Set your MIL down with your children and say it all in front of them. Their dad and her son has chosen to live with other families instead of his own. He may replace his mother next. Yep, tell her that too so she won't feel left out in this betrayal.

It will hurt your children for a while but it will be better to hurt with the truth than learn the truth later and be more angry knowing they were deceived.

As for buying another house, you let your children know that their father thinks it is better he buys other people's children things instead of taking care of his own 1st.

Is that being mean? No it is being truthful and as my son told me when he was 6 years old: 'mom, you know us kids don't like to be lied to.' <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />

L.

Ouch! I don't know......

Unfortunately, blood is thicker than mud.

However, in many instances, IL's are supportive of the BS behind the scenes. Remember, families rarely criticize each other outside the family, but within it they can be brutal. She may put on a nuetral attitude in front of you but IL's often are supportive of the marriage when the conflicted WS inevitable comes to discuss it with his mom and dad.

W

I need some input on how to address possessions. When he first was leaving (before I knew about OW) we had a verbal agreement on what he was going to take. I'm thinking I should ask for his list of what he wants in writing. Tell him I am not necessarily agreeing to those items but need a list to decide. Also, have him write what his intentions are regarding health coverage, child support, other payments. Should I do this? Or just have my attorney write out what I want and then try to get him to sign?

Do I give him a deadline for getting this stuff out? I feel like he is using me as a storage unit while he is out playing and "when he can fit it in" he'll get it done.

Thank you so much for your help. I am in such a whirlwind of emotion right now.

I talked to OW H yesterday...he said he talked to OW after I had sent my email to her. She asked him if he and I had talked and he told her no. She was skeptical and wondered how I was getting so much information. Although ALL of my information was coming from OW H, I tried to make the email sound like it was coming from within WH/OW company. I don't know how they show up to work everyday... I would be soooo ashamed!

She asked OW H to promise her if he and I talked that he would tell her. He said "sure". It's interesting how they think we are supposed to be honest with them and on their side against the opposite spouse when look at what they have done to us! GEEZ!!!!

As for possessions, find out from your attorney what the law says.

Then assume he gets nothing without asking for it and operate from the (unstated) position that all is negotiable until it gets to court - if it ever does.

Your verbal agreement is null and void because he gained it under a false representation of his status. Besides, you're a woman and can change your mind. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Take advantage of his temporary insanity and haste. The fog can have its advantages.

You may have to hold on to stuff you do not want until getting legal advice. That said, we've all heard of stories of personal belongings being stacked on the curb. You would be morally right to do that - but it wouldn't necessarily earn you any Plan A points. That's more effective as part of a good Plan B strategy, IMHO.

JMHO

WAT

Fox --
How come OW has her son? Is OWH willing to fight for custody? That is the biggest error I can see he has made.
Very few women will give up their children for a man.

If he puts on a full court custody battle, she may very likely decide your husband isn't worth it.

It should go one way, or the other. Either they are both losing their kids over their affair. OR -- let them have them ALL. Have you considered giving him the girls for a week or two before school starts? And of course (smile sweetly here) it proves you would NEVER keep daddy from his girls....

Nothing would destroy their fantasy faster than 2 hormonal non-accepting teenage girls raging around in their love nest. (I'd make sure the girls know who the enemy of their family is before they go....)

I did talk to OW H about their son. He is a hunting outfitter and is gone quite a bit. However, he owns the business and said he would hire another guide to replace him and then he would run his butt off when his son was otherwise occupied. He was trying to make it easy for his WW and therefore easy on their son by sharing and being good to her. After I talked to him, he may have just realized what this will get him. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> He has talked to an attorney and with all the info he has from his PI they seem to think he has a good chance at full custody. I sure hope he does...you're right, giving up her son may just make her think twice. If WH would treat his own kids this way, why does she think her son will be different. What about the attachment her son will have to WH? Does she think this is not harmful?

