wiftty,
you've intrigued me. This forum wasn't around when I was dating my xBF. We are still friends, and he is still in love with me, and I still wonder "what-if" one day down the road.

How often do you see your GF? We saw each other twice a week, and it just wasn't enough. I can't imagine doing that until his 15 yo is graduated. I didn't see any hope of them working through their issues anytime soon, and my lovebank drained from the stress. But we were so compatible in so many ways... thats why I wonder "what-if" one day.

Sooo... your perspective is intriguing... and I'm just wondering if we examined all angles before calling it quits. And anyway... if just out of curiosity... and trying to understand better... how often do you see each other? Where? How?

Faith1

well, faith1, its not very often, maybe once every 3-5 months, depending upon schedules, money, work, etc. . .

sometimes for a weekend, sometimes for a week, about 1/2 the time is traveling to far away places. . . like South Dakota, or South Florida, or her place, or my area of the world. . .

We are compatible on almost all levels, except for a very large difference in religious views. However, i can support her with her religion once a week, not a problem, and since i have none, its a non issue for me. She respects my lack of, and must see other qualities that allow her to accept a non believer.

I have told her that she is also free to date others since we will have to wait about another 5 years before we move closer together. . . and I don't want her to miss out on someone with the missing piece. . . so far, she has taken me up on the idea once, .. but nothing much happened. .. I myself actually have never asked another woman out since i met her.

I myself, make sure the kids come first, as the XW is a near nutjob. . .

ground rules for me are, if I am there visiting, and her kids have something to be seen, play, school open house, etc, i follow along and entertain myself, not a problem .. . if she is with me, and there is something that I need to see with my kids, she knows it ahead of time, and we go together. ..

the only expectation that i have of my kids are, that they say hi to her, and talk to her if she asks them any questions, meaning politeness to near family members. . . I have also told both her children and my children, that neither of us are forcing them to like the B/GF, just be respectful as long as the G/BF is respectful.
I told C's daughter explicitly that she didn't have to like me at all. .. just be respectful. . .

I was visiting once, and had to pick up her son at school, so because I am a foreigner, so to speak, when i went to pick up her son, i introduced myself to the head faculty member, explained who i was, and then asked where I might find him. We then went out to have lunch together. . . chatted a bit. .. and then went home. ..

I was visiting another time, and there was a large family emergency on her side, which required off site family meetings, and i offered to stay, stay and drive her and wait outside, leave, stay and hide, or whatever she needed. . . she requested that i stay for support, so i did. . . not a problem. . . did we see much of each other, no, i spent quite abit of alone time at her house. . did i object? no, not her fault, she had to do these meetings and events just random poor timing in the uncertain future. . .

she came with me on a business trip, sat most of the day while i did my thing, which took longer than it should, and at the end of the day, we had a long drive home. . boring for her, but then the next day, we went volksmarching to the top of a national monument. . . she was patient and understanding, and then she had fun and we visited a national park all day the next day. . .

She knows my ENs, recreational companionship, and SF. . . after that. . . just feed me and check my pulse. . . and I told her that I was looking for one major trait, the ability to travel, and sometimes travel very light and spontaneously. I won a free trip that she could have come with me to Scottsdale, Arizona, and another piece of bad timing, she could not attend due to family matters . . . not a problem. . . she had to do what she determined was required as a parent. . . and I support that and understand that, and certainly don't take it personally.

wiftty

Thank you wiftty. Good stuff to think about. I think you're giving a great perspective and reminder... that we all need a rich, full life as individuals... and our dating life, or spouse, is the icing on the cake.

