Remember,

He has not had the intense relationship training you have had as a result of your ex. Only you can decide if he's "trainable" and if he's worth the effort you will need to recondition him.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Peach - get out your Gloria Gaynor music - try listening to "I Will Survive".

peachy, in case you didn't catch it from your post on after divorce/relationship board, i sent you an email concerning thsi sitch.....

hugs to you... i am having a bad weekend as well... and the cocktails are looking pretty good right now.
mlhb

Don't have time to read this whole thread, Peach, but nobody so far (I only read half the posts) reacted to the following:



Ahem. HE'S going to decide? He already decided. And you made choices based on his decision.

Wow. That sounds arrogant.

Don't mean to dump on him, peachy, but why are you arguing with him again? I think NC is best till he sorts out his issues.

Someone posted "Never give up on love." I respectfully disagree -- or rather, qualify. Give up on BEING in love. It's a temporary emotion. Your love for your son is real and lasting. I have a great quote from C.S. Lewis ... I'll post it later.

Here it is; it's from the Screwtape Letters, which take the point of view of Satan and consider God the "Enemy":

"We have done this [undermined monogramy] through the poets and novelists by persuading the humans that a curious,and usually shortlived, experience which they call 'being in love' is the only respectable ground for marriage; that marriage can, and ought to, render this excitement permanent; and that a marriage which does not do so is no longer binding. ... The Enemy described a married couple as 'one flesh.' He did not say 'a happily married couple' or 'a couple who married because they were in love,' but you can make humans ignore that...

"It is [our] business ... to produce in every age a general misdirection of what may be called sexual 'taste.' This [we] do by working through the small circle of popular artists, dressmakers, actresses and advertisers who determine the fashionable type. The aim is to guide each sex away from those members of the other with whom spiritually helpful, happy, and fertile marriages are most likely."

Update...can't write too long...ds and I are watching a movie.

HE CALLED AGAIN TODAY...I DIDN'T ANSWER..WELL I WASN'T HOME EITHER!

Been out test driving cars with ds and having a blast today. No hangover whatsoever b/c skyy doesn't usually cause that...carbless and hangoverless. and yes, I do NOT have many at all ...last night a rarity folks.

So he calls and leaves voice message. last night, my phone accidentally disconnected from him...( think so at least?) and I did not try to call back or anything. We talked a grand total (from the call long) of 3 hours. Wow. for a man who can't seem to return phone calls, this is different.

The voice message was kinda like this, "just calling to CHECK IN. Wasn't sure if it was me or you...and it was an accident if it was me that caused the line to disconnect last night. I hope you didn't hang up. Just wanted to say hi. Thanks for the physician link for my mom. Talk to you soon. Have a good day. Bye".

So...he's already pushing my boundaries. I did not call back. I have not been moved. Plus tonight is saturday night and he may be out w/the Train Wreck. I am not going to give satisfaction of telling him either way if I was mad about the perceived "hang up" or not. Let him worry. As the man called at 2 pm...which was...hmmm....about 14 hours after the perceived hang up? So can we say he was worrying about it? hope damn sure he was.

believer my twin, love ya. and of course Kiwi Jen...I do take your words into consideration. I understand the lure of a former relationship...his and mine was a very serious one (3 and a half years and almost married) and we never did anything bad before however...so I don't know of his character being bad...shattered? you're also on target here. I am not sure if he is actually trainable or if it is salvageable. I am definitely disconnecting from him b/c it's healthier. and yes I do believe a dating 180 is in store for him courtesy of ME!

orchid honey...don't worry bout me. you know i have more bounces and nine lives than a darn cat. love ya girl. miss you too! tried any suthn' recipes from the book yet?

cindy love that song...but my all time fav. trashy disco song is Cher's "Strong Enough"...with all its cheesy disco goodness!

