I thought this thread was appropriate...has AmI's request to run the triathalon with her...and we did. Mission Accomplished. She's as amazing and wonderful in person, btw. So is her family.

All of the people I have met from MB are wonderful people. Some of them don't know that yet, but they are.
A triathlon is quite an accomplishment. That should help you both in lots of ways, not just your resting heart rate. I suspect you already know all about how it helps.


I was thinking about you, SS, eight days ago...I really was. I've been grieving my mother in fits and starts (one of her old expressions I took to mean, erratically on and off)...and I thought it was this time last year, which was hitting me hardest, when I did the unthinkable. Since you asked and I remembered...having pulled up this thread...well, I am off by a whole month.

If I spent as much time on MB as I would like it would detract from family time, and probably prevent me from making a living. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />
So, I don't keep up on everyone as well as I would like to.
I see your posts from time to time, and It looks like you are making progress, but I wondered HOW YOU FEEL ABOUT YOUR PROGRESS.

Feels like a relief. And a little fantasy-leaning...because recently I've been allowing myself to play the what-if game (from decades of permissions)...where I roll back time to Christmas of 2005 and my family flies down to Houston, stays at a local hotel, rents a car (entire package of course), and hopes to get an invite to Christmas for a couple of hours...and in the mean time, plays together, anyway.

"What If" is good if we can use it to change our future actions so as to overcome the regrets of the past. It doesn't work very well as therapy though. (Smile) Sometimes it makes things worse.

I didn't do it, SS. Last chance at family Christmas and there I went again, into little darn girlhood, where because they take back the invite, I don't do my own thing, from my own reasons...holding true to my boundaries.

It's hard to know what to do in these situations when you are in the middle of them. Sometimes we don't understand until much later. I don't know any way around that, because life, and it's lessons are connected to time, and it's limitations. It works how it works, and we can't cut corners and get life's lessons without going through life's experiences.

Didn't occur to me at the time it was an option...only in hindsight. So, the grieving continues.

You already know, so what I am saying is only a review. I hope it helps some though.
I am learning that we really can choose happiness in the midst of chaos created by others. It's something that takes place inside of us, not outside. It is a skill that can be learned, and practice helps.

My relationship with my father is all new, btw. He calls, emails...even came out for my MS's college graduation. He got to meet his great-granddaughter. I'm really blessed. Incredibly. So different, all this...

It sounds like his feelings were being poisoned. I hope he has a full recovery. I wonder if she will ever recover.

And we're all together...my family. We're healthy...growing, staying connected (with interruptions), and right here, right now. Got to take all my sons (and DIL and GD) to Harry Potter at the drive-in. Didn't realize it was my OS's first drive-in, ever.

Isn't it interesting how things invoke memories in us. We no longer have a drive in near us - they are all gone. The memories flood back though, and I can see our car, parked there in line with all the others.

It is good that your family is staying connected, and doing (reasonably) well. I think this is probably one of the things we use to measure our lives. Probably a good gauge in many ways.


Very blessed.

Is faith in yourself one of your blessings? Is it increasing?

Funny thing happened on the day of the triathalon...my home computer died, instead of me.

You were expecting a different outcome, where your computer lived, but you did not? (LOL)

I understand that training can do that to a person.

My internal harddrive took quite a carthasis, though. The medal says, "The woman who starts this race is not the one who finishes it." I will attest to that in all my metaphorical glory...and yeah, I'll blush deeply, if they were referring to those relay teams.

No, you have it right, and you know it. Aren't they interesting........... the lessons we learn about ourselves?

I still seek your soothing words, your keen clarity and your generous spirit, SS. I learned from other bumps in the road, though, here on MB...and those have been huge for me. I'm still at it...this growing and knowing experience.