I suppose, though, it is hard to find that balance, when you really love someone, and want to be around them, and share more of your life together. I guess, for example, if (as you say) your top EN's are recreational companionship and SF, can you stay in love with her for 5 years, when you can only get those needs met once every 3-5 months? HOw long have you been doing this already? This is not really off topic, since I and Lexxxy both seemed to have a hard time picturing a long-term (more than 2 years?) dating period.

we first met 5 years ago. . . . .

but our lives are so busy at the moment, trying to earn a living, and raise healthy children, that moving and mixing households hust doesn't make sense. . . and since i met her unexpectedly, and there were some nice little sparks. .

intellectually stimulating, very similar beliefs, right size and height, good sense of humor, right age, willing to be adventurous (agrees with man wasn't built to skydive or go scuba diving) as in travel, RVing, sailing, and i bet would be OK on a 42 foot motor yacht (when i win the lottery!) in retirement. . .

so instead of spending a lot of time dating, and I accidentally met her, meaning , i was sort of going to a party with someone else, and I met her when my date didn't quite make it. . . and she was willing to travel and see me, etc. . . and we had such a good time in fantasy land. . . we even made it through a two week vacation together, with our respective kids, in a 36 foot RV for two weeks, with the kids having never met each other before, in the mid west, where neither of us live. . .

hey, we can do just about anything together and conquer just about anything or anyone. . .

wiftty

you, Lexxy, AGG, are spouse hunting. . . dating with an end goal. . .

I am dating exclusively to have fun within a relationship, with the knowledge that i get to make a decision about marriage in the future, when the time is right. . if we make it that far, [color:"blue"] and the future is uncertain! [/color]

look at the odds. . . they get slimmer and slimmer as you get older. . . so i just happened to find someone who is just about right, is normal in my reality tv show, and so why force the marriage or the relationship, or give up the relationship just becuase the time isn't right?

will she drive me crazy at times? oh, i am sure. . . will she turn into this raving lunatic who goes off randomly in fits? i don't think so, but she might . . . and the difference is that i can leave her alone to be herself and entertain myself just fine without being clingy, taking her fit personally. ..

i have done enough psych reading and practicing on here, to be able to realize whose issue's are being discussed. . . if i am being pushy to her, she will tell me. .. and i stop, and we discuss later, and more than likely its a misunderstanding from our backgrounds. .. so just a misunderstanding is very easy to change attitudes about. . .

and if she is getting pushy with me, i can figure out a way to say it nicely, without getting all personal over it, it just might be her issues, not mine. . .

and i am not asking her to change. . not even her name. . . if we get married. . . its up to her. . .

but the most important element that i have told her, that I will always give her, and what i ask in return, [color:"blue"]is total honesty[/color]. . . and i don't yell or scream if i don't like the answer, we just kind of discuss it . . that's all. .. even if she disagrees with me which she is entitled to, even if we have different viewpoints, which we do, even if we vote differently. . . (we just will cancel each other out) its not the end of the world. . but i highly, highly doubt that she is going to run up $100,000 on a credit card, or loot the company where she works, or run off with a new 25 year younger boyfriend. . . the worst thing she will most likely do is to offend someone with an inappropriate comment once in a while. . . like i haven't?

wiftty

thank you wif <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> great perspectives! I'll have to turn this over in my brain a bit before I can respond with anything... but it makes perfect sense!!!

* * * UPDATE * * *

I really thought we had this resolved...sigh. Guess not.

A few things have come up recently.

First of all, moving. The brother he was living with sold his house. Not a huge deal, BF was not planning to live there much longer. It just speeded up his plans a bit. So he moved in with brother #2. However, brother #2 is moving at the end of this summer too. So BF is planning on finding an apartment or something at the end of this summer. So add a one year lease to that time frame, and we're talking at least a couple years before we could possibly live together.

And;
BF has made more than a few sarcastic comments about marriage. My brother is getting married in October, a cousin in August and some friends in June. Needless to say with all these weddings coming up we've had a few conversations about marriage.

Basically he's reversed what he told me originally. On our first few dates he told me that he figured he would eventually meet someone, everything would work out and he'd get married.

Now I'm hearing that "its just a piece of paper"...and that he doesn't see himself EVER getting married.

So of course I have to push the issue -- because I fully intend on getting married again, and not a million years from now.