AM...love ya. And you're right. Love ain't all it's cracked up to be. I almost bought the cds of "screwtape letters" as I love CS Lewis books. He didn't decide btw...I DECIDED WHAT I CHOSE TO ACCEPT. He made stuupid choice to date the xgf. me? I made the decision to NOT put up with him anymore like this.

I am crackin' da proverbial whip!

Maybe I am done...maybe not.

mlhb.you're so sweet...sent you an email. bit earlier inbetween doing stuff with ds...his magic tricks from the toy shop backfired btw. he got a bit discouraged <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

me? dealing with it.

Not happy about J.

But dealing w/it. Just silly images floating thru my head and I'm trying to turn em' off. Like seeing him sitting at one of the nice restaurants there where he and I went and him fawning over the Train Wreck. Bleech.

Dobie, your words, "There's a serious air of familiarity in this little speech, isn't there? Particularly the part about him worrying that you won't wait around and scurry back to him when pulls his head out of his nether regions."

Yep. His head is up his [censored]. His speech did nothing short of infuriate me. Made me act more cooly and detached I think. I have NO friggin' idea HOW I was able to hold it together without tearing up. But it happened. Again, think I had about 3 years practice with darth on this issue.

unsuspecting and brownhair... (((((hug)))))) back at ya. I really need them. I am doing ok but still REALLY REALLY DOWN NOW.

trix, you make a good point too. one of us would have to move as we couldn't get virtually married. and somebody would have to do something. he wanted imho me there. I have my ds here. i have a friend who's an attny here...he is a partner (senior one) for a firm in birmingham...and he lives here...virtual offices. so it could be done effectively...but J is a workaholic and a terrible creature of habit.

and shattered? Poof I AM GONE. Yep. You got that right. the bar has been raised a bit more than he's already beginning to figure out.

JP,

First of all {{{{{justpeachy}}}}}.

I want to say that you are doing so well and your decision to "set the bar" high for any suitor is right and will yield wonderful benefits to you and your DS when the lucky man finally makes his appearance. I know that my standards have changed as a result of living through my WW and STBXW's affair and resulting and accompanying actions, words, etc. I will not settle, period.

It is not our job change someone into who we want them to be. It is our responsibility to become the best person we can be and allow someone to see that and want to be part of it. From your posts and from respect that you garner on this site, I know you must be really wonderful. I know from your photo on the MB photo thread that your are a beautiful lady. I know from how you are protecting your DS from the "dark side" that you are an outstanding mom. So, this all being true expect the best, prepare for the best and accept nothing less.

All the best to you and your DS. You are so strong and you will overcome this struggle and will be better for it. Lastly, I sse that you are an ole' Alabama gal. Well, I am a Mississippi boy and we neighbors have to look out for one another thus my well wishes within this post.

For me, it would be over.

If we had a "wonderful, great, fantastic" relationship and the only issue was distance -- and he STILL felt the need to DATE his XGF -- there would be NO recovering from that.
This is the honeymoon phase of your relationship and there is already something intruding.

Nobody "forgets" to mention a date with an XGF. Its a very intentional omission. An unforgiveable one at this point.

IMO, a very crucial trust has been broken. A long distance relationship requires an enormous amount of trust. You can't possibly get to the next step of committment when you can't TRUST him.

How can you even CONSIDER uprooting your son, changing your career, moving your home -- when he is so recently dating another woman???
Even if he has a big "revelation" how are YOU going to be able to trust him when you can't see his ACTIONS?

Think about all those triggers you'd face -- what happens when he doesn't call when he's supposed to? what if you can't reach him sometime?
WHY ON EARTH SHOULD YOU HAVE TO DEAL WITH THAT???

Peachy, I think you value yourself like I do. And I would NEVER be OK with the man I am dating to need to "explore" his remaining feelings for his XGF. See ya. Good luck with that!
I'd prefer to find the man that can commit to me enthusiastically. The man I end up with will know that I am the prize and will not have to even think about another woman. If another woman is on his mind, he is not the man for me.

Its a minor set-back peachy...hold out for what you deserve!

