H Iamsosorry!

I am so proud of you after reading the thoughts that you are expressing in your posts. You are doing a good job here and remind me of my H after he started to get on board with how to recover the situation.

I feel so guilty about not getting my H here yet! We have not had the right moment for me to bring this up yet and were also working through some minor hostilities this week regarding the house and kids...now that we have that under control I think I can address your need for his help! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I just wanted to say to not give her space, that will backfire and make her not feel loved! What you did by just listening and rubbing her back and confirming the mistakes you made are huge! If you give her space she will likely feel like you are "getting over it". So the listening, back rubbing, validating statements, e-cards are so important! Email her every day with a little note that says something like "just wanted you to know you are on my mind...how are you feeling today? and point out something great about her like...you did such a great job handling (blank) with dd (dear daughter) last night. She needs to hear how she is terrific right now even if she doesn't seem to believe it and even if it seems to point her right back to the affair, as in , well if I was so great then why?

I am so very proud of you two. Keep up the very difficult but ultimately rewarding work that you are doing. I advised her on her thread also to read all the info on the 10 EN's and then print out the EN questionaire, take it and then share it with each other. This helped us so immensely.

Blessings Iam!
Glad

Thank you so much for the words of encouragement. I need that from time to time because I sit and wonder if what I am doing is right. I don't want to screw up!! I don't hear it(thank you) from my wife and I don't expect to but it's nice to know I am on the right path this time unlike before. This time don't want to be selfish (during recovery), so it's good to know I will have to answer to the MB community if at any time I am. You mentioned about sending e-mails to her to let her know I am thinking about her...Well I just sent her an e-mail right before I came on here. I apologized for being a bit distant from her the last day and a half. I get in these moods where I get scared that one day she is just gonna give up on us and quit the fight. I know how hard this is for her. I often sit and wonder , how am I gonna live with what I've done and then I wonder how can I expect her to live with what I've done if I am have trouble living with it! I hate what I did! I get so upset with myself sometimes because I had/have the best wife in the world and I broke her heart!

I appreciate all the help you have given my wife . I also want to Thank you for the time you have taken to keep me going . I value your (and Kiwij) opinion whole heartedly. I have checked my ego and pride at the door and want to follow the MB communities advise 100% . I Love my wife very much and I can't want till we get over this mountain and are able sit at the top and look down on where we have been and where we are going.

Oh before I go... what does ENs mean? You had mentioned something about looking at the 10 ENs?

Also how are thing going on your end? Busy week huh?

Hey Sorry,

Please read my recent post to CO. Let me know your thoughts.

Thanks,

KJ

My wife and I have an agreement that I don't go on her thread and she doesn't go on mine so if you want me to know what you wrote her you will have to copy and paste it to my thread. I would love to read what you wrote so understand our agreement. I must admit it is very tempting every day to click and read what she is writing or venting about but I don't want to lose her trust any more than I already have . So if you could take the time to paste what you wrote her to this thread and I will let you know what I think...Thanks

Not a problem! Here ya go!

Hello CO,

You don't know me 'cuz I've been posting in Recovery, but KiwiJ recommended I look at some of your posts. She thought a FWS's perspective might be helpful to you.

This is a long thread, I couldn't read it all, so I apologize if I repeat things you've already heard. I'd like to start with your most recent post;


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I guess that is my biggest EN is being faithful and that's not on the list.


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You're wrong about this, it fits under Family Committment. A family can be just a H and W, w/out kids. He was not committed to you, his "family."


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I wish my H did more of the service type things. He never once helped me around the house. But that's not and EN either, that is a love language, right?


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Wrong again. It's called Domestic Support, and happens to be one of my top 5 EN's.


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I never showed a need for him.


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That means you missed opportunities to show affection, almost always one of men's top 5.


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I think once I stabalize emotionally we will do the ENs together.


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Nope. If you wait for your moods to stabilize, you surely won't heal your M because you'll be dead in your grave from old age. Do it NOW. No offense, but you clearly do not understand EN's enough at this point. And you haven't even addressed LB's I'll bet. Almost everyone in the Recovery section of this forum has an extremely clear understanding of EN's, that's why they're in recovery. You, my dear, are not moving forward in recovery, and from what I read, neither is your H. I STRONGLY suggest you do the EN Questionnaire together, very soon. Don't forget to discuss them when you're done completing it, 'cuz that's where you'll really see the benefits.

