I have been reading this thread and have a couple thoughts.
I really don't want to get involved because it makes me 'nervous' to write on this message board.

I liked what Owl posted to 2BNormal. And that is coming from a BH.

Again, why is it 2B's concern if OM has had a zillion affairs since her?

I read this on a different thread that once the affair is in the past, to use this as our mantra: "The OP is no longer my concern."

Maybe 2B's OM's wife DOES already know.
Is it 2B'S responsibility to barge into THEIR marriage with
this information?

ML, is that what you think she should do?

I could be wrong...like I said, I am the FORMER cheating wife (an on line affair) so my opinion would LOOK DIFFERENT than that of a BS.

There was a message here about if a granddaughter found some
information that Grandma had an affair 40 years previous, should she she tell Grandpa. She was told YES.

My Goodness, what would would be the point in that? Ever hear: "Let dead dogs lie".

I also liked Bob Pure's reply, that once his wife was repentant, it is better the less people that knew (including their children) so they could move on and have a wonderful marriage for the remainder of their lives.

By the way, 2BNormal, I am so proud of you and look up to
you as being a fine lady that has got back on track in your life and in your marriage.

But it is not a dead dog, as you say. It is still alive and well as long as the other BS does not know. She has already barged into their marriage by having an affair with her H, the victim BS just does not know it. It is not the exposure that is harmful, but the AFFAIR.

Can you imagine refusing to tell a neighbor that his bookkeeper had embezzled money frm him using the same rationalizations? {"it will hurt him" - "Let dead dogs lie".] Those rationalizations would not pass the laugh test in the case of embezzlement. The premise is exactly the same here, but for some reason some folks treat it entirely differently.


That statement doesn't apply to this situation. We are talking about the BS.

Let me assure you BobPure NEVER EVER meant the OP's spouse. He was speaking of widespread exposure. I helped him in his exposure strategy and know he firmly believes in exposure to the OP's spouse.

I could not rest for fear of NC violation if I had not exposed to OM GF.


One of the things in my life I am proudest of. I saved two relationships in doing that.

ML -
I had another thought. You had mentioned in reply to ItWon'tRainAlways that I had barged into this OM's wife's marriage. The truth is this man barged into my marriage and sought me out after 24 years. I met this man when I was a teenager and he searched for me and barged into my life and marriage after 24 years! Yes, I was wrong with responding to him and getting involved in the affair, but...he barged into my life. Not an excuse for what I did...just stating facts.

Anyways...that is not my point here. My point in all of this is this:
Is the OM's wife to be ABOVE my husband on this??? At all costs???

Should I really be elevating the OM's wife's feelings and what "she should know" over my husband's feelings? Is this really what Harley is saying in his statement? And if so, why would he suggest that we do something against our spouse's wishes and further cause mistrust against our spouse?

These are real questions I have. I'm really seeking to do what's right for all parties involved.

Still another thought...

This OM has pictures of me and a letter from me that I do want DESTROYED! This has been bothering me for a good while to know that these things still exist and could possibly come back to haunt me in the future if the OM's W would ever find them.

If I EVER called this woman, would it be advisable to tell her of these things? He would deny they exist and lie..lie..lie!

first off, you DID barge into this woman's life by having an affair with her husband. That is a FACT. It doesn't matter who sought whom out, no one forced you to have an affair with her H. It takes TWO to have an affair.

Secondly, the OMW has a RIGHT to know and you have an obligation to tell her what you have done. Her RIGHT TO KNOW is not superceded by any "feelings" that your H has. Doing the right thing is never up for POJA. What if you found out your H was molesting your D. Would you not report him to the police unless it was POJA'd?

Notifying the OMW is not an untrustworthy act that will cause "mistrust." There is nothing untrustworthy about it. Not agreeing with him is not the same as being "untrustworthy."

2BNormal, just don't do it. It is no sweat off my back. You don't need my approval or anyone elses here. [you will never get that] Just don't do it if you don't want to do it. No big deal.

