I'm happy to see that you came back to the site. I'm wishing for you true recovery, personal and marital.

MM,

Good on Ya! God is all loving, all caring, and all forgiving, all ya gotta do is ask and ye shall receive.

I look forward to reading more on this thread.

Thanks Mortorman!

Really informative post, Jilly. You must be terrified, I know I was when it happened to me. I have had panic attacks too.
My dad died last year of pancreatic cancer. I can relate to how that can impact you, too.

It sounds like your husband has made a good start on cutting off contact with OW and with showing you he is remorseful. He has indicted his desire to put effort into your situation and work out things. I think you are actually in a good position all things considered, due to that.

Give yourself time to stabilize and in the meantime eliminate love busters as much as you can.

You sound like you both want to work this out. Can you focus more for us and tell us other possible reasons you think he strayed?
You indicated already that maybe you were not paying enough attention to him. Did he complain about that or has he said to you that he was unhappy about anything in particular? That might be a good starting point.

I am sorry you are hurting and confused. It may not seem like it will get better, but it will. Remember how you feel today, may not be how you feel in a few weeks. There is help here, and though it may not seem like it at times, compassion.

JJ,

I dont want to get into giving you a pat on the head or a hug just yet. Right now, considering all that has happened over these years, it is important that we are able to get out in the open exactly where you are at, what you are looking for and what you expect.

Basically, let's get down to brass tacks. And I warn you, going there will be a little rough! But if you want solutions to your issues...if you want to follow Jesus and do this right...then there really is no other way.

So, let's focus for a bit right to the core of your current situation and what is happening.

******edit**********

cr.....jilly (the woman MM is speaking to) is a professed Christian....so I don't think it's out of line for one Christian to talk to another about Christ on this site. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

You are being disrespectful to jump in on something you know nothing about and make accusations of me. Before typing, make sure you are not going to make a fool of yourself!


You do not know me...and you are waaaayyy off base! Even my friends that are atheists on here know that what you jsut posted is not the truth. And before they jump here and condemn what you just wrote, I would advise you to step back, take a deep breath...and find out what is going on here. JJ is a Christian. She stated so in an earlier post. She wants to know what to do here and has asked what God wants her to do.


If you want to help Jilly, then found otu what yo uare talking abotu before beign disrespectful to people who are actually helping her!


That is good. You are welcome back to say anythign you like. but please do so with less ignorance of me, of JJ and what is going on here.

And maybe I should ask why you have jumped off the handle here, gotten all of this wrong...gotten me wrong...and are so nasty and disrespectful. What is going on with you that would cause this?

Never mind. Dont answer that! This is JJ's thread. if you would liek to go onto a new thread where we can discuss this, I am more than willing.

And to others that know the truth here...be kind!

Maybe just put on "ignore" disruptive people.
If jilly wants to proceed on the basis of her faith, she is entitled to do so and if people want to help her on the basis of shared faith, then that is their choice and respect for that is likely to be appreciated.

I'm only here for a moment. But since I feel a wee bit of responsibility for "helping" get this thread started, I'll toss in a few words.

- MM, I am very glad that you're asking for the space to let this work. I, too, want to see that happen. And I think that needs to be a SAFE space. In other words, one without abuse. I see that JustUss is watching closely. I know others are as well.

- JustJilly, please understand something. You've caused harm and pain in your life. We all have. That does not mean that others are allowed to abuse you. If you allow or invite someone to abuse you, you're inviting them to harm themselves as well as you. Please do not go that route. No healing ever comes of further harm. Choose a path of healing. It may be the harder of the two paths, but it's worth it.

Just J,

I understand what you are trying to say here...but as I wrote above, I dont want to drag this stuff here. From either side.

if you or someone else writes this, then those from the other side feel a need to respond. On this thread...for right now...I have asked everyone to just stick to the issue at hand and see what is the current sitch of JJ and what it is she is seeking. From there, to then take her thru the steps of understanding what it is she has, will probably have...and what to expect.

Right now, she doesnt need hugs or condemnation. right now, the issue is getting JJ to fully see where God wants her to be in this and find out if she is serious about pursuing that. If she is, then we all can be of help. If she isnt, then all of this wrangling will have been a waste of everyone's time.

So, to everyone. Let's sit back...smoke a peace pipe (or a Cuban)...and wait for JJ to respond. And let's not start shooting up flares in order that someoen feels they will need to respond.

Thanks!!

Indeed MM, indeed. I look forward to JustJilly's responses as well.

MM is usually pretty good about only encouraging the 'Christian' issues when the original poster is a believer themselves. I assume this is the situation with JustJilly. I'm not a Christian, and his posts have never bothered me.