So we talked further (again) about how its not about "me" but the fact that he doesn't want to live with teenagers.
(of which I have several, and the youngest is only 12 right now..)

Ok -- so if that is his position (and I am not one to tell him that it is wrong) then what I am supposed to do? I'm not changing mine, and I won't force him to change his.

So do we break up now?

He says I'm getting worried about things too far off in the future. He tends to think about today, and maybe tomorrow.
I definitely don't work like that. Maybe its because I'm a girl (?) maybe its because I have kids I have to plan for (?) maybe its just personality. But I definitely have plans for my future.

He also made a comment about how I have lots of time to "work" on him.
Ummmm, excuse me? I do not need to "work" to convince someone that I'm a good catch. Either you see that and act on it -- or you're gonna lose out on a good thing!

Ok....so how I see it right now is that we have a really great relationship that I am thinking about dismantling because of an event that may/may not happen in a few YEARS.

Which sounds ridiculous. However, I'm not happy about investing a few years to find out that I don't get what I want in the end. And I am miffed to be in the position of having to pursue him.

And he can't give me an answer of whether its an "absolutely not" or "maybe someday". I'm not keen on waiting around a few years to find out later its the first one....

I'm starting to feel like having kids the ages of mine are a big liability for dating. So maybe I'm crazy to think that anyone wants to jump into this situation. So if thats true maybe I should give up the idea that I'll get re-married. So if I give up that idea, then why would I give up this relationship?

circles......

So, which is more important?

Mothering well?
Having a hot date?

Plan to do the best you can for your children. They are yours first and foremost. And forever. They are your responsibility.

They are not the responsibility of any man out there - except for their father.

Plan to do what YOU can for them. That doesn't mean marrying a man with a large money roll or anything else just because it makes planning for them easier. They are YOUR concern.

Lexxy, if I were in your situation, I'd dump him now. But what do I know? LOL.

The way I see it, men who say "never, well, maybe some day, if you're the right one" are dangling that out there to keep a hold of you!

Also, I think this worry will start to eat into your relationship. I know it would mine.

Cinderella -- I've never asked for any man to "take responsibility" for my children. Including their father.
I've always -- by far -- been the more responsible parent.
I'm a little offended.
And someone's "bankroll" means absolutely nothing to me. I usually make double what any man in my life makes. Sometimes triple. But thanks for assuming that was what this was all about.


Green -- lol, I'd agree wholeheartedly if it weren't for the fact it was darn near impossible to even get this much out of him. "relationship talks" are not his thing. I'm not a big fan of them either...

no offense here...i have "dated" many women with kids....but....i would not want to marry someone with kids or get into a LTR with someone with kids....

sounds very selfish, but i have 2 of my own kids and WOULD NEVER want to put them through a feeling of lower priority than my sig. others kids if it ever got that far...

call it selfish...but WE all know, children are FOREVER...spouses are NOT!!

Lexxxy, it sounds like hes getting bored, i dont know everything about your sitch...but in reading the posts....you may want to cut your loses now, rather than later....

thats just my opinion!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

My take on it Lexxxy?

That he loves you, wants you in his life, but knows he doesn't want to parent teenagers, but also knows you are not interested in waiting around for 8 years, so, yes he's dangling this big 'ole carrot(s):

and this carrot:and.....

Giving you juuuust enough so that you don't immediately run for the hills.

Now to your question...what do you do?

What is your heart telling you? Your gut?

**quick thread-jack**

Sturg, women w/ no children in our age bracket are few and far between, so methinks you'll have to dip into the younger pool of women, which then leads to another problem...them wanting children of their own. Is that out of the question for you too?

Problem #1:



Problem #2:



Problem #3:



Problem #4:


I agree Lexxxy, this sounds weird. What's worse, it seems that he went back on some of the understandings you two had reached earlier (the idea of marriage, and living with your kids in the house), which is a bad sign. Now, to be fair, there is going back on an understanding (bad), and confusion due to an earlier misunderstanding (not so bad, G and I had that come up regarding the baby issue). So you should try to figure out if this is a misunderstanding or him going back on things.


