I am reading Love Busters, but only just started chapter 3, so I know about Giver and Taker, but none of the LB's in general.... She says she needs time to trust me and that she has anger and hurt... I have been giving her space and she has been a little closer to me, I get a hug and a kiss in the morning and one at night before bed... As long as we are moving forward, I am willing to give her what she needs and give her time.. Again, just putting my kids to bed at night is worth all the trouble..

Regarding the OM.. We are all family friends, she was seeing him daily at the YMCA, and talking to him on the phone... I knwo all that stopped, he is working on my marriage and in MC with his wife, I have talked him and her, and they are actually doing much better.. I am sure the EA is over, and know even there friendship is over..

Also, there are books I see people talking about, but only there ab's... like Kaa or something..
I have Love Busters and HNHN's, but what else do I need to order and read??? I spend as much time as I can reading, I try for 30 to 60 minutes a night.. WW is stil not coming to bed till 1:30AM after last feeding of 3MO, so I have time...

What does WW do all that time until 1:30? Is she on the computer by any chance? Could she be talking to OM on the phone while you are asleep?

You need to be suspicious - they could all be lying to you very easily - you need to verify as much as you can - you really can't trust these people right now.

OH trust me there, she was sitting up IMing OM and talking to him and that is how I caught him.. She actually sleeps on the couch, I IM OM and keep him IM up on my computer to see when he goes idle and when he is on, just to keep track of him.. I am 100% postive that since I told him no IM's there have been none.. I know the EA is over, OM has moved on, but WW I think was still taking as much as he would give, which is nothing now.. There is a laptop in the living room that she can use while I am in bed, but lets just say I know she is not using it.. Also, I look at the phone 100 times till she comes to bed to make sure it does not say LINE IN USE.. And I go online and check her cell phone to make sure she is not using it..

then what does she do until 1:30?

I see. I understand everything now.

Heck, the OM isn’t smart enough to have changed his IM login, gotten a new ISP, changed from the IM program in use a few weeks ago to a new one, or anything like that, huh? Also, I guess neither he nor your WW have figured out how to buy one of those disposable cell phones at the convenience store down the block so they can call each other whenever they want? Oh, and they haven't shifted to Hotmail or Yahoo email accounts, right? Yeah, I suppose her not doing that would explain why her system password has been changed so you can’t check.

I guess there's no way for them to meet each other somewhere during the day either. You have that covered, right? They must be so stupid. I mean…they must be if they haven’t figured out a way to make that happen. My goodness. I mean, you work all day and she's at home but you trust this pastor to only be interested in saving his own marriage so there’s no question of inappropriate meetings with your wife who just wants you to leave her alone. It’s a good thing you know they aren’t doing that.

Of course, one might question how this pastor thought he was saving his marriage by making plans to be with your wife, but that's probably not important, right? He’s a changed man. He’s seen the light. He told you so and he wouldn’t lie…any more than he already has, probably.

Okay, I think I've got all that.

Is this a Christian church? Id so, Duglas, you have a responsibility to either take this to the head of the deacons or to make sure OM takes it to the deacons (and dotn trust that he does...make sure that he does).

If he is truly repentant, then he as a pastor KNOWS that he must take this to the deacons because of his position. This is not a job at Cisco! This is the pastor of a church. This stuff WILL get out...it always does. It is better if he and the deacons work thru this and that they come alongside him to help him move forward. It does nto necessarily mean he must step down...that will be up to the deacons.

The OM (pastor) has a responsibility here. You also have a responsibility. The best way to keep this from blowing up for ALL involved and maybe destroy a church, is to have the deacons go "closed door" with the pastor and deal with this.

Any other way is not the way Scripture tells us we should be.

You are responsible to your church, Duglas. If you care for your pastor as much as you say, then you must do this in order to move past this.

Satan will find a way to use this for his purposes if you TRY TO keep it secret. Count on it!

In His arms.

Loghorn.. If it is like you state, and she is lying to me about everything, then it is not worth trying anyways.. 1 time, shame on you, 2nd time, shame on me...
I am worried she will read this one day so I can not say everything I know and how I know it, but I took the advise of people on this forum and I know she is not talking to him in the house or in the car, The OM has called me crying because of what happened, his wife has called me asking me to call him and talk to him because he was depressed and remoseful over what happened.. In his eyes, they are done, he gives her no signals, nothing.. Me and OM talked today for almost a hour today, I know they are done, I knew something was going and and found out, I know it is over and have ways to make sure... SO that part is done.. I beleive that my wife has Emotional Needs that she is not getting from me now and that she was getting from him, even as friends, that is why I told them both no contact, even if it was over, them talking was still filling her love tank and that is something she should be getting from her Husband.. So, they are not talking now, that part I am sure of....