You're very depressed, that's very understandable. Ask yourself, "what do I need to do for me, that will get me to a place where I can devote myself to the recovery of my M?" The answer is, whatever it takes. Have you considered asking your MD about anti-depressants? They help "take the edge off," so you can focus. Many people here take them (myself included), and all agree they help with this.

In a much earlier post, you were asking questions about why your H had an A when you thought your M was perfect. My H didn't see my A coming either. He knew we were in need of improvement, but had no idea where I was at. Like Dr. Harley says, no one is immune to having an A, given the right conditions, we are all vulnerable to having an A (that's not a direct quote, but you get the idea). I'd like to share some insight I got from Steve Harley, about why your H had an A. This is also pertinent to preventing yourself from having an A:


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I had an A because I didn't protect my weaknesses. If you are a WS or FWS, you had your A for the exact same reason. There is NO OTHER reason or cause for an A. Allow me to give you the example SH gave me, because I didn't truely understand this concept until he gave me this explanation.

First Scenerio:
Let's say you are married, and for several years you have not felt like your spouse has been meeting any of your EN's (although you didn't know what to call your EN's at the time). You felt lonely, unloved, and weren't sure you felt any love toward your spouse any longer. You were depressed about all of the above. You start talking to a co-worker one day, and find the attention and compliments they give you to be very flattering. You find yourself looking forward to seeing this person at work. After a few weeks, this person invites you to lunch, or out for a couple of drinks. You continue to share more and more with this person. Before you realize it, this person has taken the place of your spouse, and are meeting so many of your EN's that you fall in love with this OP.

Second Scenerio: (this one is just for you!)
You are married. In your opinion, happily married. You and your spouse share your deepest thoughts and emotions. You work hard at meeting each other's EN's. There is nothing you would change in your M. You start talking to a co-worker one day, and find the attention and compliments they give you to be very flattering. You find yourself looking forward to seeing this person at work. After a few weeks, this person invites you to lunch, or out for a couple of drinks. You continue to share more and more with this person. Before you realize it, this person has taken the place of your spouse, and are meeting so many of your EN's that you fall in love with this OP.

Okay, here's where the lesson comes. In both scenerios, a spouse ends up falling in love with another person. Did the spouse in scenerio #2 fall in love because their EN's were not being met? NO. They fell in love because they DID NOT PROTECT THEIR WEAKNESSES. Now they are in love with 2 different people.

Did the poor condition of the M in scenerio #1 contribute to the spouse being more suseptible to having an A? Quite possible. But again, they didn't fall in love because their EN's weren't being met. They fell in love because they DID NOT PROTECT THEIR WEAKNESSES.

What are some examples of weaknesses? I have several, so allow me to share this with you. I have an incredible inability to express my deepest feelings and emotions with anyone, including my H. When I began feeling empty in our M, rather than discuss this with him, I chose to allow someone else to make deposits into my love bank. Before I knew what had happened, I fell in love with this OP. I chose not to tell my H how I was feeling. Heck, I don't think I was even honest with myself! But enough about my situation, I want people reading this to grasp this concept in the worst way. IMO, this is a huge stepping stone toward recovery in anyone's M that's had an A involved. It's important for BOTH spouses to understand this concept. It makes the WS accountable for their choices. It allows the BS freedom from feeling like their spouse had an A because they weren't meeting his/her EN's. It reduces the chance for the BS to blame the whole thing on themselves.



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I understand that what I did was selfish, immature, and cruel. My H was not meeting my EN's pre-A. Still, these are not reasons or excuses for having our A's. We did not protect our weaknesses, plain and simple. The rest of my life will be filled with conscious efforts of how I am going to protect my weaknesses. Understanding what your weaknesses are isn't enough. You need to have a plan on how you are going to protect them, so that you never have another A.

I'd best stop here or you'll think I'm full of it! Honestly, I don't usually ramble on this much, but sometimes you feel it's necessary in order to get your message through.

