Toolman contends that not many men of his advanced age (44 this month) would have been able to resist the feminine advances of the 20 year old to which he succumbed. (Now remember, in his defense, he says it's because we haven't had SF in years, which was HIS choice, not mine.)

Your thoughts?

Toolman is not correct...

many men resist the advances of A N Y O N E

some do not...

ARK

StoneCold,

Please excuse my signature line, I am having fun on another thread. I do want to answer your question seriously.

There is not some special phermone that a woman has that a man finds irresistable. If that were true, how could there be gay men?

The "succumbing to a woman's charms" thing isn't really true. When faced with no money, men make choices every day. Some choose to rob, some choose the job. It is a choice, plain and simple.

I faced a hiatus or two in my marriage, NOT of my choosing, and did not stray. Or feel particularly drawn to. Make no mistake, the thought DID cross my mind. But at that point, the choice is made. Embrace the thought and it will come to pass, or reject the thought, and keep your vows intact.

ARK nailed it. You resist, or you don't. I would postulate that his age would help him - given the fact that we are generally wiser from experience. The young guy buying his first care is more likely to get taken than the older guy who has purchased a few. Same goes for resisting feminine advances. Wisdom keeps us from that temptation. It'll never fall off from lack of use.

NCWalker

Thanks, NC and Ark.

I'm afraid some of my body parts are going to "seal up" from lack of use, but I didn't go after the pool boy did I? Actually, we don't have a pool, but we do have a yard boy...same age....hmmmmm.

Anyway, I said on the other thread that I'm a big fan of Soylent Green, and now that you've brought it up, I think all OP's have a very useful purpose. Let's just line em up.

I believe it is simple. From a biological standpoint, it is difficult to say no to a woman who is throwing herself at her.

However, big "however", you do have the option to avoid the situation where you would put yourself in a compromising position.

I look at it this way. I have a hard time controlling my impulse to not eat a whole box of cookies. My solution? Don't buy boxes of cookies and I won't have to deal with the temptation.

Would it be hard to resist a woman throwing herself at me? From a biological standpoint, yes, but it isn't impossible and I have actually done it when I was single and thought it was too soon.

The question then becomes why did he put himself in a compromising position? That's ultimately what it boils down to.

When I was deployed, for example, there were women out there. Cheating would have been easy, if someone was willing. Odds were no one would find out.

What did I do? I minimized my contact with anyone from the opposite sex except for professional reasons. And there was someone there that I actually found attractive. I especially avoided her.

Didn't do me any good since I came home to find out the ex cheated on me while I was gone.

Anyone that much younger is not madly in love with him or his body. There is something else she wants, especially since he is married.

Sadly, many men are flattered, thinking the young girl wants THEM. Yuck.

I think I would let them ride off into the sunset together. She'll dump his old [censored], and then maybe he'll figure it out.

You too, papa?

You would be amazed at how many of "us" that happens to.

I too, deployed, could have had relations with no repurcussions. Fortunately, I could not have lived with myself.

The value of a clear conscience is hard to put a price on.

No problem saying no to anyone! I am not an animal that needs to lead with his groin... my heart and my head (the big one) tells me where my affections go... the rest of me follows.

When I was in college (I was very inexperienced...) I was at a girl's house - and she all but attacked me. I said "no". I avoided her after that. (she stalked me for the next year....)

Opportunities presented themselves in my M, too. I declined them.

Of course - I don't think I had whatever hormonal triggers that boys get that makes them want sex kick in until about two years ago - just when XW was getting it on with everybody BUT me. (Maybe her actions made me feel that way....)

I have always loved SF - IN my marriage.

I hope to save it for my next M. With God's grace.

I want to be able to tell my son and daughters - when it is time - that I followed God's plan to the best of my abilities, and encourage them to do the same.

I am the only good example they have.

far

I agree with Papa.

If you don't want to slip into the pit, you don't walk near the edge.

-AD

I also agree that there has to be huge and gross weakening of boundaries to reach the point to believe that just because some 20 something throws themselves at you ...you succumb...

With strong boundaries a twenty year old throwing themselves at a 44 year old....(though the ages really mean nothing...would be seen as either very laughable..or more accurately pitiful

a person with strong boudaries watching someone throw themselves at them..would be thinking...

wow is this person jacked up....
what the heck is going on...

a person with already weak boundaries...
already sending out signals of acceptance.....interest
has already succumbed to breaking vows...long before any physical advance...

has N O T H I N G to with age....
has to with weak, absent marital vows and conviction...

ARK^^

Stonecold - more "fogspeak" to justify and rationalize. Wayward Spouse Manual, page 101, "How to make it seem as if 'everybody's doing it! So why not me?!" Paragraph 2: "Baby, the Devil MADE me do it! I had NO choice!"

Rubbish. I have a 21 year old daughter. Guess what, she's quite attractive, but oh so inexperienced and young. Even if she was NOT my daughter, ....you get the idea.

THE issue is one of Standards. The ones your husband has chosen are "defective" and should be replaced like worn out brakes on a car. Without a "good set of Standards," he's going to step on the breaks one day and instead of stopping, will keep on going straight into an eventual major wreck.

Oooops! He already did that and still has not figured out that the brakes AND the rotors on his own car need changing.

Driving in fog, oblivious to the real world, will lie to you that way.

I can't imagine having any respect for a 40ish man who would even consider bedding a 20 year old girl, and I'm talking single men and women here.

