Temp, my d-day was almost the same as yours, 7/26/05. I found MB a little late, and I am still trying to get NC. Steve Harley is helping me with this. She works with OM, supposedly the A has been over since d-day but she is still unsure about us and if we can recover. She was away from job from 7/26/05 to 2/10/06 but she was determined to go back and I was foolish and afraid to walk away. I think she is still questioning if divorce would be easier than what we are facing. I exposed to OMW 3 weeks ago and W has been ice-cold ever since.

She has been out of touch with her feelings the entire time. Says she doesn't know what she feels. This completely baffles me. How can you not know what you feel?

H was talking about a get away with the two of us! D-day was 4/22/06. He's in a better mood today! When he got home he asked me what I was thinking about earlier today and I said I wasthinking about the old lady walking in the street. However, I did go to my first counseling session today! No word out of him for at least a minute! LOL Then, he asked "well, how did it go?" I said it went good, I was asked to invite you next week and they can work around you're schedule. also, right now, he's reading a version of Joseph's letter. I'll let you all know how things go!

mr_c,
I wish that we had something else in common, besides a D-Day; yknow like skydiving or basketweaving! My H was 'dumped' by OW last September; they worked together (OW was his supervisor); she resigned and moved to a position in another firm that was support for his department, so they still had phone contact until January. He is just now really starting to hear me. I'm not making demands, just being honest with him about what the future would bring with a D (pretty bleak financially and spiritually) I told him that he would have to initiate any D, that I stand firm that I want my family to be together, and that I want my bestfriend back; I will not waver. I will not allow him to leave until we find out one way or the other if this is over or good. I figure, if we're together in most of our leisure time, we will fall for eachother again. H didn't even reach out and touch me until the last couple of weeks. I didn't find MB until after I kicked him out; I tried to get him to stay and work it out, but they worked together--it was impossible. The moment your W saw him again, something sparked again; it may not be full blown love, but maybe anger over what she can't have? Who freakin knows! I understand the temptation, I just always chose my H over it.

Needing,
It's good to get away--GO! Don't expect everything to be fun and great though; try to keep it light, don't talk about too much heavy stuff, just be a companion! We all would like to believe that the WS will protect us and comfort us in this most hideous of times, but they can shut down in a second. Just take care of you, no matter how hard it is to avoid breaking down; go break down alone and come back ready to fight!

Can I chime in as an FWS? Thanks!

Yes, it is perfectly normal for a WS to be depressed. For me, it was more like mood swings. While on the phone or on-line with addictive FOM (most of the A was a long-distance thing), I felt like a million bucks. But that million bucks later turned out to be counterfeit because it was all a fantasy. None of it was real. I had trouble eating, sleeping, working, you name it. Went to doctor, got referral for IC. No meds, though, they considered me borderline... kind of a situational depression. Resolve the situation, and the depression resolves itself. That's why I am not in the "get on meds" camp -- I think it's preferable to fix the sitch instead of using chemicals to alter the symptoms.

mr_c asked:
Been there, done that. If I'm any indication, the WS is in major conflict. I was conflicted the entire time. I knew I still loved my H, but the FOM had this pull on me... like I said above, he made me feel so good, but it turned out the feelings were based on fantasy, and the whole thing just led to a major crash and burn.

NeedingComfort wrote:

Outstanding! This is a good thing. Special little getaways where H and I did the things we did when we first fell in love were a godsend. They reminded me of all the reasons I love H in the first place. And when I was in WD, and my thoughts drifted to FOM, I would change the channel and instead look forward to these little getaways. It helped tremendously.

tempinsanity offers good advice when saying keep it light and don't talk about heavy stuff (particularly A and M stuff). I suppose this might depend on your own ENs but for us, being great companions to one another is what brought us together in the first place and what helped us to reconnect.