BigKahuna, the fact that there are children involved in this marriage is enough to make me interested in offering advice. The adults can heal from this, from affairs, from divorce. Children are often scarred permanently.

MM,

I didn't realize your son was 14 and was never told until recently by his mom that he was adopted. MM get the book today. Get 2 copies, one for you and one for wife. Read the book ASAP.

Many people do not tell a child they are adopted. It is one way of doing it. I am not sure what is the right way. Most always at some point however the child does find out. Trust me he has a whole lot of questions going on in his head right now. He may or may not talk about how he is feeling.

I always knew I was adopted. My parents always told me everything they knew at the time regarding my bio mother. She was a teenager in 1967 when she got pregnant. My bio father was also a teenager. They knew their heights and weights and hair color. They knew the name that they had called me in foster care. It turns out (6 years ago I found out about my bio mothers family. She is dead and I will go into this info in another posts because what I found out is relevant to my story and perhaps yours too.) that the name that was called in foster care was in fact the name my bio mother gave me. (Again found this out 6 years ago about 1 year after my D was born.)I am not positive but I think all adopted children's birth certificates show the names of their adoptive parents. The BC I had until I got an unamended one 6 years ago also shows only my adoptive parents names etc.


MM this is HUGE and I am glad that you use the word abandonment because this is an important step in understanding the adopted child. I am sorry that your wife told him in the way that she did. I agree that he has a right to know but this was IMHO something that should have been discussed with you and your wife prior to telling him and then I think you should have told him together. I thought for some reason that he was much younger. He is at a critical age and I am very concerned that if he doesn't get some help to deal with this he may be in for some trouble.

I was raised in a very fundamentalist Seventh Day Adventist church. I attended SDA schools from the 4th through the 10th grade. Even though I was raised with a strong christian background didn't ensure anything. Technically I had the belief system. Emotionally I didn't trust God. For the most part I always believed but I wasn't equipped to give it over to God. Trust is a huge problem that many adoptees face. I knew my parents loved me without a doubt but that didn't change the fact that I felt that there was fundamentally something wrong in me...I felt flawed and somehow less worthy of love.

Your son has just been thrown a huge curve ball. His parents are divorcing...read abandonment. I know you or your wife are not literally abandoning him or your other children. All of them will be affected by the divorce. However given the fact that your son just found out that not only is he adopted but that this was kept from him is a double whammy. Some adoptees feel that expressing any interest in their bio history would be a form of disrespect to their parents so they keep it inside. My parents always told me that they would support me in any way if I wanted to seek out my bio history. I was always conflicted about this. I felt that if I ask too many questions or expressed too much interest that my parents would think that I thought they didn't love me. It is complicated.

I am running out of time right now to finish this but want to add that I think it is good that your son's bio father is a good man. Does he know yet that your wife told your son? If not it might be a good idea to give this man a head's up that your son now knows.If your son wishes to meet this man will he meet him? He may not want to have anything to do with him right now.

I will address more later. MM you can get the book online at amazon for about six bucks. In the same spirit that people here say CALL THE HARLEYS...I am saying get the book. The book will help you to help your son. Read it first and if you think it is an appropriate read for your son then he might benefit from reading it too. You know your son so after you read the book you will be better able to decide if he should read it. Is he in IC? If not would he go to IC? If you do get him into IC make sure that the IC is someone who is trained in adoption. A bad IC could actually make things worse.

With sincere gratitude,
Jilly

**EDIT**************

************************EDIT******************

JJ,

I wanted to thank you for coming back and sharing all you have. I am interested in your adoption experiences (as you are unfolding them), losing your mother...and your Christian upbringing (I love how you separated the beliefs from the emotional trust)...

I've been on your road, seemingly, in some important ways. You're helping others (and yes, I'm GETTING the book!). I hope you continue to be brave and work for your personal and marital recovery. I know you have great help here, also.

LA

LA,

I am so glad you are here. I don't why but I need YOU. There is something about YOU that I need. I have read many of your posts. There is something about you I need.

I am not good right now. My dad and stepmom showed up totally unexpectedly. My H was napping in the master which is at the other end of the house. I have not seen them since Christmas. I have talked to them on the phone but I have made excuses all summer for not coming up to see them. From the moment I opened the door and saw my dad I knew something was really bothering him. When he sat down he looked like he was going to cry. My dad isn't one to cry much so I asked him if he was okay. He said no I am not. I feel like I am losing my daughter and my granddaughter.