ML -
I wasn't seeking anyone's "approval" for NOT informing the OM's W. I had real questions that I wanted advice from anyone who may have experienced this. I can make my own decisions based on what *I* feel is right for *my marriage* and what I feel that would respect *my husband*. My concern at this point after having 2 affairs is to respect my husband's feelings and wishes. I plan on discussing this again with my husband, but there have been some issues that occurred recently in which I feel this is not the right time. At this time, I am just gathering thoughts and information from those that have experienced a lapse of time and chose to tell the OP's spouse.

I happen to disagree with you regarding doing something against my husband's wishes. But, we CAN disagree. I'm OK with that. You aren't in my situation to completely understand everything that has gone on in my marriage over the past 2+ years since this has been going on.

I would have to read up more on POJA to understand it fully. My husband has not been involved on this site to understand what POJA is. I do appreciate your input and will be taking all that has been said into consideration. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Good deal, 2BNormal. That's all you can do is take it under consideration. You are the one who has to live with the lady in the mirror, after all. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Ya can't expect others to approve, though. Just know while you are reading up on POJA, that the INVENTOR of POJA recommends exposure to the SPOUSES no matter what. Any exposures after that should be POJA'd according to Dr. Bill Harley. I suspect you are the kind of person that will do the right thing. Otherwise you wouldn't be on here asking. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Since the topic HAS been brought up:




Ahhhh,
but there's the Rub isn't it??

If NO Secrets,
there's IS no pressure or havoc To Be Had (as there is NOTHING to hang over anyone's head).
Makes sense to me.

Keep in mind that the only Power, comes in Your agreeing to keep the Secret.

But your doubts are normal and I'd dare say experienced by all .......even if they are fueled by FEAR.
Truly Every person that has ever exposed at any level or Point in time has Had Fears of one kind or another.



Interesting View.

So at your house:
there was NO stress, tension, arguments, crying, Looks or any other Undo and (from the kids perspective) Unexplained Negativity for your kids to have had to first witness & then have to Make up reasons to try & explain it, For themselves???

{And then sadly as MOST teenagers do --- probably Incorrectly misinterpret these things as somehow being about "them" and then Internalizing them, even though NONE of it had Anything to do with them}.

Well,
if you managed that and your kids had NOTHING to pick up on and then as a result of being in the dark, incorrectly come to off based conclusions ......you've got 99.987% of the rest of us beat hands down.
Unfortunately for all, I doubt it really went down that way.

Now Keep in mind this is just discussion.
As with ML,
your going to Do or not do as you see fit.
No problem.

Its just Your questions and situation are helping me to see why Dr. Harley's advice on the matter are represented as they are.

Cause my approach has always been that the 4 people involved [If Both are M] SHOULD at the very minimum be Informed.
This thread is having me take a look at that view... & maybe more Should be included. (???)

The only thing I'll state about the OMW or not is this:
I've read more than once from BS's that the reason THEY (themself) are NOT going to tell the OPS, is that it should be the Responsibility of the WS to do that (with of course the WS refusing).
However,
Here we have the opposite situation, YET the results remain the same.
Not really surprised, but kind of disappointing nonetheless.

In addition,
I also find it kind of Interesting that persons can jump all over one concept (in this case POJA) ....yet totally disregard others [That are coming from the Same person/system] on the same subject.
Makes ya shake your head for sure sometimes.

Well,
Whatever you decide 2Be
wishing ya success with it. Thanks for getting me thinking.

ML - I really do appreciate all that you are saying. I need to read up on POJA as I said. BTW, my H and I haven't discussed informing this OM's W in quite some time. We have had so much to deal with concerning the A that happened after this first OM. These are my own thoughts and concerns to doing what is right even though some time has passed. He has put alot of this behind him and most likely hasn't given it another thought. When I mentioned to my H in the past about telling the OM's W, my H felt I wanted to do so to get back at the OM. That was his viewpoint anyway and it could have very well been how I felt at the time. Now, I want to make sure that my motives are right in doing so.

After I read through POJA some more and read more here about exposing to the OP's spouse, I'll have some more information to share with my H about why it should be done. In the past when I mentioned this I was still in quite a mess in my emotional state of being.