HUGE HUGS TO YOU!!!

*** Brownhair just dropping by in Cyberspace, sitting down next to JustPeachy, putting her hand on her shoulder. ***

Hi JustPeachy,

I can understand this must be especially painful and triggering after what you have been through.
I am proud of you that you are setting your boundaries and refuse to be victimised by ignorance and not setting of boundaries of others.

Being a recovering CA I know what that is about very well. And as painful as my XWH's multiple betrayal was, I'm grateful for finally have learned that I have the right to enforce MY boundaries. Others don't have to like it - but they will have to respect it, or they're "no friend of mine".
Don't get me wrong - I'm not there yet, but I'm on my way.
I'm starting to enjoy road signs like "Trespassers will be shot. Survivors will be shot again." (Maybe there's a little drop of Texan blood in me?? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />)

Respecting my own boundaries has made me feel so much better about myself.
I'm sure that when the pain wears off (and you know it will) you'll feel good about standing up for what you believe.
And that you will know what to do.
You go girl !!

hopeandpray...again, great words and I'll quote ya, "It is not our job change someone into who we want them to be. It is our responsibility to become the best person we can be and allow someone to see that and want to be part of it".

that's what I am gonna do. and my family is in alabama, except for my mom who's in N. Mississippi. I am in gaw-ga.

no settling! And glad 2 meet you neighbor!

Lexxxy....You are exactly saying WHY I chose to end things w/him. It is unforgiveable. Almost as bad if i had gone out to dinner w/darth or something. (shuddering at mere thought of that as it repulses me now) I absolutely will NOT move my life for anybody if they've betrayed my trust. and his little sin of "omission"...so far has made me see it as a dealbreaker. He knows it too. He tried the whole "but I am slow w/things as you know peach...after my D I didn't rush into anything and even after I dated the Train Wreck, I dumped her b/c I had severe questions about her character." And now he waffles? Waffles. I don't want a waffler. If I do I will marry the guy who flips flapjacks at wafflehouse! I don't want ever to have to look behind my back. YOu're right...WE ARE THE PRIZE...they are lucky to have us. I am now having flashback to "hope floats"...where she looks at her cheating xh and says "You were lucky to have me." He sure was. Ya know. I HOPE the man dates her. I HOPE she becomes the complete freak Train Wreck she is immediately. I hope he sees that he is the biggest idiot in the universe. Oh well...the whole main enchilada and why cheating or even pseudo almost cheating occurs...THE NEED FOR INSTANT GRATIFICATION OF THE EGO in today's society!

That's it. That's what we are all up against.

INSTANT GRATIFICATION OF THE EGO. Make me feel good NOW. And I want my needs met NOW. Mature love? Hmm...Why should we all have mature and rational love when there are things as exciting as extreme sports and we all know that I want to feel the rush...the high!

That's the problem with the whole single and married world today. Unless imho you got morals of titanium, you will be moved by the popular thought.

Now I am in cyberspace walking over to brown hair and bringing her a cup of cybercoffee and we're sitting down to talk. Sorry bout your xwh too. But it does make us stronger. And sometimes I am glad I'm so strong...other times I wat to run for the hills and put those darn rose colored glasses back on. Mine probably can never stay on. Maybe all WS and wbf's (wayward boyfriends) have the distinct ability TO ALWAYS BE ABLE TO PUT THEM BACK ON..thus enabling them to do stupid things...like cheat with sleazy people and women like Family Values, Monkeyho, and the Train Wreck. For if they saw clearly, they'd run for the hills with us!

It's day 2 of boundaries. I am just kinda sick this am. All last night kept wondering "is he out with the Train Wreck"? And now this am, had horrible thoughts about it.

And yes, the horrid thoughts are most likely remnants of my experiences with darth...the ultimate WS evil sith lord of all.