I hugged him and immediately started sobbing. They knew that H and I were having some marital problems but I hadn’t told them any details...just that we were working on some issues. I am unfortunately a master conflict avoider. My dad is a master problem solver. He is actually very good at it. They started asking me a bunch of questions. This is their way. They know how to deal with me when I am like this. I should have gone to them sooner. I feel ashamed that I hurt my dad. I was afraid to talk to them about it because I don't want to hear negative comments about H or to be told to leave him. This is my own projected fear of what they would say. This is about my own fears and my own lack of trust...even in those I know really loves me.

So the questioning continued and I answered what I could. My 7 year old was in the room so there was at least some attention paid to that fact. My stepmom took her out of the room and said YOU NEED TO TALK TO YOUR DAD. There is a complicated history between my parents and my H. They think he doesn't like them and vice versa. Mostly my H just avoids them so in fact they really don't know each other very well. I wind up defending my H to them and them to him.

My stepmom came back and after the immediate needs questions about was I eating (underlying question are you anorexic)...no I am not I am just don't eat when I am really really stressed. I know I can't be the only person who has difficulty with their stomach when they are under stress. Sleeping? Better now about 6 hours compared to sometimes 2 sometimes 16 etc.

Then came the battery of questions about meds. Am I on AD's? Yes... sleeping meds? Yes I do not need those so much anymore. Meds for stomach. Yes prevacid. Migraine meds? Am I having more migraines than usual? No. Are my panic attacks under control? Yes (this is not a new problem).

Have I gotten into IC? I am calling Monday to set up IC. My regular doctor wanted to look for a really good IC for me. She felt I needed someone really good. I hope she is good. I have been in bad IC before. My dad was insistent about me getting into IC right away. Was I suicidal? Not now but I did tell them I had felt that way. I felt so bad because this made my dad cry more.

I started crying and telling them I wished that I never found anything out about my bio mom. It isn't a good story. She is dead because of her addiction to meth. There is a lot more to that story too but for another post. My dad was like they have nothing to do with you. Who you are. You are okay. It's not your fault that your bio mom ***** up her life. Are you still guilty about her I thought you were past this blaming yourself. Her getting pregnant was not your fault and how she dealt with giving you up also not your fault. The doctor told you this is survivor's guilt. I don't know what I want in terms of my bio siblings...dad. No matter what I want someone will be hurt. Jilly...stop you don't have to have a R with them if you don't want to. Me...I wish I never found any of this out.

Between my dad and stepmom there are 6 of us kids. They have none together yet think of all of us as "their" kids. They have been married 30+ years so at this point I see my SM as an equal parent and I love her very much. It wasn't always this way. They have 11 grandkids. The oldest grandkids are in their early 20's. My SM said "Do you really think with as many kids as there are in our family that it is going to be something we haven't dealt with before?" I had to laugh because I know this is totally true.

SM: Is there someone else? Not for me. For him? Not anymore.

They wanted to know if I wanted to come home with them. I said no I had stuff I needed to do. My dad said there is nothing that will happen if you don't do those things. I said no I didn't want to go. They asked if I was in emotional or physical harm. I said no not at this time and never any physical harm ever. My dad quickly connects the dots. He says what I know but don't want to hear. You feel abandoned by H. Sobbing...yes dad. Come home with us. NO. I don't want you to tell me to get a D. Dad...do you want a D? No. I am not going to tell you to get a D if that isn't what you want. Are you afraid that is what you might want? Is that why you are avoiding IC? No it isn't what I want but I am afraid that is what people will tell me to do. Is this why you aren't talking to us about this? Yes. Stop we will love and support you NO MATTER what you do.

Dad: You have to take the first step to get better. You have to go to IC right away. Me: Why is so hard for me to take the first step dad? Dad: I don't know why you need IC to help you figure this out. You have to talk to me if you need help. I will always help you. You are going to be okay.

My problem isn't that I am only a CA with other people but with myself as well. I over schedule myself. I keep busy so I don't have to think. Not always...sometimes I have good periods of growth and reflection. Other times when it becomes scary I get really busy again.

It is crunch time now. If I don't get to the bottom of these issues I am never going to get better. I am trusting God more. I know he is carrying me. I realize that my MO has always been to run away. This is maybe the first time I have dug my heals in and decided to fight for my marriage. I think these issues have greatly affected my M.

I feel like everything I have kept bottled up for so long is pouring out. I apologize that my posts are so long. I don't know is important to say and what isn't.

With sincere gratitude,
Jilly

JJ

I am glad you decided to stay and continue to learn and seek some advice from here and go to your new IC.
I found IC was very important and separate from any MC as well. In fact IC was more important for some time for me.

