I must have posted in the wrong location. I thought this was just general questions. New to online stuff except for e-mail and playing.

Told my fire crew this morning. All are trying to be supportive but none have experienced this as they are all fairly young 21-28 and only one is married.

I have her work schedule and see all the phone bills. What other "snooping" is necessary. When she drops kids at gradma's she is gone exactly the time it takes to get there and back. She told me last night that her stomach is in knots and she does not want to come home because of the sick feeling. She has had medical issues like this before when she was extremely upset.

I still am very much in love with her but I cannot help to think about how do I protect me and the kids. SHe wants to move them into another school district ASAP and find an apt. I don't think that is best for the kids. We have moved a lot in the past 6 yrs. 3 states, six jobs, 6 schools. My son has great deal of trouble adjusting and does not want to move again.

She is also very angry that I told the kids what was going on...not all the details but they are 8 and 10 and asked me a direct question. I have never lied to them and won't start. I have tried not to say anything negative about mom.

Should I start looking for attorney or hope and pray counseling will work? She says she will go to the next ind counseling and next couple session but after that she does not know. She told me this morning to give her time and space. I don't know if I can stop asking why and what can be done to fix it.

slm, individual counseling will probably land you a divorce. And I don't say that lightly, but this is something Dr Harley says quite often on his radio show. The reason is that an IC will focus only on what the client WANTS, usually at the expense of the MARRIAGE. Most IC's and MC's ARE NOT PROMARRIAGE and it is very common to hear of them of striving to faciliate a divorce when the marriage could be saved. MC has a VERY HIGH FAILURE rate because of this. The same cannot be said for the Harleys. Their principles are very PRO-MARRIAGE and very SUCCESSFUL.

I agree that you should not allow the kids to be removed from their home. I would do what you need to do to protect the kids while letting her know that you DO NOT want a divorce. In matters of divorce, seperation, finances, and most especially the children, it is important to do what is BEST rather than accomodate your W. I would make it very clear to her that you are not interested in divorce and will not make it easy on her to get one. This will SLOW HER DOWN long enough for you

You are not in the wrong place at all. We can help you here.

slm - welcome to MB.

What kind of work does your wife do?

What is the workplace environment like?

Does she have work email or a work phone or a work cell phone that you do not have access to?
Mulan

There is not always an A. They were in counceling last year concerning the same issues she's giving for wanting the D. He admits that her complaints were legit.

I got my exH to MC on two seperate occasions. He was loud, bossy, controlling, mean, degrading, I can go on and on. And one day I told him I wanted a D. No A, I was just done.

It happens - Dru

Drucilla,

Do you happen to remember saying "I love you but I'm not in love with you."

I am guessing not. You see, you have to generally be in love with someone, to realize your not "IN" love with someone else. Most spouses wouldn't have a clue what the feeling of love is like, after say, 5 years of marriage. That might be stretching it, but, I think alot of us forget those giddy feelings, those feelings about living to speak to that other person for just a few seconds or hours on end. We forget it, and don't ever remember it until we get smacked on the head.

That she said this to him, well, it really lays the foundation in my mind. Secondly, her job, if I read correctly is that she gives FIREMEN PHYSICALS. Well, call me blind and stupid, but, if this was my wife's job, I'd be worried no matter what. Jeepers, talk about high risk occupation.

slm- any chance she's pregnant?

(Drucilla)

Sounds like you understand. Is there anything your H could have done to save marriage? I really want to work this out but communications not so good. W listens but does not really provide feedback, just that I have hurt her so much in the past by my behavior.

I'm trying to read Love Busters but mind not functioning well. Looks like I've done all the wrong things in the past, but was unaware of negative actions. I pray it's not too late to change me...I just don't know how yet.

I did get to one major concern. W has followed me all over country for my job and been VERY supportive. Now she is working full time and has job she loves (I don't like it for reasons already posted). She is very good at it. Always hear from other firefighters how professional and friendly she is. I have not been supportive at all. When I brought this realization to her she began to cry uncontrollably. I may have struck a nerve.

I sure hope I can figure something out. Son tells me they are looking at apartments on 13th. Any thoughts or advise appreciated. Thanks.

slm....

I could have written EXACTLY what you wrote about your situation on August 27 1999!! EXACTLY. Wife worked a lot, I worked a lot, kids, etc. We had "grown apart" The "I love you but...." all of it. You know what? Her PA was essentially over and she was withdrawing....

Do not discount anything...she says....her phrases and actions are TEXTBOOK....regardless, you need to read up and try and save your marriage....

best of luck

Quite right, I did not say that to him... but I bet he got me to say something he could have taken that way. He asked if I loved him, and I said something like 'love is not enough'. And truly, I did not love him, but I was trying to be as cool and unemotional about the situation as I could. I was worried about him freaking and becoming violent or vindictive.

SLM:
NO, I'm not sure he could have done anything, but he did to EVERYTHING to facilitate me leaving and the D. So with that I say DO NOT MAKE IT EASY ON HER TO D YOU.

My exH very quickly said 'fine, you want a D, here you go'. He did all the leg work, helped me move, gave me $.

