Habiba, on the chance that your plea is sincere and real, I will attempt to answer you questions if you'd like. However, if you don't really want the answers, say so. If you do, then let's talk a little, but I will only talk "one on one" with you, since your questions pertain to YOUR relationship with God, not His with you.

For now, let me leave you with ONE response....the only one that really matters right now. Jesus told the woman accused of adultery; "...neither do I condemn you. Go and LEAVE your life of sin." It is a command, not a suggestion. It does NOT depend on "how you feel" or "what you want." God is Sovereign and has the right to command. Jesus IS Lord and paid the price for YOUR sins, and has the right to command you as He "bought and paid for you at great price to Himself." You are not your own.

I'll await a response from you to know whether or not to continue.

Yes, FHs, my plea is sincere and real.

Did God create me just so He'd have someone to boss around? Did he make me this weak person (we all are) so life would be such a struggle to do the right thing? Is life really about just following the rules and laws?

Sure I'm not my own. I didn't ask to be born, or born again for that matter. He picked me, I responded. I've walked with Him for a long time, sincerely rejoicing in Him. But I want to know if this is all there is:

I do the right thing.

Tow the line.

Sacrifice my desires.

Do it, or else.

If all He wants is for me to obey His commands (which I agree, He is sovereign), then why did He make it so hard to obey? Why do I have needs? Desires that He doesn't want fulfilled?

I'm not trying to be disrespectful...I just really don't understand.

I'm headed to a monastery this weekend to sort things out. If I don't write back it's because I'm gone. I'll check back here Monday.

Thanks for writing on this.

Not to interfere in your thread, but a quick observation:

You contradict yourself.

From your post:

"I do the right thing." No you don't. You committed ADULTERY.

"Tow the line." No you don't. You committed ADULTERY.

"Sacrifice my desires." No you don't. You sacrificed everyone else's for your own pleasure.

"Do it, or else." Or else what?

See? You do have a lot of ground to cover before you will understand.

With prayers,

I guess my writing style is weird. Those were dramatic sentences:

Let me say it again.

Is this all there is?:

1. I must do the right thing
2. I must tow the line
3. I must sacrifice my desires
4. Or else.

I'm asking if this is what life is all about. If this is all God wants from my life.

Is that more understandable?

OK, but it's a rather weak literary device. My point being, you are not doing those things.

And I still wonder, or else what?

I know of no or elses except loss of eternal life with God.

Which would mean in the end you never do get to know why at all...

I will leave you to FH now. (Well, I stand corrected…now there is an or else...)

With prayers,

PS: Always tell the whole truth, in everything. You will find yourself slowly becoming elevated above all this other meaningless stuff.

Thanks, A.

Is that all life is about? Keeping the commands? Towing the line?

Then why did God make us? What is the point?

Does anyone know?

I am certain that FH will jump in here with a much better answer than I can, but I just feel lead to add my own two cents worth.

God did not create us to simply be happy. he created us to worship him, and to love others.

what you find in life, is that when you are loving others, and doing for others, you naturally become a happy person. When you discover what your God given gifts are, and you use them to love and support other people, it makes you happy. God did not put you hear on this earth just to do whatever it takes to make you feel good. he put you here to do good things. And the result of that is a geniune, deep happiness that truly surpasses all understanding.

I know that right now you feel like you have been doing things for everyone else but yourself. But have you been truly loving other people? I mean really loving on other people? You ask a question that my WxH once asked - "when is it my turn just to do what I want that makes me happy" and the real answer is never. There will never come a time when you get to sit back, coast, and allow others just to make you happy.
Instead you look for ways to show love to others, and to help people, and through all that you begin to discover that you become truly happy.
You need to start really loving on people. Seeing a loney widow at church, and inviting her over for tea. Handing out coats and hats to homeless people. going to New Orleans and helping to re-build a church. none of us was put on this earth to just feel pleasure. Feeling pleasure comes to us as a natural consequence of doing good things.

