Yesterday was tough. H's email kept circeling around in my head. I was so tired from the emotions that I ended up going to bed early. I wondered if I gave up on my M too soon or not. I honestly feel that I would have fought longer had we had at least a couple of years of a strong marriage. As is, we did not. There were 2 years of me working on it (in the wrong places mostly ~ I was an amatuer <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />) but still trying, and WH saying how we were not figuring it out fast enough and having no suggestions on what to do at all.

I honestly believe he did not know what he was getting himself into. I don't know what it means to be "ready" for marriage. I don't think I really was, but I tried and I was serious about the commitment and making it work. And then when he left, I searged within myself to find a way to rebuild, to work on myself.

I finally realized that WH is a good guy, but not the man I want in my life. He has made no changes in his life, he has backtracked a lot <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> and the man he is I don't want. Love is an interesting thing. None of the things I realize now, change the fact that I love him still. I was willing to be unhappy in the M, because I loved him. We were not making any headway, he acknowledged that I tried, but that it takes two, and I still wanted him in my life. I figured it could be fixed, I would find some way, I kept trying, but the reality was that I was just rowing alone <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />, going in circles.

Now, I never agreed to be friends. He assumed I did. I said, I did not know if I could do that, and he figured because I was talking to him that I could.

I lost my best friend....<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/teary.gif" alt="" />


I re-read his email several times. It amazes me that when I didn't ask him for any explanantion...he offered it.

Reading it, I see how he not only managed to make it all about him <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> (my feelings apparently on the subject of not wanting to watch my H date don't matter <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />) but he also still managed to stick it to me <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />.

There was no need to yet again mention that he does not want to get back together......did i ask <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />?

There was no need to tell me how he thinks of us back together from time to time, but has no intention of doing anything about it.

He just had to stick it to me once again <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />.....


Daisy <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

(((( Daisy))))

Hugs to you my friend. I wish I had the words to take your pain away.

You have done nothing wrong you have done nothing but be honest about how you feel about your H. He is just to immature and self-centered to appreciate you.

I believe one day when he grows up he will see what he threw away and feel the pain of it. By then it will probably be to late for you.

You will be ok Daisy, I promise you that. The pain will ease and you will move ahead in life, and find someone who will love you back and appreciate you.

For now take care of you and try not to worry about him.. I should take my own advice here ...... We are all here for you to lean on and vent to... You will be in my prayers .....


Hurting

thank you hurting....it means a lot to have you say that....

I think you and I have been here about the same time dealing with our respective situations. You are very strong. If I was in your shoes, dealing with what you deal with, WH and OW, I would not be as strong as you.

My situation I am sure looks mild in comparason. I just could not do it anymore. He was turning me into his friend. He turns all his ex's into friends....I could not do that. I guess I could have done some official Plan B, but honestly....I am planned out. I admire all of you who are doing it. I'll keep you in my prayers. You are some strong women (and man)!


I spoke to a mutual friend today. Met her up for coffee. I had not told her anything and when I started she said she already knew about the email I send to H. Apparently H spoke to her H, telling him what I said and what he said to me, and that he was not happy about what I was doing. This friend told him basically "what did you expect"...

He expected to have it all.


Today was already better than yesterday, but I know I'll continue to have difficult days.....but I'll get through it. The worse is really behind me. I thank God for that.


Daisy

Daisy,

I think the pain is the same no matter the situation. The one person you trusted and loved with all your heart has betrayed us in one way or another.

I have to be honest here this planb is killing me but I know its for the best. I can't talk to him or be around him as it hurts me everytime. I do think though its making things easier for him to walk away. You know the saying out of sight outta mind. To bad that does not work for me though.....

Who knows Daisy maybe you cutting contact may be the best thing for your H. He seems to not be happy about it. Keep your chin up girl we will make it through this no matter the outcome....

Take Care,

Hurting

hurting....


Why does 'out of sight out of mind' not work for us? I don't get how they can just forget about us, and choose to walk away.....

You know, I thougth about something H said to me back in July. "I like that I have the choice to see you or not, talk to your or not". I guess this is part of his "I have always been open and caring towards you" bit. Well, now he doesn't have the option to see me or not OR talk to me or not. He thought only his wants mattered.




I'll get through this, I know. I don't hold my breath that this will somehow change things.


I spoke to a friend this morning and I was telling her that H probably was not ready for M. Her response was that it sounds more like he is not ready for life, that he has issues, and he just keeps running away from it all, instead of dealing with it.

I cannot be around him anymore.....I could not do that to myself. It really is time to rebuild.......my life......it will take time.........

