I'd be just as angry as your husband is milkshake. What you did was wrong. He is the child's father after all.

As to the rest of the post..... You seem a bit unreasonable.

My state's new child support laws just went into effect July 1st. They are being hailed as a vicotry for non-custodial parental parents' rights. It works very simply. The state determines what it costs to actually raise a child, area-by-area. The state average is set at around $14,000, wich inclues food, clothing, medical care, etc. The cost is split between the two parents in proprtion to their income. If both parents make a total of $100,000, with the fater earning $60,000 and the mother earning $40,000, the split is 60%/40%. If the mother is the primary custodial parent, the father has to pay the mother $8400/yr ($700/mo.). In joint custodial situations, who pays whom depends on which parent actually has the child. In situations where the mother has the child for the school year and the father takes it for the summer, during the summer months, the mother pays the father child support. One other good factor: the parent paying child support may not necessarily be required to make cash payments to the custodial parent. Rather he/she can make in-kind contribrutions, such as paying for health insurance, buying clothing, paying tuition, etc. I believe this to be a much more equitable system. Certainly better than the old one where the non-custodial parent paid a percentage of his/her annual income, without regard to what it actually costs to provide for the child.

Thanks for your opinion CheckUrHeart.

I am not trying to be unreasonable. When I spoke to several different lawyers, despite my expectation of receiving only 20% of H's net income (I am willing to accept this), they have told me the difference in our income is not that great and H should pay more than 20% of his net income.

I did not demand H to pay more than 20%. However, he was trying to negotiate with me to pay only 16%. That is when I told him "this is a state required amount, I am not the one who is picking the number '20'. You make it sound like I want to receive 20% while other people are receiving less..., in reality, you are most likely required to pay more than just 20% your net income. You will be asked to pay towards DS3's daycare and doctors' bills and medical and life insurance costs, etc. But I am willing to work this out with you in this area, but you just cannot change the state required child support of 20%".

That is how I got back to him. I do not think I was being unreasonable.

Since H is so determined to D, I feel there is nothing I can do at this point. Instead of just filing for divorce, I feel that I should give this letter to him and let him know that he is free. Then we can talk about actual terms.

Please let me know what you think of this letter. Thanks for your input.

-------------------
Dearest Ketchup,

This is a toughest letter I have ever written.

I have truly loved you more than anything and believed in our strong love. I have been through most agonizing moments I ever experienced in life since you said you would like to end our marriage. My love for you is so deep that I simply could not imagine my life without you.

We were the first serious partner for each other and we learned and experienced so many “first” things together. We grew up together in a sense, and I loved that we could talk about how “kids” we were when we first met. One thing I have always been proud of about our relationship was it is pure. Like you said many times in the past, it was a puppy love and we were just innocently and purely in love. We enjoyed the same food, traveling, culture, dogs, jokes, many things in life, and we were just comfortable with each other. We also have accomplished a lot together, supporting each other and I am very proud of that. You and I have come a long way and become soul mates. Ketchup, you and I had some very wonderful times together.

As you have pointed out, yes, we did fight a lot, and our marriage was by no means perfect. I am particularly very sorry for not understanding your emotional needs and what you were going through. I always thought by fighting we were letting out our emotions and it was healthy. I am sorry we were not on the same page on this. If I could go back and change some of the hurtful arguments or comments, I would Ketchup. I am sorry I cannot do that. But I have learned a lot and truly feel that now I am equipped with more wisdom that I needed in handling those confrontational situations in the past.

Finding out about your marijuana addiction and sex addiction was extremely hard. I could not comprehend at first, as you remember. Finding your love letter to XXX many years ago and again finding your letter to YYY last fall tortured me. And you made a comment that every time you were changing your jobs, you were always in “love” with someone else and that is how you were handling your stress in the hindsight. These comments just haunted me and I had many sleepless nights. I did not know what else to trust.

However, I have forgiven you. We cannot change the past. I would like to focus on what we can do from this point on.

I realized that I have been trying to hold you against your will. You made the decision – you want out of the marriage. You believe you will be happier alone, and I have to let you go. It’s been extremely painful for me and DS3, I have to admit, but we are going to make it. We have survived thus far and we will survive again. You are free to go.

