I am not saying I necessarily disagree with the advice given above...and given all of the toxic BS that you have lived with from your cheating wife..it is understandable that you want to feel some modicum of affection. It is human. It is 100% understandable. However, if you cross this line and even have dinner with another woman (who is not your wife), you should know that this will be the TRUE beginning of the end of your marriage (given the fact that your marriage hangs by only the string that you provide). You'll be hammering a nail in your marriages coffin. I am dead serious. You do NOT have the capability to distinguish friendship, emotion, being "in like" or being "in love" right now.

Now, if it was me, I would have been on the Plan B train months ago...if you are going to entertain dating other women, or even getting emotionally invested in another woman, I would forgo the Plan B and get a divorce. Why bother with the Plan B if you are gonna hamstring your own chances of marital survival? Makes no sense to me.

You know what is gonna happen? Your wife will eventually end her affair and want to come back...and you'll be so far out getting your starving soul filled with the "nice feelings" that it won't matter.

I am not telling you that I would do this (I freely admit that I do not possess the capacity to have done what you have done with tolerating this repeated betrayal and long Plan A), but if you are going to go through all of this Plan A $hit,,,and prelude to PLan B...why quit here. Why cut your own knees and even tangle with another woman or person.

If you want to do that.....Get a divorce. NOONE will begrudge you for that...least of all me.

LM

TooSoon,

The problem is that I am attracted to this woman and going out to dinner will certainly lead to discussing my situation and unhappiness with her. The emotional wall will drop she will find out that I like her or vise versa and down the slippery slope we go (as Mr. W says).


That is the problem, I don't know how to differentiate the two right now. I certainly feel an attraction to her, but I don't know if it's because my EN haven't been met for a long time or is it just her?


I don't mean to use that term lightly, however I certainly feel "raped" by my WW and it is beause her A was against my will and it stole soo much from me. I'm not yet convinced that my M can't be saved and that is why I will go to Plan B soon.

Lem, as you know I don't always agree with you <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" /> but I do with what you are saying here. I've come too far and subjected myself to extreme anguish in an attempt to save my M through a long Plan A. It hasn't worked and now I'm ready to enter into a dark Plan B. I owe it to myself and my kids to continue with Plan B. The only thing is I don't expect I will be able to do a 2 year Plan B...maybe closer to 6 months or 1 year.

I want to be able to look at my kids when they are older and know that I tried to save our family.

Going to dinner with a female friend can get sticky very easily. The attraction is there...throw in a few drinks, lower the wall, some intimate discussion and it's no going back. That is exactly how EA's start and is probably how my WW A started.

I know OM was nice to my WW, gave her some compliments, they helped each other, went out to lunch and dinner, WW found out thorugh her work friend that OM "liked" her and before you know it they are rendesvousing on the 3rd floor of a scummy parking garage. I can't drive into parking garages without triggering those damn thoughts now.

Lem, I don't know how you were able to detach yourself from the situation enough to operate on your WW's OM. I don't think I would have been able to do what you did.

Is this why you believe in Karma?

HopeThisWorks,

I just want you to know you are an inspiration to us all. I could never be as strong as you have been.

I have read through this entire thread and cannot believe you are still hanging on. I have cried for you many times.

I am no expert, but one thing I do know is that you will find happiness eventually, with or without your wife.

Thanks hurt, I can't believe you read the entire thread! I'm afraid to go back and re-read some of stuff that was said and done. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />


I didn't think I could do what I have done and been through either...you just do. Any you know what, my stroy is peanuts compared to what some of the old timers have gone through, specifically the LTA senerios like 2long. To me that is like dying a slow death and I don't know how they do it. They are a special breed of people for sure!


BTW...

I forgot to mention one other important reason that I will go into Plan B before Plan D...I still LOVE my W! (not my WW <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />)

Hope,

I just wanted to drop in and lend my support. I also want to say that you sound good. You are going to be alright!

Happy Valentine's Day!
S.

I can't disagree with your reasoning to not go to dinner with the attractive girl at work. If your main goal is to save your marriage at all costs, then you need to do it. I don't think I could go to the length you did without giving up, especially after being so abused for so long, but I commend you for your perseverence to save the family. You will know inside if and when it is time to move forward and I am in hopes that Plan B will cause a void in your WW and she will miss you and feel the need to have a relationship with you.

Hang in there and lot's of luck.

TooSoon

HTW,

You have been an inspiration to me. You are the example of what I hope to be able to do througout this whole mess regardless of the outcome. I see strength in you that I wish I had myself and yet a soft perserverance that continues to allow a path for your WW to return home.

