ba109, for example, you know how on Dr. Laura when she gives her answer and the caller doesn't LIKE what she hears? The caller will sometime say "but, what if....?" To try and get her to give an answer she DOES LIKE. It is just an exercise in opinion shaping/shopping to avoid doing the right thing.

That is my understanding of the general issue as well ba, although in cases of renewed or attempted contact the affair would not be considered dead/past tense but rather "active" and breach of NC and all of the usual suspects for exposure to the OPS apply.

Since there has been recent and renewed contact or contact attempts in both cases that I am aware of [suzet, 2b] the long dead question remains very questionable and makes continued nonexposure to OPS very inscrutable.

In any case it really DOES boil down to a moral issue imo rather than a marriage building one.

********************

It is no "opinion." You admitted it here:

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/sho...rue#Post3089187

Just think of all the people you fooled.. Look at all the well meaning fools who were posting to you giving you kudos and high praises and spending enormous time and effort helping you with advice to expose to your victim. All for what? NOTHING.

There was no pang of conscience, only a desire for some approval because you were jealous of Katie Mae. And once you got it, you gave all those fools the bum's rush and spit in their faces. All those well meaning people who were so supportive of you. You gloried in it

Well shoooooot!!!

Here I am...trying to catch up on some MB reading and I see that another farce has been outed. Lord...what some people won't do for approval. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

Another thread (besides this one, no less) is going to heat up and I guess I am just going to have to miss it. I need to really quit this day job. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

committed (andlovingagoodheatedthread)

P.S. I admitted a long time go about the "entertainment" factor on some of this stuff...so I'm claiming it.

cl, I wish I could disagree with you about it being entertaining, but sometimes it really IS.[until I think of their victims] It is like the gift that keeps giving to see all the machinations and exercises in mental masturbation some will go through here to justify the unjustifiable. I read these endless rationalizations and just laugh some days! They are downright COMICAL sometimes! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

***EDIT*********

Pep,


I prefer:

early exposure

which provides the greatest opportunity for participation/protection for the OPS

far superior to

late exposure

which allows for only some participation/protection for the OPS

measurable superior to

no exposure

which allows no participation/protection for the OPS

all exposure is

designed to protect

all concerned

early exposure provides for the greatest amount of protection


ba109.....if you missed the belacqua thread....this is just an offshoot. I think lots of folks are interested in some clarity on the exposure issue since it isn't discussed much in Harley materials and because it creates so much controversy on the board. For those who see exposure as purely a moral objective....I doubt that whatever he has to say will make much difference one way or another since exposure is clearly the "right" thing to do and other considerations are secondary....and timing doesn't play a big role under those circumstances. Personally, I think that the clearest moral objectives can be met by telling the OPS as soon as possible and avoiding the diminishing returns and beginning protection as early as possible.

machinations

oh my...how appropriate is that word!!!

I have got to use that one today...it is gonna be my word of the day.

Thanks

committed <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

****EDIT******]

I learnt that big word from Bubba! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Starfish,
I wanted to say that I appreciate how you have spent much time on this subject and have posted with such "class".

I appreciated how you posted on the other thread that you would never humiliate me (I don't remember your exact words) on the decision my H and I made.

Mel,

In 2BNormal’s defense, I just want to tell you that I believe her when she said that OM’s W not knowing has been weighing heavily on her at the time she was writing that post... I also believe her when she said to MrW that at the time she wrote that post, she was full of emotions from the pushing and bashing and hammering at her on this site… I believe she was not lying...

Why do I believe her?

Because I felt exactly the same way than her (full of emotions and guilt) after I was pushed, bashed and hammered on this board for not exposing to OM’s W… My feelings and emotions was so severe from the pressure on this board, that I kept nagging on my H with this (to expose to OMW) in spite of his concerns about the possible consequences on our personal circumstances… My H started to feel that I didn’t respect his feelings and concerns…and felt that I was putting the feelings and opinions of the people on this board (who pressured me to expose without my H’s agreement) above his…and because of this, we’ve experienced added conflict in our M for a while…we didn’t need it at the time (with my recent betrayal and all that)…and I’ve decided to take a few days break from this board (more than a week)…which helped to get my emotions under control again.

Suzet

***********EDIT********

Thank you Suzet. You do understand EXACTLY what went on!
I was very emotional about it all. I even bought the box to mail the letter in! It is still in the trunk of my car!