I wish I felt as wise as some people make me out to be. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />
My self image is that of a pretty regular guy. I'm still at it too. Growing, and learning are what we are supposed to be doing, so that is good for all of us. It's hard to spend time on MB, and not learn.

grow (gro) v. grew (groo), grown (gron), grow·ing, grows. --intr. 1. To increase in size by a natural process. 2.a. To expand; gain: The business grew under new management. b. To increase in amount or degree; intensify: The suspense grew. 3. To develop and reach maturity. 4. To be capable of growth; thrive: Some plants grow in deep shade. 5. To become attached by or as if by the process of growth: tree trunks that had grown together. 6. To come into existence from a source; spring up: love that grew from friendship. 7. To come to be by a gradual process or by degrees; become: grow angry; grow closer. --tr. 1. To cause to grow; raise: grow tulips. 2. To allow (something) to develop or increase by a natural process: grow a beard. --phrasal verbs. grow into. 1. To develop so as to become: A boy grows into a man. 2. To develop or change so as to fit: She grew into her job. He grew into the relationship slowly. grow on or grow upon. 1. To become gradually more evident to: A feeling of distrust grew on me. 2. To become gradually more pleasurable or acceptable to: a taste that grows on a person. grow up. To become an adult.

Gives us some interesting things to think about -
I think the growing you are doing looks good on you. God can do a lot with anyone who is willing to accept his help, and direction.

Glad you're here, also. You could share how all your kids are doing...where was your last three day get away with your loving wife...and when your triathalon is scheduled...if you please.

Well.......... we have eight children, so that would take days to type out. I'll do the short version.

We have four boys, and four girls. The oldest five are married, and doing ......... mostly well. They are doing better than they sometimes think they are. We try to give help, and direction, but they need to learn addition, and subtraction before they learn algebra, so we watch, and wait, and do the best we can with where they are.

Only the twins (girls - 14) are still at home. They are doing well in school, developing their talents, and they are helpful to their mother around the home.

Most of our children live close to us, and visit us weekly or more.

We have 7 grand children, and that part of life is really fun. Nearly all of them were home last night for a family dinner. We celebrated the return (of most of our sons, and SIL's) from a fishing trip in Alaska by having a fish dinner. We are a close family, and all the children, and spouses get along well.

Last three day trip was end of March for our 30th Anniv. However, we celebrated that Anniv again in June by going on a cruise up the inside passage from Seattle to Alaska. We were away 10 days, and it was a marvelous time. I highly recommend it, and I was the one who didn't know if I would like it. I keep thinking the marriage can't get any better, only to be proved wrong. It's nice to be wrong about some things.

I know God lives, and cares about all of us. That sustains me through every trial. Help is only a prayer away -

Thanks LA. Don't let it get to you when the bad days come. It's almost always better in the morning.

SS

SS

8 Children???!!!

I thought I was unusual with having 5. People often look at me like I'm nuts!

Just wanted to say hi. It's so infrequent that I am on here lately.


I like the definitions of grow. These are me now:

To develop and reach maturity.

To be capable of growth; thrive:

To come to be by a gradual process or by degrees;

To allow (something) to develop or increase by a natural process:

To develop so as to become

To develop or change so as to fit

To become gradually more pleasurable or acceptable to

There's a theme there - evolving and acceptance. A process. I think I'm getting that these days.

Thanks for still being here. It's nice to see friendly faces!

Thanks Lizzy - I posted on your own thread.

It's odd to think of the dictionary being a source of inspiration, but there are some pretty good things in there.

Onward - and upward.

SS

SS,
Thank you for responding. How do I feel about my progress? I hadn't thought about it in that way, to tell you the truth. Progress in mourning? Progress in growing...progress as in who I am today? I guess the answer is I'm happy. Because it is a process for me.
I can't imagine getting where I hope I'm growing, btw. I wouldn't know what it looked like.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

And yes, I agree that my father chose not to have a relationship with me in the way he does now in consideration of my mother. With her passing, his life changed dramatically. I know my part is clearly seeing his choices now as solely his own...where before, that was murky.

As for the "what if" for aiding our futures (not used to an extreme, as I did before), not for therapy, I agree with you. What I like is that I caught myself in one day...didn't slap myself...and felt a little freer to choose that if it comes around again in my life.

