Hey, BTE...

I get to speak here, from care and experience...been in your shoes...remember? My oldest two sons are from diff fathers...never married to them, didn't have custody or a single legal document about them...

And I am here to ask you to own half your anger...your DH didn't do all of this to you...

You chose to have DD1...and DD2...with these men. Their relationships with those men are up to you until they are 18...what is best for them...to know who their bio dads are...they are living, breathing, changing, and unpredictable humans...you cannot control them. You have to own you made those critical two choices...to have children by other men, that will always be part of your children's lives in their heads at least...knowing DH isn't their real dad...

It's tough. It's what we did. Can't be undone. Being straight with these guys, saying this is what our daughter wants...what I want...what my family wants...what are you willing to do or not do...?

Half of the anger is that DH acted without informing, as EO said, that POJA...that here's what I really fear, believe I need to do...and MY INTENT is to be honorable.

Your DH is powerless, you understand. Nothing legally holds him to these girls...you leave and he doesn't even get visitation. He loves your daughters as his own...he IS their Dad...doing the daily loving, living and having relationships with them. He fears. He wants to do the right thing.

He didn't by not asking you what you thought about contacting this guy's mother. How angry are you about just that part...him not sharing with you before taking action? Just that part...not the ramifications or consequences to what you were thinking...

Get it in proportion, 'k? You did this...your creations and choices...and this may be the cataylst to get that acknowledgment (security) that you have secretly feared/craved for years...the unexpected result of his action may be of great benefit to you. He can't control the results and neither can you...that's part of what we set up when we made our choices...

Separate your own created pain (life long consequences for our choices to have children in this manner); and the pain of his recent choice...did it feel like betrayal, subterfuge, powerless, being ignored or dismissed? What? Get a handle on your real why...and own the rest.

He's learning as you are learning...he also made the choice to love where he has no control...and we all do...but when it comes to children, knowing you, his DW, have all the power...that is a fearsome place. Can feel uneven, unequal...it is a crazymaking place to be responsible for what you have no control over...for anyone, anytime...

LA

I told him I didn't like the idea of the letter. Then edited it for him, told him if he felt it had to be done go ahead and do it. That was on me, not stating my truth, standing up for what I felt was right. He also told me earlier that I will hear about everything I just told him again. He is sleeping, he worked last night.

I did talk to an attorney's office today. Found out some good information. I am going to file to terminate the bio-dads parental rights. If he doesn't fight it, it will cost aournd $2100. After that, we can do a name change without adoption, he wouldn't be able to fight it since parental rights had been terminated, and that means we could file it ourselves. It's only like $150 for filing fees and public record. The attorney charges $650 for it plus the other fees.

I can't keep living like this wondering if he is going to pop up today or not. Plus, if something was to happen to me, at this point he could come and take her. SHe has very vague memories of him, he would come, get her take her to Germany, with his wife their two kids and her son. I have to protect my baby.

LA, I will be back to reply more. I did just want to clarify that my youngest daughter who is a4 is my dh's bio daughter. Dh did send the letter with my knowledge. I wrote a bit more about that in my response to EO.

I need to step away for a few minutes and calm myself. Crying for two hours isnt' going to help anything, I will be back shortly.

You are right. I am more mad at myself than anything, although I took that anger out on my dh. I am mad that I got myself in this position. I love my dd7 dearly, wouldn't change that for the world. With that, I have to take her bio Dad.



My youngest daughter is my dh's bio Dad. It's my oldest daughter that has a different father. Even though he is not a part of her life, she does know he exists. I have pics of them together etc. she sees them every once in awhile, asks questions, we answer them honestly, gently, age appropriately. She also receives gifts every year from her bio-dads mom. She knows this is her grandma.



I have done this time and time again. He always shows what he's not going to do. He isn't going to pay child support, he isn't going to be a continous part of her life. He is only going to do it when he needs to. With this information, I have to make choices also.



