Luna,

I have not had to deal with a adolescent boys heartbreak because my son married his first g/f but I have had to deal with a DD'S first heartbreak.

When this happened to her I let her talk and i listened and just comforted her best I could. She was sad for a few days and said no one would ever like her again. I told her thats not true and one day she would meet someone who would love her more than she could ever imagine. After about a week of moping around it was like one day she woke up and it didn't matter anymore. I don't know if its the same for boys or maybe my DD was just different than most.

I think the best would just be there and let him talk and get it out and reassure him he is special and loved. Not sure this helps you but thats what I did with DD.


Hurting

Thanks for replying, Hurting....

Hi Luna,
Maybe moving a little further will be a blessing in diguese. It won't be so easy, especially since the boys can't come and go as they please they will have to bug him for a ride to go get something...a little more reality.

As for DS15 broken heart. The thing I remember most about how adults responded to my teenage broken heart was to minimize it. "Oh it was nothing." "Its just puppy love you're young." "Your too young to know what love is." The thing is the emotions are real, being young only means you don't have the experience in dealing with it. Being an adolescent you've got all these crazy hormones swimming around, your self image is evolving, self esteem and all this peer pressure on who is dating who is a lot to deal with.

We're adults with experience and look how it rocks our worlds! But the one advantage he has is...he has you for a mom. He has you as an example of how life goes on even if you are broken hearted. Let him talk if he wants, be there for him, support him, don't dismiss his emotions, let him know its ok to be sad, encourage him to do some physical activity, and take every chance you get to let him know you think he is a great guy.

Luna -

Hi - You sound great! It does get easier and easier with Plan B. The triggers come further apart and you learn how to handle them better.

Take Care(Good luck in helping your DS through the heartache!!)

Kim

Hi C42: thanks for the advice... I will take it...

Hi Kim: thanks for dropping by....

....amazing isn't it? ...to find that we have the strength to do what needs to be done!

Update.

Just thought I would get back to you about DS15... and his adolescent 'heartbreak'.....

Well... without specifically telling me so.... since I noticed that the 'nightly' phone calls have ended.... his 'girlfriend's' pictures are down in his room.... and since I know that he 're-read' through some of her many love letters to him with one of his boy friends who stayed overnight last weekend (who had 'breaking up' experience)... and noticed that his activities this 'weekend' are with his boy friends.... which to be honest he had missed doing activities with during the time he was seeing his GF....over a YEAR!.... I conclude that DS15 is doing just fine in the 'heartbreak' dept... he even seems to be glad to have more time to do things with his boy friends.... like many, GF seemed to have possessive tendencies already!

Knowing that it will help me my 'anxiety' level just to get off it my chest.... I will be jumping a 'hurdle' tonight....I know I will be fine....once I get it over with...

.....I am expected to go the my DS10's school... he will be presenting his class's 'school play'..... WS is one of the two 'resource' professionals - he's an actor - that helped the class put on the play.... don't know whether or not WS will be there... expect to keep at a 'distance' if he is there.... but may not be as he has other professional activities Thursday nights....

....for those of you that don't know.... OW in my case is a teacher at the school....with whom WS 'hooked up' while working as a 'professional resource' (what a laugh that is!)and got into a PA in Sept. 2004....

so...even if neither of them are there.... (OW would have no reason to be there tonight...but you never know!)..... the building itself, symbolically ... and, since I am a very 'private' person.....knowing that all the personnel there is aware of my WS's cheating ways..... it makes me very uncomfortable going there....

....but as the song goes..... I WILL SURVIVE.... there have been 'worst' moments in this whole ordeal.... I just need to breath in deeper a little.....

....as usual...many here know what I am TALKING ABOUT!

Update.

Along with the boys, our big dog also alternates one week with me and one week with WS....when with WS, dog spends most of the time outside on the balcony....

Well....WS just got a ticket due to a complaint from a neighbour last week because dog was 'barking' too much.....

