This is my plan <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

CO....

just stick with your beliefs....read my posts...you know where im coming from....i also believe that SELF ESTEEM is the most important personal need we have...without it, we are worthless...

the lower a womans self esteem, the EASIER and quicker it is to have sex....i also found, that the more "beautiful" a woman is, the more insecure she is....(dosnt make much sense) i know that sounds primitive, but i have found alot of truth in that statement...

as long as you like yourself, are happy with yourself and who you are...you DONT need sex to keep a guy as long as those boundies are established early on in a relationship...

be true to yourself, and keep working on your self esteem...no matter haow hard it is during recovery from D or A....been there!!!

I got married when I was 19....yes, 19. I was 5 months pregnant when we got married. And, no, we didn't get married b/c of the pregnancy. The wedding was already planned when I found out. We were only married for 4 months w/out a baby. I NEVER once regretted getting married young. I feel now that maybe my H wasn't ready. Who knows??


Been there too....not the flirting so much, but got hit on a lot.


Maybe Glad can chime in on this too b/c I beleive she feels the same way I do about this. I can only speak for myself though. I believe I am an attractive woman and have been told by many people that I am a very attractive woman. I get hit on ALL the time. I can tell you I am NOT insecure at all. I have no security issues. Well, I shouldn't say none b/c of the A my perspective has changed somewhat. But I can also tell you I am as low maintenance as they come. I'm not into the whole ENs thing. All I really wanted out of my H was faithfullness, honesty, and loyalty to me. I can't even sit here and think of one time he told me I looked pretty or one time where I needed to be told. Yes, it would have been nice. I also never needed or wanted affection. That is not who I am. I am a very independant woman and very successful in everything I do. I'm not saying most attractive women aren't insecure, but who's to say that nonattractive women are secure? I'm sure they have a lot of insecurity issues too.

BTW, I would never judge you. Everyone has their own opinion, I am just expressing mine <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> I hope I didn't offend you.

--CO

HA!!....i was talking bout my "playa" phase!!! (the judging part) <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

i just know what ive seen over the years and being constantly around people from all walks of life, i kinda came to conclusions and formed opinions....

but who knows...right??

anyway...i gotta scram for the day...hang in there...hope you have a good day and ill talk to ya L8R!!

Okay, someone is going to have to teach me how to put quotes in my post because I just tried 5 times to no avail and kept loosing what I had written...anyway...

CO, I think we may just be the same person! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Your paragraph on how you view sex and marriage now I could have written word for word and feel the exact same way.

I, too, am considered an attractive woman (it feels so wierd to say that!) and I get a kick out of people's response to learning that I am the mother of these four little girls surrounding me. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Aparantly you cannot be attractive, stylish, and thin AND also be a mother. (unless you live in Hollywood and are a star) LOL <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

However, where I differ from CO is that, although I can say that I APPEAR confident to the outside world, my inward self...my self-esteem...struggles a lot. Now I guess if I look back, that has been a bigger problem post-A, but I do feel like even pre-A I had a higher self-confidence (outward) and a lower self-esteem (inward). So that would correlate to sturg's findings about "attractive" women.

AHHHHHHH! I'm sorry, I have more to say than this but my H is not home this evening and my girls are just not giving me the time to concentrate on this with all the interruptions. So I will quick post just this and then hopefully remember where I was going with this and try to post later!

Blessings,
Glad

Okay, I'm back, hoping to remember where I was trying to go with my above post! It was a high-maintenence evening with the girls and I had to get up at 6am to get a little awake time to myself!

I think where I was going was into a discussion about outer vs. inner beauty...I think sturg eluded to this earlier.

Pre-A I never questioned my H's attraction to me. I knew he was and had always been physically attracted to and complementing of me. So after d-day I just really struggled with that because it was a realization of "beauty in the eye of the beholder" concept.

I think my conclusion is that during the deeper layers of recovery (when we dug deeper into the marriage itself once the A discovery wasn't so raw and gaping) I made the connection about inner beauty making the outward more beautiful...this worked both ways for us...I look back and think that my H's outward self was at his ugliest back then, but that is because his inside was so ugly. Now I think he is more handsome than ever because his inside is so attractive to me as well as his outside being nice to look at <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

And I had to look at myself too in light of what my H's EN's were. I had become unattractive as a whole person to my H because when he came home from work in the evening I was tired and snippy, I did not show him value in his "love language" and in his opinion, I was just no fun to be around.

