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Bob, did you manage to get satisfactory answers out of your wife? I try to get explanations from my husband but it is very confused and sometimes contradictory. Or sometimes he says he does not remember!!! So it goes round and round in my head, trying to make a bit of sense and trying to figure out if I stand a chance with a man who has cheated on me 4 times!
Hi lorraine555, It's good to see you reflecting somewhat, about those 3 ONS's as it seems IMVHO, it's long overdue. I hope all is going well, and you have read everthing on this site that will give you the tools to deal with this, this time, the way it should be dealt with. You mentioned about the reply of "forgetting about it". Read a very great book by David Carder entiltiled "Torn Assunder." It has an entire section abouth the worst answer a WS can give is 'I don't remember." Of course they do, they just don't want to give it up because they know it will be the source of more pain, but if you need to know, then nothing short of that complete confession will appease you. I've been there and done that!! I wish you all success in your jorney. We often refer to this as a rollar coater because of the tidal waves of emotions it will invovke in you. God bless you on your journey!
Hi bOb, I think I may have been a little hijacked here along the way but it's perfectly OK with me as long as someone else benefits by something here <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />.
I don't know how you feel at this point, but I am begginning to think that I've dwelled to much in the past and have to refocus my thinking towards the future. There is nothing I can do abouth the past, but I can certainly influence my future. With the help of God, I intend to put all my focus on the future, and stop somehow trying to change the past, which, of course, is impossible to do.
I hope all is well with you and Squid, All Blessings, Jerry
I've dwelled to much in the past and have to refocus my thinking towards the future.
Jerry
I belive that is the only way to "get past" being constantly hurt by infidelity.
I think the trick is to find a way of doing this which is authentic to ourselves.
In my caseI think my soul keeps one toe hold in the past and the affair I think because it was such a GROSSLY unfair, unjust and violent abuse of myself, that it has gone totally unavenged is counterintuitive to me. Its not helped by the fact that I ( like every BS) have all the tools I need to avenge this yet must chose not to invoke them.
This is what I meant by my thread I started a few months ago about " have you forgiven yourself for taking your FWS back?".
Infidelity DESERVES bitter, humbling divorce and loss of total reputation, and privilege of decency IMO. And BS can choose to do that. But I read the walks of divorced BS and few are as happy as mine is now. Seems to me those tools of vengeance we BS have are like nukes in that they cause MAD ( Mutually Assured Destruction).
That I KNOW my response to Squids affair, was the best for everyone involved is something my brain rcognises, but part of my silverback soul still screams for me to take some...well...RESTITUTION.
That battle is almost over within me now. We put up the christmas decorations with the kids yesterday - laughing, hugging, excited talk from the kids and beaming smiles from Squid. My house is a home once again full of people who love each other very much.
My silverback soul is being very silly, and is overruled at all times other than those few dark, triggered moments when I wake in the night to a bad movie playing.
I believe that the last few percent of disquiet over this will dissipate as Squid expresses more gratitude for my efforts. I don't want her to live as a cringing serf, but I would appreciate more appreciation of me. But it took her 40 years to develop her way of dealing with me, that won't change totally in a couple of years.
Does any of this make any sense, Jerry ?
* edited to say I will tell this to Squid next opportunity I get when we are alone. It was very cathartic to write this. It may be useful for Squid to know how I feel about this.
In my caseI think my soul keeps one toe hold in the past and the affair I think because it was such a GROSSLY unfair, unjust and violent abuse of myself, that it has gone totally unavenged is counterintuitive to me. Its not helped by the fact that I ( like every BS) have all the tools I need to avenge this yet must chose not to invoke them.
Exactly Bob, what you have there is another true definition of forgivness. That's where I need to keep my focus and lose the attitude that I'm somhow "one up" on her. I must begin to realize, that she has earned her forgiveness, albeit, by putting up with me for the last 4 and 1/2 years since DDay. I have not make this easy, as it was not easy for me(or any BS for that matter).
I know I've mentioned her lack, of what I percieved as too little effort into the R process, but I am beggining to think that, perhaps it was arrogant of me to think that she had the emotional strength to walk that walk. Thus, it fell on my shoulders and I construed that as being totally unfair in light of her betrayal. Perhaps it is, but I don't know for sure whether that might have damaged her more than she could bear. On the other hand, perhaps I'm being dellusional <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />.
In any event, I'm going to persue this new direction of "letting the past be the past, at last." Like anything worthwhile, it takes committment and patience. I am, by nature, a patient person(well I guess some might argue otherwise <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />) so I figure I can do this and, with any luck, it will produce great reward.
Through this process I have re-evaluated myself. I am WORTH Squid's appreciation, and investment. My need to "feel" loved and appreciated is EVERY BIT as important as Squid's is.
Yes, Squid's behaviour damaged her ( as did your wife's). When good people sin so greatly they can be very hurt - like the ringbearers in "lord of the rings" perhaps.
But just think CLEARLY for a moment what we ar easking for :
* deliberate acts of respect * deliberate acts of contrition * deliberate acts of love * deliberate acts of restoration
See ?
Its not like we are demanding punishment or payment !!. If is is TRULY so unpleasant to Squid for her to increase her investment in my happiness past the low levels of her instinct then maybe we shouldn't be together because I DESERVE that, as , I suspect, do you.
They are small things we desire, you and I, that require only that our FWWs prioritise our happiness above their own temporary discomfort. After what we gave them it is a small ask IMO.
You're right about the investment aspect of our FWW's effort, however, I seem to have come to the conclusion that It was more than I could or should have asked for. Your opinion seems to be somewhat different if I'm reading you right.
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Its not like we are demanding punishment or payment !!. If is is TRULY so unpleasant to Squid for her to increase her investment in my happiness past the low levels of her instinct then maybe we shouldn't be together because I DESERVE that, as , I suspect, do you.
The question the becomes, "will I ever get that, and if not, will that be good enough????"
A question I have asked my self for waaaaaay to long. I needed to make a decision over this for a long while. I have come to that decision, even if it does not bode well for me. I will try everthing in my heart and soul to perservere in this M and will endure whatever I must to preserve the vow I Made to my God upon His altar. The rest in in His hands.
I can't think of any other way to go with this. It really is not my job to try to change my wife. It will be or it will not.
Time will tell, but i am willing to give it my very best effort.
I know I'm going out on a limb, but I am going to make myself completely vunerable to my W again. It's long overdue, and the one thing that's holding me back from complete recovery.
Thanks for your iciteful thoughts, All Blessings, Jerry
Deliberately, completely vulnerable to a women who won't "put herself out" too much to help you fully heal from the consequence of her sin ?
Yes, that is exactly what I'm talking about. And you're right, it is a leap of faith, but one that I feel compelled to do, if I'm ever going to completely heal from this mess.Bob, I think this leap of faith that I have been so unwilling to do, is exactly what has stagnated me to this level of emotion for 4 and 1/2 years now. I desperately need to break out of this jail, and it's going to take that leap of faith for me to do so.
I want more than what I have right now. Maybe it's out there and maybe it's not, but I must finally find out, one way or the other. I want this so badly, that I am willing to risk being once again destroyed. To do less would be an injustice to myself and my M.
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As for me, I will never place myself wholly vulnerable to anyone again. I never did get enough back in return for doing that.
exactly as I have felt these past 4 + years.I finally came to the conclusion, that I will not endure some form of phsedo(sp) M, just for the sake of remaining M'd. It's either the real thing, or it's a waste of what remains of my life. I guesss i"m greedy, but I want it all and want it right now!!! Someone very wise explained to me that to forgive, is like leapeing across an entire river to get to the other side. Sometimes we land on an island in between the other side. We rest and contemplate the final leap. I'm tired of living and settling for life on this island. I want my true destination. The other side!
So yes bob, I'm going to take that leap regardless of the risks involved.It's the only thng I can live with, the thought that I've done every thing possible that I could do.
Wish me luck <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />, I will chronicle this in the outside chance that it may be of some humble help to others, All Blessings, Jerry EDITED TO ADD MY NEW THEME SONG:
Why must you consider yet ANOTHER radical investment when your W won't invest making herself a bit uncomfortable by investing in you a little more, Jerry ?
If your rear tire is flat,double pumping the front one does not compensate for it ! The bike still rides bad !
I'm not decrying your plan,Jerry, just trying to talk it out. I feel I have been where you are several times and each time Squid ENJOYS my over-investment, but it doesn't change much but make our M even less equal than it was before.
Maybe its dfferent in our case because Squid was not a great investor in me or our marrige for years before her affair - its not an "affair" change in her personality.
I have looked at what you have said, and I would agree, but I hope I have not lead you completely astray.
My w has made any number of changes for the better since her A. She no longer leaves the home so she can be out with so-called ftiends. She has recommitted to the M and is very sorry and repentant over everything that has occured. I believed this was a classic case of faailing to protect her weakness's. She was one, at the time, that didn't recognize that she could and would ever be so vunerable in her loyalty to me.
She has since seen the light, and realizes that she can never place herself in such a vunerable spot again. I have rather strongly reinforced that rule. She understands.
It's time for me to reward her changes with trust again, bob. she needs to know I can see the changes and am comfortable with that. I see this as an oppurtunity to rebuild from the ground up.
Perhaps I'm being naive and foolish, but to me it is now worth the risk
So why were you dissatisfied enough with the efforts your W has made to start this threat, Jerry ?
Don;t back off them just because you feel you have misrepresented your W to me ! It is our instinct to defend our spouses.
Don't under- or over-estimate them.
I applaud what Squid has done, and I rue what she hasn't. Amazingly Squid has done some of the hardest stuff, and not some of the easiest stuff ( well apparrently to ME anyway).
I have done what you propose, at least in part from time to time, AND my efforts to bridge the love gap have been welcomed by Squid and have led to a happier life at least temporarily. BUT I want a FAIR marriage, not just one that has no conflict at any cost.
What you propose may just be the catalyst that allows your W to finally feel secure enough to fully recommit to you. And even if it isn't , you will have tried that important plan.
So why were you dissatisfied enough with the efforts your W has made to start this threat, Jerry ?
Well, a lot of frustation, I guess. I had my vison since DDay of what kind of effort and work R was going to take. I suppose, since I was the one hurting the most, I expected her to feel the same way. It never quite panned out like that. But her pain was different than mine, and it seems to have, sadly, taken me all this time to figure that simple fact out. I mean, geesh, 4 and 1/2 years borders on lunacy at this point.
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What you propose may just be the catalyst that allows your W to finally feel secure enough to fully recommit to you. And even if it isn't , you will have triedthatimportant plan
Exacly why I must give this my best effort. Time will tell. Thanks for your thoughts, Jerry