GBH,
Thanks so much for chiming in on a subject that BS's are, basically, in the dark about. I know what it feels like to have someone fulfill my needs outside of the M, but never acted on it, so I am no saint, and have been honest with my H about this. It's good to hear that you have had fulfillment through your M again, and that brings hope to all. I have been staying away from too much talk about M and A. I try to talk about how his and my day were; anything new and exciting, yknow, basic chatter. We have gone out for drinks and a little nosh together, talked about our viewpoints on various subjects; it's kinda cool gettin back to basics. I do so miss him and our friendship and intimacy, so I'm biting my tongue. As long as we're still together there will be time to get to those things when the wounds aren't so fresh. I know that he feels a tremendous sense of guilt and frustration, as I do too. Thank you so much for 'chiming in'.
I think the band Nada Surf says it best at this point in time, "Always love, hate will get you every time". <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Well, we had a good night, a really good night! He read my version of Joseph's letter but didn't offer any feedback. I also mentioned my 1st counseling session. He asked how it was (I was shocked) and I said that it was good, but I was asked to invite him to the next one. I said it was his choice and that they could work around his schedule, also instead of meeting with the pastor's wife that he could meet with the pastor if that made him feel more comfortable. I'll wait a few days and let him kow that it's really important to me that he go. In a non-theatening way, I'll let him know that we can either sit in front of a counsel or a lawyer, that's going to be his choice. What do you think about that?

GBH- I am excited that he wanted to go on a weekend trip with me. H said from the beginning that he never stopped loving me, and "he never sleep away from home one night", like that was suppose to comfort me. I said "so, you were doing me a favor?" H said "NO, and put his head down!" What was that suppose to mean? Anyway, I'm going to try to schedule a weekend getaway soon! I will remember to keep it light, and try to be a playmate, I think that a wonderful suggestion!

tempinsanity- Thank you for all your wonderful advice, GBH is right! I look forward to hearing more!

NC,
Try not to do too much mentioning of lawyers; my suggestion is to lay it all on the line ONCE and leave it. Be very clear--I want to save this M, you will have to be the one to file for D and know that you walked away with out even a 'how do you do?'. Take the stance that you want to work this out, and as the waywards love to point out, no matter what the end result may be (they love to repeat that you 'may or may not' end up together, it's a convenient way to remain shut down against the damage -- they think, well this could end in a big fat D, so opening up to this relationship can't possibly help) <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> My stance is this, what harm can it do to try--we may discover a greater purpose and love, or we may fall out of love together, and decide, in a time of calm and peace, that we no longer belong. Ask for time, to separate from emotion and blame. NO DEMANDS, come from a place of what you would do, don't assume he is in a sane place, not yet.

oh, btw, I'm not saying that waywards don't care, I'm saying they're not there TO care right now. It's so funny writing this stuff out, it's so self encouraging to hear myself talk about these things. We're nowhere near clear of the forest, but I can finally see the trees...

Temp-he definitely wants to stay together, no mention of the big D, or not working things out, just not trying to do much to make me feel better. Although, last night, we did have an excellent time eating candy and goofing off. His additude was vrey lite, almost makes me wonder what was going on! You know? I'm truely hoping that he will go to the C w/ me! Maybe it's to early since, D-day, 4-22-06, maybe I'm expecting to much. I mean he did run into her a t the store Monday! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> I really need him to open up and start taking care of some of my EN's, like talking about the A, understanding why H did it, etc. Am I pushing, it's only been 3 1/2 weeks!

There is no real reward in getting these answers all at one time; it can be devastating and sometimes riddled with the 'un'reality of what has been done. Time is a great companion. Continue to act upon the things that you think he needs. Companionship outside of parenthood seems to be a big one for my H. You need answers and a plan. He needs to agree to things in order for you to continue. DO NOT flounder around waiting for something to happen. Take a moment from things, and ask him if he is willing to formulate a plan that will help to bring the M back together. Things are still very fresh, but if he is spending all of his time with you, now is a good time to take action. HE has to choose his path. You can only make the road less traveled look appealing. Take care of you.