He did tell me he was going to send the letter. I proofed it for him. I told him I didn't think it was a good idea, it would stir the pot. I sent mixed messages to him, I see that, I know that now. I said one thing and did another.



The baby he would see. The oldest of course he has no legal right to. We are trying to change that. Make plans, see that he will always be a part of her life. Right now, if something was to happen to me, her bio dad could come and take her, my dh, the only dad she has knows, risks never seeing her again.



It did feel like betrayl. It felt like my whole world was turned upside down again. Bio dad has been out of our lives for over two years now, completely, not even a phone call, and now here is, claiming he wants a relationship with our daughter, yet refusing to give me a home address for him. Scared is the thing I feel most. Scared of losing my baby. Scared that he may come and take her. Scared that she will be hurt like I was. I know I can't protect her from everything. I know I have to let her learn life lessons and be there for her. I just feel so bad that these lessons she has to learn at such a young age is because of me. Because of my choices, she hurts.

I have an appt with an attorney tomorrow and another next week. Weighing all of our options, deciding what will be best for everyone involved, especially dd7.

Hi BTE,

How are you feeling today? Any better? (please forgive the pun!)



Have you apologized to DH for this?

Have you shared your fear with him? I know you're scared. I can see why you're scared. Does he know? Or has he only heard about your anger?

Hugs, HTBH

BTE,

Defining your life, the perimeters, the necessary actions...best money you can spend, I promise. Best investment. You will feel much better as you do this...I know I did. Puts to rest a lot of what goes under our own radar...repeated uncertainty plays like a low hum, ignited my temper flares and poked my shame with a sharp stick, off and on, erratically...settling helped settle me.

You're not alone. You caught your mixed signals...how does your anger feel now towards H?

Towards yourself? Progressive steps really help my anger, lowers my fear and reduces old pain. I pray the same for you, BTE.

LA

I am feeling better in some ways, worse in others. Because my daughters father moved out of the country I may not be able to do much about it. I am meeting with another attorney later this week. I am angry that not only has he made the choice to not participate in her life, I have to spend thousands of dollars to ensure that he can't take her from me. Not that she isn't worth the money, just doesn't seem fair. He tries to blame me for him not being a part of her life. I wouldn't allow him to talk to her, I would tell him what she needed or wanted. If he really wanted to be a part of her life he would have gone to the court house and filed the paperwork for visitation, that would have meant he would have to pay child support. He always said if we couldn't agree on it without going to court then it was my fault, because he wasn't going to go the court route. Really someone that wants to have a reltionship huh... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />



I'm not sure I have came right out and apologized. I may have. It's all a blur. We have talked about it, he knows I'm scared now. Scared and angry and a bit intimidated.

I know once this is over, I will feel better, safer. Yet, I am scared, what if we lose, what if he wins, what if he gets visitiation. Will he actually visit, will he disappoint her again. What if we spend the last of our savings and it doesn't work. If we just let things be,he doesn't see her anyways. He doesn't send money, or gifts, doesn't call for her b-day, or x-mas or any other holiday. If we just let things be, can they just be? I don't know if it's the right time to rock the boat.

I am very shameful. Not that I had my daughter. I love her with all my heart. I know that she isn't possible without him in my life, so to say I wish I never knew him, would mean no her. Then I feel guilty, because I want her. I don't mean no her, just no him, and still her. I know she knows she has another Dad, but I don't think she understands what that means. I think she believes she came from my dh and I just like her sister. For that, I feel bad also. How do I explain to her, or do I, probably not yet, but one day, that I had planned on leaving her dad, we went to visit his family, I was going to come home without him, then I realized I was pregnant, so I made a choice to stay. I didn't want to stay with him, but I didn't want to be alone either. I thought a bad realtionship was better than being alone. I chose to stay. I stayed until I finished college, until I could support her and I alone, so that we would be ok.



I don't think I'm angry at him. I know he meant well. He wanted to be fair, to be honest, that's the type of man he is. Unfortunately, it doesn't work with everyone, some people take advantage of it. He meant no harm.



