As a BS should I tell my H that I am starting to have more moments of hate feelings for him then love?

That when I look at him as a liar, unfaithful and dishonest person I see nothing left?
He's a very hard person to live with... honesty was all he had left...

That I don't really feel I can overcome what he did?
How can I now live with misstrust in our lives?

That I am really feeling that I would be much better on my own?

I am... I was a truly believer of radical honesty... but being so honest just led him to do all he had done and get away with it.

Should I tell him that I believe he's a serial cheater and that he has problems he needs to work on? And that if he's a serial cheater or a sex addict I don't think I am willing to give it a try?

I really don't know if I should be transparent while he isn't.
We are supposed to be working on recovery... but I believe we are really far from it.
I don't think he's lying now... he's just hiding himself. He's just not being honest or even willing to talk much about his feelings.

I am tired <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Why am I even trying to rebuild my marriage? For the kids... How happy can they be if I am miserable?

Wait, you wanna let us know what you are trying to accomplish by this undertaking?

L.

I don't know...


Should I really tell him averything I am feeling?
That's what I used to do... but since he doesn't talk about his feelings... should I continue to talk about mine?

U could....free country and all but if he is a Ws, it's like spitting in the wind. So back to my question, what r u trying to accomplish?

I'll give some suggestions:

1. Vent - you can post here, write him a letter (but don't send it....yet), etc.

2. Call Steve H @ MB for a plan.... a good one.

3. Post here for therapy but combine this with your MC/Steve plan.

Most important....identify your boundaries and implement them.

L.

lost_willow - As we've discussed before, I feel just like you do - I hate my W sometimes too. I have never told her the extent of my feelings. Don't know if that is right or wrong, but it's what I have done.

lostwillow, you don't have to ask him if he is a serial cheater. That is defined by his actions and you have plenty of evidence to support such a conclusion. The big question is one of ACCEPTANCE.

You cannot change him, so you must accept him how is TRULY IS and decide if you can live with that or not. You KNOW what to expect, you KNOW what your future will be like so you won't be surprised when this happens again. You won't be a VICTIM if it happens again, but a VOLUNTEER who knew exactly what she was getting.

It's hard not to have those feelings. After all, the WS has stabbed a knife in your back. Betrayed you in the worst way ever possible.

But what happened to create the atmosphere to allow for the A? I know on my end that I AM partly responsbble. The awful thing is that my H CHOSE to have an A rather than bringing all of our problems out in the open in a LOVING way.

With that said, Orchid has a great point. WHY are you here? It's because deep down you DO want to save your M. Take Orchid's advice and call Steve and get a plan, vent here as it is WONDERFUL.

Take care!

Kim

lost willow,

Have you tried keeping a journal to collect all these thoughts of yours? I kept a journal for the first 6 months after D-Day and found it very cathartic. As Orchid pointed out, saying all these things to your WS will most likely accomplish nothing positive. That being said, my own experience was that the pain was so intense I had to have a safe outlet for my thoughts. The journal also helps in that you can later see progress over time as the cycles start to smooth out.

Best wishes for you. Hang in there.

Orchid:

I guess I am just well... confused... All this stuff about him being a serial cheater/ sex addict is hiting hard.

Yes venting... also, a lot. Feels good sometimes.

193296
Thanks, I will calm down and will keep it to myself... for now.

Kimberly
We were living under a lot of pressure, he was under pressure and in stress with his work and a family betrayal, I and the girls lived to support him during this two years <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> He was the priority <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

He says he has nothing to blame on me, our marriage or our relationship.
He said some nasty stuff (blaming kids), but now he says he doesn't know why he did it.

eaglesoar
I keep all my posts and a few more files where I vent sometimes. Guess all organized I can call them a journal. Writing truly helps me clearing my mind sometimes... I usually post when I have so many questions and doubts in a try to organize them trying to get help answering some questions.

MelodyLane
You coulnd't have been more right... I guess that's exactly what I am strugling with now.
And that leads me to the Radical Honesty question.

How honest can I be? I hate just the though that I even question myself about being completely honest with him.

But then I wonder... If I tell him about all I am thinking about... how can I get him to be really honest with me. he lied so well for two years...

I never know if what he is saying is for: trying to tell me what he believes I want to ear. For trying to tell me what he thinks it's right but not according to his true feelings. For not wanting me to hurt more. For his fear that I leave. Or for him still just lying.

