...like the jerk that stole my son's car last night... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

found it 3 blocks from the house, sans $400 radio, no other damage...

I think she was pretty stupid to set herself up with a man who a) was married and b) had nothing against adultery. Being shrewd is not the same as being smart about getting entangled in such an impossible situation. Simple logic should have alerted her to the inevitable outcome. But it didn't.

OUCH! Glad you found it, sd. Did your son leave the keys in it?

Like parenting, hardly any kid is taught to be "married". If you are lucky enough to have decent parents with a good marriage, you might be able to absorb some of that magic. Not always but maybe eventually you will clue in.

Many people have a sense of entitlement and invulnerablity. They rationalize. They are shallow. How many OW say, "Honey, if you can't hang onto your man, he's mine!" How many say, "He makes me feel good, so I'm going to do it." and "I'll never get hurt." How many don't look past the pretty skin of the apple until they've almost reached the rotten core? Isn't it common for OW to be given lavish compliments, expensive gifts, fancy dinners out and nice trips? What a rush! Married men do look like good catches: they look like they have money and position, look stable. From outside the window, it must look like a good life.

I think being touch by infidelity changes you. It alters your perspective. Popular culture accepts infidelity. It's not just Closer and the Horse Whisperer. Think back to prize winning books like Angle of Repose. Even an old movie like Gone with the Wind has an underlying theme of infidelity. Post D-day, how many BS have revisited a favorite book or movie only to hurl when confronted with an unremembered adultery plot?

I would imagine that "successful" OW continue being OW. They would be the ones who skate through relationships sowing a path of destruction but are unscathed. I wonder how many OW who have been as deeply hurt as the woman in the orginal post would go into another OW scenario?

It's thread like this that make me wonder if I've ever belonged on MB (after over 3,000 posts)

Yes, I know, I'm an FWW but don't forget I was once an OW which means I must be, let's see, stupid, cunning and a whole of other words.

Very hurtful and very unnecessary and who exactly is it helping?

I shouldn't read this stuff.

Well, Kiwi, I would have to argue that you were smart enough to get out of your affair. Further, we are talking OTHER WOMEN, you are NOT an OW. You are a FORMER WW. I don't think you could - honestly - argue for a minute that having an affair was smart.

How can you even relate to someone like that? That is not you. You left that behind, faced the consequences and changed yourself. That WOMAN IS NOT YOU.

As a recovering alcoholic, I will be the first to admit that I was MORE THAN STUPID when I was active. I was immoral, thoughtless, selfish and downright MEAN. That is simply a TRUE FACT and I fully accept that about myself. I could not ever hope to recover until I accepted that truth.

But it doesn't end there because I AM NOT THAT PERSON anymore. I am honest, decent and conduct my life SMARTLY today. But that does not mean I can erase my past.

Kiwi

the OW who tried to slip my life right out from under me and my kids was stupid, cunning, and a whole lot of other words.

here's the point

so was my H at the time

now he's my sweet Baboo and my Hunny Bun and my MAN for all Seasons ....

get it?

Sometimes hurtful is necessary and helping ...

Who has it helped?

It has helped me, for one, to come to terms with the person my H ~was~

It has helped me come to terms with the person I ~was~

Were you smart and thoughtful of others during your A ... of course not.

I can imagine a newly betrayed wife reading this thread ... and being greatly comforted by it. ... thinking "Maybe OW is NOT a better woman than I."

Because Kiwi THAT THOUGHT, as ridiculous as it seems, is EXACTLY what all betrayed spouses fear ....

"The OP is better than I.
Better in bed.
Better at conversation.
Better to look at.
Funnier.
More talented.
Better cook."

This thread was not intended to help you. It was intended to help the betrayed deal with something that, at first, is very difficult to grasp. The OP is NOT better.

Point taken.

After my shower I was going to come back and delete but I guess I'll leave it there.

Feeling very vulnerable today after watching my baby girl (25) "leaving on a jet plane" for the other side of the world. She (and boyfriend) won't be back until Christmas.