I also told OW H I was going to an attorney on Tuesday for a separation agreement (which he had not thought of doing). We are in Montana and anything one spouse does the other is responsible for. Any bills or debts incurred in the marriage are the responsibility of BOTH. So this nice little lease they signed together for their house, leaves me and OW H on the ropes for. I explained this to him....he is going to call an attorney and probably get a separation agreement also.

It makes me feel like I am having an A with OW H!! I did tell him about the MB website but being a guy (and a tough guy) at that...it didn't sound like he was interested. We'll see.

Heck no! My daughters are not going to spend a week or two at their house! It is an interesting thought and I would find it funny except for the damage it would do to my daughters. My encouraging them to go spend time with OW and WH and son would look like I was condoning the relationship instead of showing just how wrong it is!

DDs already treat WH differently...he can see the silent suffering. Through the fog and all....

I'm glad your daughters know the truth. And I hope they are tough on him -- its part of the consequences he deserves.

Another posted, FaithInMe used the "giving him the kids" strategy. You could almost see her WH poop his pants from here. He figured he could separate from his wife, have his little teenybopper girlfriend and everyone would be NICE about it. He never contemplated having a couple teenagers in the fantasy love shack.

I think it needs to go one way or the other. If your WH was a super involved dad -- losing the kids will be painful. If he's just an average dad -- giving him the kids (part time) will really destroy the affair quick, especially if the kids are your ally.

Please don't play "nice." This is what WS's crave the most -- for everyone to make things easy for them. Don't help him destroy your family!

Lexxxy,

The kids are absolutely my allies. However, they are very respectful and would not openly treat their dad badly. They will suffer silently. Which WS needs to see, but does he really care? Unfortunately, he is just an average dad. He has often put things ahead of us; work, hunting, helping friends, etc. I know he loves them deeply but doesn't show it in the way I would hope.

Thank you for your suggestions....it is under advisement. I just can't ever see myself letting OW even meet them, let alone have them live with her! She doesn't deserve the joy of my daughters!

Mr. Wondering,

I haven't received a response regarding this question to you...

My Plan A plan for emtional growth? What exactly is that? Is it what am I doing to make myself a better person/wife and to meet his EN? Please explain.

Plan A is a process. It is meant to take YOU from a destroyed and desparate state to a healthier mental place wherein you can most effectively fight the infidels and then strong enough to go to an effective Plan B if necessary. It Plan A has no effect and fails to bust up the affair, Plan B is the process whereby you disconnect and prepare mentally for a divorce. Plan B is not about manipulating WS, it's about YOU. Sure Plan A is meeting WS's needs, but it includes individual growth as well. How else are you to appear as an attractive alternative to the affair without becoming a better person, spouse and parent?

My posts Do's and Don't list emcompasses some of it:


Numbers 1,2, 6 and 7 refer to YOU becoming a better everything. To avoid the "don'ts" individual growth is mandated. Sometimes it's easiest to break things down into sub-categories which is what I intended to get across to you earlier.

1. Ideas and goals for individual growth (eat right, work out, new clothes, getting up and going, etc.)

2. Ways to be a better parent (Truthful, strong, etc.)

3. Ways to be a better spouse (EN questionaire, even if you have to guess, and then how to meet those identified needs to the best of your ability and to the extent allowed by WS,)

*maybe things like fixing up the house, reorganizing things, redecorating, etc. will meet his lower needs but also meet your own higher needs and the needs of your children. Household projects have a way of occupying the waiting time. Get the kids involved too. It's a healthy distraction from the chaos around you all.

Then you develope your plan and it gives you purpose and direction for YOUR life, instead of revolving or halting your life in anticipation of what WH does or does not do.

Some WS's will eat cake indefinitely. The sooner you get on getting on the sooner YOU will be in a position to decide and demand what you want for your life despite what WH is doing. MB is not a guarantee and this IS your life. Live it. Getting off the couch and functioning is not only the healthiest way for YOU to live it's also one way to make reconciliation that much more likely. You've done your exposure. Now it's more a waiting and a patience game as the affair hopefully crumbles. Until it's over, really over and NO CONTACT is established and withdrawal is done with there is no recovery. What you do in this period with YOUR life makes a huge difference to YOU and YOUR mental well being...whether you end up recovering or divorced you will feel better about yourself in the end.