He even said the other day that he fears to tell me somethings because he believes I would leave him.

I am on IC and we are living in Asia... no Marriage Counceling <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />
And the only (english speaking) pshychiatric I am seeing refuses to see both of us.

I am trying to find a plan.
Maybe I should try to read all I can about serial cheating and sex addiction.

I am slow to make "important" decisions, I am too rational and tend to look for all the possibilities, And to be totally sure about my actions, specially if other's involved.

Thank you all... all in a way help me clear my thoughts.

I have started hating and resenting my WS as well, but I know it's because of the circumstances and that those are not my true feelings for her. Last night I broke down, yelled and cussed at God until I turned purple and told him how much I hated her.

Tonight, when I lay on my floor repenting, all I could do was pray for her.

I can never tell my WW that I resent her, or hate her, no matter how furious I am. For one thing, it would give her an excuse to justify her feelings for me and I refuse to give her that.

Secondly, because I know deep down that it's not true. I want to grow old with this woman. I want my next child to be part her, faults and all. I want to go to bed at night listening to her breathing.

I want to pull her close and help her through the shame and misery she's going through whether she wants me to or not. To pull her close like God pulls us close.

So no. Despite what I feel, the only person I tell is God. Well, maybe a few hundred of you clowns but hey, that's what we're all here for <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />


FN

He was a good father and a good husband for 10 years.
He has been cheating for two years.

How can I know who's the real him?

It's really hard to really know... because this last two years, and since he lied the first time... so many changes, problems in our life, Many I now realize came from his actions, but none the less, makes it hard for me to know who he is.
I know we created and started to have problems due to all it was going on, I know we were not meeting each other's needs (we had no time, we were in big stress) for example, He worked 2.30pm - 3am, 6 days/week, I work full time 9am-6pm. Kids, work, finances, we did talk a lot and spend every minute we could together... but mostly about how do solve his daily problems at work an family issues... and kids problems)

I am not trying to justify his actions, no way, it hurts even more, but I want to be as fair as possible analizing all that happened and eventually get to the real why he did it and who he really is.

For example, his 1 and 2 and 3 EN is SF, as you can see from our daily times it was hard to keep at least the quantity we both liked and needed. Always good and as much as we could... we discuss it many times as to when will this nightmare (his work) will ever end so we can have the life we want.

Same with kids, he felt guilty he was not spending any time but a few hours weekly with them. Specially with a "probably" dislexic in primary and a "hyper-active" in kindergarden, no family at all around. I brought my sister,her H and kids here, so they could have a better life and our kids could grow up together... they were just working on taking my husband position at the company <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> and made our life ******.

I was on the other hand in permanent doubt about his fidelity and lost all the trust in myself and my gut instinct, feeling guilty for not trusting him at the same time. And dealing with my sister's betrayal and double games. Very, very worried and frustrated as a parent to see my beautiful daugther in trouble in school...

I don't know how much of everything that was happening I should consider as to identify him or not as a serial cheater/ sex addict.

Guess this is part of my dilenma now.

All I want is to understand as much as possible as to make the right decisions.


Anyway
Just one question MelodyLane.

Re-reading your reply... If he's a serial cheater/ sex addict... Do you think is there any hope for recovery?

Thank you

double post

Make right decsions for you and your family.

As for the WS, as long as he remains a WS, serial or not he won't be good enough to be with his family.

It is possible to recover but it's not easy. He is scarring his life.

L.

I am almost sure he is a XWS now.

But can't never be 100% sure after all he did.

Mate, everything you are going through right now, is normal and believe it or not healthy. As much as it hurts, embrace it, and at some point heres hoping you will.
I am not here often , but I must ask, why is it you feel your husband is a serial cheater?

lost_willow - I am right where you are (at least it sounds that way). I hate my W sometimes now. I have to try very hard not to act like it when I am around her or I know my M will not work.

One reason she had EA is that I have probably acted like I hated her for a long time - when I really didn't. It became a habit due largely to issues I had about SF. So, now I do hate her a lot for good reason and I can't act like it or my M will not recover. Pretty tough situation.

I also don't trust W at all right now - I believe "if her lips are moving, she's lying" and that was never her before.