It still burns in my mind that the OM told me to just let him have his "W"...after it ended. He knew my H knew what happened BUT he didn't want to disrupt his LIFE! My H knew this at the time, BUT still felt we should not tell his W. I was an emotional mess at the time as I stated in my above post and just did what my H thought was best. MUCH has happpened since this conversation with this first OM...and much has gone on to try to heal our marriage. BUT that secret remains that the OM's W does NOT know.

The thing is...THIS will bother me much more than it will bother my husband.


Sure there was some stress and tension which is all behind us now. My husband was VERY good at PROTECTING me through it all. When we had issues, these issues happened behind "closed doors". He would NOT let on with our daughters what was happening. They NEVER questioned him.

Thanks for your input.

Can someone please point me in the right direction on this site where the article on 'exposure' is? I'm having trouble locating it! Thanks. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Dear friend, 2BNormal.

I wish Bob would post what his thoughts on what you should do about telling BW after years have passed. He is quite wise like OWL. (I think OWL already gave his thoughts on exposure after time has passed.)

It still seems that your CONCERN should be with your own family and not OM's wife. But what do I know? (Not much.)

So, 2B, if it is really bothering you that his wife doesn't know about his affair with you and your intentions are ONLY to help in their marriage, would it be possible for you (your H) to contact him FIRST and give HIM the chance to tell her?

Somehow, I feel it would sure be best coming from him.
This may DESTROY their marriage; it would NOT be on your shoulders but his. (The consequences of his affair catching up with him.)

Now I don't know if it is suggested this way from HARLEY but my way of looking at things is to put yourself in their shoes.

So, let's say your husband had an affair 2 years ago, it is over and there is NO contact. His OW feels you should know. Should SHE tell you or should it be your husband that tells you?

If your answer is you would want HER to be the one to tell you then I guess go from there. If not, give her husband a chance to fess up. (Since you should not be contacting him, it should be YOUR husband that gives him this call.)

P.S. Just my humble opinion here; like I said I don't know what Harley says about who should do the telling after years have passed.

Killer Post Top Rope. Killer Post.

I too, am amused that Dr Harley talks about a narrow road to recovery and yet people here still like to slice and dice the principles and adapt them to something that suits them. Particularly regarding exposure.

bigkahuna,
Is this what you think I'm doing???? Slicing and Dicing???
You don't know my story anymore than I know your story, so I don't think it's fair for you to cut up what I'm trying to learn and ask here. Every situation is not a "cookie cutter" situation where the answer is always so clear. I have been sincere in what I am asking and have even asked to be pointed to the article about exposure which I still don't know where that is. My H has NEVER been on this site and chooses NOT to be, so this is what I'm dealing with OK?

Do you know that I had no clue about EXOSURE to the OM's W was necessary after that affair ended??? I am now just dealing with this after 2 years have gone by.

As ItWon'tRainAlways said...I really would like to hear from someone who has exposed to the OP's spouse after some time has passed by.

Also, does Dr. Harley recommend telling the OP's Spouse after time has lapsed...such as 2 years in my situation.

Please show me where the article is on exposure....thank you!

2BNormal, here is a pretty good article that outlines his general principle on exposure to the victim spouse. http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5060_qa.html

I will just tell you that I spoke to him MYSELF [Dr. Bill Harley] on the radio this week and he believes that exposure to BOTH SPOUSES should always take place, no matter how long after the affair. This is NOT a matter of POJA, but a moral obligation.

But even if he didn't, simple common sense should dictate that it is the decent thing to do, as a decent, caring human being.[which I know you are] This woman has a right to know the facts about her own life and they have likely been wrongly withheld from her. She could easily have contracted an STD from her H and would have no idea to even check for it.

It would be an act of KINDNESS to tell her. It is CRUEL to allow this woman to go through life not knowing pertinent facts about her own life. It would also give you a chance to apologize and make amends to her, a soul cleansing act that would benefit you personally.

How about if the secret A was over several years ago, then FMOM and his wife divorced just recently for a different reason is it still necessary to inform the wife about the past A?

No 2B it was just a general comment - not aimed at you.