WS lives one block away.....left message asking if dog could stay at house...would spend day in yard and in the house at night.....WS offered to come and 'walk' dog while I am at work....

I love my big dog..... I answered: yes..... but this means, WS will systematically come in the house.... I don't know whether this is good or bad.... WS may get a 'fix' by coming to the house... but it will be empty..... and inevitably it must at times also remind him of what he left behind...

....or I can always take care of our big dog full-time...but as our situation goes right now...WS needs access to the house anyway for tools and materials for property we co-own.... so....for now..... I choose to let things 'be'..... and I don't need to take 'that' many walks.... pretty cold out there these days.....

I know for a fact.....that the essential of PLAN B, my not wanting to 'talk or see him' until OW is out of the picture....is really starting to get to WS.....because I know he counted on us being in a friendly co-parenting relationship.... this is a big 'reality' check for WS... not enough of course to end A..... but knowing him....I know he must be trying to 'convince' himself that I will come around soon.... I don't think he could stand the idea that that is how things could be 'always'.... I don't think it was never his intention that the mother of his children would be out of his life, literally..... because we really did get along on a lot of levels..... and he wanted to 'keep' that going..... compartmentalizing..... is just not working as he had hoped... his 'wife' refuses to cooperate.....ME....

I wonder sometimes.... could my WS be 'missing' what I am, or not, because of being too much in the fog and involved with OP?

...I miss talking and interacting with S....talking about boys, visiting family members and friends, making plans like vacations and other projects....I miss seeing us 4 together.... I miss seeing boys interacting with their dad.... I wonder....does he or does he not miss these things in the fog?

....I am glad I am in PLAN B so I can't ask...I am pretty sure if WS answers....I would be dissappointed....

....this week the boys are at their dad's...but S10 came to pick up something he had forgotten and told me that dad's GF (without naming her) was 'looking after him' because dad was working...

...I really didn't need to know this information.... but I also don't want to 'block' S10...I just didn't ask him to elaborate..... the boys have both already 'decided', in trying to protect me, that OW's name 'will never be spoken out loud' at our house...

...both boys...by some of their comments....show that in no uncertain terms....they have lost some 'respect' for their dad....for having lied to their mom, moved out of the house, and gotten a GF..... I neither add to their comments nor do I defend him..... because they are basically stating the 'facts'.....

...the boys can't be fooled....WS loves them very much.... but not enough to 'work things out with mom' and stop having a GF...

...I have OW's phone no., just had to call and check early this morning whether or not she was at her place....so.... I guess overnights for now are not yet happening for OW....

....this is the OW who has been a BS when she had 3 young children and knows what an A does to a family, who promised (according to WS!) that she would never do what her XWH had done to another family....

...well....I guess she could not resist WS's charm.... for WS, she left 27-yr M with someone who helped raise HER kids.... and obviously due to their past experience has now a very 'strained' relationship with her grown children... they can't believe their own mom would be OW involved in an A...

....there is sooo much damage from this A it is unbelievable..... how can either them sleep at night?... I wonder...

....anyway.... working on trying to get some 'distance' from the whole mess, again... but actually, it just made me realize that it had been awhile since I had 'wasted' energy on 'unproductive' thoughts on WS..... before....I was continually 'focused' on WS..... not so lately!

...back on the PLAN B horse! ...I will consider it a 'little' slip up...

....guess I felt like sharing...sorry for the long post....

...once again....thank you all for reading me....it helps to know that you are all out there!

An update... for me and for the curious.

I have the boys this week (WS and I alternate weeks).

Some of you might remember, a few weeks ago I 'reflected' on DS15's request of wanting to stay with me all the time ... was weighing the pros and the cons and asking for advice.... one cons being that his Dad would inevitably be less a part of his life.... at a time I feel when it is most important... his adolescent years....(I know, some may feel that a WS in an adolescent's life may do more harm than good!)....but even as a WS he takes very seriously his dad-son relationship...its important for WS that the boys don't feel 'responsible' for the separation, etc etc..... anyway, DS15 brought this up again last night....patiently waiting for me 'to decide'....in a very respectful way.... showing a side of how mature DS15 can be about things... compensating for WS, I guess!