Where is the responsibility in that? And responsibility aside, what would be the attraction aside from sex?

If men knew where their attractiveness to women came from, they would know that showing a responsibility for their actions and the people they influence is what makes them attractive to women.

An inability to see the big picture is right up there with a lack of personal standards and boundaries.

When I see a young 20 year old boy, bedding him is the last thing on my mind. Yucky.

But hey, hollywood does it. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

Thank you all for your responses. I just want to make sure I'm not understanding human nature. I see his behavior as evidence of flawed character, whereas he sees himself as someone unlucky enough to have woken up in such a compromising position.

It is so sad. Each and every morning when I wake up now, I look at our family, our work-in-progress house, our friends that we've made over the past 20 years, and can't understand why he threw it all away, TWICE for this little girl.

I suppose it really doesn't matter why he did it anymore, but it's sort of like the stages of mourning a death. I'm still in disbelief and denial. What comes next?

You do. Now is going to be a time of healing, growing and someday of understanding, or at the very least understanding this is not the end of your life, only the end of your life as you knew it.

My sister used to tell me that the greatest thing about life is that we just never know what is around the next corner.

Could be very exciting if you let it be.

But for now it is a time to heal, and as Ark or 2long or someone says, a time to be still.

((SC))

I also think it's a character flaw, characterized by low-self esteem and lack of boundaries.

H, myself and FOM use to all work at the same university.

FOM use to flirt with all of the young college girls very inappropriately. He would beam, "I still have it!" Sometimes he even seemed high after a beautiful girl would respond to his advances.

He thought I was 19 when he began flirting with me (I was 28 but looked young for my age.) I am absolutely and utterly repulsed as I am writing this now.

My H, on the other hand, recognizes that there are attractive girls on campus, but says things like, "holy cow, are you kidding me? They don't know anything!" "What could a guy have in common with someone so young??" And H is only 34!

I can't even articulate how sorry I am, and how utterly sad, lonely and broken your H is going to be once the novelty of OW wears off. At some point she will no longer be an ego boost, just a horrible mistake that he can't talk to, relate to or ever have true intimacy with.

My heart is breaking for the both of you... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Well. Many times, self-blame. It is like your mind MUST find a reason. Nothing he says will make sense. I mean, you will not be able to add up the "pros" in the deviant behavior with the "cons" of what he is giving up.

And your brain starts thinking "Well, just because doesn't fly with me...." And it starts haunting you with little demons about all your little faults. They sound like "maybe ifs..." and "shoulda dones..." So watch for them.

What you eventually, and hopefully quickly, will realize, is that to the WS, their choices ARE logical. They are just using some weird, altenate universe logic.

It is NOT about what YOU did or who YOU are, sometimes it will feel like that. Make no mistake, there probably ARE "maybe ifs..." and "shoulda dones..." that would apply to you. What will drive you nuts is that in total, they won't add up to a decision drastic enough for him to have his A. You'll try to make up this gap with self-blame. And it will take a few attempts to get the fact that A does not connect to B in the world of the sane.

You will survive this too, and hopefully use it as an opportunity for self-examination. (Believe me, FOCUS will not be the problem. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> ). And you can be a better stonecold for it.

The age of the girl just shows the bigger problem, IMO. Toolman refused to touch his own wife-- rejected her because she'd gained a few pounds after having his babies. He lost all sexual interest in his wife and was too self-absorbed to care about whether his wife was hurt or had needs of her own.

The person he chose to cheat with was young and thin -- showing that relationships are pretty much a physical thing with Toolman. Even if he feels like he's madly in love with this girl -- or comes to believe that -- if she were to get fat or disfigured, he'd do the same to her as SC, even if she were only 22.

In an earlier post, when both Toolman and IMA were posting on this forum, Toolman tried to justify his rejection of his wife based on physical appearance as being acceptable. And from SC's description of herself, it sounds like most men wouldn't kick her out of bed.

There's some really deep-seated issue here. Almost any man would find a pretty 20-yr-old attractive. The fact that he'd act on it and betray his wife whom he refuses to touch is the bigger issue.

SC..

Shortly after my divorce as I forayed into the dating scene I went out to dinner with a much younger woman (23). I was 38. She was absolutely gorgeous, a dancer on a top 10 college basketball's team. I found myself thinking about my XW's 22 year old niece (who I cared about a lot and would be appalled if she went out with a guy 15 years older). I was very specific and direct as to why she would be dating a man my age. She was mature and we actually had nice, stimulating conversations.....

but in the long run I told her I could not see her any more...I could not handle myself in this situation. I refused to be a cliche. I felt different about it than most men would , I know this. What I did as time went on was establish age boundaries. Mine went to women around 30. That was NOT where it started.....

I made a lot of mistakes when I started dating again... alot...but this was not one of them. This woman now dances for the Lakers.....I have zero regrets....it just was not right in my eyes...

Interesting points, SendMe and GrownUp.

My WH still contends that IF he were to SEEK out an A, it would be with an older woman, say, 30 years old, with kids of her own. He keeps saying this with his mouth.

I keep saying that his BODY tells a different story. He "ended up" with a 20 year old last year, and he "ended up" with the same little girl six months later. I say, "actions speak."

I think he's kidding himself that he wants a 30 year old (who, btw, is still 14 years younger than him). If he wanted an ~older~ woman, there were plenty out there. Heck, he was already considering himself as ~dating~ for months. He had been around plenty of older women. He CHOSE the 20 year old, not once, but TWICE.