I have had those downward spirals like I used to...and have had a number of upward ones.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

I like the balance...and I know you're an average guy (no superman)...and an exceptional husband and father (probably son, too, and brother)...a fine mentor, too. It's the tone of your writing which I enjoy--I hear supportive, soothing, challenging and direct.

Balance.

Like a dictionary.

lol

Thanks for sharing about your family...what you guys do inspires me. Widens my ideas.

I know God is with me...my important relationship...listening for his direction, sharing my desires...and knowing he hears...as I hear him...to do his will...having faith this is my way, right now, given my own understanding.

I'm following Lizzie's lead and writing up the definitions you shared for my wall...right next to my monitor. Thank you for passing it on.

LA

Back from our Venture Scout trip. I only wrecked my bike once.
I rarely have time on Sunday to post, so it will be later in the week .............. if I get to it before I leave for a work related trade show sometime Wed. Isn't life fun sometimes ?

I worry about the downward spirals - was hoping they were in the past.

I hope your weekend is a good one.

SS

I almost forgot -

You asked when my triathalon is scheduled.

Due to an injury, I no longer run. I hike a little, and bike a little, but very much of any of it hurts a lot, so I keep it to a little.

SS

Nothing like a four-month-old response from me, SS...

Yet your last post fits...and you do seem to me like a wise old tree...so in tree-time, that's nothin', correct?

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Since very much of any of it hurts a lot, you keep it to a little. Wise advice. I had to search to get to my thread...which AmI created for me...with resentment on my mind...

very much of it hurts a lot; somewhere in the last four months, I stopped keeping it to a little.

Same way with sharing my struggles on this board...thought I was in the habit of sharing my stuff with others here...looks like I've lost that trail. Need a scout to lead me back.

Old self-deception of thinking I was doing when I wasn't doing...just thinking.

Like thinking downward spirals were a thing of the past...when the past is with us...in us...like the present. Been relieving again a lot of four years ago, three years ago...and I don't know if it's part of a twist in my grieving a year ago or not. Probably part of, not the whole.

My new relationship with my father remains a gift too large for me to fully get through my door all the way. As if I've been in crash position, my own duck and cover, for these last few years...not prepared for abundance, connection, the ease of accepting love is...

And my fear of loss grows higher. With it comes my acts which I know I will resent...my focus smeared all over my DH...my sons...and missing that sneaky catalyst stress when it slips in, allowing it turn me inside out into old patterns, mindset and doing the old dance again.

Not aligning to God's purpose for me...not even allowing God into my spiral, to scoop me up. And coming back to where I was when I felt happy, open...also brings that back.

Which is why this board is awesome...because what we said when we felt, thought, believed, perceived then...remains. I can revisit myself...realign.

Like a restore setting. I can reach out by sharing and be reached.

I'm struggling with leaving this board...and have been...this year has been rough here for me...full of challenges and lessons...that I get, and lose, and they come again. God's unyielding in his reach, I believe.

Resentment is heavy, SS...I think it's the equivalent of lead inside me...slowly layered, melted from the heat of anger, fueled by fear...over time...weighs me down. Gotta give that resentment to God...and I don't know if I can lift it from my heart.

With this new board system, mods can disappear threads...poof...gone. No revisiting possible.

Big time fear in that for me.

Loss.

I read tonight on SwingDancer's thread where JustLearning felt like leaving this site, too. Immediately, I felt a loss reflected again and again, endlessly. Wouldn't stop.

What do we do with our fear of loss? Where do we put it when it's so huge it seems to blot out the sun?

I would post to myself that it's not real...it's just fear. A signal. Somehow tonight, I can't get there knowing that truth. Maybe tomorrow...it could happen.

Just not right now.

In non-cyber life...I'm still driving my mother's car. Finally got it licensed in my state...and I felt loss of that, even...taking off the Texas plates. I left them out on my kitchen table. Another step of letting go, letting reality in...just not ready for it, I guess.