I am angry that I didn't do this sooner. Didn't make sure that he couldn't take her from me earlier in life. Not necessarily dh adopting her. BUt making sure I had legal custody of her. I feel shameful when I tell people that no I wasn't married when I had her, no, I never married her dad. I don't know why, because I don't think badly of other people who did the same thing. Why is it ok for other people to be less than perfect, but not me?

Ok, I keep posting. THoughts, ideas, throwing them out there. I have been working on my anger. Realizing, most of the time it's not anger. It comes out that way, I believe, because anger feels like power. I can't control things, so I get mad, as if that is really going to control it.

I have been yelling a lot. Especially at the girls. More my 4 year old than anything. She has been whiney and pretty intolerable lately. She isn't sleeping well at night again, waking up tired. Everything "hurts" again, too tight, itches. All the clothes she had no problem with wearing the first week of school, now hurt. She screams and yells, tries to rip them off. If she would just go to sleep at night it would help. I get so mad, I end up yelling. I think it's more frustration. I feel helpless, I don't know what else to do. I have decided to go back to the melatonin for a couple nights, see if that helps. She can't fall asleep at 1030 at night, get up at 615 and function all day. I can barely do it lol... Doesn't help that I have also been extremely tired.

BTE,

Learning real control from wishful control is a good place to deal with anger, fear and pain. We can cause ourselves a lot of pain from spending our time and energy on what we cannot really control, and wasting grieving time on wishing we could control...

What if some of what your DD4 is experiencing is being passed onto her through you? Your fear, anxiety, feeling uncertain, transmit, broadcasts...and this is the way she is picking up on it...seems like she was worse, earlier this year, as you were wrestling and struggling...and as you began to look inward, her sleeping improved...she just might be a great receiver...finely tuned into you.

Not saying your fault, here. Just in case you hear it that way. This is why I encourage you (heck, shove you) to understand your feelings, know them, and trace them to the beliefs they are coming from. You're worth it. You're human. We all broadcast...our children eat up our signals and then act out on them or act in...just like we did with our folks...and they did with their folks...

Getting you to the point you yell might be the one thing she feels she can control...cause in you...which soothes her, at the same time, hurting her. That's a twisted signal, very common...and with two kids, when one becomes a concern (in this case, not DD7's behavior, but parentage and security), the other sibling asserts...and I'm reading in Bradshaw's "Family Secrets" that children do this, mostly unconsciously, to contribute to the family...put the balance back in...by distracting (attracting attention), often to fix marital problems...folks can't fight with each other if they're are joining together to solve a kid problem...

Interesting.

I'm guessing. I know you know that. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Solving yourself...that's what I've been working on...knowing what feels like what and where it's coming from...just upping the awareness along with the acceptance. That's where we were going a long time ago in your thread...and now you've realized anger isn't all the time...something else which feels the same...

I mistook anger as pain...felt pain all the time (no power there...just the opposite)...could it be you're feeling pain as anger? Fear and pain are so close together...and as different a signal as sadness and rejection...just those two can feel amazingly similar to me.

Why do you punish your previous selves? You should have done it sooner...done it better...heck, not done it all...where's the acceptance, compassion and understanding for you doing the best you knew how back then...and doing better now, knowing more?

If you hear me say "you screwed up having a kid out of wedlock" then I'm sorry. I didn't say that. I said you made a choice...not good or bad...just a choice with long-term consequences for you, your husband and your children...and that I'm with you, living it...lived it...my H didn't adopt my kids for 11 years of marriage...I am in no way judging or bashing you. I still feel shame revealing I was an unwed mother...and it's been 22 years!

You sharing what you feel and think is tremendous, BTE. A compassionate gift to us and to yourself. Please know how complete and whole you really are...daring, strong and amazing? Please?

Telling my sons who their fathers were...well, God helped out there, because for my middle son, the father chose not to believe he had a son, but the father's mother decided to take us on as family, include all three boys as grandchildren, and so we have flourished with her added to our family...so she was middle son's gram...they knew about different dads involved...and she became my best friend.