Anyway... a few weeks ago I was not ready to make a proposition to WS about this.... last night... I could not see DS15 continuing much longer with the 'going back and forth'.... and so last night I was 'ready' to leave message to WS about it....

It was a long message to WS.... here is the jist of it (translated from French):
----------------------
Hello WS,

I have already mentioned to you that DS15 asks me regularly if he could stay with me all the time...since you chose to leave last summer...DS15 believes he has the right to choose with whom he stays....

INSPITE of the fact, as you know, that I do not find 'ideal' the current arrangement because....

...the two of us, as parents, do not 'interact'
...the boys are being forced to be 'suitcase' kids by switching each week to be with us separately
...our time with them has been cut in half while being intensified at the same time
...the boys don't benefit of any 'continuity' with either of us
...they no longer have 'family' time with the 4 of us together

SEEING that, DS15's request would in addition also mean, among other things...

....'separating' somewhat the boys, which I admit hurts just to think about it (NOTE: one of the things both S and I really cared about was 'building' a good brotherly relationship between the two so that in the future they could be there and count on each other!)
....that inevitably your presence in his life would be reduced and mine increased, something I do not find necessarily 'healthy' for anyone concerned

I have to date RESISTED to consider DS15's request.... even though as he says, legally at his age he has a right to choose.....

...because I don't think it's in his best interest.... that in spite of all the difficulties....I find your 'presence' in his life to be important..... that maintaining a relationship with you is important.... that I cannot compensate for what you as his dad can bring to his life... I guess you would know more about the importance of the father-son relationship

HOWEVER, I do believe that given his age at one point we will have to seriously consider his request...or at least allow him to 'try it out'..... with both of us keeping an 'open door' attitude and adjust if necessary....

SO....would you please think of ways you can remain an important 'element' in DS15's life...on how to maintain a 'regular' contact with DS15 even though DS15's 'home base' would only be with me.....

I also believe that, even though it's a decision involving directly only DS15, I cannot help but wonder, and I try not to lose sight, of how DS10 would 'take' this change....

While you think about all of this....please also consider discussing it further with both DS15 and DS10.....
-------------------------------------------

I know, message was too long....for WS...maybe S had to take over!

Even as a WS, he never questioned his 'role' and his presence in the lives of our boys... actually... he was expecting to continue actively being a part of mine as well.... big reality check!

I know this is going to be very painful even for WS - to see less of and interact less with DS15.... but unfortunately.... it's just another consequence of HIS choices.... I suspect the same will happen when DS10 will be 15 (if not sooner).....

I guess this may force WS to realize that HIS choices are basically taking him out of his sons lives much much sooner than he had expected... when, normally, as parents we feel children grow up already 'too faster'...it will be painful to him as a WS and can't imagine how painful it could be to S if some of the 'fog' lifts temporarily.....

Have some of you noticed that OW is totally NOT in my picture? ....and WS not much either for that matter, with my PLAN B......

....just trying to do 'right' by my boys...that I adore... and it's a 'big deal' for me....

....I guess one of these days I may learn to be more 'economical' when expressing myself....it doesn't look like it's today!

Take care everybody.

Edited: I tried to compensate for the length of the message by taking my t i m e.... I do expect him t get the 'bottom line': WS, expect to be seeing LESS of DS15!

(((luna)))

Thanks for the hug, C42, I need it.

Needless to say....WS did leave a message reply for me.

Well people...let's just say that it was another lesson learned...

...won't go into the details of his message...because bottom line.....WS felt 'attacked' and 'unsupported' by me....and more or less went into the 'victim' mode...with a lot of suggestions about what 'I' needed to do.....

