How about this? Why don't you all go back to the EN board, and see if TD can get some HELP here?

believer, why the animosity?

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What's this about guys? Posters aren't allowed to invite whom they wish to their own threads on Gen Ques II?

TD... FYI, my XW backpedaled two weeks after d-day. Two weeks after that, she was gone. That was 14 months ago. Today I found out that I'm divorced.

Your W will suffer over the loss of OM for months. I'm sure you've heard by now that two years is a typical time frame required for a WS to fully kick her desire for the OP.

All you can do is work on your own bad habits and keep your chin up in the face of your W's surliness. If she has the character to stay, she'll stay. Her posts suggest she's trying to make that choice - the choice to love you, even though she isn't feelin' it.

Her displaced feelings for you are competing against the power of her feelings for her AP. These competing emotions battle for attention in her mind constantly, and you never know which will be running the show at any moment.

She is watching you very carefully. The cheating part of her wants you to screw up. That spider can't wait for you to present it with a burst pinata of excuses for pursuing the OM.

So do your best not to feed it, and become the man she needs you to be.

GC

TD,

Have you and your wife sent out a NC letter? Do you know for sure it is over? This is the first step.

Also, have you read the book surviving the affair? I know you guys were doing hN/HN, but you have graduated officially to the messed up A side of things, make sure you read it.

You're wife will want you to "get over it" and forget about it for a bit, she is only 2 weeks out. It probably hasn't hit her yet what she has done, and she is still probably justifying it, still blaming you or pointing fingers at the 12 years of building resentment.

Some of what she is saying probably has some base of truth, and you do need to become the man in the marriage that she needs, but you also need to heal from it.

During this time, you will feel anger and probably want to lash out at her, this is not constructive and people here can help you learn to control the LB and DJ's

If she is there working on the marriage and the A is truly over, then you are off to a great start, if you are still unsure if it is over, make sure you guys get that NC letter out.

Bob+pure has a great thread and so does WAT - can't find the URL's and there is also another great one Here

Read as much as you can and learn what to expect from yourself and your wife.

Your wife is still too close to her D-Day to be completely out of the fog and so patience is required on your part. But the marriage can be saved. You are already on a decent path by accepting your contributions to the marriage that may have made her feel resentful or neglected...but don't take the blame. She is probably exageratting it right now to justify what she has done. I did it, as did almost every other FWW on this board.

As for reading the emails - its not constructive if you are dwelling or obsessing, but you do have a right to know what took place and she should be willing to tell you everything you need to know in order for you to heal and process.

Once again, I am glad you found us here on the infedelity boards, you WILL get through this.

Since your wife has posted before, please encourage her to come and visit us too - she will be welcomed warmly by the other FWW's who can help gently nudge her in the right direction to recovery as well.

Whee TD, your threads do tend to make for wild rides.

I'm working on what I mentioned on the other thread...cogitating... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

But in the meantime, here's some thoughts about why I'm interested enough in your case to be willing to help you, if you want it. As you could probably tell, I wasn't too impressed with you for a bit there, and I thought some of your behavior was beyond inexcusable. But I hate cheating, so I felt really bad for you when I found out that's what you're facing. When I checked up on some of your wife's behavior, I was creeped out enough to want to help you despite also thinking some of your behavior is also creepy. :P

As you no doubt have noticed, I'm not much of a one for soft-pedaling language. You specifically asked for blunt, and if blunt is what you want, I'm one for it -- my communication style on this board is adapted from a workplace style developed for dealing with my fellow engineers who regard extreme bluntness as a personal favor that makes life easier all around. And as you no doubt have noticed, it really bothers some people. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> But what matters on your threads is whether you find it helpful or not, not what others think. If you occasionally hate my guts, it won't surprise me, as I think all the posters here who have said I really helped them would have liked to have thrown things at me at one time or another. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Look, I understand some of the fears you're facing. I know you feel like if you give up all the behaviors that people are identifying as LBs, you either won't have any you left, or what's left will be too painfully defenseless to be borne. The missing piece is this: You don't need to have *no* defenses, just don't have *bad* ones. As I've said to many others, you can't fix your abusive behaviors (without driving yourself insane, that is) unless you fix your boundaries at the same time. Whether you decide to stay with your wife or not, the pain these LB behaviors are making in your life can be made come to an end.

Next thought for the day: Trigger management.

There's a difference between a cause of a behavior and a trigger, and it's a really important distinction (if you like your sanity, that is <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> ).

It's really important when it comes to DJs, SDs, AOs, and Dishonesty. None of these things are caused by anyone but the person doing them. The only cause of these is that person's choice to do them and/or not to prevent them.

The only cause. There are no others short of someone holding a gun to your head or an equivalent threat.

So you've posted how you have a major problem making nasty comments to you wife, that you do it a lot, and that you did it pretty much the whole time you were "trying" to save your marriage before D-day. While the only *cause* of those comments was your choice not to prevent them, we both know that there were some definite triggers in things your wife said. Actually, with the whole divorce-when thing, you were both stomping on each other's triggers a whole lot. And you both did a lot of choosing to LB rather than manage your triggers responsibly.