But this girl? Train Wreck? She especially hates me. J told me that towards the end of the time they were dating, she actually went through some of his stuff...and in some of his boxes in his bedroom was a huge box of things about he and I. photos of us from college. program books from the local and state beauty contests I was in. some of me doing halftime at the football games, etc. And of course the love notes in return from me. And he even kept receipts of when he had sent me roses. She BURNED IT ALL. She told him that she'd rid him of me forever as she was not going to date anybody WHO HAD SUCH A PRESENT GHOST. this was in february of this year btw...and I had no clue that I'd ever see him again.

Well now...I sure hope that the woman feels my presence! I hope she gets the absolute willies. I hope that she does. I am "strong in the force" and know that the evil sith lords and ladies can sense disturbances in "the force". I do know that I accidentally left one of my undies over at his house though. Very cute VS thongs. I think that might cause a huge "disturbance in the force" dontcha? lmao. She is a snooper. She WILL find them. And there's lots of things over there I did...such as create the planters on the front steps, the ones on the side by the garage...what's she gonna do? go insane and dig up all the plants everywhere?

I am guessing you guys must have had the discussion where you both agreed to be exclusive to each other?...no dating others, so that even though you weren't yet engaged you felt there was a commitment to fidelity...or was it just to honesty? So that the lie of omission was a big no-no. (I hate lies of omission) I assume he wouldn't have liked you to accept one of those other dates recently...it is too easy to convince oneself that double standards are ok for the one doing the stuff.

Otherwise, you are both single and living apart. Different people may react differently given long distance, non engaged, still feeling single, relationships.

I suspect some of your reaction is due to your all the pain Darth caused you from his infidelity and you are projecting that onto J. I doubt he saw it the same way...better that he take a second look at xgf sooner rather than after you are engaged or married. I imagine she has been flirting with him at work and coming on pretty heavy since she heard he was seeing you. She may not have wanted him but she doesn't want you to have him.

I wouldn't want him to continue working in the same office with her should you guys work through this problem.

I think he got the message that your boundaries do not allow for the choices he made.

I thought you two would have moved a bit faster this time around since your relationship seemed to end last time due to the long distance. Some women may handle long distance relationships different than some men are able. I thought you would have had a plan in place by this past May.

I don't think he is like Darth...he was not the WS the last time around. In his head he probably still feels single. It is either time to take the relationship to the next level or move on without each other.

I really doubt it is over...you guys seemed so right for each other. I hope it isn't too late for him and I really home he isn't wanting to continue seeing xgf. And I really hope he wasn't planning to see both of you for a while to decide between you. I can't see him thinking there is any comparison in character etc.

trix...don't know anymore. I am a bit too crushed to even really pick it totally apart. I am blockin alot out right now...pretending nothing happened and that he's not in my life... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> we weren't seeing anybody else...we had serious talks...but we were not saying the 100 percent committment thing...as to me, in this phase I am in, it would be about same time as an engagement.

who knows. I don't know anymore about it at all. I am not calling him and maybe that's the wrong thing...but the lack of calls this last 2 weeks, down approximately according to my call log on cell phone, was about FIFTY PERCENT...and that would correspond to the time he went out w/the xgf, Train Wreck.

I don't think he's a bad man. But I do believe he left a real important part out...AS HE WOULD KNOW 100 PERCENT that if I was aware of his dating the xgf, the consequences would be severe...and at the LEAST I would begin dating others as well.

So yea, he's not totally innocent. HE KNOWS.

And I am not gonna move or do anything drastic. Heck, I have friends who are in his line of work WHO WORK FROM ANOTHER CITY and their offices ARE HUNDREDS OF MILES AWAY...they telework. Only go in when a serious case arises...other than that, they're in their office in their home. Me? Can't very well do the virtual office thing in the medical field can I?

Actually imho, he has the more leeway to move.

But right now that's not even an issue.

Issue is what he did. What I chose to do. And that I feel poopy. Quite poopy about the whole damn thing. AT least last time,there was NO other person involved. It was school pure and simple and serious constraints. Once again, a 3 hour time shift happened then.

