Married Sept 04. H started acting “weird” in Nov of 04. My gut was telling me something was going on but it took me until late Dec to find out what it was. H was in heavy cell contact, text msgs etc with his old gf from well before we met. When I initially asked him about it he said she was calling him because of her job etc. My gut told me otherwise. Things continued to get worse, I kept feeling as if he were lying to me all of the time, he had his phone with him 24/7 etc, you guys know the drill. At one point I asked him who he was getting ready to call, I had been cleaning in the back part of the house, he wasn’t expecting me to walk up on him, he told me his D but I knew he was laying trust your gut instinct.

Finally in late January I found a cell bill he hadn’t shredded. I was so hurt and angry. Before we got married I told him that I would not live with a cheating H ever again, been there done that previously. I confronted him deny deny deny. Kept plugging along trying to figure things out but knowing it was bad. Meantime I had accepted a job working for the Air Force in Germany, can we say stress? What an Idiot I have been.

Feb, H takes me to Vegas. On Valentines Day (my B day) his phone rings at approx 12:15 am, just turned V Day. I laid in bed acting like I was asleep. H got up and was taking his phone into the bathroom when I popped up and asked him who it was. He said “no one!” and came back to bed. I knew. I just didn’t know what to do about it.

A week later I came home from working late to find him passed out on the bed (he is not a drinker) cell phone laying there so I took it and went through it. No need to tell you guys what was on it, plenty of nasty sex messages back and forth. So I called the GF and asked her what was going on, got the “we are just friends blah blah blah”. I asked her what kind of friend can’t wait to be (repeated one of her text msgs right back to her)? That was when she told me I was moving to Germany because we were getting divorced.

I woke the H up, confronted him, told him to get his crap out of my house etc. He of course denied again. She of course blamed it all on him. I did not expose, still not sure why, maybe the shame of it all and having recently come out of a marriage where this had happened?


I know I married him too soon after my previous marriage. I was in a very good place, emotionally, financially etc, all of it. I was very up front and honest with him during all talks.
I feel duped. Maybe he feels the same at this point.

Today, says he wants out, he is done. H is a very strong person and what he says stands. I have been aware of MB website and the principles and I am plan A-ing my butt off right now but feel as if I am swimming against the current. I do not think he is currently in an A but the way things are with our marriage he is sure ripe for it.

I do not want a divorce but he will not even look at this website to even consider.
I am at fault for a lot of things and this past week has been he!!. I even started packing my things up in the house, asked myself what the heck I was doing. Stopped immediately.
Since he would not speak to me I sent him an email stating:
“Today I will not be the person you want me to be. I will be the person that I am.
I will not pack up one more of "my" things in this house.
I will not be ugly towards you and give you cause to treat me the same.
I will not look for somewhere else to live. How can I say I love you and be so willing to leave. I am not.
No person is disposable. I do not believe marriages are either. I know we have problems, a lot of them. I also know that working together we could overcome them.
Choices you make will be just that, yours just as I am making my own.”

I feel as if he wants me to be ugly to him so he can justify doing what he wants. Am I nuts?
H’s behavior, he begins to treat me, not badly, but differently, when he wants to do something I do not agree with at all. During his A he got angry with me, like he was attempting to make me be ugly towards him so he could justify his A. This last time he began his crap I couldn’t figure out what was/is up. His YD is getting married early Sept. He doesn’t want me there for whatever reason ( I asked him this directly but got “A lot of reason” ) so he treats me like crap in order to get me angry, ugly acting and he can then justify his actions. H has his plane ticket and at this point I would not go to that wedding if I had to.
I think that he has told all of his relatives that we are divorcing, there have been a lot of phone calls to them. We are not sharing a bedroom anymore, his decision.

I am worn out but I will not give up, along with that is the knowledge that he will make his own choices,

Also wanted to add that I do not have a support system here. Tried talking to two people and got the "you're an idiot, cut and run" No one understands how I feel.

I am not afraid that he will leave me, $$ etc is good for me. I just cannot give up, my gut is telling me to hang in there and not give up.
Please, someone, tell me I am not insane to see what a good person my H can be and that I am not insane to place value on my marrige.

