Must be filtered by your work's email server as junk.

My lawyer says that it is legal that she is calling me, but she advises (like all of you) to have minimal contact with her while the PO is in place.

Well, if there was ever any question as to your WW's most important emotional need that you've been filling, I certainly would be considering either "Conversation" and/or "Domestic Support" as one of them.

She can't even go 24 hours.

I'm not saying participate. I'm just pointing this out for future reference.

On Another Subject:

You have a bardering tool you need to utilize. You tell your WW to have that PO [color:"red"]rescended and expunged [/color] from your record, then you'll consider talking to her.

Do you want that PO showing on your record for gawd knows how long??? Did you know that more creditors are now checking those records along with your credit score when you apply for credit???

Jo

That's bartering, Jo. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

GF - cut her off until the order is lifted.

ONLY absolutely necessary conversation for the welfare of your daughter. OK?

Just tell her that:

Her: Hi, how are you?

GF: Does this concern our daughter?

Her: No, I need some help with laundering my shoelaces.

GF: Sorry, until the order is lifted, I cannot speak to you about ANYTHING other than issues associated with the welfare of OUR daughter.

Got it?

WAT

I'm in agreement with WAT.

Your WW's only agenda right now is to normalize her affair behavior. She's perpetuating her fantasy. She wants her proposed agenda to be accepted by everyone in her life.

In the 'WS Fantasy'....YOU are relegated to a "friendship" role. She wants an amicable divorce. She wants you to accept the affair partner as part of your family's life. She wants preferential treatment in custody and settlement issues.

Her agenda is easier to accomplish if YOU are compliant. So, she'll endeavor to keep you calm while she dumps you.

Your job is to poke holes in the 'fantasy bubble'....ALWAYS.

It's the fantasy that keeps the affair brewing, right? And when you fail to comply, you make it difficult for her to continue on her set course.

For right now, the PO keeps you from interacting FREELY with her. That puts 'Plan A' off the table. You are not "free" to fulfill ENs. She has deliberately restricted you from doing that. Her choice. Her loss. You don't fulfill any ENs until those restrictions are lifted. And certainly you don't want to fulfill her EN for conversation....where SHE PERPETUATES HER FANTASY AT YOUR EXPENSE.

Once she lifts her restrictions, then it's Reverse Babble. (see Orchid's signature) Because you NEVER want to bypass an opportunity to 'poke holes in the bubble'. The affair has to end in order for the marriage to survive. But the affair won't end as long as the fantasy persists.

I don't know if you'll be doing Plan A or Plan B after the PO is dropped. (I leave that particular advice for greater minds than mine.) But if you can 'lock in' on the idea that the affair fantasy is your enemy, you'll begin to see opportunities to destroy it.

A WS who's in "the fog" is surrounded by the fantasy of their affair. You can use whatever metaphor you like, just so long as you recognize the nature of the beast.

All,

Good Father has his first counseling session with Steve H. this am.

I hope he'll post an update and share what SH has to say.

Jo

I hope he did his homework assignment!

WAT
------------------
Embrace your inner fish.

Poster: Resilient
Subject: Re: Just don't know what to do. MORTARMAN HELP!
QUOTE:
All,

Good Father has his first counseling session with Steve H. this am.

I hope he'll post an update and share what SH has to say.

Jo
________________________________________________________

Ditto!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Please post all comments and suggestions from Steve.

Dazed

Yes, GF, let us know how it went.

I'll give you all a report a little later, I just had a quick question for you all.

I got a call today from WW's old friend in Virginia...the one that she initially went out to see when she met OM. His ex-girlfriend.

I exposed to her, though she already knew for the most part, but now she's asking me to forward her some of the emails that I got from WW's computer.

She told me that she wants to end the relationship between OM and my WW, and wants to use the emails as proof that she knows he's been lying to her, and that my WW has been lying to him.

Do you think I should send the emails? I'd love for him to start feeling some real pressure about this A, but I also don't want to hurt my position...what do you all think?

yes -- all pressure is good.

I don't see how it could harm your case. Its her words in her writing. And very clearly she's lying to a lot of people. Its good for that to come out.

Send them on there way!

Congrats GF! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" /> I think you've just gained a very powerfull ally. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Keep in touch with her. She could help you with breaking up the A AND possibly custody issues. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Hang in there!

I have a couple of concerns about releasing the emails.

First, she already knows that they are having an A, she practically caught them in bed together. Back when this was starting he was living in her house, and she swung by to pick up my WW, who was staying there too. She went upstairs and found him still in bed (naked) and my WW came out of the attached bathroom and sat down on the bed with him, trying to make it look like nothing happened. (Though later she admitted to me that they shared a bed...just no sex)

To be honest I think the old friend still has feelings for OM, and is just looking for more ammunition to fight with him over.

My second concern is that I'm not entirely convinced that I can trust her...she could have told me what was going on months ago, and didn't. She might be asking for the emails for my WW, so as to know exactly what I have.

So...how do I know that her request is genuine? How do I know that this won't come back and bite me in the behind?

Hey WTF...just thought I'd let you in on the US military...for us WTF stands for "what the F***?" <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Just thought I'd let you know!

G_F,

WTF, is Whiskey, Tango, Foxtrot, don't forget that. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

I would talk to a lawyer about sending those emails to her, but on the whole I don't see how it could hurt.

God Bless,

JL

I did email my lawyer too...waiting for her response and yours!

But see? The first thing I thought of was that the xGF is in cahoots with the ww and if he send the emails the ww will know EXACTLY what he has on her.

Does she know EXACTLY which emails you have? All of them?

Just wondering.

She knows that I've read them, I don't think she realizes that I have possession of them as well.

That's the dilema...do I verify that I have the emails by sending them...or do I risk losing a potential ally by not sending them.

Okay, I wasn't going to respond, but I just can't resist.

Your charter was to expose, and you did that by including your WW's GF (who also happens to be OM xGF).

Your charter ISN'T to help fuel a fight, based on unrequited love, between xGF and OM. And I strongly suspect that is her (xGF) REAL agenda here.

I don't think she needs anything further (email or otherwise) from you.

Jo

I suppose I could just send the most damning one...where they talk about the whole family thing, it's reasonable for all of them to believe that I forwarded that one to myself. Just not all of them.

Then again, what does it matter if she knows I have them in my possession, it doesn't really change anything if she knows or not...I will still have them.

Tell her your attorney strongly advised not to give them to ANYONE. That way she can't be offended and can't argue the point. She'll then remain an ally.

Jo