JS,

Don't talk yourself into thinking she's having an affair unless the signs are really there. I used to be your wife. I was NOT having an affair. I just got married far too young to somebody who was selfish and pompous and didn't value me at all. I am reminding you again, that if my ex H had REALLY CHANGED on one of the first three times I left him, I wouldn't have left the last time.

Thanks Noodle, MyAlias


I want her back, I want her happy, I want to show her so much love and attention.
She wont let me.


These are all things I have said to her in the past. When I get the chance I tell her exactly what you've said...It just makes her so mad and she tells me stop.

I don't want her to leave.
JS

I know but I just can't get her past the anger she has for me.
JS

You may just have to let her have this. She may need to do this to get past it.

Just reassure her you aren't trying to upset her. That you are trying to make right what went wrong.

She asks you to stop ... what? Does she ask you to stop saying you want the M and that you are trying to change to be better?

If so, I suppose we could argue both sides of what you should do and what you continuing to send this message means to her. Maybe it feels like a LB to her when you continue with your message but that may just be because she hasn't gotten passed the pain yet.

If you two continue to have these R related type talks I think you need to remain steadfast in your direction and stated intentions. I think it's important she realize you feel she's worth fighting for and that you are trying to be a good H.

Part of the reason she's so mad is because she's so conflicted. She sees your changes but doesn't want to trust them or expose herself to being disappointed and hurt yet again.

She wants me to stop trying, to give up hope, to let her go.
I told her that she is to important to me.

She's not past the pain and it doesn't look like she wants to get past the pain.

I think she wants me to be mean or uncareing so leaving me would be easyer.
She's mad, Now I want to work on this and before I just didn't care or listen to her.


I've been doing this for a while now....every conversation we have, I tell her "I just can't work or help you towards seperation because I feel so strongly against it".
I love you to much.



I think there may be a little more to it than just this but I really don't know.
I don't think the anger and resentment will let her get past [the conflicted stage].

I called her mother last night and we talked about all the anger and resentment W has and mil is very upset to that we can't work this out because she know how much I love W.

I told mil that I just called to let her know how much I still love W and I can't help W to move on because I'm so against it.

She said "W knows she can't afford to leave right now and that I was probably happy that she can't [get out] because it give me more time to work on things and mil knows this also frustrates W, Mil wants me to let up on her and I reminded mil that if she was my mother she would want me to fight for W and she agreed and said this was just so hard to be in the middle of all of this because she loves us both but knows W has to get out in order to sort out her feelings.

Mil doesn't know what to tell me...she sounded really frustrated about all of this and wishes W could work past it.

JS

This is my first post and I am going to jump in at the deep end. I was drawn to this thread because it is so similar to my own situation, the only difference is that I am the wife. When I first started reading this thread, JS, your whole manner sounds so much like my own husband, we too have been married a long time, 11 years, we have 3 children. There are a few things I wanted to comment on, some should probably go in your other thread about the van, but there were things raised here that I wanted to comment on so I will post here. There will be a mix of my own situation and what I perceive the situation to be here. Certainly not saying I have all the answers.