My own car is now in my oldest son's hands...for he choose poorly and is in consequences beyond imagining. He allowed a coworker he drove to work with to drive his car which we cosigned on last year. The guy had a revoked license. In our city, there's an ordinance they put through two years ago, putting habitual traffic offenders into the same group as drug dealers, sexual assault, prostitution...so when they pulled over the coworker last month for speeding, they confiscated my son's car, though he wasn't driving.

The city ordinance in play reads that anyone knowing, allowing to happen or not preventing any one of these crimes (including misdemeanor theft by receiving) will have their personal property, real property or motor vehicle taken.

They put him in jail...along with the driver...he's carrying the weight of the experience along with being the first person in our family arrested. I didn't consider his one-day experience to be much...had been of the mindset that if any of my boys were arrested, they would stay there, taking their consequences. I didn't get how traumatic it was for him...his wife, after scrounging up the bond on $5,000, got him out. I was busy in my own world that day and night...clueless...not tuned in...unaware of what he was facing, going through.

God brought me to my senses the other day...got my attention through marriage-building opportunity for an acquaintance...who's wedding ring broke while I was standing there...I think God's astounding at segue's...and I heard how he was choosing to stay married and not fall back in love with his wife because years ago, she had him arrested for something unstated...and that experience was so traumatic, that the only way he would consider forgiveness was to have her be arrested, experience the humiliation he went through...

And tonight, it hit me. He's not only going to be paying the additional $500 fine for tossing his friend his keys...he's going to be paying off the $13k on a car the city will keep and auction...and the late fees on his rent (I'm thankful he kept going to work after finding out how much loss he was facing)...me advising him to keep paying whatever rent they can...so they don't owe $4k on top of the other losses for their apartment lease.

My mind went there, the night of his arrest, that this would be a huge downward spiral...lose his job, apartment, marriage and kill himself...which wasn't as dramatic or unreasonable as it may sound...he really does have PTSD, stopped taking his medication...and left his wife and my grandchild. For two days last month, I didn't know if he was dead or alive...nor did others.

His cell phone is in the car they took.

Well, my imaginings weren't real...he found rides to work and kept going...still has the job, the apartment...crushed his wife to dust for a couple of weeks...which in pain-time seems so much longer...and moved back in last week...because he's having another child next year.

Nothing healed or resolved...facing the same losses...and there I was, telling him we'd fight for him...we'd challenge this ordinance all the way to the state supreme court...making my grandiose promises...and not even understanding, listening, respecting...just posting about it here. Or thinking, hey, I have an old car he could drive...didn't even offer.

I believe in the spirit of the ordinance...do not stand by, allow, fail to prevent...I think the arrest and a $200 fine would have been huge to my son on their income...a reasonable loss. Not this.

And the driver? He's now considered a repeat offender...facing two years in prison minimum...criterion being if you have three DUI/DWI or reckless driving tickets in seven years; or 18 violations of any kind involving a vehicle in five years. I was thinking of my sons from 16 to 21...using my fingers and toes.

They're safe. For now.

Of course, my youngest hasn't gotten his drivers license yet, though he turned 18 last month...the day before OS's arrest.

Feels to me as hard to see OS's losses...the continuing damage...as if it were happening to me. Can't distinguish between the two...we can't control our consequences, neither natural or logical. Wish I could not do very much of this a lot, so it would hurt just a little.

Where do I go with that stress? Back to the gym...and then, into old patterns...where I seek relief in my DH...and focus on lack...on victimhood...back into the old days and ways I've been here to change, break, make new ones...and like my toddling granddaughter, I'm falling a lot.

She does it gracefully.

I don't.

LA

[[[LA]]] I don't know what to say to you other than I'm sorry for your sitch. YOU have been there for me,helped me, saved me, wacked me on the head softly when I was stubborn, and I have no words for you other than I'm sorry.

Please know I'll be here for you. I hope you'll be here to heal again. This to shall pass,you shall gain your strength and perspective. YOU are a marvelous loving person. Life unfortunately does have a way of sometimes taking us back to where we thought we'd already been and left. YOUR personal growth and strength will see you through this along with all of us who value you to cheer you on.