Ketchup, you were my first true love and you will always have a special place in my heart. I will never forget the memories that we shared. I will pray for you and know that you will overcome your addictions and find peace.

Love,
MILK

-------------

Any suggestions? Thanks!

As with other people, the letter is written for you not for your H. Keep the letter and don't send it. I read blame in some statements. Treat it as cathartic and leave it.

I have seen angry, demanding items in your posts. You are still in the anger stage and want to make H pay. And there is part of you wants to recover your M. There are ways to make that happen, but you need to let go of the anger and angry demands. A counselor could work with you to help in your recovery, which may also help in recovering your M. It's your choice. You can only change yourself and your actions. This is about you now, and the person and parent you want to be.
The steps of grieving are: Denial/Anger-Blame/Bargaining/Recovery/Living
You are in the stage where you vacillate between AB & Bargaining. We've all been there.

Thank you for your reply newly. For some reason, I have missed a couple of your replies on 9/9/05 and I just read them.

You said I am withholding DS3 b/c I am not financially compensated by H, but that is not true. I always said to him DS3 loves him and H is very important to him. Honestly, I never wished to punish H using DS3 for not paying me his money. I felt that I want to make it tough for H b/c he is abondoning his family, and I did not want him to feel that while he is leaving his family and responsibility b/c that is just too much (he said this) and b/c he can now go after another women (he said this as well), but he can see DS3 whenever and as much as he wants when H feels lonely and has no one to go out with. So I am not saying that I did not feel that I want H to miss DS3 terribly, yes, I do feel that, but that is not b/c of the money. I do not want H to think DS3 is someone he can meet occasionally when he is not stressed out. That is not the right parenthood.

This is interesting, though. If newly and CheckUrHeart honestly got the impression that I am AFTER H's money, then that is how H must feel. Why is it? Honestly, I do not understand. Even though H is not making any payments towards our house at all, including the last month he was living with us? Even though H demands that I pay half of his own debt? If H is helping me with the mortgage, then of course I would not expect him to pay more than 20%. But every month I am in red digging into my savings. Even then, I did not bring up the money issue until recently. The reason is that DS3's daycare costs went up and our mortgage went up significantly as well due to much higher property tax. I asked him if he could help in anyway. I did not make any concrete demand. He said no, so I did not bring that up again.

H charged his own expenses on the card I am paying. I asked him to pay for his own expenses, and he said no. He did again the following month, so I asked him to pay for his own costs. He said okay, but he never gave me the money. I let go. The following month, he did again, so I asked him about it, he ignored it, so I let go again. But I guess I got pretty upset when he asked if he could do his laundry at my place - I said okay, but I felt that he is just trying to save $1 or so?? I know I should not have, but I got upset and brought up his own expenses I have paid for - that is when we had the argument last Saturday.

I want to be humble. If I gave any of you the impression that I feel I am "right", that is not my intention. I am humbly asking if that is the impression you get from my posts. If that is the case, no wonder my own husband takes everything I say and does negatively. I've got to change that.

And newly, about the grieveing steps - I am afraid I might be still at Denial, the very first step. Yikes! I might be a slow learner....

...forgot to mention.... I really appreciate all of you for taking your time to read my posts and reply to me. Some of them sure hurt sometimes, but I need to hear them and truly value other people's views on my situation as well as myself as a person. Thanks!

Someone else had the real grief steps on another post.

I see myself in your posts, that is why I am harsh with you. I think you may be a rightfighter, and sometimes you need to let go.

I do believe you are in anger/blame mode from reading your posts.

Protect yourself financially. I went through the same things. So after two months, why haven't you cancelled that credit card and gotten yourself issued a new one?
A counselor is very important for you to have now. It will help you see things differently, and to help you be a better parent.
Many parents use money as a weapon around divorce time. You believe your X to be doing this, it's likely he believes he's what he needs to survive.
Much of what I journaled and wrote through my early D stage is stuff I will never want to read again.

Your posts sounded like you were telling him how much he had to pay, when most of us know that the real $ are only determined after parenting time is determined & by formula.

