I want to throw the bone AT someone's head ... is that allowed?

gotta run

go save lives and such

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

I want compensation for all of this ... send money <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

If I am gonna be held to some hoity-toity doubleass standard ... i want some bucks

Pep

To me this place is the same as a book, a live book with many different authors, many different subjects...constantly changing, but a book nontheless. We come here to read, to learn, to escape, to dream, and to become.

Because it is not a "how to" manual, the poster should not base his post on the "intelligence/emotional" place of the reader.

It should be done at the level (or current "place") the poster is, or what is the point?

You are the one attributing the hiarchy of the various posters, including Pep who you feel carry more weight...

you as the reader, and if the poster were to do that than yes, it would be highly arrogant.

So what is the differance?

We all play a part in this live on going book, and as Pep said our level of importance is equal for that reason and that reason alone.

For me I find value in every single post made to me by every single poster, because that is how I view people, all people including the people who report to me at work, and not one of them holds more weight with me than any other...not even my bosses.

And believe me, it is so much nicer being here in this reality I now live in, then it was when I had low self-esteem and saw people with differences of importance.

Have a nice day

I agree very much that each reader is responsible for their own reactions and their own recovery. No one here has the power to control either, therefore, they can't be held responsible over that which they have no control. People respond differently to differently people and no one can control that.

If I have a bad reaction to a poster, that is ENTIRELY my own issue, and I have an obligation to be accountable for my own reactions, my own emotions.

And sure, some posters here do have more experience and influence than others, but that does not mean that they have any control over the reactions of others. It doesn't mean they are any different from any other posters here. I would sure like to think I had that kind of power and control over others [well, not really <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />] but I know realistically that I don't.

We have a very trite saying in AA that seems very appropos for this thread: take what you need and leave the rest.

IT IS!!!! It wasn't when I started typing that long thing.

This wasn't on the thread either .....


I can appreciate the sentiment. I am a "go-to" guy at work. Others can make a mistake, but when I do, the world seems to end. But you know what? That's OK. I can deal as long as I can look at myself in the mirror and know I tried my best.

Ben Franklin: "Hide not your talents. They for use were made. What's a sundial in the shade?"


Couple of comments to THAT one:
1) Best argument yet that you are one of us "legs."
2) Glad you're not. Somebody has to keep WAT all keyed up and aroused. I'm certainly not going to do it. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Pep. Nobody doubts this. I mean, we all know you are real and human. You and the other some, because of your skill, well, it's just a bigger shock to the system when you goof. (Or probably more appropriately, when we FEEL you do.)


But you DO post what and when you are led, WITHOUT discrimination. That's nobility in my book.


Did I say rules? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> If I did, poor word choice. How did BobP put it, not rules, conventions. It is a natural sorting based on the energy of the exchange. And you know what? You won't escape it. Change your screen name? You are still you.


<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> Where I come from, we call that "the driving finger." Cuz you use it when you drive. And the customary response is: Is that you IQ or sperm count?

{{{Pep}}} Sorry. If I caused you strife or grief. My penchant for thinking aloud.

Mimi, btw, food for thought ~ I see you get *helped* all the time...probably without you realizing it or asking for it.

MrW, I have a huge problem with blaming Pep for this tragically unjust - UNANTICIPATED - outcome. She did not give irresponsible advice. She gave advice that has been given over and over again on this forum for years. It was GOOD ADVICE. This is advice that even Dr. Harley has given before. It is grossly unfair to blame her for the very UNJUST action that was taken later.

No one would have ever dreamt that his wife could have or would have got a restraining order against GF simply for demanding that his W not carry on her adulterous conversation in front of his face.

In all the years I have been on this forum, I have never seen anything so grossly UNJUST. If one were to anticipate such gross injustice in every move, then a person could not EVER object to the most flagrant abuse for fear of being kicked out of his home and having a RO slapped on him.

Please don't compound this injustice by wrongfully blaming Pepperband for one of the most unjust legal actions I have ever seen here. That is not fair. If well meaning posters can be blamed for every unjust act, then NO ONE is ever safe giving any advice here.

Heeeeeeeey, I already said that. But I said "take the meat and leave the bone" <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Exactly Mel. It is not control. But it does not take a newbie long to make a determination on exactly WHO gives consistent advice.

I'd like to think in my life I take the time to weigh everything that is said to me. But I don't. I don't have the time or energy to that on EVERY decision. So if I have trust and respect for person A, I might very well take what they say at face value and act. Whereas person B, who I am skittish about, I will verify or look for an alternate source.

No. Not control. But influence. It is a thing of degree, Mel. I am the parent of my kids. I have primary responsibility. You don't even know them, therefore you have none, or possibly the bare minimum societal responsibility of adults towards children.

What about their teachers? Certainly more than you, certainly less than me.

It just isn't all or nothing. And sadly, tragedies happen. But that is also life. Nobody is calling for an uproar, I think the message today is "Let's be careful." It is too easy to use the anonymity of a screen name as a shield for responsibility, or an excuse for errors.

This site does far more good than bad. Far more. But that also doesn't mean we never stop, take a breather, and reflect.

Ain't that the truth!

When a person decides to act upon any advice he is given, they need to make dayum sure they are in agreement. He was not a puppet on a string.

How immature for a grown adult to think it is someone elses fault because he followed their advice! He has a brain too!

If he thought it was good advice and followed it, HE is responsible for what happens and no one else. I guess if there had been a different outcome, Pep would be the BEST!

He could have ignored the advice, plenty of people here do! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Well guess what. No one here has the time and energy to know every detail of every person they are posting to.