Noodle, I can understand what you are saying about if she wants to leave let her do it off her own steam, however I don't agree with it in this case. JS has said himself he has been controlling and smothering her, and why I said it struck a chord with me is because my husband is the same, so much so that I consider it abuse! Can emotional abuse be totally ruled out here? Does she jump at loud noises? Seem skittish? Fail to make eye contact when you talk about stuff that is affecting you? go to the toilet frequently (and other nervous tendencies)? Sometimes just get up and leave the room for no reason other than she has to get away from you?
Js it is great that you are trying to change, I don't think it can be done over night, this situation has taken a long time to deteriorate and it is going to take a long time to build your marriage back up. This woman has not decided on the spur of the moment to leave. I would say that this is something she has been trying to get the courage to do for a long time, but she is being passed off as the bad guy for wanting to break up the marriage, sometimes it's either the marriage or her soul. The marriage wont work if she can't function in it and that is a point that has taken years to get to. It's all well and good to say she is responsible for her own state of mind, but living with a control freak for so long makes everything hazy and you can't see past the fog. She needs to find out who she is, separation doesn't have to be permanent, but she really needs to see that you have changed, you can talk about changing all you want but the proof is in the pudding.
Kudos to you JS for helping her financially, the only reason I am still in my situation is because I can not afford to leave - period. I, like most mothers put their own financial needs last. It would cost me two grand for bond on a house and to get the power connected etc, to him a weeks wages, but he refuses to help. Once out of the marital home it is my responsiblilty. So I stay and every day I resent my husband just that little bit more. I can't stash that kind of money and let my kids miss out.
JS there was a post you made saying she wanted to buy something for $20.00, it acutally cost $29.95, but she only spent the $20 from your account and put the rest in herself, doesn't that strike anyone as odd that she purchased something for their child but didn't dare spend any more of his money than she said it would cost? I'm not talking about he buys things and she buys things and in the end it equals out. I'm talking ten bucks, not a lot of money, not even enough for a packet of cigarrettes here.

One other thing, stop calling HER mother. She needs a confidante and by you calling mother she will see that as you trying to control her through the mother. Are you? She will see it as you are trying to get her mother on side to gang up on her, bad move.
I haven't read all of your posts on this thread, even sitting on the other side of the world I felt suffocated by them, you call her mother, you keep saying how much you are changing for her to stay, you continually say you don't want her to leave, heavy stuff. I have been living with the master of head games for the last 12 years and your posts reek of them <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Getting off my soapbox now, just wanted to throw in some thoughts from the "other side" to be shot down in flames <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Peace
The Feather

Ps I will start my own thread soon, this one was keeping me awake at night so I had to deal with it first.

Feather, it sounds like it seems to you like you are totally trapped in every move, every day. When I read back to my first posts, I felt that way totally, too. But that is not reality. I am glad you posted to JS, so he could understand how living like this over time makes the spouse feel trapped until they only see limited choices, to stay or go. Speaking from my own experience, I didn't trust myself to be able to identify and follow through on the choices that I would need to make daily, hourly, to carve out a different path for myself. But feather, you're not alone, there is an IRL (in real life) world of support to help you, and on this website, I look forward to your post! An awesome book to help you find your own path despite the crushing pressure to go back to how it was is You Don't Have to Take it Anymore, by Steven Stosny.

JS, this is where your difficulty lies. Because whatever you say or do today can easily be interpreted or misinterpreted as more of the same. So you're relying on your W to stumble upon a solution on her own. I think this is why your 180 is so important, because it removes the crushing pressure from your side. But she may still see pressure where it doesn't exist, that is understandable.

Best wishes to you both!

Hi Feather and welcome to the club that nobody wants to join...lol

I'm glad you posted and I hope to here more about you soon. The people here can really help.
None of the above applies here. I know this from her mom, grandma and others that have told me.
I said earlier that she is feeling just like I was in my 1st marrigae.

I wasn't planning on posting this morning but I had to answer some questions for you. Thank you again for posting to me.

I think you may have misunderstood some of this. I've always talked to her mother over the years (at the request of my W). Her mother has helped me so much and when I talk to her I always tell W and W likes the fact that I talk to her.
I'm really not controlling of w and mil has seen this, I hadn't talked to her m in a while so I just wanted to let m know I wasn't going to play games with w and that I would be ok with her leaving and that I wouldn't guilt her with the kids etc.


I may have played some head games in the past but w knows who I am and has said many times to me thanks for not making this harder than it already is.

Ok, on to the present.
W came home Friday night and said she found a house to rent, she said she was going to meet the lady there Saturday morning to give her the deposit money and then get the rest from her grandma today to pay the 1st months rent.