Jen, I felt the same thing reading this thread as you, in fact it gave me that feeling of anxiety I still get sometimes remembering...the panic attack type feeling.

But you know Pep is right in her post above. It still pains me that the exBS is my case may still be suffering with self-worth issues, fear, anxiety of not being as wonderful (blech, puke) as I was to take her husband away.

She could have saved her marriage if she had come here and worked the plans, especially a good Plan A, followed by a good Plan B.

I did the good Plan A because I was blindly in love with him, followed by a good Plan B when I found out he was married. (didn't know that's what it was)

I won (yea right) because of this reason and this reason alone. Because I cut him off completely after he was addicted to my plan A behavior.

It pains me to write that, but it is the truth.

{{Jen}}

Just last night I had the very thoughts Pep mentioned about OP being better looking, better lover blah blah blah.. some days we need to read things like this. We all know ~you~ are not that person any more just as I am not the MW to sOM anymore.

In reality, my thoughts are that the OP is all about newness....a doc buddy of mine calls it "looking for strange" when he hears of a guy cheating...it's NOT that the OP is better in bed...more attractive...cooks better..it's that it's DIFFERENT AND A FANTASY to get outta the way of bill paying, babies crying, chores to be done etc.

that's what the OP has over the BS...and what is it???PURE BS...AND I DON'T MEAN BETRAYED SPOUSE! It's smoke and mirrors. Pure smoke and mirrors.

I posted this b/c I wanted to COMFORT THE BS...It was NOT INTENDED TO DO ANYTHING FOR THE OP OR XOP HERE...not meant to be mean at all...JUST STATING WHAT I KNOW AND BELIEVE IN MY HEART TO INDEED BE FACTUAL...and b/c it was originally written by an OW and posted with much activity on "that site" I thought it was best served by posting it here...so we can BREAK THE BUBBLE OF MYSTERY AND GET IT THAT THE OP IS NO BETTER THAN US...AND TO KNOW THAT THEIR RELATIONSHIP IS DOOMED FROM THE GET GO.

Even my xh...in his present affair marriage...has cheated on her. He didn't really intend for a future with her...she just up'd the ante and deliberately got preggers. Was only way she could "win"..and win? what did she win? she got a man who's cheated on her from day one...never a day of fidelity in their relationship. at least three other documented affairs since their unholy union two years ago...and he's had one particularly painful affair for her (what the wistress directly told me btw) that one of the girls was "a carbon copy of you peach...of the pictures I saw of you when you two had first started dating"...since then, the wistress refers to blonde haired women as "straw haired monsters"...she winces with pain whenever she sees photos of either britney spears or reese witherspoon (whom my xh thinks I look a bit like both).

the infidels have a game running. and its our job to bust up the game. they want the money...they want the power...they imagine on a daily basis WHAT THE H AND WIFEY ARE DOING AT HOME...they get very jealous..they want exactly what we have...to quote the movie "silence of the lambs"...the mistresses "COVET WHAT THEY SEE EVERY DAY". they sure do as per my reading their site. and yes! they either totally discount the role of the wife in the marriage or they just diss the wife at any opportunity for the most part there.

they do.

it's a fact.

BUT IT IS A SHARED FAILURE...IT IS A PROBLEM AND A SIN THAT ARISES FROM BOTH OF THEIR ACTIONS...THE WS AND THE OP...

I DO NOT SINGELY BLAME THE OW. it takes two to tango.

but it is sure easy to compare the OP favorably when compared to your wifey you see each day, who washes your clothes, does the dishes, has morning breath, changes diapers, asks you to mow the lawn (no sex pun here), or take out the garbage. the OW presents to the H a pure fantasy of indulgence and hero worship. INDULGENCE AND HERO WORSHIP...yea I said it. that's what she offers. fantasy and indulgence and hero worship.