And, you've mentioned a "friend" who your child thinks is daddy. Watch yourself here.

I still have issues dealing with my X because he's not an attentive parent and doesn't put the kids first. So I constantly need to reframe my thinking.

Thanks newly. Oh about my friend - he and his wife have been involved in DS3's life ever since he was born. They are like DS3's god parents. We (H, I and DS3) used to go see them a lot or they came to see us a lot. He is a lot more patient with DS3 than his own father, so whenever we got together, he would spend the entire evening with DS3 while my husband watches movies, taking a break. So he has always been DS3's favorite "uncle". He calls him "uncle", and of course DS3 could tell the difference btw his own daddy and my friend.

But since H moved out, I think in DS3's mind both his daddy and my friend are "men" who come to visit DS3 or we go visit to spend time with, and maybe the difference has become vague. So after DS3's birthday party, he woke up and told me "XXX (my friend) is my daddy". I told him no, his daddy is your Papa, not XXX.

H called this morning. Finally he is going to call DS3's therapist. I have been taking him to his therapist and 1 1/2 months ago, I told him about it and asked H to give her a call. She wanted to hear from DS3's daddy as well to fill in. H said he would, but he never did. I think he was afraid that she may tell him DS3 wants his daddy home or something that would make him feel bad.

I think he is going to call now, b/c he is afraid that in judge's eye H is not being responsible for not calling DS3's therapist when it has been asked. That is my guess. I think H is just ready to move on and wants to be careful to not screw up his chance of getting a custody or something. I only wish H was calling the therapist b/c he is genuinely worried about DS3.

Most reputable therapists would not see a child unless they talked to both parents first. So your X should be concerned. (Yes, I experienced this firsthand).

Understand that your H will get custody. What you are discussing is "parenting time". States differ in their wording, but most split the terms between "joint legal custody" - that is equal consideration in decision making, and residential custody (ie. where the child spends time aka parenting time).

Did you buy the book Mom's House/Dad's House yet? You will find it very helpful.

Thanks, no I haven't bought the book yet but will go check out the bookstore this weekend.

I spoke to H and since he wanted to see DS3, I suggested that he would come for dinner and can stay in our house until DS3 falls asleep. H said he will have to "see what's happening" and will get back to me. ??

I laughed and said "but it's your schedule, you make it sound like you don't know what is going to happen tonight?" H just said he would get back to me.

These are the things really scare me. Is it b/c he has OW? Or is it b/c he thinks it is my "trap" to get him back? Or is it b/c he thinks he needs to talk to a lawyer before making any decision from now on?

I know I am panicing and need to calm down, but if it is OW, that really sucks and will upset me, but that is one thing. Well at lease I would know that H is the one being selfish and I may actually feel a bit better about myself. Or if it is b/c he feels that I may be trying to lure him back and that is what he is afraid of, I guess at this point, that is understandable as well (although I am not happy about it!!!). But what if it is b/c he is really taking a serious legal step and is trying to screw me up big time??? I am really scared. I don't think inviting my own husband to dinner is a sin, so don't think his lawyer can use this information against me, but I am terrified.

As expected, H declined my offer. Instead, he decided to get together with guys he got to know through the SA group counseling. They are all divorced/separated and support each other. H used to at least think divorce was a big step, but now he says "divorce is not a big deal, everybody does it". I think it's b/c his normal feeling became numb after spending so much time with people who are all divorced.

I really feel that our M is over. I have to move on. But I am terrified. How do I overcome the fear??

I am doing a bit better. As more I think about it, H has always exhibited strange traits - that he cannot handle responsibility. As long as we were just dating, everything was wonderful. Soon as we got married, he got freaked out and started to spend every weekend at his friend's house while I got stuck in our apartment all by myself as we got only one car that time and also b/c I had no family or friends in this country. Then after we got our first child, H got freaked out again and was smoking marijuana behind my back every day and was pretty much gone every single weekend. He said he was playing computer games at BestBuy and I believed him, but who knows. He might have been wandering around looking for attractive women on the street.