Just to end the exchange, I left a reply so he wouldn't feel 'ignored'...basically apologizing for any misunderstanding my message had created, and that bottom line I was seriously considering DS15's request to stay with me FT and wanted him to be aware of it.....

WS still very much in fogland.... that he is a victim...and that all problems stem from my 'lack of cooperation'. He really didn't 'sound' all that happy....and I guess I was to blame for it!

So....back to PLAN B....I am so glad I don't have to deal with WS on a daily basis! With being in PLAN B for so long...I had forgotten how much a WS doesn't make much sense....full of justifications... demands....ME ME ME land.....YAK!

I tried to muster some sympathy for your WH but...I couldn't do it. It amazes me that even in the face of thier children's pain they can only see themselves.

Go dark...stay strong.

I know, C42, it really is hard to believe...

I guess a lot of WS energy goes to NOT seeing the pain resulting from their poor choices.....

With this exchange, having some 'distance' from WS, the 'not making sense' arguments of a WS become really obvious to see!

It really is NOT worth 'investing' energy in trying to 'understand' a WS....because there is nothing to understand.... they want what they want when they want it, period.... and in so doing..... running after a lot of frustration!

Update.

One of WS's last messages included comments such as: 'how SURPRISED he still was at my refusing to sit down and DISCUSS things with him' like income tax reports, the kids, repairs to the house.....(because he suggested that he would be willing to help but couldn't under the circumstances - PLAN B)...and why would I not 'cooperate' with him.....and that he had no intention to reconsider coming back home....

....meaning.... am I playing games? ...because this is 'serious' stuff?..... yeah, like an A maybe?.... and WS actually seemed kind of panicky....

...WS encouraged me to 'resist' DS15's request to only want to stay with me.....

...is reality starting to sink in a little bit? DS15 not wanting to go and stay with him? BS who 'seriously' refuses to meet with him?

...get this people:

...WS actually said to me that, like he had told me when he moved out, if I WANTED to 'complicate' things, I could..... (as if him having an A and moving out simplified things!)

....and that DS15 should not stay F/T with me because he had 'a family duty' not to be 'separated' from his younger brother....and that certainly at one point he would be moving on and have his own apt..... he's 15!....can you believe it?

Well.... I decided to reply to WS, more or less....:

I thanked him for offering to help with the repairs, and did agree with him that under the circumstances it would not be possible.

I also reminded him (since he seemed to have forgotten why!) that our 'family' was still a priority to me... and that I was willing to meet with him the day that our 'family' was a priority for him AGAIN.... to discuss what to do....that, yes, I totally 'got it' that right now he is not interested....based on his choices of wanting to be 'single again with a GF'

I am not sure why, but I am finding myself full of energy these days..... (it may be my business trip to CA and having a chance to meet Believer.... for which I am really excited about....because had not expected to go)

....some of my friends commending me on how quickly I seem to be bouncing back..... and finding that I am an 'exception' to the rule....

....a business associate just called, who I last met in January, to talk to me because he missed 'interacting' with me... I remember now.... I was particularly 'peppy' at a series of meetings back in January...... (no.... don't get the wrong idea.... he's more of a 'fatherly' figure to me....and an easy person to kid around with....'clean' fun people.... I am into 'clean' fun!)...it must be my 'exotic' side of being Italian playing tricks on me and on others, again....

....Well....reporting back about how 'mom' was worried about DS15 first love 'heartbreak'....well....since his ex-GF called a few times...I asked him what's up (expecting totally to be told 'it's my business' - tends to want to be secretive to be more grownup) well... he answered me....it seems that.....she is now just an 'acquaintance', not even a friend ..... and by the way, mom..... I met another girl that I really like! AAARGGGGHHHH!

I guess it's normal for a mom to find her 'boys' SOOOOOOOOOOO CUTE and HUGGABLE and SPECIAL!