tell a wife who's worked a nine hour workday who comes home to a hungry child and husband and then straightened up the house to suddenly jump into sex kitten mode instantly and come upstairs and give a sensual massage to her H all the while having perfect hair and makeup and I'd bet she would tell you you're off your rocker! we JUST CAN'T DO ALL THAT EVERYDAY...now I and many of us women here DO SOME OF THIS STUFF ALL THE TIME...but we can't drop our entire lives for giving our mates nonstop hero worship and fantasy and say "it's ok honey...I want you to live in fantasyland. from now on, NO MOVING GRASS, NO GARBAGE, NO CHORES, NO BILL PAYING, NO STIFF MUSCLES...YOU ARE TO BE IDOLIZED AND WORSHIPPED...I JUST WON'T FEED THE KIDS OR DO HOUSEWORK OR ANY THING ANYMORE..I WILL DROP IT ALL TO MAKE AND MEET ALL NEEDS AND WHIMS YOU MAY HAVE."

it just doesn't happen.

We can't balance it all. we can give all, but in different spurts and at different times. even the supermom/wife isn't that good...but we try...WE ARE TRYING.

and the OP offers a lie. THEY OFFER A LIE. that's what it is.

the ws at first b/c they do feel good...go along with things...they like it as it is...and sooner or later one or the other..the wife or mistress demands more. and depending on the addiction/depth of the affair, one will no longer survive...the affair or the marriage.

sad thing is this...

if the WS chooses the infidel over the wife...

the fantasy will die...it will die almost immediately or die a painful and sordid death that will drag the infidels down with it over a period of five years or less....THIS IS MY THOUGHT ON THAT...FIVE YEARS OR LESS...heck, I give my xh and the wistress less than a year.

the true power does lie with us. WE HAVE TO KNOW HOW TO COMBAT THE FANTASY...

I think implementing along the way the 180 list helps in this category btw. we forget that we can be desirable..we can be as alluring..and we hold the cards sometimes when entrenched in this painful war we wage.

I posted this so THE BS HERE CAN TAKE BACK THE POWER.

More from the ow....I like this one...why they think sex is soo good with a married guy. here's one infidel's thoughts on the subject:

"I think it is a combination of things.

a) A very strong attraction in the first place - an EMR is not something to be entered into lightly by either party - you have to really want someone to take the chance.

b) Not seeing someone day in day out. Familiarity breeds content, sex with the same person day in day out gets dull.

c) Forbidden fruit. The element of doing something you shouldn't spices up sex.

d) The anticipation of being with someone who is not always an arm's length away. To quote an English saying: 'if there are always biscuits in the biscuit jar, who wants biscuits?' - the lack of opportunity to be together makes it special.

e) The secrecy of the affair means that both of you have the power to hurt the other in terms of revealing what is going on etc. I think that makes for a shared intimacy and bond.

Just my views. An EMR stays like the first few heady months of a R for many years, simply because of the lack of time spent together and the lack of the domestic elements of a R which can make it jaded."


AHHHHHH...EVEN THE OW TOTALLY KNOW IT'S FAKE...they know it's all fantasy.

It's a total fantasy head f(ck. that's what it is.

It's a disneyland thrill ride.

it's based on lies and fantasies.

and REALITY ALWAYS INTERCEDES...AND TRUTH ALWAYS WINS...EVEN IN THE END.

I hope I don't cause too many OW (present ones only...sorry) to have palpitations...but this is the truth.

Your role is temporary. It is not to be a lifetime made. It has a foundation of quicksand and will sink over a short while.

We gotta take back the power!

WHAT IS TAKING BACK THE POWER:
1)brave ENOUGH TO CONFRONT AND EXPOSE WITH DIGNITY AND TRUTH ONLY
2)adding 180 list and touches of our own personal fantasies to interject when felt like, into our comfy marriages...give the OW a run for her fantasy pretend money.
3)learning our spouse's en's and doing a great plan A.
4)learning when to say when and cut the ws off if no affair is severed after a flawless plan A and going into plan B...
5)being the kind of spouse you'd want to come home to...but the kind that you're too happy and comfy with to ever leave.
6)not ever really giving in to the affair...NEVER! I didn't, won't and never will.

and numero seven...
the most deadly to the affair
7)IT IS OVER ONLY WHEN THE BS DECLARES IT SO.

the power really lies with you.