Daisy

Daisy,

As bad as it hurts you really sound like you have it together.

I think in a way all WS'S are running from something they just don't know how to handle. Its always easier to run than to face it. The only problem is no matter where they run , they will always be there... ( Thanks, Ark for that one) and its oh so true, they can only hide for so long. One day they will have to face theselves in the mirror and wonder who they are and what have they done. I truly believe this...... Problems always have a way of finding you no matter how much you run..... I learned that the hard way in my younger years before marriage. I ran all the way across the country to get away but somehow my problems all followed me a short time later.

I wish I had the answer as to why they can walk away so easy but alas I don't. And to be honest I don't think they do either. I do believe its selfishness and entitlement mostly. We have to remember this is all about them, no one else matters......

I understand about not being around him. Its the only way you can heal yourself and be the person you want to be. Time will heal you and you will be happy again.....


Take Care,

Hurting

hurting....

Thank you. It hurts, but at this point I know I can handle it. I hate the feeling of loss. I feel that I really ought to be walking around in black.....I feel as though I am in mourning.

I went to the store yesterday and I was just kind of staring in space when the cashier tried to flert with me. He said "so what is going on". I just looked at him and said "nothing". He was like 10 years younger then me, and the whole idea was just sickening to me. I tried not to be rood, but I am sure he still thought I was.


I know that what I did was for the best. I need to live my life. Deep insight I even know that H is not good for me. He has many issues, depression, the business of hiding correspondence/contact with a bunch of women friends, not wanting to work for a living, avoidence of any hard work, the selfishness and the entitlement, immaturity,....but none of it changes how I feel about him.

Yet, I know that I would not take him back the man he is, he would have to change and even if he wanted to come back (which he does not), he has no intentions of changing. He is not a happy person. He looks for happiness in other people....in all the contacts and relationships he has with others, but they are not real. They are not real because these people don't know him for who he really is. I am one of the few (besides him family) who knows him. His father is really desapointed in him, and he does not even know what I know(what he has done to me). But his father sees through him, tells H that he is a quiter. I am afraid his father is right. This is what others don't see.

It took me years to see that as well, and somewhere I knew I would be next that he would dump me as he dumped so many things in his life. He is inteligent, so he has a way of saying everything, so eleguantly, that he makes whatever he things about doing so profound and people listen to him and find what he says really interesting, and a lot of it is, but a lot of it is BS if you just stop to really listen, and at the end of the day, he is all words and no action.

He does everything and is able to accomplish things as long as it is easy, but once it is just slightly more chalanging he gives up. My friend use to say, accomplishing something in life has less to do with inteligence and more so to do with "just doing it" and she was right. It does not matter how smart you are if you do not motivate yourself. Sometimes you do things, because it has to be done.....you don't wait till you feel like.

It frastrates and hurts me to watch him and listen to him, so I am glad to be removed from that. I wanted more for him. He saw me as unsupportive. I tried to explain to him that jumping from one thing to another was not the solution, because everythign would require work. He was convinced that the reason he did not do well in whatever he did was because he did not enjoy it enough, that if he enjoyed something more that he would do well in it. But the fact was that if you listen to him really carefully through all the fancy shmancy words, it came down to doing what he deemed easier not more enjoyable.....

I saw through it with time and so I was no longer the one to be included in the discussions of what he would or would not do with his life. He stopped talking to me, because I tried to be supportive and realistic at the same time. He runs from one thing to anther, try this and that, and never settles because he soon figures out that it is work to do any of it, so instead of doing the work, he moves to the next thing in hopes that it is less work.

Once in a while he is honest with himself (like when he told that girl that "I am unmotivated to learn new skills"). But he continues to live in the dream world of "I'll do it if and when I feel like".....And if nothing else, he has the depression, so that is the reason he cannot do well.

But, he cannot even let the professionals take care of this. He begins to feel better so he gets of the medication. Why? Because he must not need it because he feels better, instead of thinking that the meds might be the reason he feels better and continue to take them. Then, in less than a month he is in a bad shape again, and goes back on the meds, but they don't work fast enought, so he ups the dosage. I watched from the side lines and had no say in it, because what would I know about it, I am not in his shoes.

And so it would go, on and on in a cycle. On and off with the meds, and then he would complain to the doctor that the meds are not working....when he really did not give them a chance.

He needs all the sleep he can get. He knows he feels like sh*t when he does not get enough sleep, he even takes meds for that, and so what does he do? He goes and asks to work odd hours at work 7-3am. Why? No particular reason, they have other shifts, but he specifically switches to have this odd shift every other day along with regular shift other days. Does it make any sense? No. If you have trouble sleeping, take pills, and know you cannot function without regular sleep, why would you work strange hours that throuws your whole sleeping schedule out of whack?