Your children will only be young once. Your pursuit of your own happiness at the cost of your childrens safety and emotional stability is the most destructive and selfish thing you can do. You are permanently burning an emotional scar onto their brain that they will carry into their own relationships. What gives you the right to do that? When did you become so much more important than everyone else in the world, and you have the right to pursue "feeling good" even if others suffer?

you made a comment the other day about how it is a good thing that your children all ready know this OM, that they will be more accepting of him. I say bull crap to that. they will be even more horrified. when my children found out that their dads "friend" was actually his "girlfriend" they instantly grew to hate her. She had been showing up at their baseball games all the time, as soon as I had left to go home and make dinner. when their dad left, and the boys reflected on how Dads friend always showed up just as Mom left, they were horrified. My older son felt like he should have done something, or said something. he knew that woman was always hanging around his dad, but he just assumed she was a friend of both of ours, so he didn't think anything was wrong. Later, when his Dad left us and moved in with her, he was horrifed and felt like he should have said something, or done something earlier to stop it.
Their relationship with their dad is still broken, to this day, and I doubt that he will ever be able to fix it.

Very nicely said, WoF. Habiba, click on this link perhaps it will give you food for thought.

Yes, well said WoF...but I still haven't heard an answer to my question.

I know that there is much happiness and joy in loving others. I have genuinely loved and served others for many years, both in the US and on the mission field. I am never happier than when serving others.

I guess I want to know: What does God want? Does He simply want my outward obedience at any cost to myself? Is that all He wants, my obedience?

If so, then why did He create humans whose VERY NATURES desire things which are contrary to His laws?

Example:

*** "You have heard it said, 'Do not commit adultery,' but I tell you if a man looks lustfully at a woman, he has already committed adultery with her in his heart."

Then why did God create men to be sexually stimulated at the mere sight of a beautiful woman? It's like they are set up for either failure, or a lifetime of struggle against their VERY NATURE. ***

Please someone answer this question!

Major research undertaken by a large university recently revealed what faithful people have known for eons: true happiness in life comes from meaning.

It's up to YOU to give your life meaning. Give it meaning, and happiness will follow. True, lasting, deep happiness, that is, NOT temporary jollies. Temporary jollies are, btw, what affairs are all about. There is nothing more meaningless than an affair. The irony, of course, is that many people turn to OPs because their lives are meaningless, and they are looking for "something".

Well. The "something" isn't out there in the arms of an OP. The answer is within YOU, and a person who knows who they are and what they're doing while on this earth has no need to hurt others or violate universal (and indeed, eternal) principles on their seach for "happiness".

There is a place within us for desire. God placed desire within us so that we would hunger and thirst for that which is good, for that which gives our lives meaning and deep joy, and turns our hearts to Him and the people around us he has blessed us with. It is the confusion of God-given desires with temporary wants that gets us in trouble.

I've never posted to you before, Habiba, and I don't mean to offend, but if you're serious about this, you kinda have to stop messing around. God isn't going to give you a big fact sheet of what's in it for you. It just doesn't work that way. This is what faith is. You do as you're asked, and THEN your questions are answered. If you have the desire to do what is right, He will build on it, and you will be strengthened, and so on, bit by bit. But you have to take the first step.

Well, yeah... but that's only ONE part of their nature. A very base part, hard-wired into a man for survival of the species. We are more than this. Far, far more. We actually have divine natures. Funny how people hardly EVER seem to mention the struggle that men and women put up against their divine natures, isn't it? And yet they do it all the time.

