My situation goes something along these lines. My wife and I have been married for 2 and a half years and a little more than a month ago I found out she had cheated on me. She said the PA only happened once but I knew the EA lasted longer. Her affair began on the internet and it was happening behind my back the entire time. My wife had come to me several times during her EA and told me she wasn't happy. I spoke with several friends about making positive changes in me in order to help my wife cope with her unhappiness and make our relationship better (see EN). After having done this for about a month she comes out and tells me what she had done. We agreed that a seperation was in order so that she could have time to think as I was willing to work it out and make changes to benefit the relationship. I had put plan A into effect at this point. She left for her parents and stayed a week and we chatted via internet for that week. She then stopped all communication with me which I found odd as we had left on relatively decent terms. I called her parents and eventually my wife called me. She called me from the OM's phone and informed me she had flown across the country to be with him. (Background info: The OM is going through a divorce because of this affair as well. My wife had informed me of this during this phone conversation.)
She still speaks to me via the internet when he is at work and I feel as if she is having both worlds.
What should I do? Should I cut off contact with her while she is with him? Should I keep the lines of communication open?
She is definitely still in the fog when it comes to discussing our relationship. I made a decision as well that any contact she would have to initiate with me. I don't want to seem needy. I am trying to win her back and she claims that she is going back to her hometown in a few days. This would be a much more even playing field for our discussions IMO.

For myself, I am starting individual counselling.

So sorry this is happening to you. Plan B is what I would do. She needs something to snap her out of it, and if she has a lifeline to hold onto, she will still think she is calling the shots. It's tough, but that is what I would do.

Good luck, you are in my thoughts and prayers.

Okay, you say that you had put Plan A into effect...What do you mean by this exactly? Have you exposed this affair? Have you spoken with OMW?

Do you have children?

Mrs. W

Before she left I was doing what I could to not speak of the affair and act pleasantly toward her. My immediate family knows the details of the affair and my entire family knows we are seperated. Her parents know as well since they covered for her when I tried to call. OMW knows as they have already begun divorce proceedings.

We do not have children.

Why would you do this? You absolutely should state your boundaries and tell her that her behavior (having an affair) is not acceptable...YOU MATTER!

If you want to save this marriage, exposure is in order...Targets would include friends, family, co-workers, clergy...Anyone that has any influence with your WW...Do you know how to contact OMW?

Please read the following post by Pepperband regarding Plan A...Outlining what it entails exactly...

Mrs. W

How do you KNOW this??? Is it information supplied by your WW??? THAT is NOT a reliable source of information...You need to speak directly with OMW...

Mrs. W

I agree that you need to "independently" find out what OMs W knows and doesn't know....you can't trust information being fed to you by your WW.

Don't refrain from talking about...nor dwell on the A....confront her about the hurtfulness of her actions....but in a calm and respectful way.

I'm so sorry this is happening to you.

So I should state exactly what went on with her parents from my perspective so they realize exactly what is going on? Unfortunately the OMW is in another state and I have no way of getting in touch with her to speak with her. She has left and essentially quit her job. The only people I could possibly influence are her parents. She is not necessarily dependent on me but she will be dependent on her parents or OM if she chooses to stay in either of these place. I do appreciate the help. Thank you very much. I need to know the holes in my plan. I am already preparing to move out of my apt and sell one of my vehicles. All of these things were upsetting to her. But I feel as if I need to be thinking of me right now since I have no reason to keep these things if she is not here. Does this seem logical? I hope.

Just realized how garbled that last message sounded. Let me clarify in a bit more detail.

What I need to do is tell her parents exactly what went on and tell them that I am committed to saving our marriage. Does this seem reasonable as they are the only real influences on WW. WW has essentially quit her job so speaking with ex-co-workers won't do me much good at this point.

In regards to speaking to the OMW, it seems as if that may be impossible since they like in another state and the relationship was fostered over the internet. I'm not sure how to get in touch with her but wish I could.

I am on the right track? Is Plan A essentially over for me?

Ak...

Do you REALLY want to save this marriage? You are very young with no children...Even the Harleys advise that in situations such as your sometimes it's best to move on...You can receive support here no matter what your decision...What do YOU want? The advice you receive will depend on your answer to this question...

Yes, no matter what, I would tell her parents what the score is EXACTLY...

Mrs. W

Expose to anyone who can put pressure on the affair is the rule. And FIND OM'sW. It's not rocket science and expose to her. Kill this thing dead.

I have thought on this quite a bit and I am committed to saving my marriage. I realized that we are both young but I do love my wife very much and believe she is in the fog right now. I truly want to make my relationship work.

Aside from calling every person with the same last name in the phone book, how can I find out more info so I can find the OMW? Any suggestions?

AKMAN,

Do you have any clue as to why she had the affair? Has she given you any reasons? You see given the youth of the marriage, the chances are very large that the marriage will hit a rough spot or perhaps another rough spot and unless you and she have the tools, there is little chance.

Mrs. W is asking you a very important question about wanting to save this marriage.

But, perhaps let me take this further. Harley recommends plan A for a period of time WITH full disclosure to the affair to those that might have influence over her. However, what is often overlooked is that he also recommends that YOU set a date to reevaluate the situation. If little has changed you go to plan B. The job of plan B is NOT to punish her but to slow the lose of love you WILL experience.

Now here is my take on this. If you are willing to walk away from this marriage, then you may well up your chances of saving it. You say you love her, that is good. The love will leave in its time and hopefully not before she wises up. However, your willingness to end things means you should be willing to expose, find OM's W, expose to her and do the things necessary to see if you can end this affair.