Someone asked what was she doing till 1:30Am.. she lays on the couch around 11 and falls asleep, I tell her good night and go upstairs around 11:30, I email and check out this site till 12 or so, then get ready for bed and read, All that time I can see her when I walk by the stairs and know she is sleeping.. Also, our daughter (3.5YO) gets up to go to the bathroom between 12 and 1 and I check on the WW then too, and she is still asleep.. As a matter of fact, the last 3 days I woke up between 1:30 and 2 and checked on her and she was still asleep, and I had to wake her up, and she fed him and came to bed..
Last night I took her body pillow that she puts between us and threw it on the floor.. but she did get it and put the wall between us again.. but at least she came to bed and I got to put my kids to bed another night...

Duglas,

I believe your wife has stopped the A...and the others here believe in precautions...which I believe you take, anyway. This is a really emotional time for you, and by being here, I can feel it tugging on my own for you.

Here are the acronyms on the books:

Surviving An Affair
His Needs, Her Needs

I also recommend ('cuz I'm reading it now), Boundaries in Marriage by Cloud & Townsend...many printings on this one.

There are so many, Duglas! It's marvelous people out there sharing all they know in books. Good self-care. I'm glad you're reading.

I understand you get might feel down, and then up, and then in the middle...when you post, you're posting your truth. I reacted as Long and 193 did to your pain...because we care...that the part you do to yourself can be controlled...not the other parts.

You're doing great...this was the biggest trial of my life...and I've had a few...so please, if you're going to expect, then make them reasonable, kind and very wide expectations, 'k?

LA

Well.. Just a little update.. I guess power went out today, and WW got home for the YMCA and saw her computer is off.. She turned it on and it comes up fine, then I call because I can not connect to my computer, and she gets an IP CONFLICT ERROR on her screen, her computer and my computer have the same IP ADDRESS.. Well, I own an IT Company and work on computers all day, so she is sure I did something or got into her computer.. When what really happened is that I have a static IP in my computer, and she gets one from the router, and the router gave her my ip because it is the first one..
So, now she thinks I tried to or did something to her computer.. She thinks I can change her password but I cannot without her knowing it.. UUUUUUUGGGGGGGG she is at a friends now, says she needs space and will not be home till it is time to put our 3.5YO to bed.. Is it supposed to be this hard and tear you up this bad.. She had the EA right???

Sure it's supposed to be hard - it's all your fault, remember?

Hang in there.

I'll probably have a bad night too. That's what beer is for.

OK, now I need advise.. WW gave me a "give her space or she is out the door speach"... She wants nothing to do with me and when we are together, it is either cold or down right rude...
I thought I could put up with this but I really think this is some kind of bad abuse because I am tore up and hate to be around her... My desire to fix up is turning into resentment and anger... I went from smothering her and trying to be around her to not wanting anything to with her... She still says she needs time and space and that we can get to a place where we are "happy" together for the kids at least... I am kinda thinking that is not really worth it anymore....
I would rather have the kids 50% of the time and be happy, then being in this situtation....

So, my real question, is there a Plan B or anything I can do to distance myself from her so she can work on herself before my resentment and anger for how she is treating me turns to hate and no real desire to fix us???

We have a house we just sold and we get $50K on 5-17, I have been thinking lately that I can give her half of it and tell her to go find a place of her own... I know that if I tell her that, that our marriage is almost surly over....

SOOOOOO, any advice on what I should do here, my true desire is to fix my marriage, but not to be around someone who says she wants to fix us, but treats me sooo darn badly..

You talked to OM for an hour and you're convinced the affair is over.

"OM has moved on."

"WW gave me a "give her space or she is out the door speach"..."

I'll say the affair continues.

I'm just skeptical.

I don't understand why you trust this scumbag.

But maybe you're right - OM has moved on - to another married woman.

Exactly what is the reason you don't want to expose this church official to the church authorities? A known - and possibly continuing adulterer - lurking among your friends if not still conforting with your wife?