We talked quite a bit this weekend about everthing, her new place the kids etc. and she felt really relaxed talking about all of this to me because I told her I am now starting to understand more about how she is feeling and why she is doing this...I didn't love bust 1 time, I'm very proud of the way I handled this. We really had a great talk that lasted a long time and she seemed so relaxed after that.

I did tell her before she left, "you know that I still don't want you to do this"
W- "I know, but you now know that I have to right?
JS- "yes, as hard as this is I know its the only thing you can do and I'm not going to stop you or make it any harder than it already is.

I guess tonight we are going to talk to s12 and break the news to him. W asked "do you want me to tell s12 or are you ok with being there?
I said I wanted to be there so he knows from both of us how much we love him.

Very busy at work this morn, I'll try to post more later.
JS

Hi ears,

I wish I could describe better my day to day but I'm not a writer and I don't tell stories well. I can see where its hard to get a feel for w and I's conversations with what I have written here but I can tell you her mother has said she is very happy that I am being so understanding and not guilting W into staying and not using the kids against her.


I don't think w looks at me as being desperate or needy (clingy) because I don't cry or mope around the house.
I don't feel like I have put pressure on W for quite a while now...I'm more into excepting things for what they are.[yes still very hard]
I'm rereading Dr.Phil's Relationship Rescue right now untill Love Busters gets here and RR has really helped me to get my emotions under controll.

Please continue to let me know what you think about all of this and I'll try to explain things in more detail. I feel like I'm not giving you enough information but your comments are definatly something to think about and things I need to watch out for so I don't LB.

JS

W called this morning from home and asked if I could call electric company to get her name off the bill. I said sure I can call them right now and she said, ok I just need to get my service started next week some time.
W’s rental house is 4 blocks away from my work so I went by there at lunch time and called her (she was at home with kids)(baby sitter had dr. appt.) anyways W answered “hi” I said “where are you?” she said “at home why?” I said “Because I’m at your house and your not there” lol she said “oh your over there lol, She said “well? What do you think about it?” I said “its really nice and in a really nice neighborhood
Close to a park, close to an ice cream shop, big yard, sidewalks.

I was walking around it and talking about things and said “I don’t see any air conditioning, you’ll have to get a window unit, she said “yeah I got the word out at work that I’m looking for things. I said, well check the newspaper everyday for the cheap items section and maybe something affordable will come up.
I said I will keep my ears open as well.

I said wow this is really weird looking at your house, I can’t believe this is happening it just so weird.

She said I know, we got a lot of changes coming huh?
I said, I feel good that you got a house instead of an apartment, the kids have a big yard to play in and W has a girlfriend that lives right around the corner who has a little girl the same age as d7.

I said, oh the people 2 doors down have a big pool, the kids will have to go pay them a visit.

I’m really stuck on this, I love her and I don’t want to see her in some little house but I don’t want to sound like I’m encouraging anything either. Does that make sense?
I'm kind of torn, you know "no LB's" don't tell her what a great job she's doing breaking up the family and then don't tell her she did a great thing for the kids by getting a nice little place.

I'm not making any sence.

I’m just real glad were talking more. Now comes the kids. Where do I….no….How do I……..No…….what do I????????

She’s going to tell them, how do I prepare for this?
What do I say.
What don’t I say.
I'm really scared about this, I love my kids and I’m not sure I can hold it together when we tell them.
Do I reassure them?
Should I just let her do it alone?

I don’t want to blame her for this but I want to make sure they know where I stand, does that make sence?
I don’t want to lie to them. I want to tell them that I’ve been trying to save my marriage.

I'll just see how it goes, thanks for listening.

JS

JS, I am so sorry that things are so hard right now. I am not saying that I get the impression that you are trying to control her at this point. Or that that was ever your intention. What I was trying and failed to convey was that someone like your W who felt control so severe that they want to leave the marriage (it is possible it's not that, but that's what she said, so it's all we have to go on) may go on feeling pressure even where there is none, or none intended. Which is why I think the path you're on really fits well.