Open to God providing you what you need when you need it most...this isn't BTE against the world...this is BTE apart of a world which isn't balanced or perfect, and doesn't need to be...you may not know from where or who will walk in...unless you barr the door with judgment, or fear of the future...which can really impede your present.

Extremely tired...physically? emotionally? spiritually? mentally? Nosey, ain't I!

I will guarantee, from my experience, that your DDs will be disappointed, let down; they will experience deep rejection, sadness, others will hurt them, and they will hurt deeply. You have human daughters. Respect these feelings they will have, do not attempt to protect them from them...they are fully capable of handling them, on their own...it's when your pain, fear and anger get into the mix and they carry a double burden, that they begin to believe they cannot handle what is only their own...'cuz we add to it...

And we do. You're not nuts or wrong, BTE. You're a Mom. You're a Wife. You're BTE...your true job is to be you...what your kids crave most...and doing that job authentically is full-time. Sharing who you are with them matters more than actions by bio-dads or courts...and sharing who you are, what you feel (fear), with your DH, is working on your marriage and yourself, simultaneously.

I know you're multi-tasking. I just know it.

(((BTE)))

LA

LA~ I will respond to your above post in a bit.

I'm having a bad day again, Mostly night. I'm frustrated with the girls and dh. Tired of them not picking up after themselves, can't walk in the playroom, can't walk in the girls bedroom without climbing over stuff. Dh called in sick last night, he hasn't been feeling well. He felt well enough to spend time on the computer, but couldn't fold the clothes on the couch. Left his soda and cup on the end table. I'm tired of cooking dinner, and the girls not eating. I don't clean anymore, because I'm tired of busting my butt to have a decent looking house when they don't seem to care.

Dh's friend S, the one I have talked about before. She is still calling his cell phone, not the house. She has been calling a lot lately. He said it's because she is nervous about a job interview, the different stages of it, so she calls him for advice. She has a husband,

me: why doesn't she call her husband when she is nervous
dh: because, I have been through it all before.

There's always a reason for her to call him, they work in the same field, he has more experience than her, she turns to him.

me: why she can't call our house.
dh: I don't know.

He has talked to her about it before.

dh: why am I catching the blunt of her calling me on my cell.
me: why are you choosing to be friends with someone that won't call the house, even though you have asked her to.
dh: Fine, I will tell her if she can't call the house then I won't speak to her. I only call her cell, I don'teven have her home phone number.

me: that doesn't seem weird to you?
dh: I don't even know if she has a home phone.
me: Does her husband know how much you talk?
dh: I don't know.

At that point, I was even more frustrated, told him I would talk to him later after I calm down.

Right now I feel completely unappreciated. I just spent two hours doing the girls hair. DD4 complained because it "hurts" now. No matter what I do they aren't happy. I'm at my wits end.

I want a break, I want to go somewhere for awhile, by myself. Just a couple of days.

I hear you, BTE...I remember...

If you made a commitment to yourself to not do anything that you would resent...what would your day look like?

Cups and toys were be left where the landed...

You would not walk into the playroom, even when the girls called you to come in to them...
They would have to come out.

You would not walk into their bedroom to say goodnight, tuck into bed...because that would be taking a sip of poison to your heart...and good mothers don't take poison...

It would mean not cooking dinner for anyone but yourself, unless they promise to share in it. It would mean eating the dinner in front of them, choosing between not creating resentment and seeing them decide, too late, that they wanted to share in it with you...

To not take the poison, you would not have done their hair...and told them why...been honest and shared your thoughts and feelings, only pertaining to them, to your relationship individually...

It would mean taking any judgment from others for not doing their hair, rather than taking poison...

It would mean accepting that children do not care about how houses look, only how they feel to live and play in them...be a family in them. It would mean accepting that you do care, knowing why, and only acting on that knowledge to do stuff...not for the family, for them, but for you...no poison there...