Please don't give up on your M. The fact you are both still living under the same roof is a very good thing. Take your R to the next level, do the EN exercises, begin to have constructive conversations. Be kind to one another, respect each other. Keep reading on here (perhaps try the "Recovery section?) for support and advice. Remember, you won't fail, unless you stop trying.

God bless,

KJ

Hi KJ,
I just read thru the post you sent my wife. I think it was very straight forward on what needs to be done to move forward. I get a little frustrated sometimes because it seems like my wife is in a rut. I wonder if she just expects the marriage to fix itself. I know asking me to come home was a huge step and I can't take that away but since I have been home(two weeks) we haven't moved anywhere. I think I have moved forward as far as being a lot better in supporting her and being there for her. I have MB to thank for that. The hard part is it almost seems like she is going back wards and the kicker is she's the one who told me to "come back home because I don't want to talk about the past anymore, I just wanted to focus on the marriage and working on keeping our family together".I guess I was just kidding myself and being selfish when I was expecting more than just coming home so everyday she could vent and tell me how much I have ruined her life(while the children are standing right there <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />)! I have been biting my tongue the whole time and just trying to understand where she is coming from but I sometimes feel like I was mislead when she asked me to come home and cried together as she told me she was ready to let the past go and work on doing what ever she had to do to keep this family together. But then I ask myself, who am I to complain ...I should just be happy she didn't divorce my unfaithful butt! I love her very much and I told her today I know she doesn't know how to handle this situation I put her in and I just wanted her to know that no matter how she handles it I will support her to the end.

O kay now back to your post...I don't know if it matter or not but I didn't love the OW. Right now I couldn't care less about how she is doing. My wife always makes me angry(i think she knows this too) when she says if the OW called or showed up at my door step I would fall right back into it. I get so mad because it is so far from the truth! I hate that I had anything to do with the OW! My time with her was a mistake...a huge mistake!! She wasn't even that good looking but if you read the e-mails I wrote to the OW (which my wife did) you would think the OW was a 11 on a scale of 1-10 . But my wife would never believe that and how can I blame her. This is gonna make KiwiJ's " BS detector" go off again <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> but sex with my wife is better than OW. What does that mean? One would think the OW was better and thats why I met her the second time but she wasn't! I sit and ask myself these types of questions often. The only thing I can think of is maybe I just liked the fact that it was someone new. I can honestly say if OW and my wife were in front of me right now and I could have either one with no penelties... I would not even hesitate to choose my wife. She is a better sex partner by far. Does this make any sense? Please help!

You also made a comment in your post that my wife and I are not doing what we got to do to move forward...well what exactly can I do? I really can't move anywhere without her , can I? This is a marriage , it only takes one to destroy but it will take two to build it! I am all for taking the EN questionnaire but what good would that do if I have no one to share it with. Well no one that really cares about what I need right now. My needs are the last thing on my wifes list and I don't blame her! I have to prove myself worthy of receiving my EN fulfilled.

Well I really appreciate you taking the time to lead us in the right direction and I hope you don't post and run <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />...keep in touch, I think your knowledge will be greatly valued!

No, my BS detector didn't go off because it was the same for me.

Iamso, your wife is really struggling with the betrayal. It's understandable, it really is, it's normal and she HAS TO GO THROUGH THAT before she can move forward. Why wouldn't she think the OW was all that? She obviously turned your head (I don't mean that nastily - I'm just thinking how your W must be thinking). My H vented at me. It cleared the air in a lot of ways.

Her whole life has changed from being what she thought it was to something completely different that is scary and threatening. You've just started on a life together (you have from where I'm standing anyway after my 32 years married). She can see that disappearing.

I really do have high hopes of you guys. Have you been to counselling? I don't remember if you have or not. Trust me a good MC, and I mean a GOOD MC, is worth their weight in gold.