I think if it's possible, to get some professional advice on preparing yourself and the kids for the separation. (((JS)))

The other night w also said she didn't think I was going to like the new her because she is so differant now.

I said you know what?
I really do like the new you because your starting to live your life without worrying what i think all the time.

You kept quiet for to long and I never got to see the real you.

Your coming out of your shell more and more and I love the fact that your feeling better about yourself and I'm sorry I didn't respect you more all of these years.

I said remember a while back when I told you this marriage hasn't been that good in my eyes either because you stopped telling me your thoughts and feelings.
I said your mom summed it up very good for me the other night when i talked to her and she said, "w was afraid of talking to you because she was afraid of your reaction (due to depression) so she held it all in.

I've changed to, I now look at a women that I realize that I've treated like one of my kids all of these years instead of an equall and I feel like a fool.

I said with all of the reading I'm doing I'm learning a lot of things I did wrong and ways to change myself.

I look back and I didn't even treat you as if you could have an opinion and the worst part about all of that is now I see the damage i did.

I will never do that to anyone again. You have to love everyone before you can love yourself and thats why I don't have enemies and i don't hold a grudge to anyone.

Everyone has an oppinion. you, me, kids.
We are all intitled to that.
Problem is that I always thought that no matter what, because I was the oldest and of course the smartest <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> that my opinion was always right.

Doesn't matter, when I wasn't even listening to the other person anyway huh?

I said you are the most important person in my life but yet i feel like I treated you as an employee and not a wife.
I said I'm sorry for not treating you the way a truly loving husband would treat his wife.

I'm glad to learn about the new you, I love the new you, I really want to be with an equall from now on.
I want to be with you.

You have a life no more no less important than mine and i want to see you live that life without regret, with happiness, with freedom to express yourself without being judged or told your wrong by me.

I'm sorry for treating you that way and I'm glad your feeling free now.

I really do get it.

There was a lot more said and when she talked I didn't interupt her anymore and I did (verify and validate).

She told me about her feelings and how she has to go out and find out who she is.
She said I've always been S12,D7,S5's mom.
I've always been JS's wife
I've always been M's daughter.
I can't remember who W is anymore.

I need to find her and I can't do it here anymore.
I just repeated what she said and told her thank you for telling me these things.

That wasn't all said in succesion as written above but they were the key points from our long conversation.

Thing is I feel so good about myself when I see her feeling comfortable but it still upsets me that she thinks its to late for us.

You guys said earlier (you may have to let her have this anger and resentment)
Your right...she is entititled to that.

I'll just wait.......and while I'm waiting maybe you all have some more thoughts for me.

JS

p.s.
I'm riding my high horse today (feeling good) lets just see if I can stay on it. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Ears,


I see what you mean...it doesn't matter how I see it, it does matter how she saw it for all those years.

Looks like I just showed everyone how bad I am at listening.
Verify, validate

I got more work to do, I wont kid ya. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />
I'm learning, thanks for the thoughts ears

JS

7/18/06
Well, conversation between W and I has been pretty good lately. She seems more relaxed now that she actually has a direction to move in.

The other night I said “do you have any feelings in your heart for anyone else or did you before?”
She smiled and said “no, this isn’t about that”. “I’m too worried about who I am and what I want and besides, do I act like I have someone else?” “I’m always here or somewhere where you know where I’m at.”
“I don’t have time or energy to think about anything else, but what this is going to do to this family and myself.”
I said “am I still in your heart”.
She said “yeah I guess, somewhere”. I expected this response. (insecurities showing) was that a LB?

I said “it just seems that usually when someone wants to leave the other, it’s because they have someone else.”
“I’m sorry for being insecure I just need to know the truth about everything no matter how bad it hurts you to tell me or how bad it hurts for me to here it.”
“I guess I’m just having a hard time accepting how bad things have been in your eyes the last few years.”