All I have to say on this matter is that God DID NOT give us the lustful thoughts or the sinful nature. Eve and Adam did that when they took the fruit from the tree that was forbidden them and ate it. God DID give us the ability to make our own choices and whether they are good ones or bad ones, WE made those choices on our own. I hate it when people say, "How could God do this to me?!?!" Well, God had nothing to do with your choice, otherwise you wouldn't have made the wrong one in the first place, right? God also gave us an out from the punishment of our sins, but it doesn't give us the right to do whatever we want and then just say, "Well, if I'm already forgiven then it's ok." He wants us to make those choices on our own, but also wishes us to make the right choices. He gave us a free will, because he DIDN'T want a world full of robots, but He also layed out the laws of which we are to follow. Men were made to enjoy their wives, that's why they are so "into" women. And, before someone jumps down my throat, look at Genesis for this next comment, women were made to be man's helpers, which is why we women aren't so inclined to be visual in our attractions.

So, to answer your question, God created us NOT to go against His will, but also gave us a free will to make our own choices. WE ruined it from the beginning in the garden when the forbidden fruit was picked and eaten. Switch that around to WE as WS ruined it when we chose to partake in the A(s) which are in essence the forbidden fruit. It wasn't truly our nature until that first fruit was taken. Pure and simple. God doesn't want any of this garbage, but is willing to wait for us to come to our senses and back to Him.

Sermon now over, back to the regularly scheduled programing.

Habiba, you are asking the wrong question. In effect you are dragging "red herrings" across the path you have chosen in an attempt to "shift the blame," and therefore, the responsibility. Those who know me around here will tell you I am not likely to "play that game."

So let me ask you a question that needs to be answered first. If, perhaps, you have answered this previously somewhere, I apologize for asking it again. But I ask it because I DON'T know the answer and only you CAN answer it. But it is the pivotal point to all of your other questions.

Who is Jesus Christ and who is He to you?

If you are a Christian, you can answer that question. If you are not, that, too, will be an answer. But answering all of your other questions are irrelevant when compared to that question. It's not that your questions might not be important to you, it's that you are dealing with symptoms and not the cause of the problem.

So let's begin answering your questions there. Who is Jesus Christ and who is He to you? And then we can move on to your other questions, such as why did God create you, me, Mankind?

Let's get the foundation right before we attempt to build any structure.

Edited to add:
And a "side question" to further help me with understanding your "issues." You said, "I have genuinely loved and served others for many years, both in the US and on the mission field." With what church denomination or mission group do you associate this "missions service?"

Hmm, FF, interesting response.

Meaning. I have to find my own meaning in life to find happiness. That's the best answer I've heard yet. I'll chew on that at the monastery over the weekend.

Thanks.

Well, RTam,



Yes, I agree, it's only one part of their nature. Why is it there at all? You say for "survival of the species." How is that? Couldn't men and women both be sexually stimulated by emotions rather than sight and people would still have sex?

Why is it part of men's nature at all? Is God setting you guys up for failure? Or is it some big cosmic joke? What?

I'm not picking on men, this was just the first example I could come up with.

Again, the question:

If God wants us to do "right," then why did He create us with so many internal weaknesses. Why are we made so that it's "easy" to choose wrong but "difficult" to choose right?

Please someone answer the basic question. Please don't just quarrel w/ the example. I'm just trying to ask it in different ways, because I don't think I'm asking it clearly enough.

No, Habiba, that is precisely what I am NOT saying or "meaning." That response from you evades my direct question to you about Jesus Christ and is, itself, very revealing.

Habiba, you ask that question because you don't understand God or WHY Jesus Christ was needed. It is THAT understanding that I am trying to help you reach.

The "short answer" that you will most likely not understand at this point is that God did NOT "create us with so many internal weaknessess." His creation was perfect and pronounced "very good." But someone else thought they "knew better than God" and wanted others to join him in rebellion.

So once again, who is Jesus Christ and what is He to you?

Ok, Tigger, I'm rolling with you about Adam and Eve. "Because they ate the fruit, now we have a sinful nature." I'd like to go back in time a little more, though: If they didn't have a sinful nature before, then why did they eat the fruit in the first place? I know God doesn't want robots, but people free to choose to serve Him or not. I agree.