Doing the EN questionaire together about 3 weeks after d-day was to this day one of the single most important actions we took in our recovery. We took it very seriously and poured over it and really both implemented it and we do to this day and it makes a huge huge huge difference to learn this about your spouse without getting defensive or judging their needs. It was startling to learn that what I thought I was doing to show him love was not being received by him as love because I was not showing him love in the way he needed or received it and this was true vice versa. When we started showing love to eachother in the way we each described we needed it based on what was revealed in the EN's as we discussed it, our recovery really began taking an upswing.

We became attractive whole people to each other again. And whenever we seem to be slipping in getting along these days, I go back to this...am I an attractive whole person to him right now? Am I giving him love in the way that he receives it? For example, he did something so great to help serve our church last night and I really admire that. In the past I would have just held that thought, but today I am going to write him an email (he is golfing all day) to let him know that I admire what he did last night. And I know he will just beam inside and think I am majorly attractive inside and out! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I am guessing the little ones will be up soon so I will end this. I hope there was some point in this that went along with our above discussion.

Keep pressing on people!

Blessings,
Glad

good morning all im glad to see all of you working this out.

while i was at a very good wedding not enjoying myself oh well what did i expect W was there doing pics and was there helping her instead on enjoying myself oh well.

i did have a good talk w/ her afterwards i told her i did have a date which i did but i called her fri and told her i wasn't going i just didn't feel right taking someone else whom i barlly know to a wedding that the W was at i didn't want her to lose focas of her job no tto mention i didn't want to go that route.

damn loving sum 1 sucks when they dont want to give it back to you. we talked alittle longer and i told her that even though she had done the things she has done that i can't hate her that i would always love her and be there for her when ever she needed me. she began to cry and i just held her for a while which felt good but at the same time we both knew that we still are not going to be able to fix things right now.

i told her that one day i would be able to forgive her what shes done and that she also needs to forgive herself and if she could of just put her pride aside we could of worked out the marraige but that she had done to much damage.

well i'll see you guys later today gotta take my two boys to the local market god knows what they would do if i didn't take them every suday.

You write this [ quote] in the beginning of the quote and then [ /quote] at the end of the quote (no spaces though). I just did that so you could see what to do.

I get this all the time too, but it is more when I tell them I have been married for 8 1/2 years and have 2 kids. They look at me like I am from outter space. And I'm sure they're thinking in their heads, "How old was she when she got married, 13??"


I too have a lower self-esteem post-A. I shouldn't even say lower. It is low now! I still feel attractive, but I feel like a loser on the inside!! I am nowhere near where I was. You can read my last post on my thread to see where I am at right now with this. It hurts so bad to feel so low!!

Glad, as I mentioned on my thread, I think maybe this is where I went wrong in our M. I think b/c I didn't have any EN's I didn't think my H did either. Obviously, I was wrong. But as I said before, I am not a mindreader and if he would have told me what his ENs were, I wouldn't be on this forum right now <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />. That was an area he had a major problem with.....communication. Now why he didn't seem to have that problem with the OW is beyond me. Maybe b/c she is a worlthless wh**e and you could probably ask her for anything and she'd do it.

saenz,

Sounds like the talk at the wedding with your W helped. Unfortunately, it sounds bitter sweet. I'm sure it hurts you to even have a conversation with her like that. I am really feeling your pain through your posts. I hope sometime not far away I can feel the joy through your posts. I really hope you find happiness in working out the M or moving on. I know you are stuck in a rut right now, and I hope there are brighter days to come.

I know you say you want to move on, but I think if your W would work on the M with you, you guys could be whole again. I hope she sees the light for your sake and your kids' sake. You can't stay in limbo forever. I can tell you love her with all of your heart. Maybe she will realize just how much she means to you and you to her.