Keep with the Plan A. ELIMINATE THE LB'S... ELIMINATE. One LB can wipe out 100 EN's. THIS I KNOW. exH would do OK for a day or two then blow it with a LB. ANY thoughts I had about him changing FLEW out the door with a little LB. - Dru

(Drucilla)

Thanks so much for the insight. Have been reading Love Busters and been slapped with reality check. Looks like the book was written about us. I had no idea the hurt I was causing and I'm sure she still has no idea what damage she is doing because cannot get her to read or talk about it. W has been cordial. Informed her I DID NOT want separation or D and taking the kids out of the school district was not acceptable. W has IC today and me tomorrow. Couples MC Monday. I know she is looking at apartments Sunday while I'm at work but I'll have the checkbooks so no action can be taken. I have paperwork for temporary custody, but have not filed yet since she is still at home. Lawyer says judge will certainly grant temp custody since I am not leaving the house and going to keep kids in same school. Will have to hire sitter since they get home at 3 and I don't get home til 8-9 pm, but not much difference now.

I wish I had found this web site and books a long time ago...I may not be in this crisis then. I am still very much in love with W and tell her daily. She replies "I know." I guess that's better than a negative/hurtful response.

Thanks for sharing.

Hi Slim,

Are you VERY familiar with Plan A? Re-read the articles here or the chapters in your book. Think of anything she could consider an LB and eliminate it. Focus on her top 2-3 EN – get creative. Tell us what they are, maybe we could make some suggestions.

First, cut back on telling your W ILY daily. Right now she sees that as pressure and an LB. You want to throw a little of the 180 plan in, also. Goal is to ATTRACT your W back to you, so you need to be ATTRACTIVE. Keep a positive attitude, be busy, be involved with life and activities outside the house. This is very hard when you're having M problems, so you have to make an extra effort, here. Dress nice, buy some new clothes, get a haircut... Ask her out, something simple, fun and a little unusual. Nothing too drastic, but you want to get her thinking....

Your mantra should be “I want to save this marriage.” Tell MC that is your goal, then ASK him what HIS is. If you are not familiar with this MC, call him before the appointment, ask him his philosophy. MC will do this, tell him you are only interested in seeing him IF he’s pro-marriage. Stress to MC that children are involved. Appeal to your W IN MC, that we owe it to the children to try. Don’t do this otherwise, just in MC. Stall her moving out. She’s probably got a nest egg put aside to move (that’s what I did). Don’t ask her this (sounds bossy and controlling), but don’t be surprised.

She’s in IC. When did that start? Do you know IC? Do you think IC is supportive of marriage?

Have you sincerely apologized? I mean deeply, so that she knows it? Something to consider.

Take GOOD care of yourself… - Dru


PLAN A

We are using Employee Assistance Program from my employer. Has cuples session two weeks ago, today is W first IC mine is tomorrow. We go together on Monday.

Have not got feel for counselor yet. I intend to ask lots of questions tomorrow. She did point out some glaring differences in our communications attempts. W is not receiving the message I think I'm sending.

I have apologized profusely. I really am sorry. I had no clue I was doing the things she said I am doing. Now after reading LB I am aware and want to change negative behavior.

I have fire dept picnic Sat and she said she would go with me...family function. Our 12th wedding anniversary is coming up. Should I be low key and just provide a card or simple gift or try to set up a date?

Our schedules are very busy and do not look as if they will let up until Oct. She says she needs space and time. We will hardly see each other during waking hours until Oct. I know this is not good for M but my absence from the house is cherished time for her. She says she can breathe easier when I am at work. I miss her terribly during the day but she does not even want me to call. I usually call her once a day in the afternoon so we can connect. I just want to hear her voice but she feels I am "checking up" on her. I don't believe I have a reason to check up on her since the kids are usually with her at the office. Son is very vocal about situation and I think he would say something if there was anything happening. W has never given me a reason to mistrust her yet.

W feels that I critize her housekeeping and child raising skills. Says she feels I am embarrassed by her and make her feel stupid. She has always had some self esteem issues. Again, she is receiving a different message than what I intended to send. W admits everything I say to her right now is received negatively. W wants more help around house. She works about 40 hr/wk and I work at least 88. Figure it up, I don't have much time for anything but dinner and some sleep!

When we talked about my lack of enthusiasm and support for her job W became very emotional. I think I hit one of the big LBs. She has followed me around the country and been supportive of my career. I'm comfortable with where I am now. I am usually very confident and secure, but her job bothers me. She performs physicals on firefighters in the area. I know many of them and they would tell me if they thought she was flirty or inappropriate. However, my mind is uneasy about the job. I just don't like it...and I've told her how I feel. She just shrugs it off and asks if I have talked to any of the other guys (and I have). She only spends about 10-15 minutes with each person while others are in line waiting. She and Dr. perform about 4-5 physicals and hour for 8-10 hours. Is my reaction or feelings inappropriate?

I will do anything to save M. And I've told her that. I ask her to let counseling have a chance and not to make any life-changing decisions yet. She agreed to continue through the couples session on Monday and then I don't know what she will do.

(Thanks for the ideas...it really feels better to vent).