If he at least took all night shifts, but it is a mix and match. And the result. He feels like sh*t, and complains that he does not get good sleep, but does he change the shift, no, because the tips are better (maybe by 10$) over night. So he has insomnia instead. It is worth 10$. How sad.

Ok, I am done....I am beginning to feel that love is the most irrational thing in the universe, because as much as he is not good for me, and he does not want me, and he resented me and disliked me and probably even hated being with me on so many days, since he could not do anything with me, and at times could not even stand the sound of my voice, I love that man.

With all his flaws, I tried to accept him and tried to work with him through it all, he could not accept my flaws. I am not inosent in this. I am a stupid perfectionist. I am all about doing stuff, no matter how hard. We were clearly not a match. But I did not want a copy of myself. I wanted him to change and that was the biggest LB ever. He wanted me to change and that was a big LB as well. He wanted me to be more social, he even set up "social-date" for me. I wanted him to be more active, he just slept all the time or watched TV, and I thought it might be good for the depression to be outside and take walks....turned out he wanted the walks, just not me on them. Yes, I did pressure him about his studies, and I hate that I did that.

I feel angry, because after all he did to me, the affair, dating, the accusations of my dishonesty, the taking advantage of me sexually and financially, I forgive him and I want to give us another chance, and he will not. I did not do anything to him, but try to be the best wife I could be. Damit, I tried. I really tried. I faled miserably, I could have done so much better. But at the end of the day my failures where not intentional, and I never did anything with the intetion to cause pain, everything I did was with the best intentions. I went about things the wrong way, I get it, but don't I deserve another chance?<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/teary.gif" alt="" />

Daisy

just bumping myself along here...... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Daisy <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

I'm not sure what's up with you.

Are you just venting...complaining?

Do you want to work on your marriage since you still love your H?

Do you want help with working on a PLAN?

Not sure where you are going with this...

I understand that maybe you are not sure either...

I know for sure that it won't be helpful for you to sit around and wait for HIM to see the light....

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Just saw your other post...

I think it's time to work on your PERSONAL RECOVERY...

WHY NO PASSION?????

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

mimi.....

you make me laugh <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />! I am going dancing tomorrow night, signed up for this salsa course, so maybe that will turn into a new passion <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />!

Enjoy!
Daisy <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Hi Daisy,

Salsa, good for you! I took a class many years ago, and it was fun. I keep hearing exercise is one of the best thing to do when you are depressed. I don't think you are depressed like your H, but of course none of things we are going through are fun, and we do get low from times to time. I signed DS3 up for a Karate class, but this is a "Parent n' Tot" class, so I get to learn some basic Karate moves as well! I am enjoying it more than DS3 so far... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

How was your weekend? The more I read your post, the more I am convinced your H is just like my STBXH in that they are running away from their own shadows. They are unmotivated, and yet have a big pride so they hate being like that, so they always feel inadequate or failure.

I understand all of your struggling in thinking. You feel your H is not the kind of man you want or you married, yet you still love him. But he does not want to work on M. So why can't I just move on? But I still have all of these feelings for him...., then why not work on it? Because my WH does not want to! What should I do? And it goes on and on...., it is extremely frustrating.

The difference btw yours and mine is that your H may never file for D... So in a sense, it might make things even harder for you. Because you want to stay M, but H needs to change a lot of his behaviors. But he is not even interested in M! So you feel you can't really do much. Then if you file, you would feel guilty because that is not truly what you want. I did have the dillenma shortly after STBXH moved out - people suggested that I filed for D or legal separation, but I was too afraid to do so. Also because that is not what I wanted, I really could not do it. Then STBXH filed, which was extremely hard and sad, yet in a way, now I feel "he filed, I tried to save our M, but I really do not have whole a lot of options here, and I just need to move forward with my life as positive as possible".

Of course I still have many ups and downs, but strangely in a way I am functioning much better now. I see some of that in you too, but because nothing has been filed yet while your H continues to do whatever he feels like, you probably feel that you are in a limbo, and that is hard.

Hugs Daisy, and ENJOY your dancing tomorrow night!
Milk

Ahhhh! Don't you just hate this! I go around around in this circle........I am dizzy!