I don't know if you have gone to plan B or not yet but please do keep posting and know that you inspire many here.

Regards,

hap, I'm glad my story has helped you in the samy way as I have learned from others before me. You will get where I am some day, with or without your W and I want you to know you WILL be fine. You can't see that now because you are in an emotional overload.

Listen, my Plan A has been far from perfect and I want other BS's new to this to understand you will make mistakes and things don't always go as planned. However, with the help and guidance from the many verterans on this baord, you can have a successful recovery. It may not be with your WS, but if you do a strong Plan A (and B if necessary) you will be a fundementally different person. The changes are GOOD and they will help you through the rest of your life.

Six months ago I was in the same postion you are in now and I was a complete mess. I couldn't sleep, eat or think, lost 35 lbs in 2 weeks, my work suffered tremendously, and had thoughts of suicide. I exposed to my WW family and work and she spewed hatered and anger that I never thought possible from her.

How could the person closest to me betray me in the worst possible way?

Today my WW is days from leaving and I'm about to enter into my dark Plan B. I sleep well, have regained my appetite (and some <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />) and most of my weght, I can focus better and my work is improving. I'm still not where I want to be, but I'm MUCH better than I was 6 short months ago. It takes time and you will improve even if your M doesn't.

Plan A goes against every natural instinct you have as a BS. I remember bob pure once saying "it's like fighting from your knees". He was so right! Your WS will notice your Plan A even if you think she doesn't. That is why you need to be consistent and eliminate all LB'ers. She will look for them and use them as justification for her actions. Don't give her that. Stay on course and if Plan A doesn't work, you go to Plan B and if that doesn't work either, you will be ready for life without your WS.

Just remember this takes TIME....lots and lots of TIME so be patient and consistent. But most of all come here for help and to just vent if your feeling down...it helps, TRUST ME!

Got to go but I will check back in later.

Tonight my WW came home from work and I could tell something was upsetting her. I commented that she looked "pissed off" and she replied that she had a bad day. Then she accused me of not contributing enough to our joint account so I pulled up the account online and tabulated the amounts and it showed I have contributed $900 more than her since the beginning of January. When I approached her with this she started saying that the VISA should not be included and I started smiling because I could not believe how insistant she was on not acknowledging my contributions.

So she looked at me and said "don't laugh...not today I'm having a bad day". So I just left her alone and went to sit down. She was ironing her clothes in the kitchen and I looked over and she was balling her eyes out and tears were streaming down her face on to the ironing board. I felt awful and wanted to go over and hold her.

I don't know what happened to her today but I haven't seen her like this in a while. She seems to be preoccupied with something tonight and it is clearly evident. She is currently exercising on the treadmill so I have a chance to post.

I wonder if her condition has anything to do with OM or if it is just work related. What could possibly happen at work that would have her all upset like she is?

Hope:

A WS can run and hide but they cannot escape their own conscious. They can disguise and deny their emotions and they will blame everyone else but themselves. Deep down inside, they know exactly what they are and what damage they are doing to the most important people in their lives.

Unfortunately, pride creeps in and they have to learn to justify and protect their reasons for betrayal. That allows themselves to cope with their own actions. Let her have her moments without you supporting her, it will be good for her to feel alone and good for you to feel a small bit of justice.

TooSoon

Toosoon, my WW is a very proud person and I see her justifying her betrayal with some of the comments she makes to me. She said things like "you really don't love me" or "you are only doing this for the kids" or "I had a need and he met it" and so on. So I think you are right about the justification part. She is trying to convice herself that what she is doing is ok.

When I was talking to her about the bank issues last night I looked into her eyes and she had this look of defiance. She was not even open to the possibility that I was right. She has conviced herself that she is right even though the evidence suggests otherwise and that is why I started smiling. More of same justification type attitude I guess.

It was like I was dealing with a stubborn teenager so I just left her alone. Then the tears started flowing and dripped off the tip of her nose like a leaking faucet, on to the ironing board. It was sad to see her like that, but I did feel some "justice" as you suggest.

I keep trying to put myself in the mind of a WS and understand where are the anger comes from. I guess I will never fully understand unless I become one.

I send her an email this morning letting her know that I hope she has a better day.

In many companies, this is 2005 year end performance appraisal time. Could be she got a lousy review that may in whole or in part be related to her relationship with OM.

Could be that her superiors have noticed a decline in performance because of her relationship with OM and commented on it.

Could be that someone made a complaint about being offended by hers and OM's relationship and she has now been reprimanded. (NOT a good thing for someone in HR)

Could be she went to put a down payment on a living abode or had to prove the money in her account to get a living abode or credit for a living abode and there wasn't enough to cover what she represented. Or, perhaps, she wanted to go and buy new furnishings for her new living abode and there wasn't enough money. Or, perhaps, she realized how truly little she will have - money and furnishing wise - once she no longer has your combined incomes to work with.

