kids in the woods.

The right move? Find a way to reach her, possibly through an appeal to her family. Not to get them to take your side, but to get them to persuade WW to think hard about the effects of D on the kids.

Although it seems an eternity, it hasn't really been that long that this has been going on. There is no rush to D. Again; there is not a rush. Don't hurry to a bad outcome. Find a way to persuade WW to just stop and think for a month or two. You can do it. I know you from your messages, and I know that you can do it.

Wishing you the best as always.

Hope, I know you are hearing alot of advice here that is contrary to Marriage Builders principles, but I would hope you would consider that MB has saved hundreds of marriages using these principles. And I think this situation very much calls for Plan B. Staying in Plan A endlessly is not helping the situation, it is only helping your W cement her delusions. You say she is not on the fence, I would disagree with that. She does not know where she is at because she is very confused. She is scared to death to move out which is why she is waiting to go. If you force her hand, she will be able to see that. She will not know that what she desires is a fantasy until she is forced to move.

SHMI is correct, the family requested the meeting to find out what my WW intentions are so I don't know how it will all shake down in the end.

AskMe, I have said this almost verbatum to my MIL And BIL. I have let it be known that even after what has happened, I want to recover my M. My FIL and BIL don't know how I can think this way after being betrayed in such a way. I explained to them that I love my W and want her in my life. My SIL said "you are to classy, my husband would have kicked me out long time ago".

So they clearly know my position which has seems to have reinforced their disdain for my WW actions.

As of yesterday, my MIL has stopped watching my kids to show my WW what it will mean to be on her own. Will that type of support last...who knows?

Lem, the only way I will have a few more months of Plan A left in me is if she shows a sliver of remorse and committment to the M. I can't see that.

Mel, just so I understand your views, what advice is Hope getting that is contrary to "Marriage Builders" principles. I am confused here.

Lem <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />