"CN, I would like to ask how you imagine her husband would know if I hadn't told him?"

I would hope that KiwiJ would tell him . . . it seems the decent thing to do.

"You seem to be so obsessed with Jen's "safety" that you have entirely overlooked her victim."


Not really, I didn't know that her "safety" has been threatened. Her safety wasn't/isn't my concern here. I think that when people make mistakes THEY need to take ownership of it and correct them. They don't need to have others step into it and do it for them.

"Or did he, the real victim here, even cross your mind?"

Of course he did, that is why I think that she should have been given the opportunity to tell him . . . even if it took longer than MEL decided it should. I think it would have been less of a blow for her to have confessed than the way YOU decided YOU would do it in THEIR marriage.

I'm all for exposing an affair to your spouse. Some people take a little longer that others to make the decision to come clean.

"It matters not who told him, only that he was told."

You really believe this? It would mean the same thing to you if your husband came to you and confessed an affar as it would from having someone on the internet track you down and tell you?

Maybe it is just me, but I would want to hear it from my W Mel, and not from you.

I don't think it is your RIGHT to decide for OTHERS how fast they should confess their sins. But I can see that you think it is your RIGHT to do this.

CN, I would agree that her "safety" is not a concern here.


Well, as you can see Jen DID take ownership of her affair and her lies ONLY AFTER I exposed her to her husband. So, she apparently DID need someone to step in and do it for her. She wasn't doing it herself.


It had nothing to do with a matter of TIME, it was a matter of WILLINGNESS. A willingness that Jen admitted she did not have. She had every opportunity to tell him ....and wouldn't.


A entirely moot point because she admitted she had no intention of telling him. The important thing is that he WAS TOLD. It matters not who told him.

The fact that Jen refused to confess does not supercede Rob's RIGHT TO KNOW. This is information which he had a right to know and it was wrongfully withheld from him. He is the victim here and had a right to know. Until the truth came out, there was no hope that the problem could be addressed and the marriage could start recovering. As long as she wouldn't tell him the problem would never be addressed and the door to a resumption of her affair was wide open. So, you tell me how thats wrong? You can't.............and you know it.

I hate to remind you of this, but you are on a forum that strongly ADVOCATES exposure. Nowhere does Dr. Harley designate that only CERTAIN people can expose. That is an entirely asinine manufactured standard that makes NO SENSE. Why in the world you have manufactured this arbitrary standard is beyond my comprehension.

But, the truth is that had I followed your silly standard, Rob would not know today and he would still be sitting there scratching his head wondering why his marriage was in such trouble. But because of my exposure, he knows and they have an opportunity to fix the problem. I don't know how a rational person could argue against that, but I have seen nuttier things on this forum.

CN - "Maybe it is just me" - No, it wasn't just your opinion but we appear to be definitely in the minority. TT

You know, I don’t really understand how anyone can object to Kiwi’s husband having been notified of his wife’s continuing adultery. Why is there even a discussion about exposing this obscene resumption of a sordid, slimy relationship with that other man?

Kiwi was a regular poster here on MB for a long while and came to understand how wrong her adultery was and helped others recover from their own infidelities. Then, knowing all she did, Kiwi chose to indulge herself by allowing her partner in adultery to reconnect with her. I think it takes a special kind of sociopathic-like cruelty for someone to do something like that. She knew from her time on MB what she could not do…she knew the consequences…she knew the terrible pain it would cause…and she did it anyway! To me, that is unforgivable.

Let’s be clear. Humans are not animals driven only by instinct and rudimentary thought processes. We are not totally subject to the whims of hormones and primitive urges beyond our control. We are reasoning beings and can use our brains to overcome such things. Kiwi knew the dangers in what she was doing and had the power to prevent herself from doing it, but she would not. She made a selfish choice and refused to allow her husband his right to make choices by being honest with him.

Why should anyone keep quiet when they see that happening?

What I don't see in all the posts out here by or about what Kiwi has done is a single word about personal responsibility, self-discipline, or just plain having the cojones to resist doing evil. She needed to do what was right, simply because it was the right thing to do. She could have told her husband at the first glimpse of the other man across the way and have sheltered in her husband's arms. Instead, she decided she deserved to have the other man come back into her life.

Kiwi had lots of time to confess. Unfortunately, it was clear she was not going to do the honorable thing. I don’t know where Kiwi’s integrity disappeared to, but it was surely suppressed in favor of reengaging in cheating behavior.

What “right” does anyone have to betray his or her spouse after having been forgiven once? Having re-offended, is there then some kind of extraordinary privilege for the betrayal to be kept secret? Is there some “right to privacy” adulterers have to hide the fact they are cheating again? Certainly not. No such moral or legal right exists.

I see Kiwi and one other say they feel abandoned by establishments out here. Excuse me? People who are contemplating or actually have begun cheating on their spouses when they know it is appallingly wrong have actually deserted the establishments, not the other way around. Come on people. Get real.

I regret I feel no sympathy for Kiwi. Instead, I reserve my compassion for a husband who has now been betrayed twice and who is now in a living h3ll. Instead of feeling sorry for Kiwi’s squalid, disgusting secrets having been revealed, all my prayers go to the husband who has to suffer for what Kiwi has done.