Needingcomfort,

I think your H is going through withdrawal right now. Read about it on this site. ..3-1/2 weeks is pretty soon for him to start taking care of your ENs...Tread slowly...Like tempinsanity says, he is not in a sane place...he needs to come out of the fog...Read up on Plan A and try to keep it light...no demands...go to IC for YOU above all.

Tempinsanity,

Yes, the no strings attached line. My H fell for it hook and sinker. His FOW was a 24 yr old unmarried coworker who flirted with him for months. He says he never gave in until we had had a huge argument. He says it was just for SF, he was never leaving his family and she said she was just horny, so she agreed to meet him just for no strings attached sex. The problem is that there is no such thing...

Of course, this was a fantasy...No kids, no problems, no housework, bills...I was home taking care of all that..Plus I was pregnant at the time...who needs more responsibility? Just stay with the OW--it's better here...

He found out the hard way when she started making demands on him, then he had nowhere to turn...

good luck to both of you, you are on the right track.

Needing,
I agree, he is, most likely, still in a very selfish phase; just give what you can; he will reciprocate what he feels comfortable with. Plan A has been my savior as of late. It's strange, but I planA'd initially, then PlanB'd, then he came home (far too soon) and we floundered, then I found this website, and have been able to come up for air a bit more. I am now in a sort of PlanA. I'm not making demands, but stating what MY Plan is, and asking that we try this before a decision is made. TRY first. I'm working on getting him to include what he wants from the M, what his Plan may be, so that we can agree on the most important points, deliberate those that we're tentative on, and drop those that will not work for the both of us. It's EXHAUSTING!--but you guys have helped me to find me again. Thank you ever so much.

Mama...it is crazy how all of these stories carry that common thread of no strings...sometimes that string is that darned invisible fishing lure, pulls you in but it's invisible, until you're caught!

Huge step on his part today, he met me at my office today with lunch, remember last night was great for you, so we ate, and sat on the steps. I let him talk about his job (Stress, stress, and more stress), moved on to other subjects, then, the kids. H mentioned bring drained at the end of the day and I agreed, I said more mentally with my job then physical, but there are those days. I gave the example of yesterday after having come back from the IC, saying the last thing I wanted was to hear them talk but that it got better after having visited with a friend. we talked more @ the kids, and H said that he would love to go to a movie, or even dinner w/o them. Said that was part of the problem, we had gotten away from each other, and that he had found someone that would give attention him their undivided attention! I think that momumental at this point for him to realize that! What do you guys think? Before H said this, somewhere in the middle of the conversation, I asked if he had giving any thought to going to C w/ me. He said "no, he didn't have a whole lot of time to think these days!" I said that I wasn't trying to be pushy, b/c I'm the type of person that's a right here right now, whereas, he's more laid back. I said I was going to ask him next week, but that I want him to know that it's important to me and left it at that! As he was leaving he was at the bottom of the steps and I met him there where he didn't just give me a peck, but a kiss, not long, but a great kiss! I'm so excited and on cloud nine. I don't know what it was: Joseph's letter, my shaky Plan A (w/o rec'v SAA and HNHN yet), telling him I was going to IC, or what! Of course, I know that tomorrow can be a whole new ball, but today's been good! WWWWOOOOOWWWW, BABY!

It sounds like good progress. The fact that he mentioned needing time alone, as adults, together, no kids--he is telling you his needs there. He needs to be the center for you, and you really need that too. It's not a bad thing to let your kids come second to the relationship that you two have together. I didn't really know that before. I thought that you were supposed to sacrifice for them and put them first. It is important to place your kids first--the both of you; but your relationship together is the glue. I can tell that the intimacy and verbal aspect of marriage is important to you, and he is trying to do that. It sounds like good progress. Maybe you could surprise him, too.

Thanks so much for the affirmation! That's exactly what I was thinking just a little clearer! Yes, i would like to surprise him. I thought about setting up a surprise weekend getaway since that's what he's been talking about, or even a night out without the kids!If you have any other suggestion I would love to hear it!

Yes, that is definitely a revelation...I also put the kids first not intentionally, their needs just always came first... But everything I read since DDay says that the marriage must come first, and child centered marriages are much more susceptible to As. Wish I knew this before. I thought I was being a good mother and ended up being a not so good wife...