....I now have our 'family' dog staying with me F\T.... (seems WS had a ticket for him barking too much at his apt).... so technically I have one 'male' permanently staying at the house.....every time I look at him now I imagine EAV with her two boys! My big dog is a real 'baby'.... plan to take care of him more... have very nice conversations with him....

...which reminds me.... I don't think I have ever told the Board the story about our cat.... you will get a big laugh out of this one:

About 4-5 yrs ago when DS15 was younger, really pressured us to have a cat.... went to the SPCA and got a little male kitten.... got him operated on, vaccinated....etc..... took him home.... first 6 months, Fall and Winter, stayed inside....Spring time arrives... started to let cat out in the backyard.... first time, attacks two birds at the same time!.....DSs proud that cat had real 'hunter' instincts!

Cat usually 'travelled' with us.... but about 3-4 years, while over at a friend's house in the country..... we lost cat.... we put up posters for 'missing cat'.... went for vacation.... had a few 'cat' sightings but nothing concrete..... after two months.... got a call saying found cat that looked like photo..... S went to pick cat up.... seemed to have the 'coat' patterns of our cat... in particular a 'bull's eye' on the side... a little darker... a littler skinnier... but then..... he had to fend for himself in the woods for 2 months!....a real survivor!

The first few days back home cat spent sleeping it off....seemed very nervous.....edgy... well, he had to fend off enemies in the woods for two months....must have played havoc with his nerves...poor thing!..... we let him take his time to get 'reacquaint' himself with the surroundings.....

Well in the Summer of 2004 we were taking a long vacation - one month - so before leaving friends to look after cat, took him for a check-up, update vaccinations....

....well.... lo and behold!.... the vet who operated on our male took hubby aside and told him: Mr. S your male cat is a female! ..... what about the bull's eye?....sir...very common...said the vet...

.....well... this was 2 years later after we had found 'him'... so we let the matter drop... who knows what happened to OUR cat.... hope someone is looking after HIM.... we never had the need to have 'her' operated on.... because she had never been in 'heat' or we would have had kittens from our 'male' cat much earlier and would have been really surprised!

....I must unconsciously want my posting to be purposely long.... just to test your patience...since it seems that it is a trait worth 'developing'!

Take care everybody!

Good to see you're doing so well!

I loved the cat story. Have you read James Herriot's books?

Hi CC46,

Thanks for dropping by.... How are you doing?

quote:---------------------------------------------
Have you read James Herriot's books?
---------------------------------------------------

No..I haven't.... what kind of books does he write? Do you recommend him?

Hi Luna <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

You would love James Herriot. He was a veterinarian in England round 1940s. His stories are so funny, sweet, and real. I think the first one is All things bright and beautiful, then All creatures Great and Small and the last of the series The Lord God made them all. You have to read them in order because he also tells the story of his life and his surgery partners.
Hilarious. There are some scenes he describes you will never forget and you really have to laugh out loud!

I'm doing fine. Lately I'm very happy and detaching I think. I now see a futur for myself that I love. Me alone again. I'm happy. Hopefully this will last. Job is fun, the weather is getting cooler which is great for me.

so I'm doing fine, waiting for the 2 years to be over as pr Dr. Harley's instructions, but actually looking forward to everything and anything...

Happy. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Glad to hear your 'doing fine' cc

Thanks for the details re author... I will put him on my 'list'....

Update.

WS is moving 'forward' with his plans to move out of the neighbourhood into a 'bigger' apt. this summer.

....so....when the boys are at their dad's....starting this summer....I won't be seeing DS10 as I now do every morning before going to school..... and DS15 after school....and that's not counting all the times the boys need to 'drop by' to pick 'something' up.....

...right now....when the boys are at their dad's....the fact that they are only a 'block' away.....and by seeing them practically everyday anyway...makes the week's 'separation' more bearable.....for me and for them!