And it would mean not asking DH to do something you can do...track down his friend, call her husband, share the amount of time they have spent on the phone together...only that...and your concern...because you are defending a boundary within your marriage...

And knowing that feeling physically sick is eased with distraction, not chores...distracting from discomfort...good to know about DH...maybe you do that, also...maybe not. Maybe you take both barrels and get through sickness in your own way. Neither is right wrong...both is what it is...good to know.

Maybe you can consider not asking any question with the word "why" for one week...to anyone. Stating what you are feeling, thinking and believing is imperative...

"I feel fearful of her calling you for support, which is intimate. I am triggering to your affair with each call you take. There are other men available in your same field. I believe our marriage is vulnerable and this is a risk you are choosing to take."

Best not to state when sick...either of you.

To choose not to act when you will resent is being honest with yourself...choosing to state your truth is being honest with others and yourself. It will not make you a bad mother, a lazy wife or a careless adult. It will be you being authentically yourself, choosing to live in truth and know what matters most and exampling it through your choice of actions.

You didn't mention the PIA puppy.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

With each post you write, I appreciate you. I am privileged to know your thoughts and feelings...and I know others are, as well.

Take the break, BTE...break the patterns you have locked yourself into...taking a break and coming back to the same patterns builds resentment, anger, frustration and pain.

Your choice.

LA

Perhaps, but then it's just another thing that leads me to feeling like a failure. I nursed her for 14 months and she co-slept, still does sometimes lol. I'm sure she is pretty tuned into me. She is one of those kids that when she is in trouble she wants lots of love and kisses. Her allergies have been bothering her a lot lately also. Hadn't been a problem since her surgery in Feb. last couple of weeks have been really bad for her.



I have a feeling if I sat here and allowed myself to feel what I'm feeling. I would just cry and cry and cry some more. heck, I'm crying now. I feel like a dog chasing it's tail, in circles over and over again.



I feel all kinds of things. Tonight, after I did dd4's hair and wrapped it, she went to bed. I walked in and she took it off, which means frizzy hair. I threatened to cut her braids off. I feel used, I spend my time doing her hair for her to ruin it. Why even bother anymore. I normally don't do her hair, but she begged me to. Normally I just comb it and let it be. But, she wanted it done tonight so she could have barettes in it tomorrow.




I think it comes from the fact that I even knew better than. I wouldn't stand up for myself, no boundaries, wanting to be accepted. I did things that prevent me now from jobs that I used to dream about. This prevents me from helping dh out so he can pursue the career he wants, more self hatred. Can't find a job here that pays more than $8 an hour. I can't live off of that. Doesn't pay to go to work for that kind of money, then I hate myself even more.



I don't hear you saying it. People, when I call to find out about hiring an attorney. You know the "oh you weren't married?" line...



All of the above lol. Not sleeping well again. Emotionally drained. Was with the girls and dh all weekend long, it was a nice weekend though. Then dh called in sick last night so he was here again and today. Started feeling really distant from him. He didn't feel liek going to work, he hates his job. Every time I hear him talk about it, I hear that I am failing him because I can't find work so he can leave his job. He isn't saying that, may not even be thinking it, but I hear it.



Thanks, I really need it right now. I feel so alone, distant, empty. It's even harder feeling this way because just this weekend I felt so wonderful with dh and the girls, connected, loving.

"Perhaps, but then it's just another thing that leads me to feeling like a failure."

Tell me, BTE, did you corner the market on being human? Because I didn't get that memo...

Children are intuitive...they survive from infancy through intuitively knowing their needs, without the ability to communicate them in words or actions...they don't have coordinated thoughts, yet they can feel anger, distress, fear and joy...they know when they have too much imput or not enough...

All children.

All human children.

Where's your failure, then? Only the failure to know you matter...consistently...constantly...to your children, your DH, many others...only failure when you don't stay aware in that knowledge and love yourself, know you matter even when you don't feel you matter.

And once you know this is essential...and you do...it is no longer a failure...it becomes a conscious choice.

