Hello all!

I have been doing Plan A for about 4 months now while we are seperated. When WH first left, confessing the affair, he said he didn't know what he wanted but if he had to decide now, he wanted out of the marriage. I feel that plan A is working in the way that my WH calls me everyday, says he loves me, wants us to work on the marriage and wants to "grow old together". Problem is I told him he cannot come home until he gets help for his addictions (cocaine and gambling). He says he knows he needs help and wants to get it, but it's not easy, he is afraid and he's not ready. What?????

He says he is done with OW but I totally do not believe him. He has said that a few times before only to find out he was lying.

My question is: isn't doing a plan A while seperated and WH still has contact with OW also considered "cake eating"? Although I agree with plan A and like I said it seems to be working, it also appears to me that my WH is getting the best of both worlds, aka "cake eating". Any thoughts on this?

*bump*

any thoughts?

What you're really doing is half and half Plan A and Plan B - which results in neither MB plan.

I recommend you choose one or the other for the affair issue.

In Plan A you'd have him home and lure him out of his affair.

In Plan B you'd go completely dark and set conditions for re-establishing contact with him once the affair is ended.

Having the other addictions complicates things. MB is not equipped to handle those, although throwing them into the Plan B "conditions" may be effective.

I suggest you get some professional advice or consider advice from MBers here with experience with this for dealing with the additional addictions.

JMHO

Thanks for your response WAT. There was a 2 month period of a false recovery which I consider a plan A while living together. He said there was no contact with the OW but he was seeing her the whole time. When I discovered this the 2nd time I told him he had to get help or get out. He chose to get out. And here we are today. I'm sure the drugs have a lot to do with many of the struggles. The way I see it, my WH has 3 addictions. The cocaine, the gambling and the OW. I can't help but think if he could at least stop doing the drugs his head might think a little clearer. I guess this is a triple whammie and all the more difficult to be resolved. Thanks for you help WAT.

You are not dealing with a rational mature thinking adult ...

What is your plan for staying in this marriage if he stops seeing OW but continues to use drugs ~and~ gamble?

Are you "all in" for that?

Just wondering.....

Pep

Well, since I told him he can't come home unless he gets help for his addictions, I guess you could say I'm not all in for that. If he were to stop seeing the OW and was actively seeking help for his addictions I suppose I would let him come home again. It's kind of a strange thing. Biblically I couldn't end the marriage due to the drugs and the gambling alone, but because of the adultery I can. So since I have decided to forgive him for the adultery and choose to reconcile if he is willing then how could I turn him away because of the addictions. KWIM?

*bump*

Losing Him -

Have you been to Alanon or attended mtgs online?
You may want to look into it.

Plan A is having him home. And being the best you.
This is bigger than you. I hope that you don't plan on taking him back and healing his other addicitons.

Plan B is worrisome b/c you know that his addictions are wreckless.

It appears that you really need to read more and pick a course of action. Prepare yourself. It's a completely sh#$%^y ride.

I'm sorry you're here.
Heck - I'm sorry we're all here.

Michelle

I agree with the above posters. You have to do either plan A or B. In B....no contact at all. You give him nothing. He needs to want to get help with his addictions. If you think you will fix it....he will turn around when he is comfy at home and get back into the drugs. He himself needs to see that he is in need of getting the drugs out of his life, HE NEEDS to do this for himself, not you fixing it.

Right now he is getting his emotional needs met with you and to heck with getting himself help. Why should he get help, you are fulfilling his EN and he is still doing the drugs and gambling and this is great for him.

Are you ready for a man that takes drugs and gambles. You said you want him to get help...let him do this on his own. Give him the #'s if you want...and leave the rest for him to decide. Keep the contact down to a bare minimum and no saying I loveyou, nothing. Keep it business like and nothing else.

Many of us have been through this....I have too. It is hard learning to do Plan A correctly and Plan B correctly. Plan A, he lives with you, without the OW. Watch out for the little secrets they keep....I was one that found out about the little secrets. Plan B....no contact....for me was only about the children....he on the other hand had his OW and wanted to come over, my teenage children let him into the home and I would come home from work and he was here eating at my house while in Plan B. Excuses he made...I was livid. Keep posting and many of us can help you. Also, I do believe that counseling would be beneficial.

Thanks so much for responding?

I thought you could do a plan A while seperated? I believe someone on this board had said that. Do you have to do a plan B as soon as you seperate? I'm a little confused about this.

Also, if I was to do a plan B right after seperation, does that mean it's too late to start now? Is there ever considered a time when plan B is too late?

No you do not have to do plan B as soon as you separate...although some NEED to. You can plan A w/ WS out of the house, especially if there was a lot of LB prior to WS leaving.

I haven't read your thread yet...so I'm not up to speed on your situation. This is just a quick answer. There are some really great plan A stories.

I'll be back w/ more later.

hi LH,

I did do one month of plan a while he was out of the house but I didn't see much change in the fog.

When he came home I saw big changes very quickly.

Having you physically in the same place did make a big difference in my sit but we are all different.

Phone calls everyday are important I didn't get that while he was away but I think it gave him a chance to miss me.

While my WS was away and he did call me I made damn sure I wasn't waiting by the phone. I actually diidn't respond for over a week at one time.
It was nice not to be the only one wondering what was going on on the other end.

I am not sure if that helps.
But you are not alone.

Blind

Thanks chacha and blind! I am just so confused. The main thing I'm confused with is if plan A is working but he's still not getting help and ending contact, then why would I do a plan B? How long can you do a plan A for until it becomes too late to do plan B? Is it ever too late to do plan B? And again, should I even do it if plan A seems to be working?