The amount of venting she does is in direct proportion to the pain you caused her and the amount of public (in front of children etc) venting she does is in direct proportion to how publicly she feels her shame and embarrassment were when you had the A and then lied about it. So what you are hearing are her howls of pain, shame and worthlessness. It doesn't matter if your affair lasted ten minutes or ten years - the depth of her pain is also in direct proportion to how deeply she loved and trusted you. It all has to balance out. You cannot know, so it is time to trust her to go through her own process. What you do will show her more than anything you can say. Each time you walk away when she is exhibiting her pain (yelling or whatever) - you re-injure her by her feeling worthless when you don't stay to hear her "howl" and that brings back the pain, as if for the first time.. And so it goes on.

I hope this clears some of your frustration at how long this will go on and why it seems to reignite from time to time. Walking away and getiing indignent will re injure her. Time to learn patience and humility.

It is the only way.

My WH has wasted 4 years trying to make ME do things his way - by punishing me and using his PAPD behaviours even more than usual and up front with blatant emotional abuse too. I am wary of saying this but I think he just saw what he has been doing, so we might have a fighting chance - after four years - it is pretty slim, I am worn out. Please don't wear your wife out trying to get her to do things in what you consider a reasonable (for you) way.

PS. Why did she want you to quit your job? - I couldn't find that answer.

SP

Great post, SP.

ive been reading and following....i havent said anything cause it would have come across as too harsh and probably sent ya running...lol.

something in your last post jumped out at me....all the posturing and puffing your doing to your wife and us about how your wife is better, prettier, better sex....

AS A BS I HEAR.....I THREW YOU AWAY AND DESTROYED US FOR NOTHING.....

i bet your wife is making that same connection. you need to get REAL with why this happened....cause "my" bull meter is beeping big time. lol she is gonna disect the why.....you had better have a better answer than it was something new....

small threadjack......lol HEY KIWI....you are doing amazing here...keep it up. just thought a voice from the otherside would help....lol

Well put Nikko.

Sorry, you are getting opinions/advice from both sides in this thread. Make sure you take all of it into consideration, because both sides always have equally excellent points to make.

Like Nikko said, it doesn't matter who the OW was, or what she looked like, or how the sex was. Your W is hurting like she will never hurt again. Steve Harley told me many BS's have had horrible experiences, like having a child die, but they believe strongly the pain caused by an A was worse than that. For me, this is still incomprehensible, but I do believe it.

Fortunately, my H has not responded in the manner your W is. He hasn't had an angry episode since soon after d-day (2/28/06). He has bad days, but doesn't get angry or verbalize his pain like your W is. Steve Harley also told me it is more common for a "feeling" person to react like your wife is, and less likely for a "analytical" person to be quite so emotional during recovery. I guess I am lucky because my H is quite analytical in his thought processes, whereas I operate on a more emotional level. If our sitch were reversed, I am certain I would be acting much like your W.

Time my friend, give it time. You got faith? If yes, turn to it now, big time. Prayer always helps. Stay strong, for your whole family. I stayed for my kids initially, but am staying for my whole family now. Take care.

God bless,

KJ

That is all I have right now... "time" . The thing that worries me is I feel like my time is almost up! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> I am trying so hard and will continue to do my part as my wife goes thru the pain I put her in. I just wish I knew the outcome of this whole mess. I get scared that she is gonna wake up one morning and throw in the towel. I can just hear her saying she is "tired of trying to be with someone she doesn't want to be with". It would be so easy for her to quit and I am afraid it will come to that like it has many times before. I have been kicked out of the house 4 times now and was told she wanted a divorce and each time she would ask me to come back home so we can work on the marriage but when I am home she wants nothing to do with me except argue and complain about what I did to her. Each time she tells me to come home and she wants to stop talking about the past and work on our marriage I believe her and each time little by little she fall back into the "I don't want to be with you" mode. I think my parents are sick of me moving in and out . Two weeks ago when my wife asked me to come back home and never talk about the A affair again I told my parents the plan as I was packing my stuff to move back home and they both looked at me like how many time are you guys gonna go thru this. I don't think they wanted me to move back home with my wife at that point. So now when they ask how things are going between the wife and I , I always say...o-kay! I don't want to hear the "I told you so" lecture. I believe in my wife and I am happy to be here working on our marriage together even if she verbally abuses me. I broke the marriage so I have no problems getting my hands dirty to fix it!!!!!