I really wanted to come out of this situation respecting H. I wanted to part still caring for him and being friends. But the more info I found out the more I gut ticked off. I think had I found out as it happened I would have been able to forgive and still fight for him. But finding out months later is worse. I had myself convinced he was a man of character and I tried to convince everyone who even suggested that there might be someone else that that was not the case, that H was a stand up guy, that he did right by me.....well, now I know what was up and I know he used me and manipulated me. And the fact that he still has the nerve to tell me he has always been open and caring towards me convinces me that I did the right thing, cuting contact. His continued deceipt, lies and manipulation are too much for me to handle. He wants to be friends with me without telling me the truth about what was going on at a time we were working on our M....I don't care what anyone says, I deserve to know the truth....even though we were seperated, we were still going to MC, and he had me convinced he was working on it with me, damit he even suggested moving back in in mid Aug....ahhhhh......so he wants me to build this "friedship" on lies and deceipt......

And he wants me to feel quilty now on top of it because I am not "playing fair" and rolling over..........


I know that the man I love is the man who asked me to marry him the day after valentines day 4 years ago (this week will suck with all the memories)......the man that married me, the man that wanted to have children with me......not this guy. This guy is the WS, and I don't love him, I don't really even like him, I love and like the man I married who has not been around for a while......not being friends with the WS is not a great loss...........

Daisy <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

It was some week. But I have to say that I am feeling quite good, given everything. Had some tough days, cried ~ got it out of the system, stared in space for many hours reflecting, talked to myself a lot (shared my thoughts with the cats if you will <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />) but not once did I regret standing up for myself, not once did I think I made a mistake. I have not questioned my decision at all.


I figure, days will past by and soon it will be weeks, and soon months, and the pain will slowly go away, and the love I felt will go with it. I don't hate H at all, he has many good qualitities, but the one that matters to me, his unwillingness to work on "us" is the one that I focus on. This is ultimately the one that matters to my life.


I went out downtown on Saturday, but it was hard. For some reason I kept my eye out, thinking I could see H with his "girlfriend" at any moment holding hands, kissing, having a good time <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />.... I got to get that picture out of my head, so I can enjoy myself when I am out.

I am at work now, and it does suck to know that I can run into him even at the elevator, or just going to get lunch. I wish he would pack his stuff and go to Mexico, like he planned to <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />. I would not have to think about seeing him. I do wonder if he thinks he will get away with not filling if he leaves. I wonder how it will work if he does leave for Mexico without telling me anything, what will I be able to do regarding filling for D. I guess there are still some months before I have to think about it. In my email I did let him know that I would sign the papers whenever he liked. It was primarly to let him know that I have no intention of filling, and it was going to be him doing it. I know this person, he thinks I will take care of it, well no <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />!


We'll see how this week goes. I got some stuff that I am doing tomorrow, so I should be able to get through valentine's day without a problem. Wednesday will be harder. I am one of these silly women that keeps track of memoriable occasions, and H asked me to marry him on the 15th 4 years ago. Wow, cannot believe it was just 4 years ago, it feels so much longer. I really feel like I have known him for such a long time... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />..

Daisy <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

I just came back from my first salsa class <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />. I had such a good time <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />! I ended up being left without a partner, so danced with the instructor......I had so much fun <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />!

One hour of not thinking about H at all, what a life! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

Daisy <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Keep it up Daisy!

Milk....thanks. I really had fun. I never realized it could be so much fun.....


I got more immigration papers and they want some documents ASAP. I'll swing by H's place today and drop it off. I hope I don't run into him....

I thought about his "it feels like you want to punish me statement". If I wanted to do that I could by canceling his immigration application. But, unlike him, I still have his best interest at heart! Not that he did one iota (sp?) to get that application through nor did he pay once cent. He will have this great benefit without any work on his part what so ever, it is all because of me. It kind of ticks me off, that when I did ask him once to help me by calling a lawyer, he told me to call myself. What a jerk. He did not help me, he does not even get that if I was as selfish as he is, that I would cancle the application.....yet he tells me I am punishing him. Wow.

Daisy

I guess last night went ok.....but thoughts of H and his "lover" being together and enjoying themselves did get to me.

Today is another trigger. I do wonder if H even remembers that he asked me to marry him 4 years ago <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />. For some reason I doubt it, he had trouble remembering that when we were together, why would he remember now.....

His stupid "feels like you want to punish me" statement keeps going through my mind. Why would he say that? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> Why try to make me feel quilty? Was he trying to get me to feel sorry for him enough so that I would speak to him? It just bugs me so much that he is so dam selfish <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />......me cuting him out of my life so that I don't have to expose myself to him and his lover is me punishing him <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />. Ahhhh...

Daisy <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

"He will have this great benefit without any work on his part what so ever, it is all because of me."

Is this how it was in your marriage before all of this happened?

Daisy, your WH isn't an American citizen???? If not, what country is he from?

Lady