(((love and prayers)))

Thank you for sharing, LA and for staying....and for investing in those of us seeking what you have to share.

Ditto what mvg said....no need to add anything to it.

Acey

PS We weathered our latest crisis partially due to what we've both learned from you. Thank you. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

(((((LA)))))

WOW...I'm so sorry that your son it having to deal with these consequences...thereby producing the ripple effect...


I don't think that this is soemthing that we graduated from...they remain there, hiding, leering around the corner...lessons go unlearned...feelings remain the same...just when we think that we have learned all of the rules something changes...and we feel like we know nothing...but we know huh?

For me it's the instant anxiety and panic and I have to let that pass before I can do I before E...hear that little voice inside of me pointing in the right direction to my senerity, letting me know what I can do and what I can't do...the simpliest answer isn't the one that we tend to look for being complicated people...

I know that I overlook the obvious wanting to reach for the difficult...when in reality if I keep it simply it works out better all around and in the long run...

I hear your fears...I see you gathering your courage also...did you pat yourself on the back?


LAck, huh? Positive: you son STILL went to work...I applaude him for that...points to character even in a time when he is dealing with the devastation of being arrested...feeling judged by OP, even if it's only in his mind...ashamed...unable/not allowing himself to be comforted by those around him...

Tough stuff for everyone touched by the event...resentments...yeah...we can not see why we are going through what we are going through in the here and now...I personally would be questioning my HP asking why...what's the point?

However, once throught the other side of the valley...it's like we "could have had a V8!" Smacks us in the forehead... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />



Not when you try to do it alone, not asking for what you need...not posting here for all those who love and admire you to share your humanness... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Your strenght, hope and experience reaches to our very souls providing warmth...and I enjoy sharing that warmth with you, lending you a hand when you have spiraled...not down...UP! Climbing...same theme...could it be what we can not control? protect? because our little fledglings have left the nest?

And your OS, was completely unaware that this coworker was without a vehicle, was not also aware that he did not have a license, his pass offenses?

have your OS not known, I would want to protect, defend, fight with all my might...perhaps the lesson for your OS is one of trusting untrustworthy people...I don't know...I've have my own hardships with that one as you well know...

I wish you well, you and your family...praying for you and them perhaps when you can not...I like to think that God does not carry us this far to let us fall...

Loving you...supporting you...ALL THE WAY...

LA:

What I'm not HEARING when I read your post are HOPE and FAITH...

I'll share with you my belief, coming from another soul who has also had her share of ADVERSITY..TONS and TONS of it since CHILDHOOD...and I thought it would never stop...

My belief is that ALL THINGS HAPPEN FOR A REASON..there's a purpose..had you thought that what you posted today may have helped my sons from some greater danger than your son faced...I called both of them and warned them not to let others borrow their cars....

Nothing BAD has happened to me lately but for even the LITTLE ISSUES that I face, I've started asking what's GOOD about it, Lord? What's GREAT about this? I know you're wanting to teach me something." We are BLESSED if we LEARN the REASON but we may not know in this lifetime.

I loved, loved, loved the book THE FIVE PEOPLE WE MEET IN HEAVEN. It teaches the lesson of how each event in this life is related in ways that we may not know. GOD IS SO AWESOME..who are we to try to figure out HIS PLAN..

So me, I've learned to HAVE FAITH and continue to HAVE HOPE for the FUTURE.

I've been there with my sons. Right where you are..or worse..I won't share my HORROR STORIES..but NOW they are BLOSSOMING and when that happens..WHAT A HAPPY DAY and A BLESSING and yours surely will blossom, too...

I think EVIL FORCES try to tear us down and make us turn away from the GOODNESS in this world and I STRUGGLE not to go there.

That's why I didn't leave this BOARD. The LORD brought me here that scary, horrible night of December 2002 and here I will stay until I leave. I will give back all that I've received from ANGELS like YOU. YOU have helped change my life and I don't even know you. YOU ARE A GIFT FROM GOD and to me it's almost sinful for you to allow yourself to go to that hopeless, sad place. But, part of my learning over the past years is that I certainly can't CONTROL how you FEEL.