She is VERY depressed right now. We are both on depression meds(lexapro) and my doctor actually bumped mine up to 20mg. I suggested to her to do the same because she is in a very low place in her life and when I hear her wake up in the morning and say things like "I wish I was dead" or "Life isn't even worth waking up for ...it's the same crap everyday and I hate it". I worry about her. She is so emotionally drained. This morning was the same deal except she was mean to me too. I got upset but I got over it real fast because I don't have time to be upset...my wife needs me now more than ever. So I called her to ask if she wanted to talk or vent or even yell at me , that I would listen to anything she had to say. She said no, she doesn't want to talk to me at all! I told her since all she does is think back on things I have done that maybe she should try to think back on things she has done and remember why she asked me two week ago to come home. I said you wanted me home to work on the marriage and you never wanted to talk about the affair again. So I said lets do that,,,lets do what you set out to do. She replyed with well you didn't stay true to your vows so why should I stay true to what I said. I know she wants to be with me. I know she wants to work on our marriage. I know it is hard for her to face the man who betrayed her. I just hope she doesn't quit!

Thanks for stepping in Nikko. I appreciate you opinion and I really appreciate the fact that you have been keeping up on my situation and are making a valid point. Now that I thanked you ...don't ever post me again. I don't want to read nothing but praises for me. LOL...Nikko I am only kidding. I am happy to finally hear some constructive criticism. It's not like you just came out of no where and wanted to be negative. It will benefit me to know the hard facts that I try not to realize. I welcome you opinion anytime. I just ask that address me accordingly, in other words if I do something right let me now and if you think I am in the wrong let me know , alright? So once again thanks for your post and I want you to know the reality is sometimes hard to swallow but I took what you said and will reflect upon it and apply it to how I am dealing with my wife.

About the whole work situation and my wife wanting me to quit ...
I am a PT . I work at a wellness center and I train individuals for physical fitness or exercise rehab. My wife feel like this will be a problem for me since 75 % of my clients are females. I have been doing this for over 5 years. I feel she is scared that since I had the previous A I will do it again in the future with one of my clients. Just so no one asks...I do not do private home sessions. All the training is done at the wellness center. I am also very professional when it comes to my training and the relationship standards. I do my job and thats that. I never had phone conversations with clients, I don't go out to eat OR hang out with them. I think I am a very professional when It comes to my job. Like I said I guess my wife thinks there is too much competition with me having to train female clients. This is a matter I brought up to her before I took this new position, She flat out told me to take the job if I felt strong enough to handle it. She said she shouldn't have to baby sit me, She also said that if I was gonna have another A it would happen no matter where I worked. So with that being discussed and taken care of I accepted this new position. And now all of a sudden 2 months into it she hit a down spot in out recovery and wakes up one morning telling me to quit ! So that is the situation with my job. I sat and talked with her about it and I am willing to quit if she feels it would help her thru this and to talk with me about things rather that wake up and start making demands. I am willing to do anything to help my wife . I love her very much and I owe the world to her!

Hi Iamsosorry,

Just wanted to check in today and let you know that I think of you and CO every day and am praying that you will get through this rough phase right now. With the anger and the depression hitting CO so hard right now I understand that it feels like you have stalled. Hang tough right now and stay hopeful and committed to this process.

You are getting some great advice from a variety of posters here and it sounds like you are weighing each one carefully and implementing as best you are able. Keep this up. I know it can get discouraging....i sunk into a severe depression about 2 months after d-day and it stalled our recovery until I got more stabalized. There is a great book called Unveiling Depression in Women. You might consider picking it up for her, or would it be better for me to suggest it to her? There is even a chapter at the end written specifically to the spouse of the depressed person to help them understand what is going on and how best to help and support a depressed person. I had my H read that chapter. He got really strong for us during the worst time of the depression. I was on zoloft and it worked really well for me. If she has been on anti-d for at least a month and she still is waking up "wishing she was dead" she needs to go back to the doctor. No sense in living in that darkness when help is so available and treatment so successful with anti-ds

I echo another poster and ask what is happening on the marriage counseling front and/or meeting with your pastor. Are you both in IC? What is the plan for MC...this is a crucial step.