Self maybe wants you to cry for it...for limiting, twisting, pushing your feelings...acknowledging your own feelings is not selfish or self-indulgent...it is essential to being human, part of the design...not right or wrong feelings...just pure information, and your tears seem to me to say they are struggling to be thought of, considered, accepted and acknowledged. Beats doing dishes.

The tears run out when the recognition is what you choose...you fear then not ending...know you fear...cry anyway...know why you cry...comfort yourself as well as you comfort your DD4...hold and rock, hum, moan or sing...you're worth it. It's how you teach your children they are worth it...

You are going in circles...an upward spiral staircase...you keep coming around, rung by rung, to the same support poles...and they run from the ground to the sky...five or six of the same ones...giving you that deja vu, back to square one...when really, you're on a higher rung, same pole, different view...if you look further than the pole.

Look further than the pole, BTE.

Respect DDs' choices...they want, then they don't want...no upset...their hair...their image...your time was not wasted at all...you're teaching them by being with them, that they decide their own stuff...if the pain wasn't worth the look in the morning, acknowledge that. If in the morning, she's filled with regret and magically wants to roll back the clock, acknowledge that...consequences of choices...she knows more now than she did yesterday...hard to rein in your magical inner child when you're looking into the eyes of your own child...remembering, re-experiencing some of those past choices you made yourself.

Leave her emotions with her. Her emotions are hers...they do not judge your effort, intent or accomplishment. The time you spent is indelible...will be remembered more than the barrettes, I promise. You can't see it now...trust me...no time spent with your children is wasted.

Your choice to believe it or not...take it on faith. Then see how you feel.

Tell yourself that what you do cannot be undone.

It was done. That's reality.

Punishing your past selves for not doing what they knew to do better...no boundaries...you knew about boundaries? I didn't. I had a vague, mysterious notion, no firm information...no guide or example to follow. Did you?

Wanting to be accepted is the human urge to merge...safety in numbers...and what I believe is the number one cause of feeling constant rejection. The urge comes from inside us, about us, for us...accepting ourself...claiming our real control and letting go what we cannot...yet we pursue filling ourselves up from the outside...wanting, plotting to get accepted...not in our control...expect ONLY in our control to accept our selves entirely.

Your previous self didn't know that...be kind...forgiving...your previous selves were innocent, if you choose to believe that the way you see your past now is vastly different than being in the moment, as you were, living it.

Accepting your choices, because they were...can't be undone...is how you raise your wishful child inside and lovingly bring her into reality...what is, is...your choice to believe it's for a reason, a good reason, lessons you may not have gotten otherwise, in this way...even a harder road, a scathingly destructive one...you don't know. You are where you are now...and accepting that as it is, and choosing to see it as good, goes a long way to feeling accepted, BTE.

It does.

It isn't easy...making the choice with a sincere heart isn't difficult...living that choice, that new belief, takes practice and commitment. Gets easier as you keep doing it...

Choosing to hate where you are could be what you would have done, BTE...had you made all those other choices which you didn't...you might be on that alternate life, right now, feeling the same feelings, hating yourself for this or that...maybe for what you have right now...

You are here.

This is the map of your life, every day, because you are human, my human sister, fellow warrior and marvelously created being.

You are here.

Stop taking your DH's words into your filter and making them about you. Be more respectful. They are about him. Acknowledge and validate that they are his, and he's fully capable of changing his perspective, perception, as you are, also...he's whole, too. He chooses if the job defines him, or he defines the job...if he connects with the people he works with or if he disconnects from them.

His lessons, about him.

Ask yourself...does this SAHM gig define you, or do you define the job? Are you actually doing the most important work in life, which would be exceedingly challenging, frustrating, contain the highest level of fear of failure in it...or are you not freeing your DH from his own prison?

You felt solid, happy, connected with your family, and then you hit disconnect. That's a jolt. Like on the amusement park rides..."Please remain seated until your car comes to a complete and abrupt halt."