And maybe I don't like what I see now as much. I mean...a few weeks of a girl hitting on him at the office stroking his ego..or worse...something else. A few weeks and he does this. Almost totally outta sight outta mind...except for the calls.

I am refusing to call him or do anything. Totally no contact until he either ditches the Train Wreck for good and realizes what he has...or else somebody will realize that I am a Prize! For I am the double deal...two prizes for one...you'd get me and the ds for free! What an incredible deal! And he's either going to see it that way or else.

If he could go out with her after using such STRONG NEGATIVE LANGUAGE against her, telling me how he'd never for the life of him see her again, that there was NO way in h#ll he'd ever go back to her do this....then you know why I am so angry right now. Angry, sad and hurt.

And I detach and run. I do this. It's my defense mechanism after darth. sure is. I know what it's like and I will never be a BS again. Not ever. I will either be with somebody I explicitly trust or be happy and alone...as I am now.

No calls since yesterday. And I am thinking he probably out of being mad at me, went out w/the Train Wreck last night. Bleech.

May she derail quite soon...and if past behaviors can usually dictate future actions, she will self destruct and do something insane quite rapidly.

Meanwhile I am doing my own thing. Feeling teeny bit better today though...so that's good.

I am glad you are feeling a little bit better today.

It is weird that he'd allow himself to be temped by her again after saying all that negative stuff about her. What kind of power does she possess...I imagine it is of the sexual...animalistic type and that it was more than a date. I guess that would particularly piss you off.

Wishing the best of you and your DS...whichever way this goes.

Peachy, I'm having a small problem with euphemism here.

He "saw" her. He "dated" her. What does that mean? He went out to Starbucks? Or spent the whole weekend in a wild Humpfest?

What exactly is the event under dispute?

ok Trix...you touched on something that definitely has my goat...the animalistic part. She is a relatively (seen her photos...and no, am not impressed btw)innocent looking girl...but she AIN'T INNOCENT! she's been a bisexual, had 3somes and crazy stuff like that...she is definitely a girl who can have "casual" sex at the drop of a hat. and this is what precisely I am worried about. That she's gonna or has already tried to take advantage of J.

And if he has slept with her? Guess what. It's over! I don't take that crud.if he did...we will never speak again.

AM...honey the man did NOT elaborate...they have slept together before...they lived together for 2 mos...and I am gonna think she's gonna try that too. He's been celibate for a month now...and I am 3 hours away. She's his old gf and she is well...uh...a bit of a sex freak from all accounts from him..her "wildness" was one thing that in the end, was why he broke up w/her...he thought she had a bad prior reputation and he was embarassed about her past.

he did not say if they went to starbucks, saw a movie, went to a 5 star restaurant or mcdonalds, or had a roll in the hay. he did NOT elaborate...and that's why I am worried...

I told my H about this turn of events with J. I told him about the going silent then the 'date' thing. He immediately said, "you know what that was all about"....he meant...well you know.

It is kind of unlikely if they were 'that way' back in Feb...then it would go there again...and pretty quickly. But I really don't know him...you do.

So trix your h thinks it's "that way" again?

I think she probably tried to take advantage of him...he really is a decent guy deep down. she? well...none of his family coworkers or friends liked her.

I was speechless I remember when he told me about her. He was ashamed even telling me he'd dated a woman like that. He said "I got in too deep and at that point...almost at a year..she came clean to me about her past...that was when her x lover, the butch lesbian xgf, called my house."

Yea, her xgirlfriend butch lover called MY normal successful and educated guy and told HIM she'd kick his [censored] if he didn't stay away from HEr girlfriend.

how sick is this?

But yea, this girl is one helluva FRRRRREAK!

JP--I'm so sorry to hear your last few days have been as painful as mine. Just keep looking at that DS of yours, and think about what a wonderful life the two of you have ahead. In time, your feelings towards the STBXBF (if that is what happens) will become more clear. If it is meant to be, you will know it. Give it a little time, ok?