What Kiwi was doing was an assault on her marriage, a crime committed against a helpless victim she vowed to love, honor, and respect. What she did, knowing full well what she was doing, was despicable. I applaud anyone and everyone who reports a crime to the proper authority. I will do the same thing each and every time the opportunity comes to me. How sad some people believe otherwise.

If my husband were having an affair and refused to tell me, I would not care WHO told me.


I could not care less how fast others "should confess their sins" and have never said any such thing. I care only about my moral obligation to warn someone when they are being harmed behind their back.

And again, you are wrongly trying to frame this as a matter of time when it was a matter of willingness. Jen had no willingness and has admitted as much.

To sit by idly and do nothing while an affair takes place is IMMORAL.

THANK GOD!

"That is an entirely asinine manufactured standard that makes NO SENSE. Why in the world you have manufactured this arbitrary standard is beyond my comprehension."

It is good that you used the word "asinine" because that is the perfect word that describes your position. You the, wise and internet savvy MEL, decides if and when someone is going to confess. MEL most people have the ability to change their mind. I thought that I would never tell my W about my A . . . I eventually did. I can’t predict how my W would have reacted if someone else would have told her . . . but I’m pretty sure it would have been worse.


"And again, you are wrongly trying to frame this as a matter of time when it was a matter of willingness. Jen had no willingness and has admitted as much."

Once you become omnipotent then I will believe that you have a realistic grasp of other peoples willingness to do what you think they should. Sorry to burst your bubble, but you frankly have no idea what she would have done. You have robbed her of a change to do the right thing in your zealotry to inject yourself in her marriage. WS say things they don't mean all the time. When were you one to believe what a WS says? This is a new development.

You did it. It is done. The point is past arguing. But this should serve as fair warning to be careful what you post or MEL will get ya! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

*ahem*

is this the "group think" thread ???

I am writing a thesis .... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

BWHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

Have something on your mind Pep, or just want to stir the pot a little more?

just injecting my humor (for Kiwi's benifit)

see kinger thread...

CN,

A few posts above it would appear that you are advocating SECRETS in marriage. Would you like to elaborate? This would be very counter to MB principles.

Quote:......Oh well. [color:"red"] I think that KiwiJ did learn to not post things here that she doesn't want her husband to know. I think that this is a good lesson for eveyone . . . be careful what you say on this board. [/color] .....End Quote [color:"red"] [/color]

Secrecey is the fuel that keeps the A fires burning!

Also it is the person who pulls the trigger not the gun or the bullet that has the intent. Think about it, gun, knife, baseball bat, Affair!

[color:"red"]And Most important of all this is a public forum. If you don't want something known DON"T POST IT!!!!!!!!!! [/color]

CN, but I don't have to be "omnipotent" when someone TELLS ME they weren't going to tell, now do I? There is no need for omnipotence when reality is hitting you square in the face, now is there? lol <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />


Actually, he reacted how most BS's react; he was extremely grateful because he already suspected something. Most people here wish that someone would have told them earlier. I know I would have been grateful to whomeever cared enough to tell me. Folks aren't picky about who tells them the truth.

And Jen has been "robbed" of nothing. Quite the contrary; she now has a chance to work on her marriage [and stop drinking so much because of her secret according to her] since the truth has been brought out. If no one had told Rob, she would still be keeping her secret.


It should be fair warning that if someone is harming you behind your back, that I will be your friend and TELL YOU. If you are harming someone, yes, I will TRY MY BEST to get ya! I PROMISE!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

**snort** <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

this thread is a prime example of Kiwi's point.

LMAO

CN ... give your assumptions a rest ... I am not trying to imflame, I am tossing cold water on this discussion!

*shake it off*

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />
Pep <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Jen was never going to be willing to admit her adultery to her husband and admitted it. What part of that can anyone misunderstand? If she had not been exposed, she would have continued with her adultery without a second thought for her husband.

I wish I had been the one to find Rob's phone number. Calling him was the honorable thing to do and I would love to have it on my résumé.

"A few posts above it would appear that you are advocating SECRETS in marriage. Would you like to elaborate? This would be very counter to MB principles.

Quote:......Oh well. I think that KiwiJ did learn to not post things here that she doesn't want her husband to know. I think that this is a good lesson for eveyone . . . be careful what you say on this board. .....End Quote


Me advocating secrecy in a marriage? . . .Hardly. I'm advocating not writing anything on this board that you don't want your spouse to know. I think this conversation has strengthened my belief in that opinion. . . don't you?

Pep . . . I knows that you was foolin'

Plus, Jen has perked up lately !!! Back to her old self. She was not a happy camper holding onto that terrible secret.
methinks
Jen is a sensitive person who cares a lot about others .... and knowing she was bound to cause her H pain with the secret, she chose to hurt herself by witholding the secret.

The secret was eating her alive!

Pep

Thats EXACTLY what you are advocating when you object to the exposure of this affair to Rob. You are arguing against exposure of the affair, against the very basics of Marriage Builders principles.

"Jen was never going to be willing to admit her adultery to her husband and admitted it. What part of that can anyone misunderstand? If she had not been exposed, she would have continued with her adultery without a second thought for her husband."

WSs say garbage all the time. They can, and often do, change their minds. I'm sure she said that she wasn't going to, but I said the same thing . . . What part of that can't you seem to understand?

"I wish I had been the one to find Rob's phone number. Calling him was the honorable thing to do and I would love to have it on my résumé."

I would rather have convincing Kiwi to do the right thing on my resume, but to each their own.