But I WANT YOU TO FIGHT THAT DEPRESSION. FIGHT IT WITH ALL YOUR MIGHT and tell it to GO AWAY FROM YOU....

I've been down that road and it will suck you in...

Turn around and go in the other direction...

KEEP ON STEPPING INTO THE LIGHT...

I love you, LA..really do...

Mvg...thank you very much for your post...felt encouraging, accepting and had that smack of hearty appreciation in it for me.

S4B...wow...thank you so much for this...I'm gonna read your post again and again...

like Mimi's post...

to help me turn in the other direction...

and get The Five People You Meet In Heaven (I loved Tuesdays with Morrie), too.

This one day...this one, really long day...I really do want to choose a different perspective today...thank you for bringing me faith, hope and love.

LA

LA, I'm so sorry to hear about your son. Amazed to see that you're still here, helping others. Amazed. Reminded about that spiral staircase. I am glad that you are finding comfort and appreciation, today. You are so loved,
LA.

((((LovingAnyway))))

LA,

I am sorry to hear about your OS...it is very difficult as a loving parent to watch our children suffer...even if it is partially deserved through their bad choices. I think mothers tend to want to protect their children more than sons, so I can empathize with you.

I am also sorry to see that you are in a lower place, remember it is a rollarcoaster, just life in general really. I don't know if you read a post I made to Ami's thread, I too am struggeling with personal issues as well as with our YS. Sometimes I can say the cliches and say the glass is half-full, it is all in the way you look at things, thoughts are actions, think positively, God will only give you what you can handle, we only learn through adversity, hmmm, I think that covers it! And then there is a voice inside that shuts all this off and wants to dwell on the negative, be a victim in your words, boy do I play that one well! Even when I am feeling the bad affects of someone else's decisions, I am trying to learn what part did I have in this, what were my choices, even inaction is a choice. It helps me to focus on what I can control, but it definitely is a behavior I am trying to learn and am not profecient at yet!

You have progressed so much over your time here, remember to give yourself self care, and a break! I can also relate to reverting back to bad behavior/communication, it takes time to reprogram your reactions, at least you are aware of them, that is a good step!

My suggestion to you is to be kind to yourself, as kind as you have been to others here on this board. Of course I selfishly do not want to see you go, I am not aware of the problems you mention on the board though. Whatever is in your best interest first, think what that may be.

Mimi, I like your post and the reminder to have hope and faith. You allude to problems/challenges, when you feel appropriate perhaps you could elaborate on this. I have 3 sons, similar to LA, and they often times present challenges. It is hard to know the right way to guide/lead them in a manner they will accept...

nab

((((LA))))

I'm so sorry for your current struggles. I don't post much anymore but I hope you know how much your wisdom and care mean to so many of us.

Thank you again for helping me through a rough patch all those months ago. You gave me some tough love and my marriage and myself will benefit from it for a long time to come.

I hate to see you leave if that is what you choose but I do have your email so you can't go too far!!!! LOL That sounds a little stalkerish huh!!!

My thoughts are with you in this trying time. Again, (((LA)))

LOL...I'm practicing my future sponsorship skills on you! LOL

Hoping you have a great day...

Even I was thinking last night about things I would question, people I would talk too...believing in my mind that the ordinance was not intended for this purpose...wanting to go to victim hood also...

I think for me, I would have to gain a better understanding...and I think that you are where you need to be...I find myself wanting to go there...had it been my child...

Peace be with you today! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

One last thought...I think that the truth of the matter is SOMETIMES bad things happen to good people...

Something that we can't understand, no matter how much we turn it over in our minds...like the death of a young person...

We just have to grieve, accept, and move on...

We will cry and scream and ask God why...sit with our anger, work through it...knowing all along that "This too shall pass!"

Just checking on you! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

{{{{LA}}}}

Just checked your thread and read about your OS. So sorry.

Let us know how tings are.

LA you around? Just wanted to see if you're feeling any better? (((thoughts & prayers to you and yours)))