In order not to HJ Myrta’s thread, I will respond to both of you here:

Mkeverydaycnt, you said:

False. I never said I feel I didn’t resume the A. Please read my signature line and also read the following part of the first post I’ve send here when I’ve confessed to these boards about contact with OM:

[color:"blue"]“Dear MB Members,

I just want to report that last week contact has been broken. I’m not talking about accidental contact, but deliberate contact on e-mail. I received a very candid e-mail from OM and at that moment I’ve allowed myself to get “sucked-in” again and in-depth conversations with OM have taken place about the past, feelings we’ve experienced at the time etc. We’ve spoken about things and feelings we’ve never admitted towards each other before, so actually it feels if this time I’ve crossed boundaries into a full EA (and not just inappropriate friendship than before).

The guilt and disappointment in myself was driving me crazy and I finally found the courage and informed my H about the contact and contents of the letters during the past weekend. Yesterday I have sent a NC letter (the 3rd one in 3 years). This time my H has read and approved before I’ve sent it.”[/color]


Who are you talking about here? If you’re talking about me you’re lying. I never downplayed the recent contact with OM.

Who’s actions? Mine? Well, I don’t agree. You can’t really compare the two and determine whose actions were more “severe”. But since you want to compare, let’s go into detail:

Stanley’s actions were more severe than mine in the sense that:

• He shared very intimate and personal details about his spouse and marriage with another woman (something me and OM NEVER did during our “friendship” – we NEVER discussed our spouses and/or marriages with each other).

• He SEVERELY flirted with another woman IN PERSON and even HUGGED this person and TOUCHED her (me and OM NEVER flirted in person and NEVER hugged/touched each other – our flirtations, teasing and joking on e-mail were subtle).

• He behaved inappropriately with TWO woman (the TOW woman AND the woman at his work he flirted with).

My actions were more severe than Stanley’s in the sense that:

• Me and OM believed we were “soul mates” and unwittingly developed feelings of love towards each other (which we never confessed before the recent e-mail exchanges). We also became emotionally attached and connected to each other during the “friendship”.

• I committed “mental” adultery towards my H e.g. wrong and sinful thoughts & fantasies about OM. However, Stanley fantasized about having an A so I guess he was guilty of “mental” adultery too…

• With the recent e-mail exchanges the EA was resumed for a period of 1 day after I’ve started recovery with my H and ended the EA 3 years ago. THIS was a HUGE betrayal towards my H and myself. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

So, as you can see above, you can't really compare the two and determine which one was more severe. Both me and Stanley’s actions were severe in its own way…

Like Jen I also don’t have the time or energy now to go through my 2 threads, but what I DO remember at this moment is that I was accused by you of being shrewd and “playing” my H. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> On another thread this week you also attacked and insulted me and made false judgments, accusations & assumptions about me e.g. you said I’m an entitled WS (note, not FWS) and you also implied that I’m “insensitive” and “not genuine”…in other words, false and insincere… <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" /> You also called me “out of my freakin mind” . This was very hurtful you know…especially since I’ve never treated YOU disrespectfully. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />


You didn’t need to do that mkeverydaycnt, because that day when I informed these boards about my contact with OM, I was remorseful and I was already aware that my behaviors were wrong and harmful toward my H…I think that was VERY clear in my posts...

Bigkahuna, you said:

Actually, I think what Jen said is very valid and have some merits…<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

False. I was not hung drawn and quatered because I refused to tell OM’sW, but spesifically because I refused to go against my H feelings and betray him again by doing something (expose to OMW) which he would not agree to (and still doesn't) due to personal reasons & circumstances I've already explained on the other thread.

False again… I established NC and send OM another NC letter. I did this (send the NC-letter) before I informed these boards about the e-mail exchanges with OM.

If you’re referring to my job situation…well I’ve already made my stance clear on the other thread and will not go into detail again on THIS thread. If you want to know something specific (on my job situation and why I’m still at this job) I will refer you back to that thread and some post’s I’ve made there to explain me and my H’s circumstances. If you’re interested, tell me and I will give you links to some of my posts on that thread regarding this issue.

I hope this could help to clear up some things...

Suzet--YOu are very right about you and Stanley's comparison. There is NO comparison. My husband did shared intimate details with this Tow woman in more than one occassion. He even told her about my dislikes about the vacation in Italy. So, they are pretty tight friends, it seems.

You seem like a very contrite woman and you are doing the right thing. Dont let anyone tell you otherwise. FWWs like myself wish to be in your position, you really did not do anything physical with OM. You stopped in time. YOu should be proud of yourself!

Be well and continue recovery!!

Myrta

assumptions Suzet... not worth responding to... I made that mistake with you before.

Funny isn't it that the two people on this thread so far... you and Myrta both have had a problem with NC.

I really have no more time to waste on either of you.

Thanks Myrta for your encouraging post, I appreciate it very much! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

NS: I just posted my personal views on the differences between EA’s/PA’s and ONS’s on your thread since this topic was raised by some members (I copied 2 long posts of mine from other threads). I hope it’s okay, but in case you feel I’ve HJ’ed you thread with this, please let me know and I will delete it or just send links to those 2 posts on the other threads.