Suzet, by her own admission she only agreed to tell her victim because of peer pressure. She was "acting on her emotions." Her "pang of conscience" was all an act. She only did it to appease people here and not because of any real remorse. I am just going by her words. It was all contrived. Her H agreed that she could expose, so it has nothing to do with that. Not that she cares a whit what her H does think - she doesn't:

This is what 2BNormal really thinks of her husband's opinion:

2BNormal wrote: #3080074 - 08/14/06 06:05

...Her husband's "wishes" only count when it is convenient for 2Bnormal...

2B, I think what I said was something like I would continue to encourage you to expose, but that I wouldn't humiliate you....and I want to make sure you remember that first part as well as the last part....because I think they're both important. I don't support the decision not to tell the OPS in your situation, especially since recontact occurred. I will continue to do my best to keep encouraging you to discuss the need for exposure with your husband until you can get his agreement.

One of the surprising things I've noticed about exposure is that many BSs fear exposure because it creates "shame" and embarrassment for them. They don't want anyone else to know that their spouse cheated on them. They think exposure is like "airing their dirty laundry" and especially men sometimes feel as though it means they're "less" of a man because they couldn't keep their wife interested. It's another part of the "vitimization" of affairs because it lowers self esteem so drastically. So I understand how your H might not approve.

Part of helping your husband to understand the need for telling the OPS....is going to be helping him see past some of those issues. It's a moral dilemma for him too....you see? Because he is unwilling to offer protection to this other spouse because of the stigma he attaches to "exposure" and the "percieved" loss in status. That is an area where you can help him grow....and not take responsibility for your actions. He's got it in his mind that only "Jerry Springer" trash goes public with anything.....and this is really a discreet effort to protect the other marriage....so continue to help him see that.

I don't know if you can convince him.....but I really want you to keep on trying. However, if you can't....then you have 2 moral dilemmas....keeping your word to your husband, and meeting your duty to protect the OPS. That creates confusion where you may feel those things cancel each other out and leave you paralyzed. But don't be paralyzed....just keep talking to your H about how this can be accomplished in a way that he doesn't lose "face".

Suzet* and 2BNormal,

Why don't you guys just make use of the "Ignore" feature? Then, you won't be drawn into these same conversations over and over again. Melody's opinion doesn't seem like it's going to change and she seems determined to express it often. You can't change her, but you can certainly make choices that minimize her ability to impact your time here. I suspect that most of what's going to be said has all ready been said between you all -- not much new going on here. You're unlikely to miss anything important to you.

Respectfully,

Mys

starfish, just so you know, her husband has given his blessing to 2BNormal to expose, so that is not the real issue:


Many well meaning folks here spent much time and effort advising her in how to do this and helping her write the letter. http://www.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/sho...part=1&vc=1

******EDIT****************

And for the record, I would like to know what Dr H thinks about this issue too but I can guarantee I would not replace his judgement with my own in these circumstances.

I would consider it a guide only, after all he is not God.

Starfish, Yes I do remember that you said you would still encourage me to expose.

I never did receive my H's "blessing" to send the letter. He was very hesitant and concerned if it was the right thing to do. There were many discussions we had after that day and he expressed his concerns to me. I can't ignore his concerns as I feel what he "feels" matters very much to me. It is him who I am married to. He is concerned for this woman. And he is concerned that telling her this "late" will have negative effects both on her and on our marriage.

At this point, I can't keep bringing it up over and over again to him. What would you suggest I do at this point? I will still continue to pray for this woman and that somehow this will be brought to "light" to her. I do believe she should know and have never said she shouldn't.

Edited to add: Starfish, do you know what the attempted contact was from this former OM1? It was a offline message that said 3 words..."me miss you"....still attempted contact...no doubt he was "fishing" to see if I would "bite" on those words. I didn't reply, nor did I have any conversation with this man. My first reaction to this attempted contact was to immediately tell my H. My H called him and asked for him to never attempt to contact me again, and we have not heard from him since. I have closed the account the OM tried to reach me through and there is no other way he could attempt to contact me except for calling me, which I highly doubt he would after the conversation my H had with him.

Also, you do know there was another OM after this OM1? This 2nd OM's wife does know of the online affair and I'm very glad that she does know.