So, what if a fact like "the papers being filed the next day" was missed. That is just an example. BUT, it is impossible to know every detail.

Melody...

Mr. W is not blaming Pep for what happened to GF...he is simply pointing out that her words, as do yours and many others here on the boards carry more weight...tis true, I'm trembling as I write this response to you...

Think about it...Mr. W is a lawyer, he saw that GF should probably not take Pep's advice until after the legal papers had been filed...even though, YES, her advice was sound, it just needed a qualifier...because of Pep's status on the board, Mr. W questioned whether to post that qualifier and chose not to...Because when someone with seniority around here is questioned, others with seniority come to the automatic defense of that person because of that status...so the rest of us lay low, even when we shouldn't...we seem to forget that we are all indeed playing for the same team, and newbies can suffer because of that...make sense?

Mrs. W

Agree with you totally, Susan...

I was VENTING moreso about that LOAD ON MY SHOULDERS..have learned to take it off and put it down...

Hs DO, however, LOVE for you to ASK FOR THEIR HELP...batting my eyelashes as I go into the kitchen to perform wifely duties...


<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

This is all blown so totally out of proportion.

PEP's simple statement is something I've thought about for a long time (and even DONE on occasion). Becoming over involved in the problems and situations of others to the extent that I have neglected my own home and situation.

I think that is ALL she was trying to point out. The RISK of getting emotionally attached, especially to the opposite sex.

For it to be turned into a discussion/attack of her approach and posting style is a huge distraction and disappointment!

Dr Dobson said THIS in 'love must be tough'

"The fastest horses don't always win races, but you should still put your money on them".

Pep ( and others) words are the fastest horses IMO.

Great, this thread might just end up with pep not posting anymore. Just what this forum needs.....FFS... * sigh *

MrsW, then I am even MORE confused. If MrW thought that advice needed a qualifier, then why was that not posted? That certainly cannot be Pep's fault.

I don't see that anyone here just automatically defends someone because they have "senority;" but because they think they are RIGHT. Perhaps we have folks here who are so devoid of principles that they will defend just because they are friends, but I don't know WHO that would be.

I will just say again that it seems very much like Pep is being blamed for a very unjust FLUKE that no one could have anticipated. In fact, if MrW HAD told GF to ignore her advice and wait until the papers were filed, I would have objected too, because there is no way I would have ever anticipated such an outcome. No one could have. But anyone here was perfectly FREE to object to Pep's advice.

Um D...Edit Please? LOL

Mrs. W

100% agreement Susan. Now let me tell you the difference between theory and reality. In theory, nobody should be discriminated against because of race, age, or sex.


I'll re-read what Mr. W wrote, but I don't recall him blaming Pep at all for what the person did. The gist I got was one must weigh advice given carefully.


I doubt if that would be the general consensus. I think most would be thankful that the gentlemen's situation turned out good for him. And nobody is saying Pep is the "worst" as the converse. And WHAT we are saying is certainly not exclusive to Pep.

======= End of Post, Start of Rant <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> =======

And since today seems to be a day for pointing and saying "Look, a duck!"

It is kind of funny to me individuals in Idiotville were chastised for supporting Kiwi simply because they liked her. This smells an AWFUL lot like that.

What is REALLY SAD to me is the fact that here is another example of our childishness.

KiwiJ makes a big mistake. No one doubts that. And the PRIMARY discussion should have been the severity of breaking NC even a bit. And it WAS discussed. But look at all the energy that spun off into who did what, said what, thought what, sided with whom. It's about marriage building. And we discarded the poignant lesson for the titillating details and ancilliary energy.

And here we are again. Jumping to the defense of someone who is not really being accused. But was in a situation that should put what we choose to do here in stark contrast.

I don't really care that Pep is the example. I think she is great. What we are talking about is a reminder to us all that there are REAL people on the other end of the screen and they are here talking to us because THEY DON'T KNOW WHAT TO DO!!!!! And we tell them something and act surprised when they do it.

This is not SimMarriage. This is REAL Marriage.

The point is NOT Pep.

The point is: be quick to listen, slow to speak, slow to anger.

The point is: we have to be careful of what we say, if our DS or DD is tugging at us, or we are on the phone while posting, or cooking dinner, or anything that detracts from our attention (and again, I am NOT saying Pep does that, this is GENERAL) DON'T DO THAT!

The point is: this is *almost* like a suicide hotline. There are real consequences from what people glean here.

The point is: NO. We are NOT legally responsible for actions that people take from what occurs on this board. But just from the nature of it, it is incumbent on us to have care.

The point is: It is not that we shouldn't do "this," it is that we should be careful when we do.

We can't say "We didn't ask for it." We did. The MOMENT we clicked "SUBMIT".

I agree very much, but this is advice that you should be directing to yourself not others. You can't dictate what constitutes "careful" for others as that falls under the domain of each person's judgment. It is a very subjective term that changes from person to person. Pep determines the standard of her own posts based on her own judgment, just as you do. You must be "careful" with your OWN postings and can't expect others to live up to YOUR standard of what constitutes "careful." See what I mean?

Your idea of "careful" may not be my idea of careful. And is it up to EACH PERSON to determine the standard of their own posts. We can't dictate our own personal standards to others, in other words. So wouldn't you agree that you can only control yourself and not others?

Maybe we each and every one of us should always put a disclaimer at the top of every post saying something to the effect:

"This is opinion only.”

Or, "Do not try this at home."

Or, "Please don't shoot this messenger."

And also, "Be sure to call the MB counseling center,” at the bottom of every post.

For me, I think somethinh akin to the above is always implicit everywhere on the internet in the first place. Shoot, I take my own posts with a grain of salt.