Having triggers when you don't have a plan to manage them can make you feel like you're going crazy. For example, if when you were a kid, a neighbor used to walk up to you and say "pudding" and then beat the daylights out of you, you'd probably feel a stab of anxiety and stress every time you hear the word "pudding" -- that's a trigger. There are two main parts to managing the trigger:

1. a plan for how to avoid it gracefully
2. a plan for what to do when it gets hit

1. For example, if you're invited to a friend's house and they're making pudding to serve, you could ask them indulge you and call it something else, you could excuse yourself and leave, or you could head to the bathroom when dessert is served.

2. If you can't avoid it or you plan for 1 doesn't work, and someone says "pudding" anyway, you could excuse yourself and take a break until you feel in control.

Now where all this gets hairy is that your posts show that you have a boatload of triggers, and guess what, you'll probably develop more as a result of the A. Your wife also has a boatload of triggers from your porn addiction and abusive behaviors. So it's trigger-central in the TD household. You must feel at times like you're going nuts.

So back to the nasty comments problem: We need:

1. A list of circumstances where you're likely to make them or feel tempted to make them
2. A list of things your wife says or does that seem ok, but make you feel like your brains are leaking out your ears

As we find the triggers, we can make the two parts of the plan to deal with them.

Somehow I don't get the sense that you are here to help TD AT ALL, but rather to DOG him to settle some sick little, spiteful resentment you happen to be harboring. This man has come here asking for ask and you are harrassing him, my friend.

Why not take your resentment back to the EN board and lay off the man? This is not the time or place for your resentments.

Same question: What's this about? Posters aren't allowed to invite whom they wish to their own threads on Gen Ques II? Where's the rule that says a poster can only ask for help from those you approve?

Yes but you aren't offering him help. Leave him to us.

mineownself, don't try that crap on me. Your spiteful, angry posts to this man are out of line and have most likely run him off this forum. Perhaps you should take your resentments elsewhere?

Look guys, this is getting sad. TD read stuff I said on EN that was at least as harsh as anything I've said here, and he still followed it up with an invitation to post on this thread and said he wanted my view.

I really don't see why you find that so threatening.

mineownself, the question is what DO YOU find so threatening about TD that you would come over here and dog him about his "nasty" comments with your own sarcastic, nasty cheap shots?

How is it that you have such a huge resentment against this man that it wasn't enough to run him off the EN board, you won't be happy until you run him off this board? Why do you feel the need to disrupt this board too? And why in the world do you think folks over here would tolerate that?

LOL. How do you figure I ran the guy off when he asks me to post to him? That doesn't make any sense.

Do tell. I must have missed that part.

A reminder!!!

This is a marriage SUPPORT forum.

A place to come for information and SUPPORT while trying to rebuild and recover your marriage.

It is not intended as place to to tear apart and crucify ANY poster.

SUPPORT!!!!!!!!

mine,

What you are missing, is that alot of his acting out and emotional abuse as you call it, could have very well been due to the stress and the deep down feeling that he knew something was happening...Yes he may not have handled it right...but there is more to this now than just the changes he needs to make. He now has alot of healing to do too.

the good folks here will help him heal while implement alot of the things you are talking about..and your bluntness fine. But people can't work on themselves until they can grasp the situation - he has a long road ahead of him, but step by step.

I know you have been posting to him for awhile..and I know many of his posts were full of outbursts and he probably was full of LB and DJ, but he was grasping at a situation that deep down he probably knew was more than just HN/HN. Unless you have personally been in the position of a BS, you have no idea what the pain does.

So he handled it wrong, fine...but stop beating on him about it - he knows now, and this board will help teach him the tools to recover from it and learn from it.

I like others don't see you helping as a BS needs to be helped, but more going after him on what he needs to change. You are welcome to be here, no one said you couldn't be, but you are approaching this soley as a HN/HN thing and due to his previous posts and behaviors, which honestly could have been solely due to the stress in his marriage and contributions by his wandering wife pushing the right buttons.

There is a process, a time and a place to get to those things, right now his heart is probably at the bottom of a pit and changes will come, but he needs to have support and grasp what he has discovered 2 weeks ago before he can make those changes happen.

I am sure he and his wife will arrive at that place, and then will be the right time for your posts. The timing for someone who has just been betrayed is off.

Thanks, Justuss. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Hey Tired Dad...may I suggest you start a new thread on GQII with some specific questions and an update on your situation.

Things may e pretty bleak for you right now, but let me assure you, there are folks here at ALL points on the A script...pre-, post-, recovery, etc.

How can we help?

Justuss (and all moderators), thanks for the efforts you put forth in helping to keep these forums up & running.

Please explain to me (and I assume others) exactly how you expect us to support fellow posters. And where you see others being crucified- specifically T-D.

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