She just smiled and said. “I’m not going to say that I was right or wrong for feeling that way (judged, controlled) but that’s just how it was for me.”
“I just need to move on with my life and find out what it is that I want.”

I said “I just hope you know how really sorry I am” and she said “I know, you don’t have to apologize to me anymore” and I said “well, I just feel really bad that you felt that way all these years and sorry that I didn’t notice it and take appropriate measures.”
She said “I know.”

I said “how come you don’t wear your rings and bracelets that I got you anymore”
She said “I’m just trying to do little things to help me get the right mind set to get through all of this because its very hard…I will probably start wearing that stuff again pretty soon.

It was a nice conversation (I think) for both of us…she was really relaxed and smiled a bit and we talked like two friends and she didn’t look uncomfortable or mad at all.
She even said “anything else?”
I Said “No not right now but it was sure nice talking about things.”

She asked me last night if she could tell S12 what “the plan” is, I said I think now’s as good a time as any.

She said S12 I have something very important to talk to you about so turn t.v. down.
S12 said am I in trouble? No.
I have decided to get another place to move to and we wanted you to know about it before we tell the other kids.

W—This is something I have thought about for a while now and something I have to do for myself, I got a place, not far away and will be moving in sometime this weekend.
It is big enough that you and D7 and S5 can come and stay there to, you can decide on your own where you want to be on a daily basis, dads house or my house.
S12---Do you guys have a schedule yet?
W---No, we won’t use a schedule. You can go to either place anytime you want to. If you want to be over here with dad you can be here anytime, if you want to be with us (meaning D7 and S5) you can be with me.

W---your dad and I love you guys very much and this is about me, not you kids so if you have any questions, we will both always be here for you.

S12 had a few tears running down his face but didn’t cry out or anything and hasn’t asked any questions yet.
W---teared up a little bit but was ok for the most part, I didn’t say anything other than “you ok son”?
S12 yeah.

Called W at work today and said we need to talk a little more tonight about how she wants to move things, when, what, do we want the kids to help or be gone etc. I also said I was worried that S12 would ask me questions and then her questions and we need to make sure he doesn’t get in a pattern of comparing answers etc.

She seems so easy to talk too lately.

7/19/06
Hey, I just want to say that I have been reading posts from all over these boards and I see where my name comes up a little bit here and there.

I guess that many of you are like me and are reading other posts. So I’m going to use this opportunity to say a few things.

First of all. [calm voice]
If someone comes to MB’s they are here for help.
If they say that they can’t stand the way there wife looks (to fat, to thin, to old, overweight, etc.) go a little easier on them. Try to remember if you bash them they will think this is the wrong place to be and go somewhere else (maybe to a dating sight) and where will there marriage be then? What about there spouse?
Some of you seem to be using this sight to vent your own personal anger against people.
Maybe I’m wrong….I’ve been wrong before... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />
I’m not agreeing with these people, but they have real problems. REAL! Maybe its there own fault for getting into marriage in the first place but that’s where they are and now there asking for help and guidance.

We all need a little MB 2 x 4 once in a while.

I'm so greatfull for this sight and I'm so glad you all have been so nice and helpfull to me and I want to see others feel comfortable sharing here.
I lurked here for a little while before posting and was scared to post because I didn't want to get ripped a new one.

I also see a lot of people on MB who have changed themselves and saved there M and that’s where the secret lies.
Help them change, not by bashing them or belittling them but explaining better how all of this MB stuff works.

Sorry for the rant but that’s just what I’m seeing.

W and I talked last night some more, she asked me to help her with a resume which was very nice. She wants to find a better paying job and a girl she knows has an opening at a place and asked her to submit a resume.

She told me the other night that she was a bit uneasy because I’ve talked with all of our neighbors (they are like a big family to us) and she hasn’t talked to any of them (one on one) for a while.