It totally made me wanna hurl again when I read that the fact that OP COULD EXPOSE IT made me sick...sick sick....the fact they KNOW IT'S A GAME...WITH HIGH STAKES...and that a family and kids and a future is whwat is at stake...and that they just don't care b/c it feels good. BECAUSE IT FEELS GOOD...it makes me sick.

get angry enough reading this so that you will get enough courage to fight the good fight. My marriage WAS WORTH MORE THAN A FANTASY...IT WAS WORTH MORE THAN A THRILL...IT DIED MANY YEARS BEFORE IT SHOULD HAVE...AND SADLY...we still miss each other as it's easily read in our feelings and interactions...isn't your marriage worth giving your all? isn't it worth a spouse getting spunky? Isn't your family worth your very best effort here? after all you would NOT be here at MB if you didn't have the try still left within you. do not give up. fight it.

learn the enemy ways. learn OUR WAYS OF TRUTH...combat it justly...do not go gently into that good night.

and remember...just b/c they may be living together...or just b/c they may seem happy...IT IS OVER WHEN YOU SAY IT IS SO...AND YOU WILL DECIDE THAT. it is not the OP's right. IT IS YOURS. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

I hope my presence here on the boards is a dose of expresso to the OP out there...the practicing ones. I am the kinda bs ya don't want hanging around...ever! I got it. I learned alot. I may have divorced b/c of an ultimatum of the highest degree (blackmail surrounding pregnancy of ow), but I WILL NOT GO DOWN EVER LIGHTLY...my fight may not yet be done. sorry, it's the truth. I became the attractive, smart, go getter and shed my housewifey clothes for scrubs and sharp labcoat again. I grew my hair out again, worked out, and made darn sure my thoughts WON OVER MY EMOTIONS. Now we're two years out...and I am thinking differently.

I have the power. IT LIES WITH THE BS.

OUR POWER IS IN WORKING THE PLANS!!!

I think you are on target, Peach...

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Yea girl.

the problem I see here is TIMIDITY.

I live out loud. I am not timid. sure I was frightened of exposure...and heck, exposure with the present wistress was NOT TO BE SOMETHING THAT WORKED...why? she was from a family where her own dad left her mom, her mom died, thus she was raised by her infidel father, and her own sister was living in sin with her bf...barely 19 at the time. so exposure didn't work a lick on her family. only thing this chickie responds to is unpleasantness.

the plans do work. and they work if they are believed in.

truth stands. lies fail.

it's as simple as that.

I just want these bs here to regain their self worth. their self confidence. the power lies from within to grasp WHAT THE AFFAIR AND THE AFFAIREES ARE...WHAT IT IS...HOW TO DEFEAT IT...IT HAS A PLAN TOO. if you understand it, totally grasp it, WHICH I DID NOT AS A BS, but do now, it can 100 percent come down...even after a divorce.

and even if the bs bows out...the affair will end. it will end. too much has gone down. too many things SACRIFICED FOR THE AFFAIR. too much loss and pain. well, maybe some hysterical bonding can occur...but we all know that's short lived....

btw...hurtinginok? your wh and his ow are simply hysterical bonding right now. especially after the ow received your letter...lol! hence, the return of your comforter...the equivalent of hurting's little navy dress in the oval office...lmao! no wonder the ow wanted that comforter out...IT SURELY DIDN'T COMFORT HER! and rightly so!

Mimi, it's all about perceptions. and so many of us wonder what in the hades is going on with the fogged. it's hard to know. but I truly believe that deep down they have some sort of idea what it is they are doing...but they just for some reason push the rational thought to the back of their head and let the pleasure centers of their brains take over...that's what I don't get.

and we gotta find out what will make the RATIONAL THOUGHT TAKE OVER...only thing I know? make sure THE BS BRINGS AS MUCH PLEASURE when the WS is in cake mode...while HAVING GOOD BOUNDARIES...and then applying enough DISPLEASURE/PAIN to the other areas when appropriate so that REALITY IS INJECTED INTO THE AFFAIR.

who? do I have something here?