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Well, that's what I hear.

I recently had to relearn that even as we abruptly disconnect, so do we reconnect. It's not forever, though our inner child (I know you don't buy it, but I do) gives us the feeling that empty, alone and disconnected feels like forever...the way it will be...even as our happy, joyful times feel like they are but seconds, sometimes...that's not the adult experience and you know it.

We connect and disconnect...we have to sleuth ourselves and our lives to find out why...our jobs, not others'. They aren't doing it. We are reacting instead of owning...that feeling alone, helplessly reactive, feels adrift...separating...distant...empty of power.

You've felt this way off and on, your whole life...does it come from your belief that once you've really fixed yourself, you will stay fixed, connected and consistently happy?

I had that belief. Why I had to stop fixing anything (okay, so I still do computers, but that's it, I swear)...and learn to be...struggle to just be...increase acceptance and awareness...not productivity, achievement (they all overlapped fixing for me); and then the aloneness, distance, persistent emptiness was filled...because it's an illusion, coming from my belief, my constantly evaluating (even in dreams, sleep, half sleep) belief...that I was broken and had to be fixed.

Living abundantly, in the present...is stopping the misinformation, not trusting it, living from it...being dominated by it...because it isn't real, can't be...accepting those feelings as real signals, yes...living from them, no. Choice. The more you spend on self, in your thoughts, encouraging, nuturing, accepting and celebrating self...the less you believe your feelings as truth...as being true, your reality...I feel empty therefore I am...and begin living a life running over.

You're not alone, defective or crazy...and your daughters aren't, and your husband isn't...and you will connect again, and again, and again.

Gorgeously human...no earning required. You are. You are.

Does it fix everything? Can't. Nothing is broken. Will you experience highs and lows with these new beliefs...yes, you will...evidence me...my recent FOO meltdown that I CREATED in myself...the apocalyptic fear come to pass...when it hadn't...not really...and people here and in my life helped me by handing back my own advice...helped me to stop foundering in misinformation, and see my present for what it was, my choices...and I believe I chose well.

Process, not perfection. That's the meat of life, BTE.

(You know I want to say bite me, huh? Okay, I won't.)

LA

It would pretty much mean me not picking up after others. Not taking dirty clothes out of the bathroom, handing towels up so they are dry after showers and baths.

Problem is I struggle between resentment of doing things that I don't really want to do and guilt that because I am a sahm those things are my job. A lof of this stuff has to be done whether I do it or not. We have people coming tomorrow (if they show up) to lay new carpet. The week after they are coming to paint. They can't paint rooms they can't walk in.




Our computer is also in the playroom. That would mean no computer, might as well take the air I breathe away lol.



A lot of the times they tell me they want it, they will eat it. Then they decide they don't like it (usually teh 4 year old) it could be something she has eaten before. How do you fit in the obligation to feed them, it's not as if they are old enough to fix themselves something. This is what I struggle with, not causing resentment, but knowing I am responsible for their care.



ANd if he knows? and doesn't care? My husband and S have been friends for like 8 years, before our marriage. Some people don't have problems with friendships like that. I would be ok with it if the friendship didn't take place only at work on cell phones. Very rarely in front of me.




That's because he could be his own thread lol. He is a puppy that's for sure. I have a Kirby vacuum, less than 2 years old, he chewed completely through the power cord. My fault, should have been put away. IF he gets caught peeing he runs to the back door and waits to be let out, he knows what he is supposed to do, chooses not to.

Hey BTE,

I'm totally swamped in my real life today, but I wanted to drop in and give you a quick hug! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I'm reading and following along, and I'll write more when I can.

(((BTE)))
HTBH

Group hug! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

BTE, that 123 Magic sounds really promising. Have you read Dr. Harley's thought on dividing household chores? That the one who wants it done the most takes it? Would that apply here? That getting the kids self-sufficient in picking up falls on your shoulders because you're the one who sees it as a priority?

It's not a one day and you're done, it's every day for many years.