I said, those people all love you just as much as they love me and they would love to talk to you and give you a big hug but there afraid of your reaction.
I told them you were uneasy around them because you don’t know what I’ve been saying (good or bad) to them.
They said they love her no matter what.
I then told her exactly how they all felt and reminded her that many of them are on there second marriages too and have been where we are at now.
I said they feel so bad for both of us, you for being so conflicted and me for being hurt and confused.
This made her cry. I know she will miss these people to.

I said does everyone at your work know about all of this and she said yes. I said, I guess I’m just afraid they will get a bad picture of me.

She said “those people all know what a good husband and father you have been and that this is just something I have to do right now and they are just as confused as everybody else.

Many other things were said and overall it was an enjoyable evening for both of us.

We were together all night and S12 came in and asked if he could spend the night with friend next door and we said yes.
He came over and hugged W and kissed her on the cheak and said Ilu and then hugged me and said bye Ilu.

He dont hug much and hardly ever lets W kiss him (you know boy thing) so we just looked at each other and kind of laughed and said wow that was cool.

I think he's more worried about us then we are him.

I still want to DJ (old habit) (bad habit) but I didn’t, Just got to keep focused. I’ve got to start reading Love Busters too.
It came the other day but I haven’t cracked it open yet.

I know, I know....IM ON IT.

Peace
JS

JS,

Thanks for the update.

Oh and I agree in part to your request to other posters and the tone they may use when dealing with certain troubled posters. Just remember some people need to hear the hard facts of what's being seen. It's hard, sometimes, to sugar-coat replies when the troubled poster needs a shake-up. I'm not good in conflicts, as I assume you aren't either, so my first response when I see these posts is to cringe. Somehow, though, I think this forum sends good messages and there is a good blend of things that need to be said. Whether it be a bit of compassion mixed with a MB 2x4 or what have you ... it does seem to work.

As far as your W I keep being angered that she's forgetting her vows as a W and responsibilities as a mother but I suppose it's best to say "Sometimes you have to let them go. If they come back to you they must truly love you.". I just hope she isn't looking to become extremely independant and decides that's the better life for her.

JS, thanks for the update. And I wanted to thank you for your post above. It has some thoughts that I want to share with my H, because though I have felt controlled, I see it has gone both ways and I am working with that DJ-attitude as well.

I hear you about meeting each other where we are. We have a great old-timer LostHusband who I think summed it up best, on a public forum you are going to get advice from many times a broken perspective. There has not been a response yet whether I agree with the perspective or the tone or not that does not have a nugget or more of truth in there, or enough to get someone thinking to find the truth out for themselves.

MyAlias,

Good to here from you this morning.

Liked your thoughts.
I'm not refering to anyone that has replied to me, everyone has been extremely helpfull to me.
Please people dont stop busting my head, I need it.
JS<--->*can be hard headed* <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />


I agree but I can't help think that a new poster wouldn't feel very welcome if the first reply was a bash to him/her. I'm mostly refering to a new poster getting there first response as a negative one......haven't seen it much here but I have seen it.


I think she just needs change, more independance, more freedom to explore for herself with out me holding her hand like a little girl. (at least I think thats the way she see's it)

I don't think she needs extreme independance, at least I hope not but I agree that at least now she can decide what she wants without me standing over her all the time (if thats how she has felt).

I just hope I can take this time to focus on me and not obsess about her all of the time, who knows maybe we both can find out who we are (for real) now and if its meant to be (which I think it is by the way lol) our marriage will only become stronger.
If its not meant to be than we are one step closer to our new lives.

Ya know what I mean?
JS

Hi Ears,

Anymore questions? just fire em my way.

Maybe, I rambled a little to much.
Your right though good or bad those posters have nuggets lol <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />
Edited::::To Add
Now that you mentioned it, I'm starting to see, The more opinions, The more it makes you stop and think.

Friday 07/21/06
Tonight she gets the keys to her new place. I guess she’s going to take the kids over and tell them what’s going to happen and show them there “other” home.