Blessings and take care… I sincerely hope you and Stanley will be able to work through this and continue with you recovery.

(((HUGS)))

Hmmm…your response speaks volumes... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> Just as your recent “attackts” to me on Mortarman’s thread... You don’t want to respond because you don’t have anything to say in your own defense... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

no, I don't want to respond because I am through wasting my time on such a self centered foggy poster. WS have taken up too much of my time in life.. I am not giving time to you at this point.. Suzet, in all honesty, with your foggy thinking you are not worth it.

MKEVERYDAYCNT---Are you sure your world is no longer upside
down?

Myrta... you are seriously a sick woman. Your rationalizations and drama define you. I really hope you find peace. From what I have heard... you have been a drama queen from the moment you arrived on the scene... having someone like Suzet to fuel your fires is just so convenient. You both have now made it to my ignore list because I am not the type to "rubber neck" at an accident scene. It's time for the white sheets until you get out of the fog.

If I was a drama queen, I would be telling the world, and the newspapers what has happened in my marriage, like others here. Only strangers here and our marriage counselor knows.

YOu are more of a drama queen, insulting all FWW and WWs here. Grow up and take a chill pill.

Mkeverydaycnt, you can't make such ridiculous accusations & assumptions and attackts without backing yourself up and give reasons… You can’t say such insulting things and then turn away by saying you will not give your time to me…

So, why are you stating that I’m a “self centered foggy poster”? Why do you say my thinking is “foggy”? What have I said that make you think this about me?

You think I’m not worth it? WOW, what a thing to say! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> I personally don’t view ANY person on these boards as “not worth it” (including you).

Your unwillingness to back up your words with proof just confirm to me that you have nothing to say in your own defense. Oh well... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Suzet- We are in his "ignore list" ,because we are both foggy women. We are not worth it <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />.

Oh yeah...I forgot. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> But we ARE worth it in our H's and God's eyes and THAT'S the most important isn't it! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> I will not allow some angry person who doesn’t know me personally define me or influence my sense of self-worth again...

mkeverydaycnt,

When I read your posts I sensed alot of sadness behind the anger....but I didn't know your story and I wanted to understand what was driving/triggering some of your harsher statements. Now that I've taken the time to read it....I understand alot better why anything that resembles a lie or foggy thinking to you is so abhorent and triggering for you. The woman you lived with for so long....and had a child with....cheated and lied to you for so many many years. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> You suffered greatly. You wanted very much to marry her but she could never come clean or stop creating drama and it sounds as though she was pretty unstable. I know you feel freer now that you have custody or your son and you aren't revisited everyday by that kind of chaos....but I'm not sure you've resolved alot of your feelings about what she put you through yet. And I think many of the stories on GQII....especially the WW, FWW ones trigger some pretty awful feelings for you. As a Christian, it must have also been difficult to reconcile having a child out of wedlock with your beliefs....which is probably one reason you really wanted to marry your ex. despite her continued duplicity. I'm sorry that happened to you. As a BS....I also had alot of anger to overcome and I can empathize with those feelings very well.

It's possible that it may actually be harder for you to really recover completely while you remain in an environment that continues to remind you of how you were betrayed. It may also may be possible that you're projecting some of your feelings about your ex onto other waywards.....I dunno....but I think it might be worth looking at in your own personal journey. Don't carry this kind of anger into your next relationship or even your future because you deserve someone who is honorable and willing to truly commit to you.

I'm not telling what to do....or how to post....I am just sharing my concerns about where you are in your healing process. As always....I could certainly be wrong.

Blessings to you.

Thank you for the very thoughtful and caring response to me. It is greatly appreciated.

I do know that I need to balance my "hsitory" with what I experience today. I try and keep that in mind as much as possible. I will say that I have had a great many experiences on these boards with FWS and WS that have been very positive. There are certain people here and in another venue that would call me to the carpet immediately if they felt that my past was clouding my views (shape yes, cloud, no).
I do appreciate the time and caring you displayed with this and do realize it is a battle for me to constantly be aware of.

As for why I wanted to be married.. I was not a Christian when my son was born...I wanted to be married because I loved her with all my heart... and I wanted to give my son the family he deserved. He has that now... albeit just with me and my family.

Thank you again.

btw.. I am in IC and he feels that I have resolved most, not all, of the issues that were visited on me. My harshness on this site is just my intolerance for unjust behaviors. That extends to all aspects of my life. I don't care what anyones past mistakes were... I only care that they are taking steps to stop hurting those in their charge today. My IC and others here that I trust and believe in feel that the manner in which I express that angst is correct. There is another poster on this forum....who would have been considered a very foggy FWS but two months ago... I have gone out of my way to tell her how proud I am of her positive changes. In fact, I let her know very recently, that any man could be proud to call her his W. Was I harsh with her when necessary... yep. But I am balanced.

The critical difference between Suzet* and Stanley is that Suzet* has admitted that she was in an EA while Stanley remains in denial. The clincher for me was when Stanley went to email his TOW friend while in Italy and left Myrta alone to look for a pay phone. Not good.