--CO

man co you had alot on your mind huh.

i hate feeling like this, why did she do this, im a good person w/ no vices i cant belive im going threw this.

and you know sturgis is rigth she traded down from me for god sakes he has a record which she though was funny dear god.

i would love to share w/ MB all there emails they sent back and forth but what good woul dthat do me.

i woke up in a great mood today then by mid day i was feeling sad and lonely then around 4pm i was pissed off cause i was helping her find an apartment. and calming her down, why do i have to be that person why do i ahve to still care so much knowing she doesnt care as much 4 me as i do 4 her and that really sucks. for me no wthats feel ing like a looser.

waassup bro!!

love hurts man!!! the only thing i have really learned along the way and truely believe, is the part of self esteem and self worth being SO important in our lives...we base everything on that...what kind of car we drive...where we vacation...where we live...."keeping up with the jones'" so to speak....

it also dictates, who we are attratced to....this is deep for me....i have seen it....a person with low self esteem is attracted to someone who is strong...(emotionally) or has a healthy ego....but after a while, and it could be years...they get feeling inferior, get even LOWER feelings of self worth....the ying and yang thing about opposites...

my opinion is that after a while, they grow to resent the stronger peroson because the feel more inferior...i think thats when the give into weaknesses, like haveing an affair...

this makes alot of sense to me....thats why SO many seem to trade DOWN!! they need someone lower than themselves to feel GOOD about themselves in some jaded sort of way....

think about it....when we were kids, did we ever RESPECT a cheater???? whether it was hide n seek, tag, football, board games??? NO!!!!....but also think about the playground....remember bullies??? who followed the bullies....WEAK or insecure kids, and the bullies also beat them down too.....

i think this makes alot of sense to me, thats why i believe being secure and keeping your self esteem in tact is SOOOOO important....

you DO NOT NEED SOMEONE TO LOVE YOU, to feel good about yourself....the fact that your charactor and ethics are in tact is HUGE.....

i took along time to get to this point in my life...in fact I still need some work!! but, when i look in the mirror, I LIKE WHAT I SEE!! im sure my X struggles with this, and her now husband, the OM.....i dont even need to go there...his self esteem is a TRAIN WRECK!!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

keep your chin up bro....no matter where this road takes you...keep your charactor and ethics in tact...

i wanted my X to suffer or one day give me the DRAMA reation that she SOOO made a mistake or that shes sorry....i NEVER got the drama....but all it takes for me is to look at her.....she used to be beautiful, i thought inside and out....but now shes weathered looking, haggered and put on lots of weight....

no matter how jealous i got of her "livin the high life", i realize, that in todays world when a womans "LOOKS" is everything....SHE CANNOT like what she sees, soooo,

really now.....how happy can she be????

the fact i keep getting better, keep working on my personal demons and keep improving my own life....THATS revenge my friend....not lieeting her beat you down...living a good life is revenge enough!!!

yes.....bro....LOVE HURTS.....but its how we grow as humans...and.....life also goes on!!!

it took me about a year to get over the pity party...so dont expect changes overnite....but the longer this ordeal went on for me...the less and less i cried....

i thought i picked up that you live in FL, go buy a MC...there great placed to ride down there i imagine....go pick up a new hobby....learn to fly....do something you NEVER did before....just take care of yourself!!!!

thanks for the words strug. i tnd to forget some of that stuff. to help myself.

sturg,
As I said on my thread, this is right on point. I think you hit the nail right on the head!! This is exactly what it was like in my M. It makes perfect sense. You explained it so clearly too <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />! You really know your stuff!!

--CO

co
becarefull you might blow his head up.how are ya today?

hey bro....no worries there...i look in the mirror....I KNOW im cocky, funny, macho and a HOTTIE!!!!

(and then........ i wake up)!!!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

you and me both,then we wake up.

so i was on the phone w/ W last nite cause i needed to vent
and low and behold i told her about the fact that i cancelled a date to the weding we where both at and last nite she threw it in my face i was so happy cause her she is for the last month saying she doesn't care but when she finds out i been talking to someone everything changes. now i'm the bad guy funny huh. cause its been only 1 month since i found out.

i told her she has double standards it was so funny to hear her say 2 wrong don't make a right and all that. and all i'm doing is talking to sum other girls on the phone imagine if was to go out w/ one. i love its not right 4 me to be talking to other people but yet its ok 4 her to stay @ her ex place for a week and have an A.

not to mention all this help i've been giving her in the past month finacially and emotionally instead of saying no.

i feel so much stronger today i'm on the top of the roller coaster.

remember....no matter what she sez.....

she may not want you, but she dosnt want anyone else to have you either....thats POWER baby!!!

wait till you DO go on a real date one day, even if its just lunch or coffee....itll freak her out!!

I KNOW I CANT WAIT