...I believe it will be another 'painful' step to overcome...and not having any 'family' living in my city..... I suspect to be hit the hardest by feelings of 'loneliness'.....we'll see...

...I am really not looking forward to this new 'challenge'.... it feels like, starting with WS getting involved in A, with each decision he is making...with each step forward he is taking.... it is slowly but surely 'destroying' the family it took us 20 yrs to build.... and it saddens me...very very much..... and I am overcome by feelings of 'powerlessness' because there is nothing I can do about it to stop it!

...it saddens me most of all to see that my boys' 'family' is being/has been taken away from them....and that WS doesn't even want to see that......

I somehow feel it would hurt less if WS were to at least 'recognize' the damage being done... rather than, out of his own need, choosing to, at least, act to ignore it....even though somehow I feel deep down he must be hating himself for doing what he is doing....but can't seem to stop himself.....

....I feel helpless....because I would so much want to 'make it' up to my boys but know that I can't..... and it hurts to see my boys hurt.....and it hurts to see that their 'dad' doesn't seem to want to see it....WS has the 'option' to change the course of things but won't....

....as I am writing this.....I am realizing how this next decision of WS....moving out of the neighbourhood....is making me really angry.... angry because I feel helpless.... angry because WS is allowing this to happen....and even worse....he is the one responsible for it!

Good thing I am in PLAN B..... because were WS in front of me right now...he would have an earful.....

I think like many parents.....WS hurting me is not as bad as WS hurting my boys.....

....you know....I wonder sometimes....I do believe I could one day forgive WS for hurting me.... I am not sure if I could for hurting the boys the way he is.....with his selfish decisions...they are being symbolically 'torn apart' by our 'separation'.... and WS won't even see it!

I feel helpless as a parent....and a failure....because I can't 'protect' my boys from all this pain that I feel has nothing to do with them....

....I expected my boys to be 'hurt' in life...but I didn't ever think it would be coming from those that are supposed to 'protect' them..... and be there for them...... with my feelings of helplessness..... I feel a 'complice' to WS hurtful acts inspite of the fact that I never wanted the 'separation'.....the reality is that we are, and we are all suffering the consequences, whether we 'wanted' it or not!

....I really feel that when we choose to bring children into the world.....we choose to be responsible for their wellbeing and need to do the best we can to always show them that we value them (or we wouldn't have brought them into this world)... and I am really mad because WS by his choices seems to basically be telling them (and me)....yes.... they, we, are worth it, up to a point!

I am mad at WS for giving himself 'permission' to 'check out' of our family just because WE did not live up to his image or expectations to a 'T'.....

I am mad at WS for having 'giving up' on US..... like a captain of a boat.....while sinking....choosing to be first to jump rather than the last... I know I know.... this in itself speaks volumes about MY expectations.....

...but yes....I did expect him NOT to abandon us......because he chose to have a family, he chose to have children.....

....I guess at one point he must have started to question his choices....and rather than find solutions 'within'..... started to find solutions elsewhere.....

...it feels that we are at extreme ends..... WS totally 'blind' to the damage..... and me....overly sensitive to it.....do I feel the need to compensate for his lack of awareness?

...anyway...I see this is turning out to be a 'venting' of sort post....sorry about that... it didn't start out that way...take it as a sign of 'trust'...... I feel comfortable enough with you all to 'share'..... because I know for a fact that I am not making much sense.... just getting through the 'moment'......and know that most have 'lived' through similar moments and know what I am talking about....

URGGRH!!!!

I have got to pull myself together...so that I can be 'there' for my boys tonight! ...they really don't deserve this.... how will I ever make this up to them?

I am sorry.....I can't see the screen very well.....

bye for now.

Luna you can vent here anytime you want!!!!

((((Luna))))))
<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />You have a right to be angry...just channel it in a positive way. Get rid of the negative energy...you don't need it. Your WH is a fool. Some day he will KNOW it even if he never admits it to you.

You are incredible lady with so much to offer.

Thanks C42.