I am NOT talking about being mean, abusive, or even love busting. I am talking about relentlessly following the plan here KNOWING you can and will leave her if she does not come around.

If you are not willing to lose, you are going to have a hard time playing to win. Does this make sense to you? If so, set some dates for reevaluation of this. Proceed with ALL of plan A, and be prepared to go to plan B. That means starting to read up on plan B, work on your plan B letter etc.

You can do this, but you must insist that she and you understand WHY this happened before continuing this marriage.

I hope something I have said makes sense.

God Bless,

JL

*ugh*

The more I read the more I feel like I completely messed up plan A while she was here. Honestly I'm not sure when she will be coming back to stay here. I also feel as if I am not on a fair playing field talking with her since she is with OM right now. Would it be best to stop communication until I know she has returned to her parents?

Essentially I feel like I'm still in the prostrating period of trying to get her to come back to talk to me. It's very difficult for me to express myself without her getting upset at me. I have told her that when we decide to see each other again that I think marriage counselling is a definite must. I am also beginning my own personal sessions tomorrow. I want to know some things about myself. I do realize what some of the problems of the relationship were and was trying to right the ship. But I believe she was already neck deep in the EA to care, or see what I was doing.

Ak,

Not sure of your financial situation...I *think* that www.netdetective.com is relatively reasonable in price...That site has been used by some here with good result I understand...Also, www.zabasearch.com

Do you have any emails from the OM to your wife that he sent to his entire address book? (a joke or some other nonsense) OMW *might* be included in that...THAT, btw is also an EXCELLENT exposure resource...Let EVERYONE in his addy list know exactly what their pal "Mr. I.M. Evil" is up to with a married woman, ya know?

Mrs. W

Ak, everyone makes mistakes in trying to go down this EXTREMELY HEARTWRENCHING path...Don't beat yourself up...Mistakes can be overcome...You move forward from here...


You are right, you are not on a "level playing field"...You are dealing with an active WW...She looks like your wife, she sounds like your wife, but she is a completely alien creature right now...You cannot trust anything that she says in her current state...NO WAY...However, do not cut off contact with her, as your doing so only allows her to continue her affair "in peace", so to speak...You can still talk to her...You must understand though that almost everything that she says will be "fog babble" right now and allow it to roll off of your back...Use a lot of hmmms...I see's...uh huh's and some nods...Just let her feel that you are listening to her, not judging her, while still stating your boundaries-remember, it's not a love buster to tell her that her affair is hurtful and damaging to you...


Ok, and the BEST way to allow this to happen is to burst the bubble in fantasyland with exposure of this affair to bust it up...Remember in doing this to state that you are trying to save your marriage and enlist the help of the person/people that you are exposing to by asking them to help you with this goal in whatever way they might be able to...

Also, remember that the best defense for a WS is an aggressive offense...She will try to pin the blame for her affair on you...Do not accept the blame for her CHOICE...Accept the blame for 50% of the state of the pre affair marriage only...She will still blame you for a while...Know what you know and move forward...Trying to tell her otherwise will be futile now...

Do not try to "educate" her...Right now, especially, MB is your safe haven...Do not tell her about this place...THIS is where you will develop your "battle plan"...Don't hand her the "playbook", okay?

Even when she gets upset, remain calm...If she yells, you whisper...steady...be her lighthouse...



Marriage counseling is ill advised until you are SURE that the affair has ended, no contact has been established and the withdrawal period is over...It would be a waste of your money otherwise...When you get to that point, a PRO Marriage counselor is what you will need...One with a FULL UNDERSTANDING of Infidelity and it's dynamics...


This is great...Again, be CERTAIN that this counselor is pro marriage and understands infidelity fully...If you can afford it, I would highly recommend phone counseling with one of the Harleys right now for you instead...They are phenomenal...They understand infidelity, are VERY pro marriage and will help you to come up with the best possible plan for you to save your marriage...This board is a great source of support, but it is no match for professional wisdom and guidance that you can get from the Harleys...Here is the link for the counseling center...

Read JL's post to you again...There is really good stuff there...

And know this...No matter what happens, YOU will be ok AK...

Mrs. W

Okay, well as far as finding the OMW it is near impossible, I tried some of those sites and the name is too common I can't find out any decent info.

As far as her being an active WW, that she is. However, she claims her mind is clear, today we had a conversation where I voiced my feelings and thoughts about what was discussed in my thread. She was way more understanding than I expected. I truly expected much more hurtful things from her. She mentioned the chores and taking her for granted. But not in a vindictive way. It was weird.

I accepted the blame for my 50% and told her it was her choice to do what she did and I am not responsible for it. Again, not much anger from her. Do you think I'm making progress?

AKMAN8 -

I wish I could be encouraging, but my situation won't particularly inspire you.

My ex-wife was up to her ears in an EA with OM#2 (already had a couple of years with OM#1). It was an internet thing, and she got to the point of wanting him to move into our house.

Unfortunately, I had a long history of being a conflict avoider (CA) and had let her get away with all this stuff while she gave me various guilt trips about how she wouldn't need another man if I was the husband that she needed and all this other "stuff".

To really, really fast forward. December 2004 I gave her a choice, she never really chose, and I divorced her. As of today, she is still involved with OM#2.

My advice (but listen to others here too). Draw the line in the sand with no wiggle room. Frame it as what you have to have in order to avoid the pain you are enduring. Don't point a finger, but make sure she realizes the choice is hers and there is no negotiation on fidelity (even emotional) in a marriage.

In my experience, it ain't gonna get better if you don't (and I'm quoting Barney himself) "nip it in the bud".