H claims he loves DS3 very much (which I believe) and misses him so much, yet simple thing such as calling DS3 on days he is supposed to call at certain hours is apparently too difficult for H. It's been almost 2 months since he agreed that he would call more often for DS3 (Mondays, Wednesdays, and on weekends between 7 and 8pm), yet he has missed his calls so many times and also called much later than the time we agreed. He has a cell phone so he can call anytime anywhere, and I don't understand why it is so difficult for him to be consistent. Last night he ended up calling at 9:15pm, and DS3 was already in bed. I was upset. I did not want to be mean but just told H "try to call earlier" in an angry tone of voice. Poor DS3, he always expects his daddy to show up or call at certain time and H ended up not showing up/calling or changing his schedule at the last minute.

H went to church on Sunday (H went to his brother's church) so I was a bit surprised but at the same time thought it might be a positive sign, but now thinking back, H went to church every Sundays last fall b/c he fell in love with this girl (one-way emotional love), so who knows what his true motivation is. Apparently, H told his brother several months ago that "Jesus told me to divorce Milk". What??? Of course his brother tried to explain God hates divorce and that should not be the case, and then H told him "well I don't have to believe what you believe".

H has severe mental issues I believe.

I am going back and forth and have been pretty unstable emotional wise these days.

H called last night and wanted to talk about how to "split" the assets. Initially I was able to remain calm and said "well, if you really think this is the only way you can feel happy and you think all of your unhappiness and emptiness over the past 12 years were due to me, then there is nothing I can do about it". H said no, he does not blame me for everything.

But then when we started to talk about our R, he snapped and said "I just don't love you, I just want to move on".

Even though I felt I have been preparing myself for the past nearly 10 months, these words still hurt me very badly.

When I told him "I told my friends you are not that kind of person....", he hang up on me.

I could not sleep last night. For the first time in a long time I could not stop crying in front of my son. He was worried about me and I felt bad.

I know this is a normal greiving process, but I don't know how to survive this. I am also very scared.

milkshake, this is going to be hard, but it must be done. You and your H are going to have to have productive talks about making the divorce happen. This is the hardest thing in the world for someone who doesn't want a divorce to do. So you and your H must set a some boundries. The divorce talk are only about business. Emotions and talk about the relationship must be off limits.

Your opening statement:

""well, if you really think this is the only way you can feel happy and you think all of your unhappiness and emptiness over the past 12 years were due to me, then there is nothing I can do about it"

set the stage for this conversation to go badly. It addresses how you feel, but has nothing to do with what he wanted to discuss. Then you started talking aboout your relationship and the conversation went out of control from that point on.

Your H's error in this was that such conversations should not occur over the phone unless there is no other choice. I recommend that they initially occur in a public place where both of you are less likely to lash out and behave badly.

You are not going to even begin to heal and move through the grieving process until the business of the divorce is out of the way. So it is in your best interest to work with your H to make this happen as quickly as possible and without emotion. I know that probably sounds impossible, but you can do it if you put your mind to it. After a business meeting, there's nothing in the world wrong with going home (or to the park or some other private place) nad having a good cry.

Thanks CheckUrHeart. I know this must be talked over, and every time I feel I may be ready to just have a "business talk", but then I break down.

Some people can remain calm even when they face death, and I don't know why I panic so much when I hear the "D" word from H. I have been trying to tell myself that my life does not just end here, and I do know that in my head but I do not know how I can address this in a business like manner. Maybe I should write to him. I hate being so weak!!

Would you consider enlisting an MT to help you get through this terribly hard time? A lot of people don't know that, while their primary misssion is to save marriages, they are also good at helping end the ones that cannot be saved, and do so in a healthy way.

What is MT?

Marriage Therapist or Counselor.
It's a good idea and an intermediary can help return the meeting to its stated focus.
A divorce mediator could also do this, and some are from the counseling field rather than from the legal field.

Oh, okay. H would not go to MC. We tried two different therapists for a short period of time and I also took H to a seminar held at nearby church, but he did not want to hear what they had told him and we stopped going.

I will try to calm down first, then will probably tell H that we can discuss D. H is coming to pick up DS3 this Saturday, and hopefully by then I am a bit calmer and can tell him I am ready to discuss.