Well, this sounds a bit like rationalizing <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />. You want to be married, and you have every right to want that, so don't make the mistake of saying "I might as well settle for a guy who doesn't want my kids, because no one else will either". I, for one, would be happy to date and marry a woman with kids (of course, to be fair, I have to say that because I have similar "baggage" <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> ). Still, there are plenty of guys out there who will marry a woman with kids, so don't start thinking of yourself as unmarriable <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />.

Remind me again, how old is your BF? How long has his longest relationship been? He seems a bit too much like a "single guy", KWIM?

AGG

i scored....its actually kinda funny story....im 42, my D satrted at 39, so during my early 40's i "played" around alot, dated girls in their 20's and such...just "flings"...

last year, i just "fell" into someone at the carwash, of all places...the next thing i know we are hittin 1 yr aniv next month....shes 36, NO kids, (unfortunatley had a med issue, and cant)....but i had the "V" surgery years ago so it was a non issue for me...

she adores my kids, so im very lucky!!!

so, i cant answer your question, with an example...all i know is where im at now, and the relationship im in...

i KNEW my other post was going to sound alittle selfish when i wrote it!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Ah so you did your dippin' already... why am I not surprised? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Well good for you Sturg that you found what you were looking for! Happy almost 1 year anni <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

**end quick thread jack**

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

ill take a 'seasoned" woman anyday!!!

too much DRAMA with the young ones!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />

Hehe, so why are you still practicing your pickup lines in Cabo? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

AGG

like a ninja.....you gotta keep your edge!!!

well sturg, I take that "seasoned women" thing as a compliment! congrats on the one year. And you "fell into" exactly what you were looking for. Isn't it strange how that can happen sometimes?? when you least expect it. And to hear you say that the "younger ones" are too much trouble and drama.. does my heart good too since I was traded in for a younger model not on just this occasion, but a few others. (which I find odd since no one thinks I am over 25, not even the kids I go to college with! I still get ID'd for crying out loud... oh, well, nother story!LOL)

anyway, back to the topic at hand. Lexxy, my take on this for me, my personal choice is this: I do not know that I would seriously date someone who did NOT have kids already. I feel (my opinion only so please don't bash me here) that a man will understand me and my children if he has children of his own. Someone who has never had kids does not get it. (maybe some do, this is just me)... I know my kids come first and are important to me, and I would expect the same from someone I might date who had kids. But like AGG said, you can love your kids and love someone else the same. you shouldn't have to choose. My sitch, I have two, twins, they are with me 95% of the time. They are not with their dad much and I may be going for full custody. They are part of the package. Does not mean I am not able to give 100% of myself to them and to someone else. I can. It's not like they would have to come on dates with me or anything! and they will be with their dad for some extended time frames when he has vaca's or something. But that has to be understood for who I am with. I am a family person. My children are young and will not meet someone I am with until I am SURE it is going to be a long term thing so as not to cause them confusion. So, if I date a guy who does not have kids how is he going to "get" how mine are such a huge part of my package?

I am not saying I would want to date a guy who had like 5 and they all lived with him or anything like that! But I think you get my gist. That is just my take. It works both ways too. I understand someone who has kids. Who may have to cancel because a little one is sick, or because he has to do something with them. When AGG says gf doesn't understand why he would want to attend childs sporting event on his off weekend, I having kids, to get what he is saying. I would go even if my ex had the kids. I would expect someone I was with to go even if their ex had the kids. You don't stop being a parent just because they are not with you for that weekend. But I digress here...

My point is that I, personally, would probably not date someone who did not have kids because I would want them to be able to comepletely "get me"...
And I am with you on the waiting 8 years. Geez! I am not getting any younger either. Mine won't be out of the house for another 10-12 years! I sure as h*ll am not going to wait that long to marry again or whatever! No way.

It is a tough one because in all other respects you really care about him. Good luck with this. I hope it all works out. mlhb