LA, I hear you, these are equal individuals, and I agree with you that children do indeed learn from necessity, just like BTE not sure where to draw the line, especially how kids are so individual. I have seen with my own older daughter, how much they are capable of when left to her own devices.

As is usually the case, BTE and EO, you've prompted me to consider something in a new light...

Teaching our children...what do we do...(besides EVERYTHING)...we look for results to judge how effective our decision was, our actions and effort.

WHY?

Why do we look to the results instead of pick from our principle? We are response-based in our parenting, aren't we? We're even told..."Try this and see if it works"...

OHMYGOSH...think about this...we don't see the results for decades...and humans aren't cattle, not to be worked...but lived, experienced, understood and accepted...

Wow...think we have a hard time letting go of judgment, of stopping us from being reactive, response-based...when we were raised that way and raised our children that way?

Sorry...just blurting post here...wow, EO...that really hit me...

LA

Wow, LA, that's thought-provoking!!

I just wanted to pull this line out, savor it for a minute:


I'm reading this book called Positive Discipline, and it's about parenting (and teaching) with kindness and firmness and respect for the child. And it's fascinating, a great read, I highly recommend it.

The author says that children's main goal, in everything they do, is to belong and feel acceptance and significance. When they are feeling discouraged, they tend to fall back on what she calls mistaken goals to get that sense of belonging (she calls mistaken because they don't typically work).

The 4 mistaken goals are undue attention (the child feels special if he/she is the center of attention), power struggle (they feel special when in control), revenge (they are so hurt that they want to get back at the person seen to be causing the pain) and assumed inadequacy (they feel like they will never succeed and just give up trying).

The thing is, I think this can apply to grown-ups, too! Whenever I feel like my H is being "whiny" or "needy" I now stop and ask myself if he's just asking for my attention, albeit in a super-irritating way. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" /> Sometimes I even ask him if he's feeling lonely (he usually is!). The annoying behavior goes away if I focus on him for a few minutes and let him know how special he is to me.

The author swears it works with children, too -- because you are recognizing that they are not TRYING to be difficult but rather are trying to feel loved in the best way they can think of. If you can meet them halfway, show them you love them, and encourage them -- often, the annoying behavior will decrease a lot. ** This is a VERY abbreviated version, obviously, and applies ONLY to the first mistaken goal of behavior. There are other suggestions for the others. I just thought this might be most relevant to BTE's youngest DD today.

I think back to the times that I drove my mom absolutely nuts (so she said) -- and most times, I was just begging for her attention but didn't know how to get it. So I think this lady is on to something.

YMMV, of course, but I really wanted to share this with you. This book has been really eye-opening for me!

One more thing, is that the book talks a lot about mistakes, and how as kids, we were "taught" to do "better" by being punished with blame, humiliation and/or pain when we made mistakes. Which is why so many of us as terrified of making mistakes, even as adults. The author emphasizes, over and over, that we need to learn to see mistakes as a learning experience, no more, no less. She says we just need to take ownership, apologize to anyone who was harmed, and set about finding a solution to the problem so we don't make the same mistake again (this sounds like LA's recipe for making amends, doesn't it???).

I know that for me, personally, I am more terrified of "messing up" or "being wrong" than almost anything, and I have in the past (not too distant!) gone to almost any lengths to make sure no one found about my mistakes. I'm trying to change my perspective to see mistakes as a ahance to learn something new -- not a judgment of my worth as a person!

Anyway, I have been so entranced by this book that I wanted to share with you all!

Hugs!
HTBH

Wow, HTBH, what cool parallels! Someone had put the positive discipline website up a few weeks ago, and I got so much great perspective from it! About when a kid messes up in class, the class would brinstorm, first a punishment, and then solutions to help the kid do better, like a reminder beforehand for example. Then they decided not to use the punishment, but supportive soluntion. Awesome concept, and easier to implement than the punishment!

I don't think it's coincidence that you posted about this as BTE is struggling with motivating her kids to do better <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />