Cherished, how have things been going for you, lately?

Bump.

Jennifer68,

Things are going OK. I think Tom lobbed a grenade at my love bank last month with how he treated me regarding my father's heart surgery. My parents live in NJ, we live in Minneapolis, they were coming out to the Mayo Clinic in Rochester for his heart surgery, and they asked that I bring the kids two miles away to have a pizza dinner with them before they went to Rochester. Tom thought that, if I got to do that, then he should take the kids to visit his family for several days. Anyway, I thought his approach was heartless and that's why I gave the ultimatum of spend 15 hours per week with me alone or move out.

I track hours Monday to Sunday. In the last week, we spent 15.5 hours together. He's stopped trying to convince me that the hours are too great or I'm being too stringent in what I count. We had about 1 minute of unpleasant time together when Tom felt bullied and told me. We mostly had neutral time, doing things like looking at how to track his business expenses and watching movies, and we had two times of having sex (for the first time in about a month) that were quite a bit better than neutral.

I look at willingtowait2's thread and think that's where I could be in a few years, with a husband who so clearly doesn't care about her and she's off trying to figure out if he's having an affair. The affair is a symptom of a lack of care. The problem is a lack of care.

The nice thing about my ultimatum, too, is that I know whether or not he's doing it. With an affair, do you ever really know?

In truth, though, it's just too early to tell. This is a "Hail Mary" pass, and the ball is in the air.


Cherished

Well, I hope this is working for you. You've been in my thoughts.

Take Care...

Jennifer68

I'm going to take a break from MarriageBuilders until May. Tom seems to have accepted that I mean it when I say that 15 hours per week is a condition of our living together. Also, if indeed my dramatic weight gain came from giving up exercising, then I'll need to add in that exercise time to my day as well. It's just so exhausting to face the reality that trying to follow the POJA without having time together did not work at all but instead led to heartless disregard by my husband. I simply couldn't take it anymore. The question I had on emotional divorce and the responses I got here really helped me to realize that I could no longer cope with a marriage of neglect. I had to either end the marriage immediately or give an ultimatum. I gave an ultimatum and now it will take time to see what effect our actually spending time together alone will have on our relationship. I have a plan and now I'll execute it and see what comes of it and let you know in May. Thanks for your support.

LM, I think people can change. What it takes to change, however, is a change in behavior. I will no longer settle for stalling. Tom is willing to spend 15 hours per week with me. Maybe, just maybe, he can be the husband I need and he'll let me be the wife he needs.

Cherished

Good Luck and God Bless You! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> I truly hope that it works for you.

Hi Cherished,

I absolutely know the position you are in and a little of what you are going thru. I don't know if you remember my post from a few days ago.(the abuse poll)

I am in a very similar situation w/my H. Substance abuser,
abusive behavior, former EA.

In the incident I posted about the other day, I very calmly told him that there would be no alcohol in our home any more period. I still have my bags packed and I have definitely hit my own "bottom". I am not afraid of him at the moment as there has been absolutely no drinking since. He is remorseful, extremely remorseful, which is ok but I don't buy into it. He will not consider counseling or AA or any other type of program. He says that every one has their own method of recovery. His is just to quit the alcohol. He will have to prove me wrong but this approach to me is pure Bull----! He says that if he has a problem on his own, then he will seek help. I gave my own ultimatum: There won't be a next time of any kind of physical encounter as there will be no more alcohol. Period.... If there is alcohol, program or not, my bags are packed and will stay packed and I AM OUTIE OUTIE OUTIE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! He knows this as I have in no uncertain terms told him.

Here is what I intend to do: (1) I will go to Al Anon meetings regularly. (2) I will take care of myself and focus on myself (3) I will give him the support he needs but HE MUST TAKE CARE OF HIMSELF!!!! I WILL NO LONGER DO IT FOR HIM, I DON'T CARE IF WE LOOSE THIS BUSINESS!!! (4) I am now in the process of developing a plan to care for myself financially to the best of my ability. (5) I WILL TAKE NO MORE ABUSE, PHYSICALLY, EMOTIONALLY OR VERBALLY IN NO SHAPE OR FORM. And I have told him that too. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> Whether or not I have all my ducks in a row, if the agreement is broken, I AM GONE. I can pick up the pieces on my own.

I think you have to really reach a "bottom" of your own before you really mean what you say. I have told him I am at my bottom, and if he does not believe it he will if the agreement is broken.....Bags are packed, things are in order. I AM SOOOOOOO READY TO GO!!!!!!

Hugs and Blessings,
Tare

Well, Cherished....I honestly don't know what to say that will not seem heartless or cruel or "not supportive" to you here. I agree people can change. They can. I will leave it at that.

You already know what my thoughts are on Tom and his desire to change and be the man you and your chuldren need him to be. Not a thing in any of your posts has caused me to re-think that opinion.

Logging the 15 hours in your case (with your WH's history and ongoing abouse of you and the children) is akin to me choosing to worry about someone's suspicious mole on their back while they are dissecting their aorta.

That's how I see it.

I would not have rendered any opinion, but you mentioned me in your post above, so I assume you wanted a response. I honestly don't have my "hopes" and prayers" hinged on you being the wife that Tom needs....nope, all of those "HOPES" are directed towards your children in that they get the MOM they "NEED"

We'll see you in May.

God bless you and your children.

Lemonman <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

LM --
I read your post and then went and hugged my children good night. I'll make sure to be the Mom our precious children need.

Cherished

Good Luck and Best Wishes, Cherished! My prayers are with you!

Take Care...

Jennifer68

Cherished,

My thoughts and prayers are with you too. I wish we could be friends because you are such a sweat, loving person. I will miss reading your posts over the next few months as I wonder how you are doing but understand your need to focus.

Well, it took just a day or so for me to realize that I needed to stay on MB. I am following waiting's story and it is giving me the resolve to continue with the ultimatum. She accepted neglect (in her face disregard) hoping for him to change and instead what she seems to have gotten was infidelity (hidden disregard).

As of Monday, our rolling average of time together was 10.25. Since then, we have spent 4.75 hours, mostly talking on the phone because he is in San Francisco this week.

I really hate that I had to get to the point of making an ultimatum in order for him to spend time with me, but I see the alternative as what waiting has been doing. That's what she's been doing alright -- waiting -- and she waited with good intentions to get to a marriage that would be good. That's what I did for several years.

Last summer, Tom told me that he was waiting for me to settle down, to get over the affair. What he didn't realize is that I don't view his affair as "one mistake". What I see it as is the result of years of his neglect, which was in my face and which I accepted.

This isn't easy, but I see no other course than divorce. If he hadn't been willing to spend 15 hours with me, I would have filed. But now he is, and we'll see what comes of it.

Cherished

I'm glad you decided to keep posting. This is a support network and a good place to vent. We all need plenty of that.

Well, things are neutral to positive. I will keep posting. I had to get good and fed up with neglect.
Cherished

We now have a buffer of 7 hours, down from 10.25 hours last week because we only spent 11.50 hours. I told Tom I felt umcomfortable. He said the point of a buffer is it can vary. I said that it can vary but there's a difference between 0 and 10. He asked what. I said at 10 I feel uncomfortable and at 0 I boot you out.

He seems like Johnny Cash in the Walk the Line movie home with his family while in love with another woman. Not a lot of energy. I asked him what ideally he would like to do and he said retire.

I am exercising a lot and need to lose 30 pounds by the summer if we are to go to teh MBW. If we don't go, I think I'm done. I don't want to live with a miserably unhappy and lethargic man for the rest of my life.

Cherished

We finished the Disrespectful Judgements coursework for Harley's program. On Monday, I asked Tom why he seemed unhappy, and he said it was because I didn't trust in God. It had to do with my wanting to donate stock to the church's capital campaign at the start of the campaign rather than pledging an amount that we would donate at a future date. I am hanging onto 15 hours per week and just sticking it out until the summer MBW in Minneapolis. If we don't attend that, I'm done.

Cherished

Cherished,

My first husband and I had this same type of discussion. When there was a faith promice drive he would pledge large amounts that we could never meet and then do nothing to meet the pledge. I felt the burden on my shoulders to save more from our family budget or work more on the side to make up for his pledge. I saw this as irresponsible on his part. He truley thought God would send him the money in the mail if he just promised to give it. He felt like I didn't have enough faith either. I was the one taking care of the checkbook though. He couldn't keep it ballenced. Not because he couldn't add and subtract, but because he was plain irresponsible with money. Is there a way your H can make a pledge all of his own that will not have any empact on you. For example, can he pledge to give up something he spends money on now to pay for what he wants to give. That way it is more of a win-win solution.

reb123,
Well, we already agreed to and did donate $3,000 in stock. He said he'd like to make a pledge without making a donation and the amount wasn't the issue. What I have said is I'd like to give up coffee and donate $25 every month that I don't drink coffee. I'm down to 12 ounces. In this way, I am showing support in a very meaningful way. That's win-win for me because I feel better when I don't drink coffee. Also, I'm now exercising a lot to lose weight (5 times on the exercise bike for 30 minutes and 5 times walking 3.7 miles in 52 minutes every week) and somehow coffee never mixed with being active, so giving up coffee is win-win for me. Thanks for the feedback. He's dropped for the moment how I don't trust in God. We both are thrilled with the parish school, especially given the home environment. They are taught respect and responsibility there. I have no problem with donating to support the parish and school. My problem is only with making a pledge before making a donation because then we are morally committed to make a donation in the future and we don't know what the future holds.
Cherished

Our buffer is at 6 hours as of right now, but we hired a babysitter for all day this coming Saturday so we should be able to spend more than 15 hours this week. I'm up and down about whether this is worth a try, but I figure if it doesn't work out I'll just resort to divorce which is what I would have done had I not tried an ultimatum. He doesn't get the importance of meeting my emotional needs. He doesn't get that it can be enjoyable to meet my emotional needs. I'm hoping the MBW will accomplish that.

He gave the condition of my losing 30 pounds if he is to go to the MBW, so I have set up a program of exercising 30 minutes 10 times per week. I will not restrict food, since it seems that people who feel deprivation tend to react by binging. From what I have read, exercise can boost metabolism and temporarily serve as an appetite suppressent. I hope it works. I'll be busy the next few months exercising that much and spending 15 hours per week with Tom and taking care of four young children. What's nice, though, is that the house is calm. The children really sense it. It's only been since Christmas Day that we had our last blowup, but that is a long time for us.

Cherished

What unreasonable goals has he set for you?

What unreasonable goals have you set for him?

L.