Could be now that she's planning to move out, OM is showing his true colors and backing off/running scared, or even outright told her that this is fun but he has no intention of having a relationship with her once she's divorced from you.

Could be anything...

Regards,

BB

HTW

Man, my wife and your wife would make one heck of a debate team, becasue even when they are wrong they are right. It wouldn't matter that the moderator had evidence to the contrary they would simply re-write the answer such that it mirrors theie beliefs. You know what the bible says about pride. Pride comes before the fall. They will fall and only hope for our family's sake and their own it is before it is too late and we have lost all of the love we once reserved for them alone. Hang in there my friend.

That's what I was thinking. All the other things Brit said could be very possible. Maybe they both got bad reviews leading to the above quote.

Could be anything . . . but I bet it has to do with OM in some way, shape, or form.

This is good Hope! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Hope, I am not threadjacking, just want to share my experience in the hope it helps you. I told WH from the getgo where he would stand financially if he chose to pursue the divorce. He said I know and I won't fight you for anything. He was still clueless. He cries to all his friends "I have no money". <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> We met at his lawyer's office before our 2nd to last court hearing. He filled out the child support papers incorrectly. He listed his net, not his gross salary. He was shocked they base CS on gross salary. His attorney came in and said she's right - I'll be right back, I have to redo the paperwork. He was clueless. I also told him he pays taxes on that $ but I don't. CS is tax free. He said "that's not fair". All I could do was laugh. I can't tell you how many times I said to him "WH, where have you been? We have been through this over and over." As soon as he filed I was searching the internet and knew almost down to the penny how much I'd get in child support. It's not a mystery, it's a black and white formula. He had no idea. In the end - he was clueless. The fog. He is now living the reality and feeling the pinch. I imagine your WW is starting to feel the reality of her sitch as well.

Shattered & BB,

I think you girls may be right on this. My WW had thoughts of buying a new home near OM and her work friend that would have included new furnishings, maybe relocating the kids to a new school there, seeking $20,000 in alimony, $900/month in CS, custody of the kids and basically continuing the life she has now, only without me.

I put an end to that pretty quickly! Now she is forced to stay at her parents house for a while until she can afford a place that MUST be a maximum of 10 miles from me (OM is 30 miles away). The kids will not be relocated, no alimony, no CS from me, she won't see the kids half the time, she is looking at a condo instead of a house, she can't buy all the new clothes and shoes she did with me.

She will have to cut back her expenses BIGTIME as will I but I'm not a big spender anyway. She won't have me to maintain the house and cars, cut the grass, pay the bills, help take care of the kids, I won't be around to help with the kids and housework when she leaves early and returns late from work, etc.

Meanwhile, I can cook, clean, do laundry (need work on ironing <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />), and take care of the kids. All I need is some affection, admiration and SF and I'm happy <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />. Aren't we me simple creatures <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

As for the work thing, since I exposed to her work WW and OM have this in their file and will have to be extra careful, espcially since my WW works for the HR department. So that could be a reason as well.

She may do fine without me, who knows, but I'm not making this easy for her. She probably expects us to "co-parent" and be friends with me...NOT! I hate that "co-parentling" term since it seems to promote seperation and divorce.

I wholeheartedly agree!!

I've often thought the MB boards could use a few trained psychologists/psychiatrists to help us understand why WS act the way they do. (Not that there's anything wrong with the terrifically deep and useful insights of the posters here!) It would be useful to understand even better or at a deeper level how WS can think the way they do.

wnh, I guess that is why they used terms like "alien abduciton" and "fog babble" because there is no other way to describe the strange behaviour of WS's.

Although I must admit that insight from FWS like dorry and ff are extremely helpful.

On another note, tomorrow I begin work on a new project with my co-worker. She came over to my office to see if I had everything ready to start and we had some small talk.

Since she has arrived 2 weeks ago I have made a concerted attempt to avoid her and limit my conversations with her.

I don't think she knows of my current situation and that my WW and I are soon to be seperated. My manager and several other of my colleagues know, but I don't they have told her anything. I'm feeling anxious almost to the point of calling in sick tomorrow. I want to know if any other BS's have experienced this and how the handled it.

Thanks

Conduct yourself professionally. Limit the exposure you have where you find yourself in a 'dangerous' environment. Realize you are vulnerable. Protect yourself and your credibility.

Opportunity always exists. Realize that, and it helps to reduce the allure that this lady might present to you.