We swept so ,much under the rug that it's not funny. There isn't an elephant in the room, there is a whole herd.

hey im not the best person to talk to but it seems preety dead tonite.
trust me people here will help you just wait it out and try to calm down.
i hope everything works out for you but for some reason tonight is very slow

by the way if it helps ya johnnylove75@aol.com
you could reach me and i have no problem supporting you

Thank you so much JM, I think it helped to just write out all of the craziness. I love living in Europe but the time difference is heck when you are waiting for words of wisdom.
I am at work right now, can barely think. I am so restless, like I need to take action. I am holding still. I think it was WAT or someone just as wise as him that had a post on here about just being still.

I asked H this morning if we could sit and talk tonight. He said that he had no idea what I wanted to talk about but sure, then left for work.

After work today he told me he was going to the golf course. I told him to have a good time, but then realized I had the chance to meet at least two of his emotional needs, admiration and companship. So I bit the bullet and asked if I could go with him. I went! It was okay, there is definitely something between us but it wasn't ugly either.

One of my issues is being being turned down, for lack of a better way to put it. I can't stand having the person that I love teling me no when it is something i want to do. When I said I bit the bullet, I risked being turned down but he didn't, shocked me. I'm not all joyous right now but it is a little bit of something at least.

Plan A you are not supposed to talk about the relationship, I lost sight of that this morning. Now trying to figure out a way to let him know that I want to pass on the chance to talk, rather than saying good night to him and leaving him hanging.

Blessings to all of you and many thanks to all that post their trials on here so we can all learn from them.

GS, I'm glad you started your own thread..it does feel good to get it out. Is your WH older than you? Could this be part of a mid-life crisis? Have you exposed yet? How does he know OW? Do they work together? Are you sure there is NC?Is he still guarding his cell?

You are right hold off R talk in plan A. Search yourself what are your needs? Can you meet those needs without him? Can you guess what his needs are? Will he let you fill any of those EN? Do you have solid evidence of affair? Plan A is the precurser for plan B. You should not do plan A indefinitely, set a time frame. (don't tell him). Have you thought about plan B?

I know what you mean about extending yourself and feeling rejecting. If you invite him somewhere and he declines go anyway.

My Dad was stationed at Rhein-Mein Air Force Base we lived in tiny town in the Frankfurt area for 4 years. I was a kid but I LOVED it! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Keep posting!!

Growth,

if you need a shoulder to lean on.............well and if you're livin in Germany............there might be a possibility that you get in contact with me.

Do you have a email address that I could write you to??

Let me know how I can get into contact with you, if you want to. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

hugs
bb

Growth,

So sorry you are going through this. But you are in the right place. It sounds like you've been through this before with a previous marriage, that's unfortunate.. but in this situation, it means you are more prepared and better equipped.

Regardless of how timid or strong headed a person is, once they are in an affair, they find a way to justify and end their marriage. Plan A can be equally successful in ending the affair, regardless if you husband is a strong willed person. Plan A doesn't force him back into your marriage, it wakes him up from his fantasy and reattracts him back to his family.

However, you are not in plan A if you are not exposing the affair. Gather evidence and expose. You say you haven't exposed yet because of shame or embarrassment. Will you be any less embarrased if he ends up divorcing you and going with this woman? That's where it's headed if you don't take action now.

You'll have to get over your fear of rejection and your insecurities if you are going to be in a solid plan A. A WS will tear you up from the inside out if you let them. Find your support where you can, but don't expect it from him while he is in an affair.

Hello Growthspurt,

I don't live in Germany but right around the corner in Belgium. So we're in the same time zone !

Just a few questions:
How long have you been in plan A now ?
And would you consider yourself a conflict avoider ?
I'm asking because I have "been there, done that" and paid the price for it.

Hugs
Brit from Belgium (we do hug a lot in Europe, don't we <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />)

Cha Cha, thanks for popping onto my thread. He is older than me by 14 years. No, I don’t think it is a mid life crisis. I think he manipulates people to get what he wants. I emailed his older brother yesterday and got a ton of insight on him. I had known H as a friend, not a close one, for a couple of years before my first M went down the tubes. Then things just happened when I wasn’t looking. I knew to look for red flags but in all honesty I didn’t see a one. Maybe I was too honest from the get go and set him up for success. He knew what I could not tolerate in a relationship so he was able to avoid doing those things while it suited him? Hmmm

Back when H had his A I called up my ExH and asked him why in the heck this happened to me again. ExH told me that I am too honest and to trusting. That has always bothered me how can/could anyone be too trusting but I have since come to see his point &#61514; I do not trust my H the way I did before his A.


BlondBlossom, I will just keep posting here for right now. That way I will not cross anyone else’s boundaries. Thank you for the offer!