All that being said, I want my family to stay intact. That is why I am trying even though I sometimes don't want to. I think you feel that way too, so just try to remember that - that's what I try to do. Maybe the feelings won't last forever.

Finally my husband decided to talk.

He says he feels very remorseful, very guilty and very hurt because he feels me giving up on him.
He knows he's not doing all he can to re-assure me, he's trying but not hard enough( because he does not know how) and he's really sorry for it but it kills him seeing me so apart and not openly talking like before. He wants my help at it. And we also don't have much time together out of our daily rotine. - This is true

He says we are now different people, and that he also does not know how to deal with all this.

He feels like he had grown up, even thou he's not sure why he had this affairs. He believes it's just a sum of various factors that lead to it, he was being selfish and childish and the opportunity came and he never though about the consequences, not more then the need to hide because he knew I'd leave him if I found out.

After d-day, he realized how wrong he was, when we talked about what his behave led us to.

He's hurt that I don't fully trust him because I should see the turning point, after on conversation we had, and I desperatly finally made him realize how important the policy of radical honesty is. He says since that day he's not hiding anything and told me ALL that happened, there's nothing more. He says I am under evaluating the fact that he told me he had FA on second A and that he didn't had to, except for the fact he wanted to be honest.

He just want us to build a stonger relationship. To be with us, me and the girls, is all he wishes and have ever wished, he had never though about leaving us or have never stop loving me, he was just living fantasies out of the bad reality we were living, due to his work, he felt helpless at giving us all he wanted, specially not being with the girls, and felt guilty form their problems in school.

He is hurt I have any doubts that he will never cheat again, because he now knows what it is, since faced with the consequences, and he does not want to loose me or the girls, and he'll never risk it again.

He also added that, just right after he said "he was blaming the girls because we had them too young" he realized how stupid he was being. Same for many other hurtful and childish comments he had done before.

BUT AND THEN HE SAID...

The "Annual trip he's been attending for the last 4 years, for the same event that he had his first ONS two year ago" is coming and he has been invited. He said he didn't told me right away because he needed to think about it, he had promised me he would not attend it anymore, on my request... but he has been thinking and he believes he should go. He knows it's not the best time but it's there, he should have given the confirmation already but was waiting to talk to me first.

Reasons he pointed he should go:
1. Everybody is counting on him to go.
2. The company who organize and pays for it, used to send the invitation to his old newspaper ever since, and this year because my husband moved to another company, they send the invitation to them so my husband would be the one to cover the event.
3. They really want him to be the one to go.
4. The president of that company is a very very important contact and a friend of my H, so he'll be REALLY upset if he doesn't go.
5. Professionally it's REALLY important for him to go, specially after he messed up already at his new job when having his last A.
6. This is really a small community, and it's really important for him to cover this event, and not really easy to get another job.

This is all very true.

About us:
7. He will always have to travel in the future, less in this new job but he will have to.
8. We better start learning to face it and why not now? It a bit early but... we can try.
9. It will be a test for both of us. He knows it will be very hard for me, and it will be very hard for him because he will know I wont be ok.
10. It's a test for me, as to control my fears.
11. It will be good for us because nothing wrong will happen. (how will I ever know it???)

Just the fact he even considered this trip felt like d-day.

My immediate question was.
So you are telling me you want to go on trip for 10 days, to the same event you started cheating, knowing that woman will be there??????


He said she wont be there for sure, because two year's ago she told him her newspaper always send different people each year.
I know he can't be sure, probably not there, but not for sure that the true.

He says even if she's there, it's even better because he will test himself and will prove me he wont cheat.


------------------------

I don't really know what do do. This trip just feels to me like a dead sentence to our marriage either way.

If he wont go:
I feel I can't stop him from going because it will be really bad for him professionally (and for the family on the long run)
If I wont let him go, he wont go, but the consequences and ressentment will raise, from both of us.
Will I really feel better with him from not going? I really don't know, apart from feeling guilty for increasing his low "professional" credibility...

If he goes:
I will NEVER know if anything happens or not.
I believe it will kill the last thin hope and wish for recovery I still have.

I CAN'T TRUST HIM! If he goes it's like accepting his behave, it's like letting him do whatever he wants to and be ok with it.