Surprise your H with a getaway--sounds wonderful! If he is more of the laidback type, he will not get around to doing this on his own...it will be just talk, so you go out and Just Do It!!

Good luck!

Y'know, a good movie and some early dinner outside of the home is a good jumping off point. Man, what I would do to have a break, some money and a bed and breakfast, at the ocean. I love to listen to the waves break, catch a sunrise over the water(or sunset if you're on the west coast). WE always enjoyed camping together, just us, reading books and then cooking over the fire, roasting marshmallows or making s'mores. It's nice to think of the good things. Most of all, try to enjoy.

We had talked about goingt o the movies. H said that he can't remember the last time that he went. Tonight, I'm getting someone to watch the YS, and we're going to take the oldest son to supper. The YS is the one that gives a some trouble, 3 yo, he likes to yell and scream and cry when he doesn't get his way. I'm working on it but he's 3! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />OS is 7, almost 8 and really good. H doesn't know the we're not taking the little one! I think he might enjoy that. He gets off at 7. I would have done both but we have to pick up the OS at 7:30.
Temp- I really liked your ideas. We use to go camping also, then we moved up to a camper, and now we don't have one. Hurricane thing!<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/teary.gif" alt="" />

Ah, the 3yo's. My son is turning 4 next week. He is really turning into a source for entertainment, but I do know about the constant interruptions in conversation, just to discuss whatever is currently meandering through his mind. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" /> I went to the movies recently and had an early dinner with H, and we both enjoyed our time together. It does sound, however, like you are further along than we are; you've gotten him to verbalize wanting to save the M. My H says something to the effect of 'Que sera, sera'; not ready to re-commit. I did make this an unsavory alternative for the longest time because of the pain I carried, and did not implement MB tools until quite recently, so I paid for that one. I dealt with rejection for months, and am just now making some head-way. I know that he has love for me, but hasn't really 'cared' for me lately. I hope to turn that around, and I hope that my needs will be fulfilled too. Have a great night out!

Hey Temp, I wanted to say that I read up on your posts. Did you try Joseph's letter, I'll have to search for the link. Or maybe someone can add it? I rewrote it to meet my needs, but held the same thoughts. I also, told him that I went to an IC that same day. I'm not sure what the change is but this is the second good day that we've had! I can tell you that you may not feel like being cheery before you see him, but you have to sike yourself up, just like football players do before a game. I keep going over and over in my mind, I'm going to be happy, I'm going to greet him upbeat. I push all of the bad thoughts and feelings aside. It's kind of like dressing your best in order to feel better about yourself, for the last 3 weeks I have went out of my way to dress nice, you know very professional and the comments that I get from OP help me make it through the day. I might even use those comments to make myself happier when I see him. H's less on the defense, and he sees that I'm not going to wallow in self pity. I've mention in passing that everyone is entitled to one mistake and the important thing is that they learn from it! then, when I have him in a good mood, I pick a time to throw something out there, like tonight I said "last night all I dreamed about was buses coming at me!" H asked "WHY?" I said "probably b/c you're girlfriend drove a bus" then I changed it again saying "I'm sorry should I say drives a bus!" But I watched the tone of voice, implying a joke. H said "You got that wrong again." I said "what do you mean?" H replied "you mean X!" I laughed and said that was good and left it at that. No more talok on the matter for the night! I forget who said to KEEP IT LIGHT AND AIRY! They were right because H coming out of his shell a little more at a time. Stand proud, keep your head back, and concentrate on you, really examine you, think about your past behavior and his reaction, think about the things they the two of you did together when you were "in love", comment him, you M H for a reason(s) what was it? I hope this helps and I didn't overstep the line with my thoughts, but it seems to be working for me. Believe me, I've really had some bad days, but when H gets home, I try to push all that aside, and sometimes I just can't.

Anyone else have any thoughts on how I'm handling things? I'm still waiting on my books! AHHH! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />