So how does this fit with MBers?

Mimi, an ACOA with full knowledge of those concepts....

It doesn't...That's why I haven't been around...I've found another group who supports my decision...

MB is not working for me, it's only making things worse IMHO...

Just my POV...

Rin,

That is your decesion?

Rin yes the program says not to make any big life changing decesions in the first year. Don't letter of the law it with the program. If a big decesion needs to be made in the first year it needs to be made. The program would not say stay with an abusive H for a year.


This statement doesn't make sense to me. UMMM. You are chosing to enable his behaviors. Go do what you want and I will be here when you get home? So he can do what he wants and handle the consequences of his own life.

So if he stays at OW's this weekend who's watching the kids? If he spends a couple hundred bucks on the OW who's doing without? I don't get it.

I have been with you since almost day one. I think you are a wonderful person. I will not stop posting to you but you should read through some of the threads that have been posted lately. Especially the one about what people thought when they first came here.

It is the people that worked the MB program who now have happier lives. With or without their WS/FWS.

I wish you luck. I really truly believe you are tyring to self diagnose and it isn't working.

I came here got help, went to MC and got more help. Went to IC and got more help.

This weekend my FWW are spending it together. Our M has been great for month's now. We are a team.

No big fights. I am not eating a crap sandwich to maintain it. I am truly happy.

Good Rinder:

You are taking the AA approach, which will work. I used a bit of both. To be honest it was mostly AA and some MB principles too.

The thing you are letting go of is the struggle, fear and pride. Doing this will do wonders for you. It will cause WH to look at himself too.

Alcoholics and children of alcoholics cannot continue to monitor and struggle. When we impose OUR WILL on others, it causes resentment and rarely has beneficial effect.

When we let go and concentrate on our progam, loving and becoming useful, we initiate Gods will, which will have a better effect.

I'm not disagreeing with MB, but I'm pointing out that in this particular situation, the fight and turmoil has gone on for a long while with little real results. This is because Riders own will and the will of MB was being pushed on WH. Yes this approach works, but it is NOT full proof and won't work for EVERYBODY.

Rinder, I know your approach now is the one I took. Youll find new opportunities and new outlooks you never thought you had working the program. Things will slowly fall into place. You will change for the better and this, to me, is the best plan A in this situation. Plan A, yet it relinquishes the control and the expectations that you've been having issues and dispair over.

I know you have chosen the right thing to do.

Thank you DF...I have been wanting to talk with you...

You nailed it on the head...I'm giving up the struggle and turmoil that this has brought me...I'm accepting without approval...

Frog, I know that you can understand this:

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over expecting different results. I've been doing the same thing with the same results...I'm letting go...

Most of the A was talking on the phone...no visits, no sleep overs...they are just talking...boundaries can be removed, enforced, whatever "I" need...

I AM OKAY with them talking at present...this is ME...

MOF, this pass Tues. H and I got into another arguement...I went to my meeting and that's when it hit me that I was doing the same thing with the same results...

I came home, announced a tryst, and I was dropping the "rules" since that time, H is calling me and letting me know where he is and is still doing things for me...here we are at the end of the week...about the time that the niceness would wear off and he's still at it...

He has not picked up anything I offered, had laying out, wasn't interested in talking about anything that I have read or sharing...He's reading my Step two book, interacting with me more today...

I go a call this morning after posting to Mimi, turns out the L's sitter was rushed to the hospital for heart failure...H got the call, and explained the sitch and said that if I needed him to handle it he would if I was unable...

I picked up L while he called and made arrangement for F. Now, in the past, I would have done both...but H stepped up to the plate and even called back to say that if L was too much to handle with me at work that he would come get him...

H is still coming home immediately after work, that has not changed...home and work...even missed bike night...

MB has had some effect for me but I'm in a continuous power struggle that was eating up MY energy...I refuse to continue to struggle with him...

I have only found that H has fought me more...he either could not or would not give me what I needed...Fact is "I" have everything I need to heal...it's all in me with my HP...

This does not mean that I am going to be allow myself to be a doormat...

YES YES YES! You are getting it!

Struggle and conflict and monitoring somoene and their actions is NOT what you need to do now.

Do you like what you are getting? No? Then change it! The conflict is the insanity. It drains so much emotion and energy that could be used for something like say:

Doing good for others!
Getting out of your own head and letting God work. God or your HP cannot enter your life it is consumed by conflict, fear and resentment. God helps those who help themselves. You do what YOU can to change and God will change the things you have not been able to change!

Unless you've been where we have been it's hard to understand this. It's so simple, yet very hard to do. This is about taking ACTION in your own life! Keeping your side of the street clean and not judging anyone else.

In fact you have not made a life altering decision here by changing the stategy, you are doing the opposite. You are working the program into daily life!

You have chosen the right path. This is the AA forum I use.
http://www.activeboard.com/forum.spark?forumID=42735

Hi, Rin.

Sounds like you're feeling good -- that's great to hear!

I have some questions. NOT arguing -- I don't have any room to judge anyone else's plan. I'm really just trying to understand your approach.

You said that boundaries can be moved, enforced, whatever you need ... and that you're ok with them talking. When I read that, I was thinking about how I would feel CRUSHED if my H was talking to OW -- that's my stuff, though. So I was just wondering if you are really ok with them talking, or is it the lesser of two bad things -- like a choice between fighting this issue or let him talk to her?

And what does "accepting without approval" look like? Do you watch what he does and just hurt, or do you still try to keep up with the O&H and tell him how you feel? Or do you pretend like he's not there? I don't quite understand the mechanics of it. Do you display your disapporval, or is that just "yours" to deal with?

I kind of get the idea of letting go, each experiencing their own consequences, etc. It sounds a lot like breaking the enmeshment that we've talked about a lot around here .... but wasn't sure about the consequences part. You said that he will experience his own consequences .. how does that happen?

My last question, and then I promise that I will quit bombarding you with them .... this plan seems so separating and dividing .... what is the plan for helping to build intimacy?

I really am not arguing or trying to say there is anything wrong with your choice. I don't understand it well enough to be able to say anything like that. It sounds like it must have worked for some people, like the ones on the other site that you've been on. I'm interested in hearing more about it.

-AmI.

She needs no support from anyone. She has it herself now with her Higher Power. I know it's hard to believe in this.

She is no longer looking to others to help solve her problem. She is looking at herself to solve the problem. She's been banging heads for 10 months. What kind of Serenity and happiness can one find in doing that?

I'll bet she's all fixed up in a matter of a couple months.

Yes....but what about her MARRIAGE....

As I recall, her WH does not believe in marriage anyways...so this seems to be supporting and enabling HIS BELIEF SYSTEM....

My opinion...

I think that you asked wonderful questions, my lady...I appreciate you expressing your intent...

Let me see if I can help you to understand...I set the boundary that WH could not go to the store and NC with OW...he held his end up on the store from what I understand but did not with Contact...

So, I know that he can't stick to his word...I know this...he has proven it...well, I monitor contact and WH break my boundary...I get hurt...

I was unaware that boundaries can be removed or reajusted to fit a new sitch...I didn't get that part until I read it...well, it made sense to me to remove the boundary...

To WH it wasn't about talking to the OW it was about me trying to control, telling him who he could and couldn't talk to...me parenting him...nevertheless...I was expecting him to give me what I needed and for whatever reason it wasn't working...I remove the expectations because I can't cause, cure, or control him or anything that he chose to do or places that he goes...

What I can control is me...I can control whether I set myself up for pain and more hurt...I can control whether I look at that bill and see contact...if I chose not to look, I chose not to make myself the victim and cause myself additional pain IF WH has contact..

See right now, I accept that he IS talking to OW occasionally...I don't like it, not one bit...but I accept that fact as the truth...I don't Approve...WH knows I don't...

We are a team in everything else EXCEPT this area...this is the area that the abuse happens...the book burning, the breaking of glass, the yelling, all the crap...this is the area that we agree to disagree...