It hurts he didn't even mentioned the possibility of me going as well, even thou I know that we know I couldn't <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Why should I have to live like this??? He has to travel, then he travels but WHY should I be here in pain knowing I'll never know what happens????
This is not the marriage and life I want.


Any advice would be helpful. Please I really cant think right now, am really tired of it all <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

I didn't read all the justifications for your H going on the trip and I don't want to. if you are uncomfortable with it, he should not go. End of story. What is more important? His image with his coworkers or his marriage?

As to your thread title, IMO don't say you love and hate H as long as you want to R. Vent those feeling here. R requires you both to want it. If H feels that he has hurt you too much, he might lose interest. It is a delicate balance but yes you can be too honest. I prefer to say I am just having a difficult day.

If your H wants to take a trip, let him take it with you to the Bahamas or Cozumel. So what if the company doesn't pay for it. What is really important to him?

BTW, I have had to travel extensively for most of my career. I have never once been threatened with termination for declining a trip. That is grounds for a law suit in the USA any more. Excuse me but I just don't by that reasoning.

This really got me thinking back to the situation I once was in.
My xWS and I had always shared the hobby of "horses". We attended many different activities and I had always encouraged him to go even if I couldn't.
I always trusted him and NEVER would I of thought that he'd be into any OW or whatsoever.

But it happened. My xWS attended a horse tournament without me and this is where he met xOW. This is where his affair started. After d-d, I was always together with him and attended everything concerning horses "together" with him.
But within years, I began to question myself. Why did I have to live with this constant upcoming pain, when I was attending these horse tournaments.

It had all lost it's sparkel for me. Wasn't shiny and special anymore. It killed me everytime because triggers came up everywhere.

Slowly but surely I told my husband that I couldn't do this anymore. I just couldn't take it. It was killing me and it was no longer what I wanted anymore. I backed off but I did tell him that I would NEVER stop him from doing what he loved to do.

I did not pressure him in any way, I left the decision completely up to him.

I knew for sure that if I didn't attend these activities "together" with him, I was risking my marriage. I knew that if xOW came along, he'd be voluarable again. But I was completely "fed up".

Doing this "together" for 3o years was always so special for me. It had always meant the world for me to see him happy and I was so prowd of him. But this had died the day he had "replaced" me with xOW. and it hasn't came back.

Anyways.............I knew that if he truely did want to go on with his horses, I'd be loosing him within time. I risked this. I left the decision up to him and the time we did spend together was always great. We found alot of other things that were fun to do. Slowly but surely my xWs let go of the horse tounaments.

We were having so much fun doing other things that he hardly had time for horses.
The day came and he told me that he was selling the horses that we had. Again, I left the decision up to him. I did ask him if he truely wanted to do this and why?

He replyed that he was having so much fun doing other things, he sees that he has put in too much time with the horses. He had never been aware of how much time that he truely invested into his horses and he's amazed that I had went along with this for so many years.
The years when our children were small, the years when we were building up our business, the years when I was taking care of my grandmother and small children and the years when we were either renovating our house or building a new one.

I was always there and I never complained. He said to me that he now realizes that he never really had time for "me" and that he now realizes that his marriage is more important than doing these very "Time consuming" things.

So we sold our horses and we now have a new hobby.
We bought a 4 wheeled Horse. (Mustang) and we love to go cruising..........we are out constantly meeting with friends. We go out alot with our children who are now grown up. We are also "Grandparents" and it fun to see our grandson growing up.
This is something that my xWS really missed out on with our children.

lost_willow, I hope you understand what I'm trying to say.
I let go completely and my xWS made his decision.

If he would of kept on doing what he had always done, I would of known the direction that I was going to go. It was NOT up to me to tell him what was important for our marriage.

If I would of told him what he should do, I'm sure he would of held on to it forever.................

Instead, I offered him "fun time" only that it no longer involved horses..............this way, he has never felt that he is missing out on anything.

This is the marriage that I want and he loves it too!!!!!

bb

Traicionado,

I guess we're just living the mess that infidelity causes.

It's almost impossible for him not to go to that trip now. It's a fact.
He can refuse it with a lousy excuse but it will have bad consequences for him, and to the family either we stay together or not.

I know he should go.

What I don't know is that I want to live with it...

Blondblossom

I think I can understand what you mean.

I need to think about it.

I am confused. I just feel trapped.

thanks for your support.