Do this since you're communicating with OM: ask him to send your wife a NC letter. Whether he does will speak volumes.

WAT

OM has broken off communication with both of us, he has not contacted my wife in anyway in over a week, he also will not talk to me either.. Him and his wife are fine, and he thinks he is doing no good talking to me or her.. So, OM is out of the picture completely, I know this for sure..

Dug, reading your words and also between the lines, I see you aren't going to expose this adultery and you aren't going to apply MB precepts to recover your marriage. You don't seem to understand the MB plan is one coherent strategy and you don’t get to use bits and pieces where you think they fit. Frankly, you don’t have the experience with this to be able to determine which pieces work and which don’t in your situation.

On the other hand, the folks who have been posting to you out here DO have that expertise. They’ve already been through what you’re just starting to experience and they know what is in store for you. The weird thing is, most adulteries are “cookie-cutter” in scope and operation. The words, the behavior, the tone of voice are all the same. You believe your situation is unique because you’ve never had to deal with one before? It’s not. When people say they see flags in your wife’s behavior, it’s because it happens over and over and…you get the point.

Actually, Dug, I've seen a number of folks like you over the last year and a half I've been lurking and now posting here. For some reason, there are people who base the rest of their marriages on trusting their adulterous spouse to suddenly be willing to tell the truth. Huh? How curious a concept. Adultery is founded in lies and exists in deceit. Where is the logic in suddenly believing them when they say the adultery is over?

Dug, there is a narrow window of opportunity when a betrayed spouse can end a wayward spouse's adultery and fix the marriage. Your window is closing quickly and I hate seeing that. You and I both know there's no ironclad guarantee MB principles and techniques will regain your marriage for you, but it's the best bet you have. If you won’t do the things you need to do, you might be one of those who come back here a year or so later and lament you should have listened to others. I’d hate to see that, but in my view, that’s where you’re headed.

Good luck, Dug. I doubt you will succeed in making your marriage work using your methods, but I wish ill luck to no one. Best wishes.

duglas - If I have learned one thing as a result of my W's EA - it's that I don't know anything for sure regarding W - my point is: just don't be too sure of anything -

why don't you expose OM just for revenge - I know that's a bad reason, not nice, not Christian, blah blah blah - but OM has messed up your life and you still think he's a friend - you need to mess his up -

I didn't tell OMW in my case to get even with OM, but I will admit it was a nice side benefit and I do hope his life has been truly crappy since then - unfortunately, I am not sure it has ....

OK, if I believe it or not, I know that them having any realtionship at all hurts me and our chances..
I told them both in an email today that I believe there is nothing going on between them but that for me they can not see, talk to or have any contact with each other..
I also told them that even if it is over and they do not understand why, that me needing them apart should be reason enough, and if WW was unwilling to break all contact that she should move out till she can, or I will get a seperation aggreement and leave myself till she cares how I am feeling..

He replied and said he is sorry for everything and will break all contact 100%, and promised not to contact her and will go to a different YMCA just to make sure not to see her.. I have not heard from my wife yet, she was actually having lunch with OM's wife when I sent the email...

We talked last night, she is still saying she is emotionally scared and has not desire to trust me with her feelings again YET and that she is working on herself.... I do not have anything to do but sit and wait.. I know that she actually wants me to do nothing for her and wants to give nothing in return...

So, I might be hard headed, but I am listening...

Well, just an update.. I told you about the email, the OM said OK, but the wife through a fit, told me that I was trying to control her and not give her space.. All the normal crap.. then told me she needed time alone and that needed to leave for a few weeks... I told her no way, not without a seperation aggreement, so she wrote on a piece I paper that she asked me to leave, not that I abondened her.... I told her to leave and take the kids, but she did not want to.. WE have a 4MO so I could not take them, she is nursing..
So, I am off to stay at an extended stay hotel.. She said give her a few days, I said will she be ready to give him up in a few days, she said NO.. I said OK, talk to you then and packed a few days worth of clothes and left...

My bet is that the OM will be over to your house in the next 48 hours.

thanks for your kind words..........
Actually, I went there this morning to pick something up and her mother was there in her PJ's so I asked and she said she was staying the night till we worked through this... So maybe she will agree to my terms

Very foolish.

Very, very foolish.

Go home right away. Start a new thread announcing when you do, I'll not spend anymore time on this one.

WAT