Now, I will still open my mouth, speak my peace, be true to myself...we are a team in everything else except where talking to OW is concerned...

H is home every night...lunch with me somedays...works every day...with us on the weekend...should that change for the worse than I will do what I have to...set a boundary, disapprove, whatever...but today I am okay with my present sitch...I'm not getting the leftovers...she is! He's with ME and NOT HER!

IF the sitch changes and he starts hanging out with OW...I will consider that then...(by the way...I wouldn't be happy with that)

We are still doing everything together, spending time, watching tv, talking about the boys, whatever...

Is that making any sense? The consequences of his actions are to be determined by God and then me.

It's all Al-anon, AA related...I'm working my 12 steps...it's the ultimate plan A and WH has the chose to come along with me or not...regardless, I will be okay...

I WILL BE OKAY and I WOULD like for WH to come along but if that doesn't happen then that wasn't my HP's plan for me anyway...

((((((AmI))))))))


Open-minded...that's all you need...believe...have faith!

Mimi, I'll keep you updated! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Rin..tell me to back off if you want...

But, IMO, you are not describing a MARRIAGE...

Yes you are TOGETHER with your H but you are TRIANGLED in with another woman....who is INFESTING your LIFE and your children's lives...

His continuation of a any form of relationship with her... so UP IN YOUR FACE... is a form of EMOTIONAL ABUSE...

I am just so sad for you...

You will not understand mimi...no matter how hard I try...this may not be right for you or anyone else here...it's right for me as an individual...

Can you please accept this?

I'm sorry that you feel differently...I DO NOT intent to change my mind and I understand that you are only concerned for my wellfair...

I have heard you out...Thank you!

CERTAINLY!!!

Give me a shout out if you ever want to do that! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

In working on herself the Marriage will be helped indirectly. Her fear and insecurity that has been driving her for the past year will wash away. You might see it as enabling, but it really is not.

The WH has a lot of resentment in her trying to monitor and control. If she plan AA's with love and letting go, his attachment will dwindle with the OW because there is no more danger in it. His subconcious self knows he's hurting her with his actions. With that removed, with no more fighting, monitoring and anger will cause him to wonder "WTF is going on here????."
He will come back, just as plan A ..without forcing Plan A. And if he does not, she'll be a stronger and more confident person than before her marriage began.

Thank you DF...I don't think that I could have said it any better...

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> You nailed it again...if he doesn't straighten up...I'll know that it wasn't meant to be...but I see that I am only pushing him away with my demands to stop what he is doing...

I truely believe that he is continuing to talk to her to rebel...b/c I've asked him not do...this is his inner child rearing it's ugly head...he's digging in his heels, fighting for his freedom in his head...

JMO...

Agree...

What you describe is not remotely marraige recovery.

He remains a WS and you work around it.

Usually the time I see this type of agreement is when one spouse won't hold on and the other won't let go.

Sorry you have settled for this...yet it is your right to settle.

DJ alert...

I am not settling in my eyes...

Thank you for your POV...

OK...

Limit this answer to yes or no...I think you may be getting lost in your own semantics.

Are you enthusiastic about him spending time and having sex with other women?

Yes or no?

How is that not settling?

Or was this a sunshine enema only session?

Her strategy is HARDLY settling.

Rin....this same exact approach WORKED for my situation. You are approaching this the same way I did and it was a matter of weeks and it is now better than the best of our last 8 years together!

Trust in what you are doing. The AA way of life applied to your situation will NOT let you down if you follow it.

Rin,

Good luck. I wish you the best.

I would yes you hit my definition on the head but your solution for doing things differently is not what I would think would be a good answer.

Quite honestly I think your H won. He had a stronger will.

He decided to yell, throw and break things everytime you told him that talking to another woman is crossing your boundry.

He made it so uncomfortable you decided the best course of action is to let him talk to his girlfriend if he wants. Go see his girlfriend if he wants. If he sleeps with his girlfriend you will disapprove but he will have to suffer the consequences of having a girlfriend.

Just my opinion.

Rin I think you are a great person but I do not think this is a good idea.

Good luck.