I'll ask another way:

You know the balance knob on your radio?: Left ----- Right
It's like God made us like this:

Wrong ---------x--- Middle -------------- Right

We're just a little bit skewed toward the wrong. Why didn't He create us to be skewed a little more toward the right, if that's what He wants? I'm not talking robots, here. I'm talking just a little more past the middle.

I believe that Adam and Eve had sinful natures before eating the fruit. Otherwise they wouldn't have eaten it.

Any answer there?

FHers:

Jesus is my Savior. I love Him. He is my only hope.

I was asking these questions WAY BEFORE this affair. And by the way, God does answer people before they have faith.

I think He gave us the ability to question things, and as we do, He reveals more of Himself to us.

For this affair, I am completely at fault. I am guilty. I fully acknowledge this. I just want to know why it was so hard to fight for so long, but it was so easy to give in after MANY YEARS of struggle against it.

Oops,

I mixed up who I was answering.

River Tam had the good one about meaning.

Forever Hers was who I was trying to answer as per my last post.

Sorry guys.

In one word....SIN. That IS the "why" you are asking for. "Me first, me, me, me!!! I want, I need, I deserve, I choose because 'if it feels good, I will do it!'"




Because God created them with "Free Will." They could choose to obey or disobey God. God gave them that "Free Will" KNOWING that they would choose to disobey and sin. Yet, rather than create a race of robots, God created us in HIS image, with His capacity to choose. God has always wanted our love, but He has wanted it freely given, as a choice, both before the Fall and after the Fall.

In addition, because God loves us He also prepared the WORD to be our Savior from the coming (Adam and Eve's choice to eat of the ONE tree that God had forbidden) "poor choice" NOT because we deserved it, but because God DOES love, and always has loved, US...you, me, all who He does not want to perish through our own choice. So God prepared, in love, THE "way out" for us from the bondage and penalty of sin.




I don't want this to come across as cruel and harsh. It must be asked, but I want you to understand that I ask it in the hope that you will THINK about it before answering.

"Jesus is my Savior." Is he? Why is he? It is easy to SAY that, but what have you done that makes Him your Savior?

"I love Him." Do you? Why? What did He ever do for you that you should even "like" Him, much less "love" Him? And HOW is your "love" for Him to be returned? What did Jesus say that one who loved Him would DO in response and out of that love?

"He is my only hope." He is? Why is that? Your "only hope" for what? Who IS He?

And lastly, a Sovereign has the right to command and the servants have NO rights independent of those granted by the Sovereign. The only "right" of Servant is to OBEY the commands of the Sovereign.

I submit to you, habiba, that Jesus, Son of Man, did NOT want to go through the scourging and crucifixion. He had done NOTHING wrong. Three times Jesus asked the Father to "find some other way." To die horribly in YOUR place simply because the Father loved you and willed that Jesus must pay your penalty in His preordained manner was what God required of Jesus....and Jesus submitted to the Father's will.....out of love, by choice, to atone for Adam and Eve...who chose poorly. Jesus was BOTH Son of God and Son of Man. He CHOSE. He chose to become Man. He chose to NOT call down His angels to rescue him...He chose humble obedience to the Father's will.


Talk to me habiba. Let's talk about YOUR faith and WHY you believe Jesus is your Savior and why you don't seem to consider Him your Lord?

James 1:13-16
13-Let no one say when he is tempted, "I am tempted by God."
for God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does He tempt anyone.

14-BUT EACH ONE IS TEMPTED WHEN HE IS DRAWN AWAY BY HIS OWN DESIRES AND ENTICED.

15-Then, when desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, brings forth death.

16-DO NOT BE DECEIVED, my beloved brethren.

I pray the Lord will speak to you this weekend habiba and always, may your ears be opened to hear. His Word speaks for itself. Don't forget to bring your bible with you.

Hoping the best for you,

Lady