Sun, I honestly don’t think he is in an A. I think he is doing this in order to get what he wants. There is a wedding back in the states we were supposed to attend and for some reason he does not want me to go.
However, this is a Marriage Builder website and the principles can work on a marriage that is not in a good place. I know it can, have a friend that used all of it and is very happily married, no A involved, just an H in mid life crisis.

Brown, I am guilty as pegged. Conflict avoider big time. Hate it, gives me hives just thinking about it and believe it or not I currently have 30 people working under me. I do what I have to do at work but my M is…I just don’t want to rock the boat. I am realizing how this makes me look as a partner though. Weak and indecisive, not very attractive traits.

Was very tired last night, haven’t been sleeping much at all so did not have the chance to sit and talk with H, a good thing.

Thanks all of you

What do yo do if they won't talk to you. I talk to him, about non R things and he responds but that is it. Nothing from him. Help!
Ugh this is frustrating, totally frustrating.
*biting my tongue*
I am pleasant and resolved. I put myself out there to be turned down and that is what I got tonight.
Weird, seems almost as ig he is feeling sorry for himself. How the heck can that be ?!?!?!
I am feeling slightly insane.

Hi GS,
I would recommend that you go into counseling for yourself.
Conflict avoiding isn't something you do for fun - it's something that's deeply conditioned, and it needs specialist help to "cure".
The problem is that a CA looks like a really nice person to be with, and we get plenty of strokes for being the CA we are... especially when a Taker is around.. And we're very likely to choose a Taker for a partner.. so we get stimulated to be even ore of a CA... compromising even more... while our own personality, our own preferences, our own choices, are dying inside, so to speak.

BrownHair, he is a taker..how do I break the cycle? I didn't even know this about myself, the CA until recently? I feel as if i am dying a slow death here!
I know ho wunattractive it is to him right now but dammmmmmmmmm sheesh. I swear he is feeling sorry for himself. I went to therapy during my last M and resultant D. This never came up. Could it be that I am now doing the CA ??

My CA is most present in an emotional relationship.
I'm more assertive in other relations.. not assertive enough, as far as I'm concerned, but that's easier for me.
So it might not come up with a counselor I guess.

I'll break it down for you, the way I see it anyway:
- I tend to avoid conflicts because I need affirmation.
- Or at least, I want to avoid rejection/indifference.
- I need affirmation because I have no self-esteem.

Remedy:
- When in conflict, don't automatically back down. Observe. Wait.
- Learn about war tactics - I mean it - it will show you the CA "tactic" and why it doesn't work.
- Talk to your counselor about these things.
- Build up self-esteem.

hmmmm I think I have pretty good self esteem. I know who I am. I just can't get past him wanting me to be who he wants me to be..sound nuts? It's like he wants me to be angry so I fall into that trap? spinning in circles
I am seriously not afraid, he can go, is fine with me. Jeez, don't know which way to turn and it is difficult trying to find an ICS here. agh!
I just a few mins ago sent an email to schedule an appointement with MB wish me luck.
Am wondering if since my last M went sour and ended in D if I am trying to over compensate to avoid another D? But looks like it is headed that way anyhow. I don't think my H has the courage to be honest. I told someone earlier today that the reason I filed in the first M, the XH didn't have the courage to do it and I am not going to do it again, my gut(instinct) tells me to hang in there because I have a lack of fear this time. I know I will be okay.

You will be okay, GS. Be glad you're not a terrible CA <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" /> !

Your H probably IS feeling sorry for himself right now.
And yes, if you're angry, it's easier for him, so he might try to trap you into getting angry.
Not that he really does this on purpose.. just a way for him not having to face up to himself and to what he's done.

thank you brown *hugs* I just do not care to go through another D. His choice if that is what he wants, I have been very clear that it is not what "I" want Standing firm but being forgiving..I don't think he can believe it yet

Give it some time GS.
I'm signing off now - early start tomorrow.
*hugs* 4 U 2 !

I have an appointment with someone on the MB staff Monday. Got the email late today.

H seemed so sad this morning so being stoopid I told him that I am sorry for the things I have said and done that caused him hurt and that I love him.
He wasn't happy to hear it and told me (tone of voice, no uncertain terms) that he has not changed his mind wants out. I told him that it's ok because I have not changed mine either.

I hate being at loose ends, that is how this feels to me. I want to attempt to negotiate a 6 month deal with him, both of us working our butts off on the M but I know better.
Thanks to all