ChaCha,

you still have more advise? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I felt like my husband was "having his cake and eating it too"; moved out but came for family dinners and visits. After reading a book about "detaching with love" I decided to put an end to that behavior. So I'm doing a "soft" Plan B right now. We communicate minimally in regards to daughter, dog and the separation agreement.

My hope is that in time he will see what he is missing on a daily basis. My problem is, I didn't have much time doing a solid Plan A, so while I have told him that I love him and want to work on our marriage, I don't know if I was able to prove that to him before he left.

It's my understanding that Plan A means that the WS ceases all contact with their affair partner.



If your Plan A was indeed working, then your spouse would not be "getting the best of both worlds."

Plan A's are no guarantee of a saved marriage and the success rate of Dr. H's plan B seems to be even lower.

Either way you need to be consistent-pick a plan and stick to it.

CS, you don't have the slightest idea what Plan A is or isn't, so why are you even posting advice to this woman? Nor are these "plans" a cafeteria plan where you pick one or the other. They are a TWO step system, not an either/or.

LosingHim, I am sorry you have been misled here, but Plan A will never work on an active addict. You are wasting your time. Plan A only gives him an open door to EXPLOIT you and will do nothing to repair your marriage. There is nothing that can be done for the recovery of your marriage until your H get help for his addictions.

I would suggest taking steps to protect yourself from him and STOP being available for him to exploit, you are only enabling him to stay out there and drug and gamble for another day. However, if you cut off contact and stopped holding his hand, he would hit bottom much sooner.

In the meantime, I would suggest checking out Alanon. That is where you need to be now, not on a marriage recovery site.

Here is an article addressing an alcoholic spouse that should help you understand the process around addictions.

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5048a_qa.html

Actually, I took the opportunity that someone here provided to read what Harley specifically describes as Plan A and Plan B.

Please tell me where I misrepresented what Harley said or where my "advice" to be consistent was wrong. You stated, as I did, that her Plan A was not working. So, again-what did I say that was so wrong?

Also please tell me why you didn't "correct" another respondent who, as I did, advised the young lady to be consistent.

Looks like you are dragging your baggage re/ me from thread to thread.

plan A does NOT mean that the WS ceases all contact with the affair partner.....it is the hopeful outcome of plan A but plan A is done because there IS contact

CS....you really DO NOT have the knowledge or experience to provide help

Here is what Harley says about what Plan A is

(My interpretation is that a successful Plan A would result in the cessation of contact between the WS and that OM / OW. This is whay I said that her Plan A was clearly not working.)

[color:"blue"] Plan A is for the betrayed spouse to negotiate with the wayward spouse to totally separate from the lover without angry outbursts, disrespect, and demands. These three Love Busters not only ruin any effort to reach a negotiated settlement, but they also make the betrayed spouse much less attractive to the wayward spouse. Instead of encouraging total separation from the lover, the anger, disrespect and demands of the betrayed spouse make the lover appear to be the only one who truly cares about the wayward spouse. They literally throw the wayward spouse into the arms of the lover.

On the other hand, if the betrayed spouse approaches the wayward spouse with respect and thoughtfulness, the cruelty and self-indulgence of the affair is much easier for the wayward spouse to understand. And once the wayward spouse's mistake is acknowledged, it's much easier for him or her to take the first step toward recovery by agreeing to never see or talk to the lover again.

In these negotiations for total separation, the causes of the affair should be addressed. Since one of these causes is usually unfulfilled emotional needs, the betrayed spouse should express a willingness to meet those needs after the affair has ended. Another common cause is a wayward spouse's failure to take the betrayed spouse's feelings into account. The betrayed spouse's inconsiderate behavior sometimes leads the wayward spouse to believe that he or she has the right to return thoughtlessness with thoughtlessness by having an affair. Willingness of the betrayed spouse to follow the Policy of Joint Agreement goes a long way toward resolving the issue of thoughtlessness.

A third possible cause of an affair is a lifestyle where spouses spend much of their leisure time apart from each other, and form leisure-time friendships with those of the opposite sex. A plan to avoid being away from each other overnight and making each other favorite leisure-time companions goes a long way toward creating a passionate marriage that is essentially affair-proof.

In general, a betrayed spouse's effort to encourage the wayward spouse to end the affair should address all the root causes of the affair, and offer a solid plan for marital recovery. It should not be one-sided, however. The plan should make the wayward spouse and the betrayed spouse equally responsible for following the overall plan.

But plan A, an effort to end the affair with thoughtfulness and care, doesn't always work. In many cases a wayward spouse is so trapped by the addiction that he or she does not have the will-power to do the right thing. Once in a while the fog lifts and the cruelty and tragedy of the affair hits the wayward spouse right between the eyes. In a moment of grief and guilt, he or she promises to end it. But then the pain of withdrawal symptoms often brings back the fog with all its excuses and rationalization, and the affair is on again.

Sometimes a wayward spouse settles into a routine of having his or her cake and eating it too. In an effort to win the wayward spouse back, the betrayed spouse meets emotional needs that the lover cannot meet, while the lover meets emotional needs that the betrayed spouse has not learned to meet. While this competition is excruciatingly painful to the betrayed spouse, and the lover as well, the wayward spouse basks in the warmth of being loved and cared for by two people, with no real motivation to choose one over the other.

So, to avoid an indefinite period of suffering while a wayward spouse vacillates between spouse and lover, and to avoid rewarding the selfish behavior of having needs met by both spouse and lover, if plan A does not work within a reasonable period of time, I recommend plan B.
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Apparently CERTAIN people's opinions here have value while the opinions of others do not.

Thanks for the confirmation.