I had to pick a prescription up at Walgreen’s today so I got her a card while I was there.
On the front it said “you’re a star” with a (picture of a star) (pretty generic card) when you open it, it says “you can do anything you set your mind to”.
I wrote “congratulations on your new house and good luck” “I’m glad we shared so much together and I will always love you”
“All my love always JS”
I put it in her mailbox so when she goes over there she will find it.

In the recent past when I have given her cards, she doesn’t say anything right away unless I ask but usually she will say something in a day or two.

I’m not really feeling that bad about all of this because at least now we are going in some kind of direction. Sure it’s not the one I want but it beats staring at each other night after night with nothing to say.
Oh we make small talk but she doesn’t ever want to talk about anything to personal that’s going on in her life.

She’s sent her resume to a place she wants to work at that pays a little more money. I asked her some stuff about it and she was real vague, and the more I asked the more uneasy she got so I finally said “what’s wrong?” She said your just asking to many questions.
I guess it makes her feel controlled or something…I’m not sure.
She won’t tell me much more about it and gets mad if I ask questions.
All she said was it’s a satellite company (as in satellite tv) and she talked to “a friend” and that’s where she heard about it.

She keeps being real vague on everything we talk about (like she’s sneaking around) but then later I find out more Information and it turns out to be nothing.

Like the so called “friend”. Now old JS is thinking, hmmmm, some guy I’ll bet. Cause that’s how she acts…. ( still insecure) but then I find out it’s a girl she knows and she is looking for another office girl at this satellite company and told wife to apply.

I’ve always been one to tell everything to her, like if I go out with the guys etc. I tell her who we saw, where we went etc. She has never been that way to me, She always makes me ask her the questions and then later says “you always make me feel so guilty and you give me 20 questions all the time”. I say “sorry, just trying to make conversation”.

This is something I am learning not to do anymore and when I don’t ask she tells me anyway a couple of days later.

Is she testing me? Seeing if I still have insecurities?
She has always been this way, If I don’t ask then a day or two later she will talk about everthing.
Sorry but that is something I just thought about and wanted to know if the ladies here had anything to say about that.

Tomorrow I’m taking the kids to my sisters to go swimming and spend the day so she can move some stuff out. She told me she thought it would be to hard on the kids to see her moving stuff and I said I don’t think that they will think anything of it unless we make a big deal out of it.
I also think that when they get home and see some stuff missing that they will more confused, but I didn’t argue with her I just said “are you sure you are worried about the kids or will it be to hard on you?”
She said “actually both”

I’m doing ok. It really helps to be here at MB’s

I will………..[keep on keeping on]
I have a future, with her or without her and I have 3 wonderful, beautiful kids
I guess in a lot of ways I’m a lucky guy.

MyAlias, Don’t ask “what now JS?”

It’s a question I can’t answer yet, I hope to just take it a day at a time and work on this like she had been working on this for the last several years.
I won’t give up on her. I want to call someone and make love…I have so much love to give.
Don’t answer that because I know I can’t do that and I WONT, I’m just spouting off……she’s just been too good to me through all of this.
I know she’d probably love to be mad at me or be mean but that’s just not in her, never has been.

…I’m so horny, I want to make love to her…we were always so good at that.

Have a great weekend everybody…maybe I’ll check in some time before Monday.

JS

While I believe it's extremely important to not have any secrets I see this being an issue for your W. She probably feels the need to have some freedoms. Your questioning feels like badgering. Like you don't trust her or she needst to report in to you. There's not much freedom in that.

I believe you do have some insecurities. It's good your trying to learn new behaviors. I would suggest backing off the 20 questions. If she eventually tells you what she did in a day or two then you should learn to accept that and be patient. If you start asking questions and you can tell she wants to be vague then just let her be that way and hopefully in a day or two she'll tell you all about it.

Remember this is all about her having the ability to feel like she's living her own life. That she has some control and isn't always under the watchful eye. You two have some differences in how you behave and I don't think it's mandatory that she act the way you'd like. OK?