Yes Todd, Stanley denies any emontional affair with this woman. He says he has not given his heart to anyone but me.

mk,

As you mentioned in your post....we are "shaped" by our experience....not necessarily "clouded". You've quite obviously progressed a long way from the wounded man you were when you arrived....and have reached out in a sincere desire to help other people. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> I'm not here to judge whether you express your "angst correctly" or not, but I do think that reading your story helps <me> understand why you react so strongly to what you deem as rationalizations given by WS or FWS. Whether you're tender or harsh (based on your opinion about another poster's sincerity and transparency)....I do think you speak honestly....and I do honestly believe you're motivated by good intent....as well as past pain. What kind of relationship do you have with your ex now? Have you reached a place where you can forgive her? Forgiveness isn't a gift you give her....it's a gift you give yourself. It frees you from hate....because hate harms the vessel that harbors it. I think you still really love her....maybe you always will. Your love for her helps you separate what she does....from who she is (someone you loved)....and that's alot harder to do on an anonymous board. They get all wrapped together.

In any case....I'm glad I got to know you better....and I wish you only the best.

Before I say anything else, I want to let you know how very much I appreciate the caring you are displaying.

As far as what type of relationship we have... we are co parents when she chooses to act in a way that it is safe to have my son around her. Two IC have told me that isolating my son from her is the best thing I can do right now. My son agrees.

I don't hate her. I have forgiven her for what she did to me... that was never that much of a problem for me... the past cannot be changed... I was more concerned with what the present was bringing. She tries still to get me back... but I will never allow myself to trust in her words again. She has demons that I pray she can defeat... but I need to take care of me and my boy.
I am having a harder time forgiving her for what she has done to my son. He would have a loving caring family including brothers and sisters if she had only been upfront and honest with me in the past... letting me make a decision about the rest of my life based on truth. She didn't do that and I lost a very good person in order to put my family back together. I felt that she had finally come to her senses... she was in fact duping me just to sabatoge that relationship. I can get over the impact on me.. but my son has lost since I have now decided that the age for my having anymore children has passed. I am however looking into a foster adopt of a child close to my sons age.
I do still love her. That will not change... but more than anything at this point, I feel sorry for her. She has lost so many people that have cared for her. While I took the brunt of her lies and betrayals... others in her life with a lot less forgiveness than me, were also touched. I hope she can mend those fences.

Be well. And again, thank you for caring.

mk,

Before I say anything else, I want to let you know how very much I appreciate the caring you are displaying.

You are very very welcome.

As far as what type of relationship we have... we are co parents when she chooses to act in a way that it is safe to have my son around her. Two IC have told me that isolating my son from her is the best thing I can do right now. My son agrees.

Wow....that's really sad, but sometimes....when a parent is in self-destruct mode....there's no other recourse. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

I don't hate her. I have forgiven her for what she did to me... that was never that much of a problem for me... the past cannot be changed... I was more concerned with what the present was bringing.

Someone asked an interesting question the other day to other BS....have you forgiven <yourself> for being manipulated so long? Don't forget how important that is.

She tries still to get me back... but I will never allow myself to trust in her words again. She has demons that I pray she can defeat... but I need to take care of me and my boy.

I agree.....you probably devoted even more time than you think you should have. I'm hope you're right that she's winning the fight between her and her demons. All of us deserve to be happy.....but some of us, keep making decisions that make that impossible.

I am having a harder time forgiving her for what she has done to my son. He would have a loving caring family including brothers and sisters if she had only been upfront and honest with me in the past... letting me make a decision about the rest of my life based on truth. She didn't do that and I lost a very good person in order to put my family back together.

Yeah....that's tough....I'd probably be in the same spot (more able to forgive things done to me...but struggle with anything done to my children). I do urge you to help your son forgive his mother even though it's not in his best interest to be with her. As his father....he'll look to you for leadership. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I felt that she had finally come to her senses... she was in fact duping me just to sabatoge that relationship.

wow....that was cold. ugh. mk....you're going to meet the right person at the right time. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I can get over the impact on me.. but my son has lost since I have now decided that the age for my having anymore children has passed. I am however looking into a foster adopt of a child close to my sons age.

You don't sound so very old to me.....are you sure? H and I had a really late baby....he's adorable. But adoption is pretty cool too. I'm 51 and my youngest is only 9.

I do still love her. That will not change... but more than anything at this point, I feel sorry for her.

From what you've related.....I do too. And when someone we care about refuses to stop harming themselves and others....it can leave us feeling really powerless. Sometimes....you can't help them chere....and you have to detach from their chaos. That's what you did.

She has lost so many people that have cared for her. While I took the brunt of her lies and betrayals... others in her life with a lot less forgiveness than me, were also touched. I hope she can mend those fences.

I hope so too....time will tell.

Be well. And again, thank you for caring.

I like your name....make every day count....carpe diem!

Some days I need to take a break from this place.. it does trigger some feelings in me. But when I run into a good soul like you, it reminds me of why I came here in the first place... and why I stayed.

Have a great day.

MEDC