Hope for the best, be prepared for the worst, but continue LIVING. This is AWEFUL but it's really NOT the end of the world. You will make it. IMO, experiencing (not just enduring) the bad times in life is what makes the good times that much sweeter. Remember, you've got young impressionable children watching you too. It would be a good thing to demonstrate to them strength through adversity, patience, love and a feminine constitution of survival, not defeatism and hate.

Mr. Wondering

Thank you so much Mr. Wondering

I have printed your post and will devise a plan. I have already started on some of these things. I think I did a Plan A before I knew what a Plan A was! Of course, this was when I only thought he was expressing "problems" in our marriage and I threw myself into doing what I thought would make him happy. Then I found at about the A and I didn't Plan A as well. I was pathetic and needy and desperate for a few days.

I will post more and explain later what I have done and what I intend to do.

Everyone's support is greatly appreciated.

Just remember to keep up slightly and unapoligetically (sp?) with the stick of Plan A:




The stick of Plan A

Exposing adultery where it matters most. Exposure that takes the form of a swift and sudden unexpected tsunami of truth.

Not appologizing for exposure or speaking the truth in a kind yet direct way.

Directly communicating the hurt and devastation that the affair has caused.

Not accepting blame for the infidel's choice to become adulterous.

Let the consequences of adultery and infidelity fall freely upon the heads of the adulterous.

Establishing boundaries that disallow the affair to effect children of the marriage, financal security of the marriage, and otherwise ruin innocent bystanders.

Standing up to infidelity as a beast that must be slayed for the good of the family.

You know that song..."sometimes your the windshield, sometimes your the bug" ? Today I feel like the bug!

I can't believe it, but I am actually looking forward to seeing the attorney tomorrow. I don't want a D but I'm wondering what WH will think when I take the initiative and get a sep agreement. hmmmm

I think I'm just looking for a reaction from him of ANY kind. Right now, I get nothing. He will speak if I speak to him but that's it. It's an indifferent tone and gives me strictly facts.

Before you present it to WH you should post it here for comment. Your attorney may cover most everything but he is not in the business of marriage building. He or she will just use a form document and try to cover all the bases. Post it here for comment. Many experienced eyes can give it a look-see.

Mr. W

You're right, I will post sep agreement here for opinions and input.

I had a 3 hour talk with DD13 last night about all of this. I am so grateful for those that advised me to tell my daughters the truth. She is so much older and wiser than I gave her credit for. It broke my heart to hear some of the things she said and I wish WH could have heard it. She thanked me for being honest with her and she said she feels 100 times better just knowing she can talk. You always tell your kids that they can come to you for anything, but do they truly know that? Mine do now. She slept with me last night (3 dogs and all!) and we talked a little more this morning. I am so proud and honored to be their mother. WH has lost so much more than he can imagine. One of the things she said when I was telling her that someday he will "wake up" and realize how wrong he is and how much he misses us and may want to come back. She said you know, Mom, it might be too late, maybe we won't want him back. She said over and over again that you never think it is going to happen to your family and how can he do this to us. She also said how angry it made her when he said things like I love you and I don' want to hurt you guys and I miss you because she feels if all those things were true he wouldn't be doing what he is doing, he should just stop. It felt so good to have her talk to me and to KNOW now that she will come to me. It's hard to see the pain and suffering but it's also good to see her anger and realize that she does know right from wrong. I am SO glad I told them. I didn't know I would get results so quickly.

DD12 left the room and didn't want to be in on it. I'll have to watch her closely and reach her when she is ready. She is much more outspoken than DD13 and I'm surprised to see her hold this in so tightly.

Good job, Foxy.

WAT

Maybe thats the very reason she doesn't want to hear it just yet. She knows how outspoken she is and won't be able to contain herself with her dad once she hears the entire truth.

Fox,

Hugz to u and your children. Very proud of all of U!

The ws certainly does not deserve to be in a family as good as yours.

take care,
L.