It will be a great help that your dad and mum (its good your SM is like YOUR mum too for you) are able to be there for you, my mum & dad, and family too for that matter, have been a blessing. For me and my H.
Just knowing they were there and I could talk, scream, cry or whatever and though they may not agree with me, would love me regardless was SO important.
Yes they did give me some tough love and now I am so grateful.
Now I can look back with affection and a smile or two as I remember my mum (& dad to a lesser extent) wanting, itching, to jump in and FIX things for us, but refraining and leaving the choices to me, because I had to be the one to choose and change. And a strong, forgiving and compassionate H is not just a blessing but a miracle.

This will be hard JJ, but you know that I guess, but there is hope and lots of very good people here who have been through so much. However that said I still feel good professional MC when you are ready for it is worth its weight in gold. If you can access the Harleys please do so, the reports from those who have used them are so positive.

wishing you all the best.
AW

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JustJilly - I hope you don't mind my intruding in your discussion with Mortarman, but this statement of yours jumped out at me as one of the "fundamental self-identity problems" that you are trying to deal with. It involves "questions" that everyone asks themselves at one time or another. "Who am I?" "Why am I here?" What is my purpose in life?" "How and why can I be loved?" "Is there someone 'out there' for me?" "Why am I 'alone' while surrounded by a sea of humanity?" "Why was I wanted by someone other than my 'natural parent(s)?"

JustJilly, I'd just like, as a fellow believer in Jesus Christ, to give you something to think about as you seek to answer those sorts of questions for yourself.

"This is love, that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us."

Upon accepting Jesus Christ as our personal Lord and Savior, BELIEVING in him and who he is, we are all ADOPTED by God as his children and as the bride of his Son. Prior to that time we were all "illegitimate" and children of Satan. We were conceived in sin and lived in sin. Not one thing that we could do on our own would, or could, change that position. "....But God."

That one simple phrase "makes all the difference." God CHOSE us from before time began. God knew us before we were formed in our mother's womb. God knew the path that our lives would take and sent his Son to redeem us, to adopt us into HIS family when that time was right for us. For some it happens very early in life. For some, it doesn't happen until the very end of life. For many, it is somewhere inbetween birth and death.

There are even many who "think" that they are Christians, but have never truly surrendered their hearts to Christ in humble belief in Him and in submission to God's will. Some of those "go through the motions" for appearance sake, but deep down, they know they have NOT truly accepted Jesus Christ. God is patient even with them, knowing who will and who will not come to a saving faith in Christ.

There was, and is, nothing that "merits" our adoption by God. In fact, once we become believers and enter His family, we begin to grow in our new lives, still struggling with our sin-natured flesh and "wrong choices." God is patient and uses ALL the circumstances in our lives to bring us into a closer walk with Him and to become more "Christ-like." For our part, as that process begins to unfold (called Sanctification) we begin to see just how far from "perfect" (as God defines perfection) we are and how it is HIS adoption of us, not what we do, that defines LOVE. God sees through the sins, the bad choices, the circumstances in our lives, to see our soul. God sees our heart and loves us because he loves Jesus and accepts what the Son did as more than "sufficient," it was complete.

We, through our adoption, BECOME a "new creation" in Christ and for Christ. We are HIS, never to be abandoned or "cast out" again. We, like any children, CAN still bring problems on ourselves through rebellion and "self-will," but we NEVER stop being his child and receiving his eternal "sonship and daughership." He WILL pick us up and heal our self-inflicted wounds and use even those experiences to teach us the wisdom of surrendering our lives and our "will" to his will.

Like it or not, most of us tend to "learn things the hard way." But the bride of Christ will never be "lost." There is no changing the eternal promise of God to those whom he loves, because to do so would be to deny his love for Christ Jesus and is promise to Jesus that he made from "before time existed."

With God, trust is NOT an issue. It IS who God is.

Let me put it the way Paul put it:

"Paul, a servant of Christ Jesus, called to be an apostle and set apart for the gospel of God - the gospel he promised beforehand through his prophets in the Holy Scriptures regarding his Son, who as to his human nature was a descendant of David, and who through the Spirit of holiness was declared with power to be the Son of God by his resurrection from the dead: Jesus Christ our Lord. Through him and for his sake, we received grace and apostleship to call people from among all the Gentiles to the obedience that comes from faith. And you also are among those who are called to belong to Jesus Christ. To all in Rome who are loved by God and called to be saints: Grace and peace to you from God our Father and from the Lord Jesus Christ." (Romans 1:1-7)

Greater love hath no man than he lay down his life for his brother. Jesus considered you "worthy" of his love and chose to lay it down for you in humble submission to the Father. YOU were, and are, THAT precious to Jesus and the Father. You ARE the adopted child of the Father and the "worthy" bride of Christ. How much more "worthy" could one be after that?

God bless.