Also...do the EN's on your own. You will be that much more familiar with yourself when you two are able to do it together. I will continue to encourage her to do them with you. First, though you must both read all the info on each of the 10 ENs so you understand them thoroughly before taking the questionaire. I gathered that she thought she had an understanding of them, but really had not yet spent time reading on each one of them and looking at the questionaire. Right now, though, she needs to climb out of the dark hole of depression just a little bit right now before things will begin to proceed a little more. This has to be the most important focus right now--getting the severity of the depression under control.

I am sorry for the difficult stage you two are in right now, but it is normal and part of the journey. Just keep on persevering and look up. God has all the strength you need to sustain you through this.

Blessings,
Glad

Thank you so much for you thoughts and prayers. That means a lot to me.


I would even consider recommending that book to her. She would take it the wrong way if it came from me...know what I mean?

I agree except she can be pretty stubborn at times . I was recommending anti-d's to her months ago but she was too proud to use them. She would say I put her in this mood so now I have to deal with it. It wasn't that I couldn't deal with it , it was because I cared about her.

I will. I just have to find the time. Every free chance I get I am either on here or doing something for my wife.

Well as far as counseling...We are going to the pastor tonight. Last week he wanted us to take a step forward and take some test that show the reality of what the person taking the test feels about their marriage. He showed us an example test and it show the husband of the example marriage scored high which meant his idea of what a marriage consists of was very unrealistic. Well when we got there he asked how our week was it wasn't a pretty moment. He pretty much told us to forget about this MC and get into IC . He feels if we are not ready to move forward then the whole concept of the test would be lost. I feel I am ready to move on. I am sure any FWS would be. But the fact is I can only go as far and as fast as my wife. So I have taken the initiative and joined a mens support group at the church. It is every Tuesday at 7:00. I am hoping to learn more about my faults and become a better person so that in return I will be a better husband to my wife. I am waiting for my wife to give me the list of IC covered under the insurance so I can get going with that as well. I will still continue with the mens group because I want to get the Christian reinforcement for my personal well being and hopefully with that and the IC I will come out of this a better man!

The verse that I turn to when I feel like all hope is lost is... "All things God works for the Good to those who Love him !"

Keep us in your prayers and thanks for checking in. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

ive gone back and re-read all the posts....

what is the version you told her and what is the truth...lets start unravellin this ball of thorns.

the why is huge.....

Sorry,

Hello. Well, today is almost over. What's your plan for tomorrow? You know, your plan to meet your W's most important EN's? Wait, you don't even know what her 5 most important EN's are! PLEASE find time to do the EN questionnaire!! I am assuming you've read His Needs/Her Needs, but if not, read it BEFORE doing the questionnaire. I didn't the first time, and really botched things up because of not having a clear understanding about each of the needs and how Dr. Harley describes them.

AD's? You wanna talk AD's? You came to the right place. I've been on every SSRI on the market (okay, that's an exagerration, but I've been on several). Turns out I'm bipolar, but that's neither here nor there. Lexapro made me very tired during the day. Obviously people have different side effects, just sharing mine with you. Your poor W definitely needs to see her doctor, or better yet, a psychiatrist. I'd recommend the latter.

Here's a little secret of mine about getting people to read stuff. Order any recommended books through Amazon.com and have them mailed to your wife. If she asks, say yes, they are from you. Hopefully, just knowing you took the time and effort into getting them for her, will be enough to get her started reading. My H did this for me, and it worked.

Gotta go watch American Idol! I'll check in on ya later.

Your fellow FWS,

KJ

I will answer this post tomorrow when I have more time .