FIND WAYS TO INJECT REALITY INTO THE AFFAIR. LIke send the bills to the WS at the affair shack. Make him pay his obligations there and feel the stress of balancing checkbooks...and if they don't do it, have a lawyer come over and demand he do it. do as orchid did and send all his dirty duds over so the ow can play washerwoman as we do.

I think we're onto something here!

INJECT REALITY INTO THE AFFAIR..,FIND APPLICABLE WAYS TO DO SO. And YOU, THE BS INJECT SOME FANTASY INTO THE MARRIAGE WHEN APPLICABLE. that means full out vicky's secret, cuteness, and good dinners which are still ways to man's heart. or shopping/day spas/jewelry/affection if your WS is a woman.

wow!

that's USING TOTAL REVERSE PSYCHOLOGY...I LOVE IT!

I LOVE IT I LOVE IT I LOVE IT!

peach...i just have to say YOU are the bomb!!!!

i so enjoy your posts!!!! this one and the 180....

thanks to you...working it right now as we speak while the WH is lying on the bed beside me!!!!

thanks girl... you deserve a dozen more roses!!! and a hunk of a man delivering them!!!

Jaysmom

GETTING INSIDE THE HEADS OF THE INFIDELS...

Geeze, there's a lot of space here.... Let's decorate! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

L.

Hey Peachy - Glad I read this post!!! I needed that!!!!




Yea - I picked up "The Divide" at the library. I thought I could read it even though the H in this book has an A & leaves his wife.(not the main story line & I dind't know it was even going to be part of the story!!) It's hit too close to home!!!!!! Had to put it down & won't be finishing it.

Kim

I think you are so onto something.

PLAN B injects REALITY into the A. PLAN A injects FANTASY into a previously stale marriage....PERFECT, Peachy...

My H was the KING of CAKE-EATERS from D-Day onwards. I think he would have held onto both of us for as long as possible if D-Day had not occurred...

What spelled the END of his AFFAIR finally was: (1) when he thought I was gone and NO OPTION of anymore FANTASY with me...He really ENJOYED the wife that I was during PLAN A..wanted her to return...I'm still that wife, BTW, haven't changed back and (2) when he realized that the OW could not do REALITY during PLAN B..did not want to do REALITY..she wanted to keep the FANTASY LIFE going..he actually said this..I'm not exactly sure what he meant..he said that he could not keep that up 24/7 and neither could she...I imagine that she wanted to continue a lot of partying and drinking and did not want to take care of her daughter..cook dinner..clean the house..etc...who knows...

I have to admit to be one who dwelled on my hatred for the OW. I continue to feel, from my religious perspective, that she will burn in he// if she does not repent..I have not forgiven her for what she has done to me and my family,etc...long story....

However, I have changed in my thinking about this from a worldly perspective. IMO, now, OW are just normal people like any of us. There is nothing really SPECIAL about her...IMO, what WSes and OP have in common is the CHOICE that they made to go beyond the BOUNDARIES that need to be established around relationships. Once they stepped outside of that BOUNDARY, then they became ADDICTED to the thrill and excitement of that RELATIONSHIP. Once ADDICTED, then they came up with all kinds of RATIONALIZATIONS for why it's OK...

I think there can be zillions of different reasons for CROSSING OVER THE BOUNDARY..on the pathological side, some folks are psychopaths and have never had normal relationships, don't want normal relationships..then there are the evildoers..then there are normal, God-fearing people like me who are tempted for some reason or another and get caught up...I could be depressed and I could start a friendship with a man in my office who brought me coffee each day...I could see it happening really...

Stepping back from all of this now...I think it is ESSENTIAL FOR US ALL to maintain SAFEGUARDS and BOUNDARIES in our dealings with the opposite sex and to PAY CLOSE ATTENTION DAILY to OUR MARRIAGES..giving our MARRIAGES priority and TENDER LOVING CARE...



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