1-commitment to her
2-contribution to household duties
3-she is priority
4-to know I find her attractive
5-honesty
(not in that specific order)

So how did I do? Do you know what her EN are? I guess you won't know if I am right unless you know her side of the list. I remember these were her top five when we were going to our original counselor. I bet she won't remember mine though!!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />
Well anyways my plan for tomorrow will be to hug her(since she won't kiss me) first thing in the morning and tell her I love her. By the way we are sleeping in separate beds right now. I don't know if she mentioned that on her thread or not. She said she doesn't like waking up and seeing me next to her because it reminds her of what the OW saw the morning she(OW) woke up next to me. O-kay where was I ...oh yeah thats right, after I tell her I love her I will kiss my daughters and roll around with them on the bed or floor , depends if they are awake or not. As she is leaving for work I will tell her she looks great! (EN = to know I find her attractive) I will later call her and leave a voice mail on her work phone so she has a nice message waiting for her as she starts her day at work. I will probably tell her something like, I love her and thank her for bringing me back home to work on the marriage. I will tell her how happy I am for our girls to have a mother who loves them so much and wants nothing more than to get thru this mess I made so we can be a family again. I will also tell her I am sorry for the decisions I made in the past. I am sorry for the place I put her at in her life that she did not deserve. I will end it with some words of encouragement to let her know I am gonna do everything I can to show my appreciation for the greatest gift I will ever receive ...her LOVE! Later when I get home from work I plan to do a few loads of wash so she will be able to come home and not have to look at the dirty clothes falling out of the hamper. (EN=contribution to household duties) I will then think of something special to do for her for when she gets home from work since I don't schedule any appointments on Thursday evenings so I can be with her. (EN=she is priority) So what do you think of the plan. I usually don't figure out what I am going to do until that day because it could all change in one way or another depending on what mood she is in . This is the first time I actually planed it the day before and I only did that because you asked. Well now that I look over what I just wrote I guess it really isn't gonna matter what mood she is in because those are all things I can do regardless of her mood. So what do you think?

Hey about the AD...I definitely think you should talk to my wife because she too get very sleepy with the lexapro(10mg). I am fine(20mg) . Like you said everyone is different.

American Idol fan huh? My wife and I are too. I am pulling for Kathrine or Elliot. I always pick one guy and one girl. So far every year I have been right! Top that <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />!

Well it's been a long day and I need to get some sleep because I may need it tomorrow for the uphill challenge in my marriage ! Talk to ya tomorrow MBs !!!

She isn't verbally abusing you - she is howling in pain - if you can get this concept it will help you enormously - you will not react as if it is abuse, it is just your judgement of what you deserve. As for your parents - you should always tell them OK - and then if you have to leave again - just tell them it is part of the pain.

I agree that it sounds as if she might do better on Zoloft or something similar - she should be feeling better now.

As for your job, if it was me - I would insist on changing my job, whatever he said if I was the one who shewed I couldn't be trusted. I would just change it - PTs are always in demand. To tell her you will and then try to put the responsibility for you changing on her and also on how she behaves is cowardly to say the least. You have to do all you can as long as you can as much as it takes.

Setting standards for her to achieve to leave this job is a LB - and you aren't even doing the ENs yet. LBs destroy bunches of ENs - so you are not filling her love bank and are dropping atom bombs into it. It may not feel this way to you - but I bet it does to her.

So quit the job and get that discussion off the table. Do not do it because she really wants you to or because she might behave better or anything like that. Do it as an EN, a gift from you to her - given selflessly as a token of your renewed devotion to her. What a great gift. Just tell her there is no question and it is your gift to her - say it gently, over and over - and do not tell her of any trouble you have getting another position - say "it is No Big Deal", don't make this gift a weight on her heart.

Good luck - I know you are trying and that your apparent BS is part of the damage the FOG does to your comprehension of the sitch. If you can see the logic of this it will make you feel so much better and therefore benefit her and then your marriage.

SP

its early and i havent had much coffe but there is something i wanna touch on that im getting from some of your posts.....its the disrespect. the jab about her not remembering yours, and others previously.....

listen, i dont care why your doing it.....sarcastic humor, thats just cause im frustrated....whatever....knock it off. its disrespectfull and hurtful and makes me wonder how serious you are. and if your letting things like that slip out at home i bet she is wondering too. i get you dont like the feeling that she has you by the balls....however please remember that you are the one who got you there.

and on another side note....watch her carefully with the anti-d's....for me zoloft almost killed me. it deepened my depression and made me suicidal/homicidal. not joking on that. how does she react to regular meds....for me i cant really take meds and if i do i have to take a way lower dose like a child. nobody took that into consideration when drugging me with anti-d's. they just kept upping it. i finally got better when i got off them all....